Spotify Raising Prices in Multiple Countries

[Krizoitz]

If buying is not owning, then 🏴‍☠️ isn’t stealing.

1. There have always been things you have to pay for but don't get to keep.

Ever bought a meal? Once you eat it, it's gone. Does that mean you should get to steal food?

Ever been to a concert? A sporting event? A performance of any kind? You paid money for something that you never owned and that you'll never be able to experience again in the same way.

Ever taken a taxi? Leased a car? Flown an an airplane? You've never owned any of those things, so are you saying you should get to take them freely?

Finally ever paid someone to do something for you? A plumber perhaps? A house painter? A doctor? You can't own those people (well not anymore) so does that mean you shouldn't have to pay them?

See how stupid that statement is?


2. Yes piracy is stealing, always has been, always will be.

Ownership is only one kind of financial transaction. If you don't like the terms, either don't participate or find someone with terms you agree with. The alternative to "I don't like these terms" isn't "Therefore I get to take it freely".

Unless, that is you are willing to sell me your home for $1. If you don't agree then I'm just going to take your house and by your logic its not stealing.

 

[ijordano]

Not paying artists and funding genocide is expensive

 

[ijordano]

1. There have always been things you have to pay for but don't get to keep.

Ever bought a meal? Once you eat it, it's gone. Does that mean you should get to steal food? No but you paid for food to eat and you ate the food, so you got what you paid for

Ever been to a concert? A sporting event? A performance of any kind? You paid money for something that you never owned and that you'll never be able to experience again in the same way. The expectation was that these are fixed length, one off experiences, a better comparison is buying the dvd of a concert, which yes you do get to experience again as many times as you want

Ever taken a taxi? Leased a car? Flown an an airplane? You've never owned any of those things, so are you saying you should get to take them freely? again, you pay for a ride or a ticket from A to B, you dont have to undo your journey after paying for it so actually you do own the journey, in a way

Finally ever paid someone to do something for you? A plumber perhaps? A house painter? A doctor? You can't own those people (well not anymore) so does that mean you shouldn't have to pay them? How silly, you do in fact get to keep the work a plumber, painter, or doctor does

See how stupid that statement is? No, because if you buy an album or a movie digitally, no one should be able to take away your access to that a few years down the line

 

[JamesMay82]

That heavily depends on your approach to listening to music. If you want to listen to the same 200 albums the rest of your life, yes. If you like exploring new music, and not necessarily albums, streaming is far cheaper.

Before streaming, I would typically spend 30-50 USD per month buying CD’s, many of which I haven’t touched after the first week of owning it because it turned out to be crap. I have several friends who spent way more than that.

The new music I have listened to just this week (as of Tuesday morning!) would have cost me at least 50 bucks in the CD era.

This is true, however I read that it's more commonly to happen that our music listening/purchasing slows down after a certain age which is why I prefer the CD's plus you own it as well.

But for people starting their collection you can easily get started with 2nd hand cd's and very often going for Pennys on eBay and Facebook marketplace.

I agree that streaming is fantastic for exploring new music, but I also can’t help wondering if it’s slowly devaluing the experience. When music is just a swipe away and costs virtually nothing per album, it can start to feel disposable. There’s something different about owning a physical copy and it carries a sense of commitment and connection that clicking “play” on a stream just doesn’t give. if thats makes sense

Edit - I also rip all my cd's and organise into iTunes and even that feels a bit more special than streaming. It's like I'm the curator and owner and its mine to keep.

 

[wbeasley]

Free with the purchase of hardware, and then with the purchase of a dev license to put your app in the store. That’s more freemium than free IMO.


You said it caused harm though. You weren’t just making stuff up were you? I want to understand how you think it causes harm.

you can get coding tools and training materials for free without paying them money.
and OS updates long after you bought the hardware. things we once used to pay to get.
that's not freemium at all.

"making stuff up"? is calling someone a liar.
Spotify have been saying hires is coming - for years.
i didnt make them promise something they havent delivered.
it's one of the reasons I ditched them. along with their use of EU to do their dirty work

An agonising timeline of our eight-year wait for lossless Spotify HiFi streaming

As we muse the many other milestones of lossless hi-res streaming

www.whathifi.com

8 year wait for it.

 

[Krizoitz]

@ijordano

No, because if you buy an album or a movie digitally, no one should be able to take away your access to that a few years down the line

1. Then only buy from services that offer that option.

2. That’s not what I was replying to. You want to comment? How about you include the ACTUAL TOPIC AT HAND.

The rest of your comments don’t even apply, because the ignore that topic. Try again.

 

[Velli]

This is true, however I read that it's more commonly to happen that our music listening/purchasing slows down after a certain age which is why I prefer the CD's plus you own it as well.

Definitely. For some it makes more sense to just keep their collection and listen to that. Nothing wrong in that.

But for people starting their collection you can easily get started with 2nd hand cd's and very often going for Pennys on eBay and Facebook marketplace.

The music I was referring to that I listened to yesterday was all released within the last couple of months. Not much of it is likely to be listened to again.

I agree that streaming is fantastic for exploring new music, but I also can’t help wondering if it’s slowly devaluing the experience. When music is just a swipe away and costs virtually nothing per album, it can start to feel disposable. There’s something different about owning a physical copy and it carries a sense of commitment and connection that clicking “play” on a stream just doesn’t give. if thats makes sense

I agree. This is why I demand more from a streaming service than simply a steady flow of music that I like.

Edit - I also rip all my cd's and organise into iTunes and even that feels a bit more special than streaming. It's like I'm the curator and owner and its mine to keep.

I think this is all about mindset though. I do manage my playlists and favourites quite rigorously. I’m sure I’m a minority.

 

[Jensend]

In total per user, or total total?

Per user (and they have more users, so also in total total, but that's irrelevant to the point). That's part of why comparing revenue per stream is silly. Users never pay per stream. They either pay per month or per song.

If an American (or pick any other country) subscribes to both Apple Music and Spotify, the dollar amount from each service that is passed on to the rights holders is similar. Apple is not paying two to three times as much per paid subscriber (in the same country), as the payment charts you may have seen may imply.

 

[GrassShark]

you can get coding tools and training materials for free without paying them money.
and OS updates long after you bought the hardware. things we once used to pay to get.
that's not freemium at all.

What coding tools? I’m asking you to name them — ones that do not require the purchase of any Apple hardware to access or use. Also, OS updates and training materials (I assume you mean documentation and the various wwdc session videos) aren’t free tools, they’re product support.

"making stuff up"? is calling someone a liar.
Spotify have been saying hires is coming - for years.
i didnt make them promise something they havent delivered.
it's one of the reasons I ditched them. along with their use of EU to do their dirty work

An agonising timeline of our eight-year wait for lossless Spotify HiFi streaming

As we muse the many other milestones of lossless hi-res streaming

www.whathifi.com

8 year wait for it.

I asked you to explain how this caused harm. If you can’t do it just say so.

 

[sdz]

Why would I pay monthly for music that I will never own?

Mostly for convenience and because of the recommendation engine and the vast music library.

 

[Think creative]

That heavily depends on your approach to listening to music. If you want to listen to the same 200 albums the rest of your life, yes. If you like exploring new music, and not necessarily albums, streaming is far cheaper.

Before streaming, I would typically spend 30-50 USD per month buying CD’s, many of which I haven’t touched after the first week of owning it because it turned out to be crap. I have several friends who spent way more than that.

The new music I have listened to just this week (as of Tuesday morning!) would have cost me at least 50 bucks in the CD era.

if you're constantly cycling I suppose. But the social media/mindless listening experience is something a lot of us are turning away from. I too have convinced myself that the discovery is important, but in reality are we actually discovering that much new music that we want to listen to again? Also, there's always YouTube if you want to listen once to new stuff constantly. You mention it costing you $50 for the music you would listen to this week, but my question is, how much of that is stuff you would want to listen to again? Are you really finding several hundred dollars worth of great new music you want to have every month, or is it that you like to listen to that much, but stuff that actually sticks with you is closer to a cd or two a month?

I suspect for most people, it's the latter. (I know it is for me). Honestly, finding 12-20 great new albums a year (unless I've discovered a genre I had no clue about and dive into it, for instance I'm now dancing salsa so salsa music as a whole is new to me) would be a great year in music as far as I'm concerned.

Personally, the idea of still finding new music but than deciding if it belongs in my curated collected is something of a new hobby I'm excited about when my iPod parts arrive this weekend. I think

 

[Think creative]

Depends on how much music you buy. Also CD's don't last forever.

How about you accept that not everyone has the same priorities as you and for many of us streaming is a superior option?

for convince and mindless listening streaming is 100% the superior option.

Until it goes down. Or requires your ID or it will then lock you out of your account you've spent hundreds of dollars on, for years. And then the reality that you don't own any of it, well... then it was a very dumb option. (I'm not canceling yet, I'm now just actively working on my own collection so I'm ready).

 

[JamesMay82]

if you're constantly cycling I suppose. But the social media/mindless listening experience is something a lot of us are turning away from. I too have convinced myself that the discovery is important, but in reality are we actually discovering that much new music that we want to listen to again? Also, there's always YouTube if you want to listen once to new stuff constantly. You mention it costing you $50 for the music you would listen to this week, but my question is, how much of that is stuff you would want to listen to again? Are you really finding several hundred dollars worth of great new music you want to have every month, or is it that you like to listen to that much, but stuff that actually sticks with you is closer to a cd or two a month?

I suspect for most people, it's the latter. (I know it is for me). Honestly, finding 12-20 great new albums a year (unless I've discovered a genre I had no clue about and dive into it, for instance I'm now dancing salsa so salsa music as a whole is new to me) would be a great year in music as far as I'm concerned.

Personally, the idea of still finding new music but than deciding if it belongs in my curated collected is something of a new hobby I'm excited about when my iPod parts arrive this weekend. I think

I’m 43 and probably just buy a handful of albums a year and it’s usually older songs that I discover by maybe hearing it on radio or in a movie… last obsession was dr hook

 

[wbeasley]

What coding tools? I’m asking you to name them — ones that do not require the purchase of any Apple hardware to access or use. Also, OS updates and training materials (I assume you mean documentation and the various wwdc session videos) aren’t free tools, they’re product support.


I asked you to explain how this caused harm. If you can’t do it just say

What coding tools? I’m asking you to name them — ones that do not require the purchase of any Apple hardware to access or use. Also, OS updates and training materials (I assume you mean documentation and the various wwdc session videos) aren’t free tools, they’re product support.


I asked you to explain how this caused harm. If you can’t do it just say so.

well there's little point in downloading coding tools if you dont have a device to run it on...
but then you can buy one device AND code for others you dont have and run emulation to test it.

as for harm, i moved to Apple Music and went back to free Spotify because they didnt deliver on their promises. so losing my subscription would harm their bottom line in some small way

 

[Krizoitz]

for convince and mindless listening streaming is 100% the superior option.

Until it goes down. Or requires your ID or it will then lock you out of your account you've spent hundreds of dollars on, for years. And then the reality that you don't own any of it, well... then it was a very dumb option. (I'm not canceling yet, I'm now just actively working on my own collection so I'm ready).

1. Its convenience not convince
2. It's not mindless. I mean maybe it is for you, but then that's a you problem
3. Ok, it goes down, I still got the value out of it that I wanted. I don't NEED to have access to that music indefinitely, that's not important to me. I literally DO NOT CARE about owning it. Just because that is important to YOU doesn't mean it's important to the rest of us. Stop acting like your way is the only way.

 

[mrochester]

I’d love to see some research into the psychology of music streaming.

I suspect it’s one of these purchases where once you’ve committed a certain amount of time and money to it you feel compelled to continue committing more time and money to it because of knowing that as soon as you stop paying, you have absolutely nothing to show for all that time and money committed.

It would also be interesting to see how people feel who have escaped from music streaming after many years. Do they regret all the money they wasted? Do they wish they’d stopped sooner instead of being trapped in an endless cycle of paying for access?

I think it would be fascinating to see.