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I’m not interested in the musical history of internet music to be honest. We all used Winamp, lastFM, Diamond etc and all these predated Apple and Spotify. I am talking about two companies as detailed in this thread and how their products have developed in the modern era.

I was one of those people once upon a time who stored 20k songs on iTunes and bought CD’s but those days are gone for me. I don’t want to store even more cd’s than I already have much of which my wife is pressuring me to get rid of as I have about 10k of them in boxes in our garage. The best thing I ever did was start using a streaming service. No hassle, dealing with iTunes bugs losing your music etc and the last 6 years iTunes free have been great. More space on my iPhone too and less space on a cloud being paid for. I don’t know many using iTunes these days apart from guy I work with. It’s an unnecessary evil IMHO.
I spent a quite a bit buying albums on iTunes over the years, burned a couple of thousand of my CDs before selling them prior to moving overseas and then last year due to Apple Music and iTunes clashes and some user errors I deleted it all. Now I am ok with using Spotify. Minimising and decluttering can be freeing. Not all will agree but whatever is best for you is fine.
 
Apple should remove all non-Apple apps from the AppStore and see how many iPhones they sell.
If Spotify or Epic want to pull their apps, Apple won't stop them. The devs are only on the app store because it's making them money, the argument is solely about wanting a bigger cut of the pie.
 
If you owned a store would you sell a product where the manufacturer put a sticker on the box telling you to go somewhere else to buy it cheaper?
If you sell World of Warcraft in your store, it has been like that for 15 years: Of course people are directed to buy subscriptions elsewhere. With stickers directly on the box.

The base game is paid in the store though. Apple needs to come up with a different model that compensates them for their recommendation/discovery services as well as the technical services to download/update the app. This cannot be anywhere near 15% though.
 
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Think about the App Store like a really nice shopping mall. Businesses pay rent, but they don't pay a percentage of their sales. Seems like Apple needs to offer some additional business models for in app purchase instead of taking 30% cut.

For example, someone downloads Spotify for free on the App Store. Spotify pays apple $1 for the download to a new potential paying customer to cover the hosting, financial transaction, app review, etc. If they subscribe to a monthly in app purchase, take 30% the first month, and then 30% once a year....
Many malls. Especially the better ones do take a cut of the stores sales. Next
 
That isn’t what we’re talking about though. What we’re talking about is purchases within an app, not purchases in the App Store.

For Apple to require a 30% cut of in-app purchases would be like Google asking for a 30% cut of anything you ordered from Amazon in the Chrome web browser. Or for Google to disallow purchases from within Chrome if they don’t go through Google merchant tools. If it wasn’t for the requirement that you make purchases through their payment APIs, no part of those in-app purchases would have anything to do with Apple. The infrastructure to deliver the content doesn’t live on Apple servers, so why do they deserve any part of that once they’ve delivered the app to a user’s phone?
Not at all the same.
A large part of the appeal of the App store is that if I have any issue with charges from an in-app purchase, I take those issues to the App store for resolution, and they are handled under consistent Apple policy compliant with the laws in our country, instead of having to chase fly-by-night developers for a refund on the worthless "spins" that their game just sold my 7yo for $65. The minute Apple allow apps to handle payment outside the app store, you can kiss goodbye any refund for defective/misleading app store purchases.
 
Those supposed billions that you talk about came from you and I spending our money on iPhones. There is a monopoly and the US Government has stated so already. It's a question of what remedies are going to be put in place.
No, the US government never said such a thing and no court is going to rule that a company that has a minority share of the market is anywhere near a monopoly. Next?
 
Again, should Best Buy allow free items to exist on their shelves, advertised by them, traffic created by them, etc. with a label on the item that says pay for activation at www.websitex.com?

Even if its not free, if the item has a price tag of $19.99 but a sticker on it says "or pay for me at www.websitex.com and pay only $14.99" no retailer on the planet would allow that.
True, but if there is only Bestbuy in your town and no one else is allowed to open a supermarket, it will be questioned for sure.

We don't talk about moving out of the town. We are talking the people live in the town now.
 
Probably been said somewhere in the previous 14 pages, but Spotify is by far the largest music streaming service in the world. If that is being strangled, well, I don't know what to say.
 
You will when Apple takes over everything and you have zero choice. How will you feel then?
Every single day, more android phones are sold than iPhones.
iMessage? Not available on android.
tv+? Not available on android.
Fitness+? Not available on android.
Apple News? Not available on android.
On top of this, anyone who uses Apple Music on android is actually giving 30% of their monthly subscription to Google, since it goes through the play store.
Apple is nowhere near taking over the Internet. I mean, not even close.
 
Anyone who downvoted this statement permits their agenda to overlook an uncounterable argument. This is pure truth.
It's true, but it's not relevant. It takes a massive investment to build and run a shopping mall and attract customers to it, but does that mean you should be able to set up a stall inside somebody else's mall to sell your product without paying them, just because asking you to commit those resources is too big an impost, and there's no more real estate in that suburb to build your own mall in? And yes, some malls do have lease agreements including a percentage of turnover at different tiers, and will terminate your lease, kick you out, and keep all your stock locked up while they take you to court if you try to take payment on the side which you don't declare to them.
 
Well, realistically, they’re one of the two major mobile platforms.

Also, honest question: is Spotify one of the apps that Apple won’t allow to advertise, after downloading the app, that subscriptions can be purchased outside of the App Store? I honestly don’t know the answer to this, so I’m asking.

Lastly, I hate having to go to the Amazon website on my iPhone or iPad to buy a book or rent a movie. You can’t even use the Amazon app to do so! Does Apple get a cut of stuff I order thro the Amazon app? Why are books and movies different? I’m really surprised that both sides have never come to an agreement about this, especially since it’s been doable on Android for as long as I can remember.
Read the app store policy. Physical goods (books and pizzas) and services (such as Uber) are treated differently to digital goods (apps) and services (subscriptions), for reasons that are completely valid and should be obvious.
 
People can change and move to Android and all these "limitations" disappear magically. Apple is not a public service, but a private company. We should start from there and look forward.
 
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Let’s continue your argument to the extreme, I own the airwaves, it’s my 5G or LTE network, I built all of the infrastructure that allows all of your (Apple or otherwise) to connect with each other...of course you’re free to develop your own platform, build your own towers, launch your own satellites if that‘s what you prefer. Now, whilst your using my platform, that by the way, you have to pay me for, I want you to use my payment system, yes when you pay to access my network, you must pay to use it with my payment system. Oh, and if you guys who are using my network sell anything to each other, I would like you to give me 30% of the transaction fee. The reason, you ask? Well, for one it costs me and absolute fortune collecting all this money from your transactions and two, well I have to check every device that’s on my network, to make sure they’re not being naughty and that costs a lot of money too........
Except that Apple aren't in this position, they have a minority of the smartphone platform market, they're not stopping Spotify distributing an app for free on the App store, they're not stopping Spotify selling subs on their own website, and they're not taking a commission on sales on Spotify's website.
 
Beermat maths.

158 million subscribers x £9.99 = £1,578,420,000 per month
0.05% of 158 million subscribers = 7.9m subscribers
15% of £9.99 = £1.49
30% of £9.99 = $2.98
7.9m * 1.49 = £11,771,000 per month to Apple
7.9m * 2.98 = £23,542,000 per month to Apple

At 30%, £23m is a drop in the ocean, compared to the almost £1.6b Spotify gets a month.

Unless of course Spotify are lying about their subscriber base.

Huge revenues here for products they dont actually own (the music).
 
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These are rather problematic, not just Music, but also the other categories where Apple directly competes with others in the App Store, like Fitness and Video Streaming.

It's a difficult position to compete from if you have to give 30% revenue to your competitor to begin with.
FedEx and UPS seem to do just fine against the USPS.
 
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I wonder if all these guys band up together and remove their app from Appstore. And these are some very well established, popular apps with a huge user base. Will a user prefer the iPhone if they know all those apps not available in AppStore. I mean, AppStore is one main reason why Windows phone could never raise its head, similar to Android tablets.
 
Well, maybe Apple should go ahead and announce that they're taking a 30% cut from their own subscriptions as well. It wouldn't matter since the money would be go right back to them, but at least it'd shut people like Spotify and Epic up.

Can't be anticompetitive if we're taking a 30% cut too from all Apple Music and iCloud subscriptions amirite!
Imagine if they (Apple) said they were taking 30% from their subscriptions to give to charities. The Spotifies and Epics would blow a gasket because they wanted a cut and that Apple was performing unfair marketing practices that forced people to like them more, lol.
 
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The question is: if Spotify had a kind of App-Store, would it allow competitors on it to direct users to the competing platform for topping up a subscription?

The problem is that if you allow Netflix and Spotify to do this, you have to allow everybody to do this.
And then you have to ask: if people's credit card data is compromised because they were directed to some other site, who will take the blame in the court of public opinion?

Pundits will just scream "But Apple needs to check all the sites where it directs people to!!11".

Imagine having a populuar blog and allowing people to comment on it.
Then comment spam starts to appear, directing users to some shady websites.
Then people click on these links advertising cheap "health enhancements" etc.pp. entering their credit-card-details etc.

People will blame you, not themselves...
 
People can change and move to Android and all these "limitations" disappear magically. Apple is not a public service, but a private company. We should start from there and look forward.
Its not people that are complaining, the software companies are. I know some spotify users, on iphone and android, and I've asked them what they think about this, and they just shrug their shoulders, not giving two damns.
 
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Except Apple doesn’t take a cut of everything. If they deserve a cut because of the time and money they invest in iPhone/iOS then why doesn’t Uber have to pay them 30% of every transaction? Why does Apple allow reader apps which don’t require IAP?
The actual Uber service is not ‘consumed’ on the iPhone. Therefore the 30/15% does not apply. Buying physical books on the iPhone: same. Buying ebooks in the Kindle app on the iPhone: ah, you would consume it on the iPhone, therefore the 30/15% would apply. Amazon doesn’t want to pay that, so you have to use a web browser for purchasing. It’s a non issue in my opinion.
 
I can agree that apple has the right to its cut on payments done through App Store, but apple not allowing Spotify to direct people to its website seems shady
What ? Shady ? So Spotify can use, AppStore, Apple SDK for the App, and just wehre the Pay Apple for using the Plattform ? The App is free and they just say, ill take everything you are giving me and pay nothing and on top of that ill sue you for the "Anticompetitive" behaviour ... like What, where is the "Innovatioion" here, what have Spotify dine to pay the Artisit more, that they have more ... just Nothing, Spotify business is important here not the innovaiton or what so ever....
 
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