Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
You’re correct, but you’re also misunderstanding something (or just talking about something different from what I am). The iOS VOIP multitasking function is indeed important, but it’s for when you are ON a call right now. That’s all well and good.

But I’m talking about when you’re logged in to receive incoming calls, but not actually talking ON a call. In that case, there’s no VOIP transmission happening, and I certainly hope they’re not keeping an active VOIP channel open (which may be exactly the bad thing they have done—perhaps because it’s easier to do with their existing system).

You're the one misunderstanding. The correct way to handle VOIP on iOS (as required by Apple) is for the App to declare that it is a VOIP app and for it to continue allowing certain connections to run in the background.

Push Notifications should not be used as they are too slow to create a reliable experience.

In this state, there's very little that the App can actually do in the background - so the battery usage should not be an issue.

Other than maintaining a simple network connection to check for incoming calls, VOIP Apps are only able to run for a maximum of 30 seconds no more frequently than every 10 minutes.
 
Well done Skype team

This version blew me away. I video chatted with people in Europe and in South America connected to AT&T's 3G network on my iPhone 4. It was flawless. I could not believe how smooth it was. Thank you Skype! Great work!

PS: Try talking to someone in South America using Facetime...
 
Used this today. Mom said the picture is more pixelated but the mobility makes up for it.

It's going to kill FaceTime
 
What does it matter? The iPad does not have a camera. Audio-only is sufficient. Skype can worry about iPad video conferencing when Apple releases an iPad with a built-in camera.

Until then, it's a wasted engineering effort.

And yeah, I'm an iPad owner, too. I simply don't understand your sense of entitlement.

It matters because not everyone [such as my family and my company's employees] use Skype only for calling. Many times we're required to use text-based communication and it's rather disappointing to use the app in 2x mode where even the key layout is somewhat different than the traditional iPad keyboard layout. One may question as to why we would only want to use the Skype application and not something else. The main reason behind the Skype official app is due to the ability to text-based chat while on a voice call with another party. There are a few apps which should have been made iPad ready within a week of launch; quite simply, Skype should have been one of them.
 
You're the one misunderstanding. The correct way to handle VOIP on iOS (as required by Apple) is for the App to declare that it is a VOIP app and for it to continue allowing certain connections to run in the background.

Push Notifications should not be used as they are too slow to create a reliable experience.

In this state, there's very little that the App can actually do in the background - so the battery usage should not be an issue.

Other than maintaining a simple network connection to check for incoming calls, VOIP Apps are only able to run for a maximum of 30 seconds no more frequently than every 10 minutes.

Thanks for the info. (But I’m pretty certain Apple doesn’t require VOIP-capable apps to work that way when not doing VOIP. I have VOIP-capable games, and they don’t run VOIP 24/7, only when in use. Receiving calls does not technically need VOIP—it needs some way to tell the app to launch and start VOIP.)

The all-VOIP method (instead of Push plus VOIP) is great if Skype can "run in the background" without side effects like memory use and battery use. But two side effects seem* to be real—and I hope they’re fixed in this version but they don’t seem to be in my testing:

1. Battery life.

2. Failure to stay online. People try to Skype me but the app is no longer running and I’m unexpectedly no longer online! (Maybe it quotes because iOS quits apps when it needs the memory? Will it quit a VOIP app? I’ve never had it quit my GPS app, say, while giving me directions.) Other apps pop up message notifications for me weeks after I last launched the app.

(I’d say 3. Memory use, but that’s hard to test. The main symptom of that would be other apps and games behaving badly.)

As a result, Skype is OK for outgoing, but I still want it to work better for incoming calls too.

I hope the VOIP service can be used as you describe, and that Skype can work the way it should, but if not, Push solves both problems. What’s your evidence that Push has to be slow? Has Skype said they can’t use Push because Apple’s service is unreliable? (I’m really asking—I don’t know.) In my experience, some apps clearly use slow back-end servers, and Push notifications are delayed (like some turn-based games I play) but others—such as the IM apps I use—are instantaneous. Push signals have to come to Apple from somewhere—outside Apple--so not all apps Push at the same speed.

One speed issue I can see is that if the app isn’t running, then to start an incoming call the app must load and launch. But apps can load fast, and Skype seems to. The person on the other end can wait 2 more seconds to see my lovely face :) And eventually the app is going to quit—or else keep using up memory, which is worse.

I see no good reason why Skype couldn’t use a Push server and NO battery life to receive calls, with no loss of online status if the app is automatically quit. Then VOIP to handle the calls. The way they do it now may be legal (and it’s thoughtful of Apple to have a non-Push service for VOIP companies to use without a lot of work). But it seems to have the above problems. I’d rather Skype (finally?) do the work needed to integrate iOS Push with their back-end.

If there’s another way to achieve these same three goals: NO battery usage while able to receive, NO memory usage while able to receive (once the app auto-quits at least), and NO loss of online status over time, then I’ll be very happy :) I don’t care what the solution is, Push or not, I just care that it’s solved—and I fear that it still hasn’t been :( If my fear is correct, then I want users to know what ask Skype for for Christmas 2011 :)

* Now the big question—the reason I raised the topic—is to get to the bottom of whether the problems were—and more importantly, ARE—really happening. People use their phones in a lot of ways, and battery life trends are hard to notice sometimes if you’re not really paying attention. If your battery is low, who’s to say what the culprit is? It’s hard to know sometimes.

So I’d welcome more user reports. My own experience: battery life doesn’t seem to be obviously affected! But my online status doesn’t last anyway. If it did (if I launched the Skype app more often) would I see needless battery drain even while not talking? I definitely want these answers—which may take time to pin down—before I bring Skype back into regular use.

Questions for all Skype iOS users:

1. Is your battery life affected when you’re logged in but not talking?

2. How long does Skype keep you online to receive, if you haven’t used the app?

does the skype app have to be open in the task switcher in order to get calls??

Good question! I hope not, because then the app can’t keep eating battery :) When I quit and relaunch the app, Skype does say I’m “connecting” which makes it sound like I was offline... except it connects pretty quickly (which has never been Skype’s strength), and that gives me hope that maybe you were never offline even when the app was shut down. (But in that case, incoming calls would have to be triggered by Push. I hope they are! But it doesn’t seem so.)
 
Last edited:
Thanks for the info. (But I’m pretty certain Apple doesn’t require VOIP-capable apps to work that way when not doing VOIP. I have VOIP-capable games, and they don’t run VOIP 24/7, only when in use. Receiving calls does not technically need VOIP—it needs some way to tell the app to launch and start VOIP.)

Games are not VOIP Apps. They use an entirely separate feature of iOS as part of GameKit (Game Center) to handle VOIP (assuming they use Apple's APIs and not their own). Either way, they aren't declared as VOIP Apps and cannot use the Multitasking VOIP APIs.

The all-VOIP method (instead of Push plus VOIP) is great if Skype can "run in the background" without side effects like memory use and battery use. But two side effects seem* to be real—and I hope they’re fixed in this version but they don’t seem to be in my testing:

1. Battery life.

This is inevitable. If you have a VOIP App running in the background (no matter how little it is able to do), you have to accept that some battery life will be used up.

My testing of Skype indicates that it behaves in the way that Apple intends the VOIP APIs to be used - maintaining a basic connection to monitor for incoming calls and periodically notifying the Skype service that the user is still online.

I'd say that the major use of battery life is simply going to be that a connection is being maintained. The iOS device will keep Wi-Fi active and it wont be able to go into as much of a sleep as it normally would do.

2. Failure to stay online. People try to Skype me but the app is no longer running and I’m unexpectedly no longer online! (Maybe it quotes because iOS quits apps when it needs the memory? Will it quit a VOIP app? I’ve never had it quit my GPS app, say, while giving me directions.) Other apps pop up message notifications for me weeks after I last launched the app.

Although iOS quits Apps that use too much memory (or when the OS needs more memory), Apple recognises that people expect VOIP Apps to stay connected permanently. As such, iOS should restart VOIP Apps if they are dropped due to Memory issues. Skype might not cope with this situation correctly though - it's pretty hard to test.

(I’d say 3. Memory use, but that’s hard to test. The main symptom of that would be other apps and games behaving badly.)

I've had a quick look at Skype on my iPhone 4 when it's in the background. It's only using 27MB of RAM - a pretty small amount considering the size of the RAM in an iPhone.

I hope the VOIP service can be used as you describe, and that Skype can work the way it should, but if not, Push solves both problems. What’s your evidence that Push has to be slow? Has Skype said they can’t use Push because Apple’s service is unreliable? (I’m really asking—I don’t know.) In my experience, some apps clearly use slow back-end servers, and Push notifications are delayed (like some turn-based games I play) but others—such as the IM apps I use—are instantaneous. Push signals have to come to Apple from somewhere—outside Apple--so not all apps Push at the same speed.

One speed issue I can see is that if the app isn’t running, then to start an incoming call the app must load and launch. But apps can load fast, and Skype seems to. The person on the other end can wait 2 more seconds to see my lovely face :) And eventually the app is going to quit—or else keep using up memory, which is worse.

The main issue is that if you go down the Push Route, the following must happen:

1) Caller starts call on their device (could be a phone or computer).

2) Service like Skype identifies where the call should be routed.

3) Skype sends a Push Notification to Apple

4) Apple sends the Push Notification to the user (this could be lost at this point, or delayed significantly)

5) The user can Accept the call once they receive the push notification

6) The VOIP App would start up, connect to the service and then connect the call.

This all takes time, and there is no way to cancel it if the caller decides to terminate the call. If things are running slowly, the caller might hang up. It's also hard for the service to tell whether or not the recipient of the call actually got the notification (no network coverage, device off etc.).

I think you are overestimating the problem of memory usage. It matters very little and Apple has implemented an excellent way of dealing with memory problems in rare cases.
 
Isn't it supposed to be the big screen that's the person you're calling and small screen for your video? Mine's the opposite :confused:

That happens if you switch to the back camera. Switch to front facing camera and your video will be a thumbnail and the other party will be full screen.

I'm glad Skype did this so that when you switch to the back camera, you can more easily see what you are showing the other party. You don't need to see them as well in this scenario.

Overall, I am very pleased. I had a video call on my iphone while riding as passenger using the back facing camera pointed out the window. The other party, who was in Europe, said it felt like they were right there in the car, as the video quality was that good.

The other important thing, was that video and audio were always in sync. Nice!
 
1) Caller starts call on their device (could be a phone or computer).

2) Service like Skype identifies where the call should be routed.

3) Skype sends a Push Notification to Apple

4) Apple sends the Push Notification to the user (this could be lost at this point, or delayed significantly)

5) The user can Accept the call once they receive the push notification

6) The VOIP App would start up, connect to the service and then connect the call.

Exactly! Good description. And then you could be logged into Skype with no battery usage. The above can be nearly instant (I have yet to see evidence why that’s impossible, since many things on the Internet go through more steps than that). And if the caller wishes to cancel their own call during any of those steps, they can. Step 6 then fails and the recipient sees a Connection Failed notice.

The app launch is the longest step; it would make the call ring for a second or two more. And if you use Skype enough that it stays in memory, then that’s skipped anyway—so the launch delay would only affect occasional Skype recipients, as it should.

I’m still hoping that Skype might have already gotten this right, because battery life matters (and RAM does too—when, eventually, you run out).

If not... You make a case that the way things are is “good enough,” and that may be true for some. It’s a valid point. And if you’re a Skype fan, I respect that because I am too (and would like to become one on mobile as well). Many people stay near chargers a lot, for one thing, or have habits that never run down their battery. Not much problem in that case.

But I haven’t seen a case for why adding smart use of Apple’s Push service wouldn’t be even better. You’ve said it would have to add connection delay, and you seem to be certain that there’s NO way this delay could be kept brief enough not to matter. But that sounds like an educated guess to me—and I see Push working near-instantly all the time, even when an app launch is involved. So I still hope for better from Skype in future.

And any Skype fan should be glad for anything that adds to awareness of how Skype could improve. OR adds to awareness of how Skype already did exactly what I’m hoping! (But my hope is shrinking.)

(And I certainly will NOT keep Skype running if, as people seem to think, it uses battery while waiting to receive. Instead, people will have to push an IM to me telling me to get on Skype. Which is power-efficient but awkward for both parties... and also a reminder of how Skype could simplify that: the Push could launch Skype instead of launching Meebo to tell me to launch Skype :) Which is a lot like how FaceTime works, in fact, and Apple has offered the necessary Push service to 3rd parties too.)
 
Exactly! Good description. And then you could be logged into Skype with no battery usage. The above can be nearly instant (I have yet to see evidence why that’s impossible, since many things on the Internet go through more steps than that). And if the caller wishes to cancel their own call during any of those steps, they can. Step 6 then fails and the recipient sees a Connection Failed notice.

That's not a good user experience. The current system handles the unreliability of data networks, Apple's Push Notification System and the VOIP network itself much better.

The app launch is the longest step; it would make the call ring for a second or two more. And if you use Skype enough that it stays in memory, then that’s skipped anyway—so the launch delay would only affect occasional Skype recipients, as it should.

The App launch is not the longest step - connecting to the service is.

The App must connect, find out what it should do next (it doesn't get any data from the push notification), find out the IP of the caller, connect to the caller and establish a call.

I’m still hoping that Skype might have already gotten this right, because battery life matters (and RAM does too—when, eventually, you run out).

RAM usage is absolutely not a concern with VOIP Apps on iOS - Apple has ensured that in a very impressive way.

But I haven’t seen a case for why adding smart use of Apple’s Push service wouldn’t be even better. You’ve said it would have to add connection delay, and you seem to be certain that there’s NO way this delay could be kept brief enough not to matter. But that sounds like an educated guess to me—and I see Push working near-instantly all the time, even when an app launch is involved. So I still hope for better from Skype in future.

It's simple - Apple and VOIP companies do not believe Push delivers a suitable experience. Adding Push notifications would be a step back and would involve not using important features of iOS.

Let's put it this way. There's a HELL of a lot that Apple isn't allowing on iOS. When they DO allow something (like VOIP) - you know it's important.
 
I know what you’re saying—I’m just looking for more actual evidence to figure out what’s going on, and whether the problems BOTH of us are imagining are real!

VOIP is important without a doubt. So is Push. If Push is as bad as you say, that’s a shame—and I put it on Apple to fix it, not Skype. But I still haven’t seen any evidence that the problems you describe are real and insurmountable. You say Push would be a bad user experience, and you seem certain, but I think that’s more of an assumption. Yes, Push requires a few steps—but why can’t those steps be efficient? They seem to be efficient in (some, not all) other apps.

And I also haven’t seen (clear enough) evidence of the battery drain from leaving Skype logged in—so, fingers crossed that it’s not true! And then Push vs. not-Push doesn’t matter as much.

I HAVE seen that Skype quits when not in use, and doesn’t leave me logged in. So for now it doesn’t matter—it won’t work for me yet, so battery life is a concern for me someday, not today :)

And when talking about how BIG a problem is, you have to remember that we use multiple apps. If an app drains just a LITTLE battery and just a LITTLE RAM, but you use several such apps, together they are a problem. Whereas Push lets an app use NO resources--until they are needed.

My pure guess as to the reason Apple allows VOIP 24/7: they know it could be a lot of work for VOIP companies to use another method, and that many just wouldn’t adapt their systems to involve Push. Fair enough—I can be patient with Skype if they tell us that’s the case, and I’ll hope they do that work eventually. But that other method might still be better in the end.
 
And when talking about how BIG a problem is, you have to remember that we use multiple apps. If an app drains just a LITTLE battery and just a LITTLE RAM, but you use several such apps, together they are a problem. Whereas Push lets an app use NO resources--until they are needed.

The big issue with battery consumption is not what an App is doing (ostensibly CPU usage), but what the phone must do to support that App running.

Skype uses 0% CPU when it is in the background (it's not allowed to use any more unless you're in a call). Skype isn't draining the battery - the device is.

The iPhone will keep Wi-Fi switched on instead of turning it off (this drains a lot of power). If Wi-Fi isn't available, it'll maintain an active data connection over 2G or 3G - both of these generally use a lot of power.

Other processes on the phone might need to do more to keep these things going.

As such, your fear about battery consumption with multiple Apps is unfounded. Given the limited amount of Apps able to run in the background on iOS, it's unlikely that you'll ever have more than one doing it at a time. Even if you do, the thing that drains the battery the most is not the Apps - it's keeping the phone's hardware on.

As I've explained before, RAM usage is not an issue on iOS.
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.