Surely Apple has employees who read these forums...

Discussion in 'Mac Pro' started by aaronhead14, Dec 21, 2016.

  1. aaronhead14 macrumors 6502

    aaronhead14

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2009
    #1
    Surely Apple has employees who read these forums... right?? I don't see how there's any way Apple doesn't know what consumers want in their products... So why the heck doesn't Apple just make the products we want already? I'm so sick of Apple ignoring our wants and needs.

    This is all I'm asking for:
    • A Mac Pro with a tower-like design (similar to the the pre-2013 Mac Pros).
    • Up to 128 GB RAM (and user-upgradeable)
    • GTX 1080 or Titan Pascal graphics card options
    • A non-proprietary SSD, and plenty of room to add my own SSDs later
    • PCI-e slots for expandability
    THAT'S IT! That's all we want! Just make it happen. It seriously can't be that hard to make a product like this....

    In fact, if you're really so adamantly against making the Mac Pro that everyone wants, please let me make it myself. All you need to to is give me permission to install macOS, and give me Nvidia Pascal drivers.

    In the meantime, I'm really enjoying my new, custom-built Windows PC. But I'm really, really, really missing macOS. It's so much better than Windows!
     
  2. kennyisalive macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2016
    #2
    Apple's head is so far up its own ass that I doubt they can even hear themselves.
     
  3. singhs.apps, Dec 21, 2016
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2016

    singhs.apps macrumors regular

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    Oct 27, 2016
    #3
    Yeah. macOS is what keeps me tethered...for now.

    I have used windows right since win 95 till windows 8 and it isn't so bad... just that this whole transition between a traditional desktop with legacy stuff and the new touch UI is just plain... silly.
    Win7 was just nice.

    But when I look beyond, the hardware variety and power more than makes up for it...
     
  4. nnoble macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2011
    #4
    I can see your point but users on here represent only a part of the market. Also, successful businesses need to look beyond immediate demands and work on things you'll want in the future that you've maybe not even thought about. Who knows, way into the future you'll have the equivalent of todays 3D printer that will provide you, me and every other unique customer with exactly what we want on demand. Only problem I foresee is that there'll be nothing to complain about.
     
  5. JesterJJZ macrumors 68020

    JesterJJZ

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  6. aaronhead14, Dec 21, 2016
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2016

    aaronhead14 thread starter macrumors 6502

    aaronhead14

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2009
    #6
    I despise this way of thinking. Why? Because I see no reason why Apple can't look at both immediate demands and future products. There's absolutely no reason for Apple to abandon (or seemingly abandon) the (arguably) best product in their lineup: the Mac Pro. They can absolutely still make iPads and Watches whilst updating the Mac Pro on a yearly basis.
     
  7. nnoble macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2011
    #7
    By definition there was nothing to despise in what I said. Today's products were conceived, designed and produced yesterday when today was the future. That was 'this way of thinking'. Perhaps what you really despise is that you can not get what you want right now when you want it and as I said originally: "I can see your point". But it's a tough life.
     
  8. Chicane-UK macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2008
    #8
    I had switched to macOS almost exclusively for the last couple of years, but forced myself back to Windows even on my Apple hardware, just to break the 'addiction' - just because Apple just isn't making the products I want. The only way for them to get the message is to vote with your feet.

    Unfortunately I feel Apple are so arrogant they'll just think people aren't buying Macs because of changing markets or change in customer habits.. not because they're failing to release new hardware, and failing to produce the machines that their customers actually want to buy.
     
  9. Draeconis macrumors 6502a

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    May 6, 2008
    #9
    Steve Jobs liked that quote Henry Ford (apparently) gave, “If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses.”. Apple too, in their own way, have defined what their vision is, and people have followed it, until now.

    With the advent of their mobile device disposable design language migrating to the Mac, this forces even the militant Apple faithful down a path they find uncomfortable at best, hostile at worst.

    We accepted built-in batteries to mobile devices, and it worked out ok.
    We accepted non-user serviceable batteries on laptops, and it's not too bad.
    But the move to soldered-on or non-standard connectors is starting to grate;
    • Rather than M.2, there's some proprietary standard that's incompatible. (Unless you have the 2016 MacBook Pro).
    • Rather than MXM (in the Mac Pro) GPUs are connected via some proprietary standard.
    • Rather than MagSafe, USB-C? Really?
    Apple have clearly defined products that now tie you in for a certain amount of time. And you better buy what it is you'll need in a few years rather than right now, because like an iOS device, there is no upgrade path. You have to admire the rather cold business logic to it all really. Made products people really want, and they'll force themselves to pay whatever you want for the privilege.

    Don't get me wrong, I've had Macs for years, but I can't see myself buying any more, or recommending them to anyone. To most non-computer people, the concept of not having a regular USB-A port.. or a MagSafe connector.. or hey even that battery checking area that went in 2012 (that was useful!) is hard to explain away.

    Yes yes, Apple tends to drive the entire industry in change, and change is uncomfortable at times. But this isn't even a vaguely gentle migration to USB-C disposable devices. It's a hard kick. And why Apple thinks a machine they ordain with the 'Pro' moniker and can cost up to £8,000 can in any way be classed as disposable is beyond me.
     
  10. gnasher729 macrumors P6

    gnasher729

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2005
    #10
    Sure, some Apple employees read MacRumors.

    But MacRumors isn't Apple's customer base. MacRumors is Homer Simpson multiplied by a few ten thousand. And we all know what happened when they let Homer Simpson design the car that he wanted. We have seen this just in the recent past, where Apple released products that according to the MacRumors crowd wouldn't sell at out, and they fly off the shelves! Which is then explained with the buyers being brainwashed, stupid, they would buy a turd with an Apple logo and so on...

    Apple doesn't build what _you_ want. They build what _many_ people will _buy_.
     
  11. Average Pro macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2013
    Location:
    Cali
    #11
    Concise, true and relevant. And what makes it difficult to embrace is that I am also one of those people who will be looking to replace my nMP in 2-3 years.
     
  12. T'hain Esh Kelch macrumors 601

    T'hain Esh Kelch

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2001
    Location:
    Denmark
    #12
    Indeed, the Mac Pro and Mac Mini just appear to sell so little that it isn't worth it for Apple anymore. At least, not in Cooks eyes.

    What I don't get though, is why they don't create an xMac to replace both the Mac Mini and Mac Pro. Apart from the absolute high end professionals, which are shifting to Windows now anyway due to Cooks neglect of their segment, it would cater to most people that the iMac doesn't appeal to.
     
  13. 1911 macrumors member

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2008
    #13
    Re: Apple doesn't build what _you_ want. They build what _many_ people will _buy_.

    Yes, but wouldn't MORE people buy, for example, an iMac where you can upgrade the memory, swap hard drives etc.?
    Apple hurt the product by making it a sealed unit with no upgrade options, basically they're following the rest of the
    "Disposable" mentality, where there is zero regard for the consumer.
    I have a real hard time cracking open my wallet and buying into the "disposable" mentality, so I'm still working on older hardware.
    I'm sure I'd have spent much more money on Apple products had they showed some respect for the consumer.
    The iMac and the Mac mini are now just toys, not business class machines.

    What Apple needs to do is simply have two divisions, a consumer division and a professional division, there are people who are
    willing to make an investment in hardware that solves a businesss need.
    The same thing goes for Mac OS, remember the good ol' days when 10.6.8 was running, it was probably their best OS release. Then
    they just dropped the ball.
    Too bad for us.
     
  14. Dave245 macrumors 601

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2013
    #14
    I don't think Apple read these forums. Remember Apple doesn't give what consumers think they want, it was Steve Job's saying that "customers don't know what they want until we give it to them" I don't think that people on this forum represent the overall consensus, for example lots of people have complained about the new MacBook Pro's on this forum, yet Apple had record orders within the first 5 days, in fact the orders were higher than any MacBook Pro they had before it.

    I do think people such as yourself want specific things, but whether Apple will deliver those is a question only they can answer. There are people who will say that Apple is going downhill and so on, but i still think the Mac is an overall better machine than any Microsoft or others have to offer at the moment, have we seen BIG innovations from Apple? no, but lets not forget that this isn't 1988, most things have been done, Apple have great iMac's and MacBook's that work well and i don't see them altering the form factor in a big way for many years.
     
  15. G-News macrumors regular

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    Oct 2, 2013
    Location:
    Switzerland
    #15
    At least that's what they've told you. The fact that they've Extended the rebates on USB-C peripherals makes me think they still feel people need extra incentives to buy these new machines. Which contradicts reports of record sales. Also the reviews so far have been more than mixed. I'd be surprised if the next quarter didn't show a further dip in Mac sales volumes.
     
  16. ugru macrumors 6502

    ugru

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    Sep 8, 2002
    Location:
    Caput Mundi
    #16
    That data were not about units sold but about indexed revenue, which is different. Furthemore, they reported only the first 5 days when no one knew the problems and the real performance of the rMBP 2016 that were reported only after the first units were delivered and tested...

    I am courious to see if Apple will ever release the real numbers once the extended return windows is over or they will keep them hidden like they do with Apple watch...
     
  17. Dave245 macrumors 601

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2013
    #17
    I didn't say units sold, Apple said the amount of orders at their online store was higher than any previous MacBook Pro. It was then later reported (by 9to5Mac) that Apple's new MacBook Pro had outsold every competing laptop in just 5 days.
    Also reports are saying that demand will be strong for Q1 of 2017. Of course this isn't a fact, they could be wrong and MacBook Pro sales could fall into 2017 or it could go the other way. My point is that people have ordered and continue to do so, even with the minority of people on these forms not being happy, i'm just wondering if that is down to the average consumer being more happy and wanting different things from the MacBooks, than the people on these forums.

    http://bgr.com/2016/11/22/macbook-pro-2016-sales-strong-demand/
    https://9to5mac.com/2016/11/09/2016-macbook-pro-sales/
    --- Post Merged, Dec 22, 2016 ---
    I don't think there is a conspiracy. It also shows that they have listened to what people have said, and i think the dongle thing was more about people being less happy with the prices of the dongles than the overall ports being removed from the new MacBooks. Let's face it, Apple have done this before and will again and again, as technology moves forward it wont be problem, like the removal of the headphone jack from the iPhone 7, it's not going to be an issue when people adopt to wireless headphones.
     
  18. Neodym macrumors 68000

    Neodym

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2002
    #18
    Ummm - USB-C is _the_ standard connector for many years to come! Unlike the proprietary MagSafe connector ...

    Most non-computer people don't care about MagSafe. They are more interested to buy that standard powerbank / spare PSU and simply connect it. This is possible with USB-C, but not with MagSafe.

    And in one or two years, USB-C will be so ubiquitous, that people will be glad to have that standard port on their machine to simply plug in the USB-C (thumb)drive. Yes, perhaps Apple took away USB-A about a year too early, but they're infamous for being a bit overhasty on these things. Nevertheless, experience tells that it won't take long until people accept it and stop complaining.
     
  19. ugru macrumors 6502

    ugru

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    Caput Mundi
    #19
    As I said, let's wait until the extendend return window is over and see the real data about the unit sold, that would be a good indicator.

    The revenue generated by the orders in the first 5 days and only in the USA is irrilevant, as many of those units could have been already returned by now.
     
  20. Dave245 macrumors 601

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2013
    #20
    Yea defiantly, people may have returned theirs after trying them out. Microsoft are saying that their Surface is selling better and people are trading in their old MacBooks towards one, personally i wouldn't because i don't like the idea of the Surface, but each to their own.
     
  21. SoyCapitanSoyCapitan macrumors 68040

    SoyCapitanSoyCapitan

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2015
    #21
    If you want USB-C charging then you can't have MagSafe. You have to have one or the other because of PSU design issues, especially in such a thin case.

    If you want a Mac with standard m.2 drives then there is an additional support cost for Apple if SSDs develop issues. Apple would have to rely on Samsung for support and updates. It's more cost effective and easier to support if you license the SSD controller from Samsung and then create your own SSD format.

    If you want GeForce cards you have ask Nvidia to stop getting into legal battles, produce better OpenCL performance and improve Metal support. CL performance was extremely bad in Kepler and the legal battles just added to the pain of dealing with Nvidia.
     
  22. thefredelement macrumors 65816

    thefredelement

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    New York
    #22
    Especially these guys,
     
  23. imanidiot, Dec 22, 2016
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2016

    imanidiot Suspended

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    May 1, 2011
    Location:
    Denver, CO
    #23
    If you think that this is something the average Apple consumer will or wants to do, you are in extreme denial.
     
  24. G-News macrumors regular

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    Oct 2, 2013
    Location:
    Switzerland
    #24
    I don't think there's a conspiracy either, but marketing/Investor friendly messages and carefully chosen words.
     
  25. jjhny macrumors regular

    jjhny

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2005
    #25
    This Apple knows very little nowadays. Tim Cook is involved in social issues more than anything. He uses a limited computer set (probably spreadsheets, email and safari) and he thinks the rest of us only needs what he needs.

    If we use that Henry Ford analogy with Tim, he would offer us a shiny (and very thin) moped and say that we can carry freight with it. This is just sad and delusional.

    Steve Jobs understood it, that's why he said there are cars and trucks in computing. And Mac Pros are (were) the trucks. They do the heavy lifting, they need processing power, as much as possible.

    Further, this obsession with a single screen, and 27" inch screen maximum is nuts. I use multiple 34" and 30" screens. Pros need screen real estate - as much as they can get. They need processing power - we never have enough. I have to run render farms to get most jobs done. On edit I need a separate screens. I need as much RAM as possible, multiple drive arrays, servers, back up devices, etc.. Apple is acting like those need don't exist - because Tim doesn't need them.

    The Mac Pro represented a production workstation - are there new technologies that can improve on that model? Yes. Is Apple being a genius and giving us the future? Absolutely not. They are giving us a shiny, useless moped. Maybe I can get paid to play candy crush... ha!

    Apple are dumbing us down to IOS, it is pathetic. If I had to do production work on an iPad I would be out of business. In the windows sphere they are using 18 and 20 core processors, nVidia TITAN cards, massive RAM and HD's. Apple used to be the cutting edge of tech, a machine that windows people could envy. Not anymore.

    Maybe there is an emoji for stupidity that we could use for Tim Cook's Apple. Maybe Tim's cartoonish, dumb, wide eyed stare.
     

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