You can download the Lisa here: http://lisa.sunder.net/downloads.html
Who is going to port it iOS? That would be interesting......
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I heard that Jobs gave Bill a copy of MacOS so they could code Office better, and then suddenly Windows comes out.....coincidence?
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restraining order prevents that....
wrong. Apple bought the right to use tech demoed to them by Xerox for millions in stock. Please cite your claim that MS did the same.Per Al Kossow, the Lisa operating system has some historical significance which will be detailed in an upcoming CHM blog post that will accompany the release of the operating system source code.
What we already know is that the Lisa operating system was one of the first graphical user interfaces to a commercial operating system, much of it cribbed by Apple from a quick visit to Xerox PARC. Microsoft Windows quickly followed the Lisa operating system and while Apple claimed that Microsoft had copied the Lisa operating system, in fact Microsoft had also seen the Xerox PARC work themselves.
The Lisa operating system was followed by the Macintosh and its game-changing operating system.
wrong. Apple bought the right to use tech demoed to them by Xerox for millions in stock.
Further, Apple then added a whole lot to what they saw.
Actually, not quit. primatives could be written in machine language, C, and other languages.Clascal. Pascal with classes. No C anywhere in sight.
If I remember correctly, contemporary workstations included the Xerox Star (at about $10K), first-generation Sun workstations (at about $20K) and Apollo workstations (at about $30K). But all of them were large systems (large towers) with large monitors, not compact desktop systems.$9995 in 1985 is equivalent to over $25k in 2017. So a top-of-the-line iMac Pro ($13k) is still about half of what the Lisa cost back then. For an exponentially more powerful computer. As a business machine, the price is fair.
Perhaps they will be able to get/share commented source code/disassembly of the ROM?excuse my ignorance, but surely not much of the source code would of much use to anyone, especially since most of the Lisa/Mac in the early days relied on the graphics toolbox built into the ROM, right?
I agree. The important thing to note is C's design goals. Its original purpose was for implementing system software. Specifically, to make the UNIX kernel source code portable across platforms. As such, it had to be extremely lightweight and very close to the hardware.When C first hit the scene, I thought it was a step backward in terms of computer language development, primarily due to it being closer to the hardware and requiring the programmer to be (painfully) aware of and managing null termination on strings.
This is great news. Hopefully it will spur someone to produce a Lisa emulator with all these apps so we can run them and experience what computing with one of the first GUI platforms was like.
Having had personal experience with the Xerox Star, early versions of SunOS (SunVew GUI), early Macs (System 6) and having read Jef Raskin's books, it will be particularly interesting to play with the Lisa environment, comparing it against what I already know from that era.
If I remember correctly, contemporary workstations included the Xerox Star (at about $10K), first-generation Sun workstations (at about $20K) and Apollo workstations (at about $30K). But all of them were large systems (large towers) with large monitors, not compact desktop systems.
If Apple had been able to break into the business/scientific market with the Lisa, it would have been priced very attractively.
Perhaps they will be able to get/share commented source code/disassembly of the ROM?
But even if they don't, ROM images are available to someone who is good at performing web searches.
If we have the OS sources, however, then it should be possible to recompile them for a replacement library. The result won't be a Lisa emulator per se, but may be just fine to make a platform that can run Lisa apps.
I agree. The important thing to note is C's design goals. Its original purpose was for implementing system software. Specifically, to make the UNIX kernel source code portable across platforms. As such, it had to be extremely lightweight and very close to the hardware.
It became popular in the UNIX world primarily because every UNIX system had a C compiler available. But on other platforms, other more powerful languages (BASIC, Pascal, FORTRAN, COBOL, etc.) were far more popular, because they were easier to work with for designing applications.
Today, thanks to extremely powerful computers and servers, the pendulum is swinging back in the other direction, with application development focusing on languages like JavaScript, Python and Ruby, which are extremely high-level (and wholly unsuitable for low-level system software) with very rich standard libraries. In addition to what I think of as expanded versions of C (C++, Objective C, C#, Swift) that attempt to bridge the gap by offering features relevant to both system and application software.
I mean in terms of the depth of the language's features. C has almost no features, offloading everything into libraries (standard, OS, and others). BASIC, offers quite a robust set of features built-in.“Other more powerful languages (BASIC...”. You lost me right there![]()
I may have chosen my words poorly there. I don't mean to imply that Swift's syntax is C-like - it is quite different. But at an architectural level, it draws from many other languages including quite a lot of Objective C (which in turn grafted SmallTalk's object model onto C).Also, I wouldn’t describe SWIFT as a version of C. It isn’t very c-like (which is one of the reasons I still haven’t mastered it)
It actually used "Twiggy" disks, which were unique Apple inventions. They were 5.25", but they featured two slots for heads. The drive had two head assemblies - one for each surface, one making contact in each slot. The heads shared an armature, moving in synchronization together.The Lisa pictured appears to be a later 3.5 inch floppy disk version. The original came with two 5.25 inch floppies. I was one of the first to own a Lisa and it remains my favorite computer I have ever had.
That's what I had always read. Apple was short on business software and Microsoft promised to develop a spreadsheet and word processor for the Mac OS. Apple gave Microsoft the code and Gates and company went to work reverse engineering it to create Windows.
Now, just think if Gates had ripped off the Amiga OS instead of the Mac where Windows would be today![]()
I mean in terms of the depth of the language's features. C has almost no features, offloading everything into libraries (standard, OS, and others). BASIC, offers quite a robust set of features built-in.
BASIC's biggest problem was performance, mostly because it was interpreted. But when people started writing compilers (and when Microsoft's dialects added proper functions and did away with line numbers) it became an extremely good language for application development.
I may have chosen my words poorly there. I don't mean to imply that Swift's syntax is C-like - it is quite different. But at an architectural level, it draws from many other languages including quite a lot of Objective C (which in turn grafted SmallTalk's object model onto C).
This is in comparison to languages like Python and Ruby, where not only is the syntax different, but many of the basic concepts (e.g. how parameters are passed to functions) are very different and will come to bite you if you forget and end up thinking using C concepts.
It actually used "Twiggy" disks, which were unique Apple inventions. They were 5.25", but they featured two slots for heads. The drive had two head assemblies - one for each surface, one making contact in each slot. The heads shared an armature, moving in synchronization together.
The Twiggy drives were not very reliable, which is one of the reasons why Apple's engineers soon changed it to Sony 400K 3.5" floppy drives.
Absolutely cool! Guessing it'll be C with some Assembly thrown in there for critical areas....
That brought me back to my high school days of coding in Pascal and adding assembly for fun. Back then there was no programming teacher so they had the geometry teacher teach us...and it was just fun....mainly doing anything graphical that was more advanced than pascal's turtle graphics was done in assembly with some amazing tutorials i had found...man what a memory trip that was!Almost certainly no C. Apple used Pascal as its primary higher-level language back then. The source to QuickDraw and MacPaint were released in 2010. QuickDraw is entirely assembly, and MacPaint is a combination of Pascal and Assembly.
That brought me back to my high school days of coding in Pascal and adding assembly for fun. Back then there was no programming teacher so they had the geometry teacher teach us...and it was just fun....mainly doing anything graphical that was more advanced than pascal's turtle graphics was done in assembly with some amazing tutorials i had found...man what a memory trip that was!
Wasn’t called Mac OS back then. It was System 7, System 8 etc.
My Lisa Purchased in 1982,had both drives.The Lisa pictured appears to be a later 3.5 inch floppy disk version. The original came with two 5.25 inch floppies. I was one of the first to own a Lisa and it remains my favorite computer I have ever had.
pascal's turtle graphics
Benefits?I wonder why ? what a are the benefits to this ?
I would be nice to go back in time and see a unboxing of the Lisa with people of that era and see the reactions.
Now, just think if Gates had ripped off the Amiga OS instead of the Mac where Windows would be today![]()
I always loved that design, the revised one with 3.5” diskettes, which official name was Lisa 2.
Wasn’t that done in LOGO?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turtle_graphics
What is the difference? To me Pascal and C look so alike