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fener said:
A mispoint.

There is 1 GiG PER HI-MD , not the MD Player. This is a MD player, and you use minidiscs with it, which each has a gig capacity.

They will retail aroung 7$ each. And the player is to cost 325$, (much higher if you buy through Sony, though; maybe like 400$)

If you make a rough calculation:
7$ * 10 Discs = 70 $ That will give you 70 GIG. Plus, 325$ for the player, you will have 70 GIGS of DATA, not just music, all removable, for under 400$

now, thats very high Cost/Benefit.

First off, yeah, I know it's one gig per MD, and no maximum for the player, but I was assuming one disc because of the limitations I already discussed-you can only have one in at once, it's a pain to cary other discs, keep track of which music is where, etc. you don't want to be swappiing discs out every couple of songs on the subway or walking etc. but you do want to have access to more than one gig at a time, etc. etc.

Also, am I misreading, or is your math wrong? $7*10 Discs=$70, but that is not 70 gig. It's not a dollar a gig, it's seven dollars a gig. 10 Discs * 1 gig/disc=10 gig. You've paid $400 for 10 gigs. That's not high cost benefit. You get twice the storage, and all in once place, with the 400 dollar ipod.

And for that matter, wanna go for the top of the line ipod's capacity, and carry around 40 minidiscs? that's 40*$7=280 dollars, plus the 325 for the player, and boom, you've broken 600 bucks.

The one way in which it is cost effective is that if you have a growing library, you don't have to predict it's final size, and buy that, but you can start at the bottom, and your player can grow with you. If you buy an ipod mini, it becomes too small, you buy a 20 gig, it becomes to small, you buy a 40, then obviously you're paying more.

Of course, there is the other inefficient option with an ipod, of you buying an ipod, the battery running out, buy another of the same size, it dies, buy another. That one I'm still cursing apple for.
 
dontmatter said:
First off, yeah, I know it's one gig per MD, and no maximum for the player, but I was assuming one disc because of the limitations I already discussed-you can only have one in at once, it's a pain to cary other discs, keep track of which music is where, etc. you don't want to be swappiing discs out every couple of songs on the subway or walking etc. but you do want to have access to more than one gig at a time, etc. etc.

Also, am I misreading, or is your math wrong? $7*10 Discs=$70, but that is not 70 gig. It's not a dollar a gig, it's seven dollars a gig. 10 Discs * 1 gig/disc=10 gig. You've paid $400 for 10 gigs. That's not high cost benefit. You get twice the storage, and all in once place, with the 400 dollar ipod.

And for that matter, wanna go for the top of the line ipod's capacity, and carry around 40 minidiscs? that's 40*$7=280 dollars, plus the 325 for the player, and boom, you've broken 600 bucks.

The one way in which it is cost effective is that if you have a growing library, you don't have to predict it's final size, and buy that, but you can start at the bottom, and your player can grow with you. If you buy an ipod mini, it becomes too small, you buy a 20 gig, it becomes to small, you buy a 40, then obviously you're paying more.

Of course, there is the other inefficient option with an ipod, of you buying an ipod, the battery running out, buy another of the same size, it dies, buy another. That one I'm still cursing apple for.


Yeah, its 10 gig, not 70
 
Not impossible

jxyama said:
i don't dispute that some of the posts here are extremely biased in favor of apple, but what you said above is impossible. ipod's been out for 3 years. if you had three ipods averaging 18 months, the first one you purchased must have been 4.5 years ago.


Not impossible. I bought two gen 1 iPods, one for me and one for my son's graduation from the Apple Store. Both players died between 18-22 months after purchase. Both died from HD failure.

After my first iPod failed, I bought a third iPod. It was a gen 3 and I bought it from BestBuy with a 2 year replacement program. The hard drive died after about 15 months but at least this unit was replaced free by BestBuy.

So when I say I bought 3 ipods that averaged only about 18 months for HD life, I may have even been giving the iPod the benefit of the doubt. I didn't say they died consecutively. Two died in parallel.
 
I agree on why iPod has been a big hit.

Fast and easy controls. its as simple as that.

I 've not seen any players as fast as iPod handling the database.

I used RCA Lyra A/V Jukebox. If I were to compare it with iPod, well I can't. Only thing to compare is that its price. 50 bucks cheaper.

It has a 3.5" screen, which is good. Able to watch movies is good, but there is no way you can use it as an MP3 player. Very slow, and bad U/I.

So, I sent the unit back, bought a new iPod 15 gig, and bought a GBA video player for 35 bucks. (Love the GBA s batt life, around 14-16 hours!)

Happy now.
 
digitalbiker said:
Next, who says that Sony is not working on new jukebox type software to aid in the purchase, download, transfer of Attrac format songs to MD and Memory stick for various players.

They may very well be working on something new, but right NOW the software I've seen and played with sucks butt. As for memory stick.
soapbox.gif

Three words: Cybershot 707 $1,000. I, and many others, got bent over and ****ed by Sony on their crapstick and their redesign scheme that left our quad digit priced camera in the dust. The camera was debuted in Fall of 2001. I got mine Summer of 2002 and less then 6 months later Sony announced the Memory stick Pro that was not compatible with the 707's and every other memory stick device currently on the market. They threw us a bone with those duo crap things that only go up to 256. I will NEVER again trust Sony proprietary memory crap. EVER. I'd sooner use a memory standard pioneered by Microsoft. If you can't tell I'm the side of homicidal about this subject. I own Sony TV's, speakers, DVD players, PS2 but I will be danged if I will ever touch, breath upon, or glance at a memory stick without going ape****.
new_cussing.gif


Frankly competition is good for Apple otherwise they would sit on their laurels, competition forces Apple to innovate or die. Apple does it's best work when it is under pressure to survive.

Amen.
 
funkywhat2 said:
i tried installing it on my wintel, it doesn't let you specify a drive to install it on. it has to be on the boot drive. wtf is that, are they scanning your drive and sending reports back to sony each time you boot up?

That's funny. I installed on my D: drive (ie: not bootdrive) just fine.

The installer is kinda sucky, though, like SiliconAddict mentioned. Haven't rebooted yet so I haven't had a chance to check out the program itself.
 
SiliconAddict said:
If you can't tell I'm the side of homicidal about this subject. I own Sony TV's, speakers, DVD players, PS2 but I will be danged if I will ever touch, breath upon, or glance at a memory stick without going ape****.
new_cussing.gif




Amen.


Unless they get a music store with lots of music in Japan and parts of Asia I cant see them getting far...
 
digitalbiker said:
Not impossible. I bought two gen 1 iPods, one for me and one for my son's graduation from the Apple Store. Both players died between 18-22 months after purchase. Both died from HD failure.

After my first iPod failed, I bought a third iPod. It was a gen 3 and I bought it from BestBuy with a 2 year replacement program. The hard drive died after about 15 months but at least this unit was replaced free by BestBuy.

So when I say I bought 3 ipods that averaged only about 18 months for HD life, I may have even been giving the iPod the benefit of the doubt. I didn't say they died consecutively. Two died in parallel.

ouch... sorry to hear that. :( (and apologies if i sounded like i questioned you. it just didn't make sense to me the way i read it... so thanks for the details.)
 
sushi said:
Very practical. That is why they sell very well here in Japan.

Sushi

Care to elaborate? When I asked how practical it was I meant from a UI standpoint. It doesn't seem to have anywhere near the incredible UI (i.e. scroll-wheel) that the iPod has. Does it at least have the hierarchical menu system like the iPod?

Frank
 
digitalbiker said:
This site is ridiculously bias toward Apple!

And the award for "Obvious Statement of the Month" goes to...............


digitalbiker!!!!!!!!!!

Frank
 
fener said:
If you make a rough calculation:
7$ * 10 Discs = 70 $ That will give you 10 GIG. Plus, 325$ for the player, you will have 10 GIGS of DATA, not just music, all removable, for under 400$

now, thats very high Cost/Benefit. (count batt life too)

Don't forget to add the cost of adding bigger pockets to all of your clothes so that you can carry all of those discs.

Frank
 
I actually had a Net Minidisc. The player was really something. It was cheap (US$130), small, light and it uses 1 AA battery that last more than 40 HOURS!!!

The thing that crippled it was the software, the obligatory conversion to ATRAC, that decrease the quality of the music (and delays the transfers). If the player had been able to play MP3 in addition to ATRAC, it would have been just what I wanted.

I haven't tried the new software, but if Sony has solved those issues it can compete with the iPod. Also, you have been comparing the price of only the high end of the new Minidisc players. The low end start around US$180. In addition, the high end can record through line in and MIC in, which is very important for a lot of people.
 
Heltik

macrumors member

*

Location: UK





Read the article. Et Tu Sheryl Crow!! After all her "I love iTunes and Garageband". I guess Sony paid her a lot of money? Or are Sony her record label?? That would explain a thing or too.

So anyway. You'd want the most featured Sony... at $299 was it? And then 40 * $7 odd for 40 gigs capacity. So that's another $280. And then you'll need a very study bag to put them all in. And probably a PDA to index the tracks on each of those puppies.... And if it was me, then I'd have to hire some poor soul to fill 40 gigs worth of Mini Disc woohoo hi-density discs, because I'm buggered if I'd do that myself...

And then when I finally got sick of all that instead of just... wait for it "plugging the iPod cable in"... then I'd have a whole 40 Gigs of music that I really couldn't do much with.

Bargain. All aboard the idiot train!!

Personally, as soon as it's available in the UK, I'll be going with iTunes. As long as it's about 60 pence tops a track. We get utterly ripped off in the UK!!
 
digitalbiker said:
How will all of the itms users feel when in 3 years AAC fairplay is abandoned and "encryptionofthemonth" is used instead. Now your entire music catalog is frozen in time and your only option is to re-buy everything using the new "encryptionofthemonth" technology with better specs. You might be able to convert from AAC fairplay to "encryptionofthemonth" but it will be at a loss of quality.

Who gets burned? Apple, who get to re-sell their entire catalog? The music industry? The user who bought into the itms scheme?

If Apple were to upgrade its DRM or increase the bit rate, I can guarantee you that users would be able to re-download all their purchased music with a single click for free. Apple already does this for users who are installing ITMS on one of their five computers. You move to another computer, authorize the ITMS, and boom, your music begins to download. Steve Jobs has repeatedly said that the music you download on iTunes is yours forever.
 
That NY Times article was a pretty funny read. You could tell they were trying to not become too negative with their criticism-but they couldn't cause it was THAT bad.
 
AndrewMT said:
If Apple were to upgrade its DRM or increase the bit rate, I can guarantee you that users would be able to re-download all their purchased music with a single click for free. Apple already does this for users who are installing ITMS on one of their five computers. You move to another computer, authorize the ITMS, and boom, your music begins to download. Steve Jobs has repeatedly said that the music you download on iTunes is yours forever.

Are you sure about this? Have you actually authorized another computer and the music that you have already downloaded??? I have always had to transfer the music from the computer on which I originally downloaded it.

Frank
 
frankly said:
Are you sure about this? Have you actually authorized another computer and the music that you have already downloaded??? I have always had to transfer the music from the computer on which I originally downloaded it.

Frank

Yeah, you go to "Advanced" > "Check for Purchased Music....." and you type in your account login and pass and you're done! It's an awesome feature that a lot of people don't know about.
 
Macrumors said:
Sony launched their music download service today -- "Connect".

Not to be a troll here, but this article seems slightly hippocritical.
The service, however, appears to be built around supporting Sony's own MiniDisc format, which has not seen significant commercial success over the past several years.

Actually, Minidisc has seen success, in parts of the world outside the U.S.A.

Sony is expected to introduce high capacity MiniDisc devices later this year.

The format was introduced some time ago. The actual launch has been pushed back twice. The most recent time was the launch scheduled for a couple days ago. The current delay is because of a manuafacturing issue involving the new high capacity discs. Current launch date is late June.
While songs are similarly priced to the rest of the industry ($.99/song), Sony will be using the ATRAC song format, making it incompatible with most MP3 players and the iPod.

Replace "Sony" with "Apple", "ATRAC" with "DRM protected AAC" and "the iPod" with "Minidisc".

Now read the sentence again.
 
SeaFox said:
Actually, Minidisc has seen success, in parts of the world outside the U.S.A.

[snip]

Replace "Sony" with "Apple", "ATRAC" with "DRM protected AAC" and "the iPod" with "Minidisc".

Now read the sentence again.

a few caveats:

1) US is the biggest market in the world. yes, MD is very popular in Japan, but no company would feel comfortable if the device they are trying to sell is not successful in the biggest market.

2) iPod is the most popular portable music player. the fact something isn't compatible with iPod is a big negative, while not being compatible with MD isn't as big of a problem.

and believe me, i wish MD had taken off in the US. i converted all of my CDs into MDs back in 1999. i even labeled all the songs and discs, manually, one by one, for most of 200+ MDs i own. then bang!, i get an iPod and song names and disc names are automatically labeled and they all fit in one device. :mad: :( :eek: :D :cool:
 
ebunton said:
The true nature of Connect is revealed...

Here is news of an interesting Sony Product on MacMinute I found earlier.

http://www.vaio.sony.co.jp/Products/VGF-AP1/index.html

Yes, this is supposed to be the iPod killer...From a gadget point of view I do think Apple has to do some catching up with the GUI on their iPod. It suddenly looks a bit old fashioned, compared to the Vaio. Not that I care that much, but the innocent customer probably will.

Battery life is another strong point for the Vaio (20 hrs). But it's ATRAC centric so you'll have to convert your mp3's etc. to this format before you can upload from your PC.
 
gwuMACaddict said:
nope
i had one of the original minidiscs for jogging. it was worthless. skipped all the time. and i hated that you could really only record once on a disc... i think this technology is useless... why doesnt anyone do anything with flash memory yet?

you should learn more about what you own...
MiniDiscs are rewritable, you can add tracks to a recorded disc if there's space.
AND, there's whole lotta devices out there which uses flash, but the capacity is low and still expensive compared to HDD and Optical discs.
 
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