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T-Mobile and Apple Announce iPhone Germany Rate Plans

The iPhone has now Time Machine™. With the iPhone in Germany you are able to talk at rates we had here about 5-6 years ago. That is awesome!!!
 
Tafkas said:
The iPhone has now Time Machine™. With the iPhone in Germany you are able to talk at rates we had here about 5-6 years ago. That is awesome!!!
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That is pretty awesome.

After reading many of the posts, one would think that it took you back 70 years, and forced everyone to have an iPhone.
 
It'll be interesting to see how many people buy the phones and just unlock them.

I'm utterly damned if I'm paying these rates - it doesn't matter which ones you pick; US, UK, DE, they all suck like a Dyson. But unlike a Dyson, they keep on sucking for a year or more.

Unlocking's worth risking an iBrick to have a decent iPod, browser and phone but with a low-cost SIM card.

Otherwise simply wait for iPhone 2.0 -- February? With 3G, new OS and better applications.
 
voodoofish said:
FYI, in europe the reason incoming calls and texts are free is because whoever sent them pays money for them to be delivered, ie. the network operator makes money every time you receive a call or text message [edit for clarity - unlike the US where it is you who is receiving the call/text message who the network makes money off, it is the person who has sent the call/text message who the network makes the money off, since part of their phone bill gets paid to your network as an 'interconnect fee' or whatever they call it]. in the UK the network three even pays you to recieve calls/texts, as they are simply passing some of this money they make back onto you.

So, actually getting free incoming calls is *not* actually worth €15 a month, if anything it's worth a discount off your line rental since your carrier makes money off the caller every time someone calls you.
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Actually, in the US, both the person who sends the message and the one who receives the message pays. Thus each text message sent is in a sense, double paid.
 
naroola said:
I disagree. These rates are good. Think about it... these include VAT which is 19%, and incoming calls and incoming SMSs from anywhere are free, on top of the free Wifi zones!

In the US, we pay through the nose for those for these services. Do the math... let's pick the middle plan at 69 Euros:

1. Remove the cost of wifi zones which in Germany equates to 30 Euros/month, i.e. 69 - 30 = 39 Euros.
2. Let's remove the cost of incoming calls and SMS messages, say another 15 Euros (pulled this out of the air, but to me it seems reasonable) i.e. 39 - 15 = 24 Euros.
3. Remove 19% VAT (cause in the US, the rate plans are advertised without taxes) i.e. 24 Euros * 0.81 = 19.4 Euros. This equates to roughly $25 per month.

Now in the US... $25/month for 200 minutes (incoming and outgoing), 150 SMSs (incoming and outgoing) and unlimited data is not good? iPhone data plan itself is $20/month! So really, $5 you are getting 200 mins of talk time and 150 SMSs.

I am sorry I disagree, but these rates are excellent!!!
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Your analysis is quite arbitrary and doesn't seem to be based on any hard numbers. I believe a German poster told us that the hotspot cost is 15 Euros, and that incoming calls are not truly free.

These plans are terrible and T-Mobile should be embarrassed with this offer.
 
i'm not exactly german but i figure the rates in austria will be the same or even more expensive.

the rates must be a joke. come on, i can have a plan for 25 euros where ALL the calls are free of charge. flat. or i can have a plan for 3 cents/minute and 3 euros monthly tarif.

those apple/tmob tarifs are a disgrace. i'm an apple fan. i love their products and i'd get everything that seems usefull to me. the iphone does. but the tarifs shock me. that's why i'll not buy it. i figure when apple/tmobile see the number of people who bought the iphone, they'll see they have to drop the price to break even.

especially in germany & austria, apple cannot come up with tarifs from like 1990.

ah: don't forget. the german customer of the iphone has to buy the iphone (i guess for like 400 euros), activate the iphone for 40 euros and pay a ridiculosuly high tarif for 100 (!) "free" minutes. come on, that's not even two hours!

why pay that much money if you can have some new state of the art nokia mobile for 0 euros, perhaps 40 euros activation and a tarif that lets you phone for as long as you wish for 25 euros?
 
CalBoy said:
Your analysis is quite arbitrary and doesn't seem to be based on any hard numbers. I believe a German poster told us that the hotspot cost is 15 Euros, and that incoming calls are not truly free.
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Incoming calls are free as long you stay within Germany (or more general, in the country where your contract is based). That is the general rule in Europe. There might be exceptions, but I don't know of any specific ones.
 
correction

Glenny2lappies said:
It'll be interesting to see how many people buy the phones and just unlock them.

I'm utterly damned if I'm paying these rates - it doesn't matter which ones you pick; US, UK, DE, they all suck like a Dyson. But unlike a Dyson, they keep on sucking for a year or more.

Unlocking's worth risking an iBrick to have a decent iPod, browser and phone but with a low-cost SIM card.

Otherwise simply wait for iPhone 2.0 -- February? With 3G, new OS and better applications.
Click to expand...

Just an offline correction - the Dyson KEEPS on sucking due to its special design (no, I am not affiliated or have any interest in Dyson other than that I own one).

Again, the difference is that the VAT is IN the price, however, it is now at 19% in Germany...
 
megfilmworks said:
Wow with ATT for 79.99 US we get:
900 min.
unlimited data
visual voicemail
200 sms
rollover
free m2m
free nights weekends
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But no free Wi-fi hotspots. And that free m2m is so deceiving, since it's only to AT&T customers, not all cell phones.

And to the poster who said wikipedia said the average US sales tax is 8.5%, that seems high to me. Maybe in some places but not many, even NYC is less than that.
 
CalBoy said:
Your analysis is quite arbitrary and doesn't seem to be based on any hard numbers. I believe a German poster told us that the hotspot cost is 15 Euros, and that incoming calls are not truly free.

These plans are terrible and T-Mobile should be embarrassed with this offer.
Click to expand...

I just returned from Germany 2 weeks ago and I had the 15 Euro plan that I had from T-Mobile was a 24-hour usage plan over 30 days, i.e. you only have a total of 1440 minutes worth of time you can be online total within the 30 day period. Once you go over this time limit OR 30 days, the plan expires. This was the rate without having any additional T-Mobile cell phone or land line service. I got the rate of unlimited usage of $39.99/month from the T-Mobile US website which equals about 30 Euros (my initial estimate)... https://selfcare.hotspot.t-mobile.com/services_plans.do
 
manu chao said:
Let's do the math again. From the consumer side, pre-tax prices are irrelevant, your bank account only sees the after-tax cost (from a company point of view, it is the other way around). Typical sales tax in the U.S., according to Wikipedia, is 8.5%. That will make the $60 plan cost you $65, that includes 450 min. Assuming half of them incoming minutes that roughly compares to the Complete L plan with 200 min for outgoing calls in Germany, which is 69 Euro. Taking the PPP implied by the Big Mac Index of 1.1 this translates into $76.
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I am sorry, but tax rates are government imposed fees, which neither apple nor T-mobile nor the end-user have any control over. So in order to do a calculation of the true value of a good or service being sold, you have to take tax rates out of the equation. Otherwise, rate plans in Sweden (25% VAT) will seem way worse than plans UK (17.5% VAT), for example.
 
kuebby said:
But no free Wi-fi hotspots. And that free m2m is so deceiving, since it's only to AT&T customers, not all cell phones.

And to the poster who said wikipedia said the average US sales tax is 8.5%, that seems high to me. Maybe in some places but not many, even NYC is less than that.
Click to expand...

No free WiFi hotspots? So what? Its not hard to find a completely free one.

I have to admit, apple appear to be encouraging unlocking... at least they aren't encouraging anyone to go one the included plans.
 
manu chao said:
Incoming calls are free as long you stay within Germany (or more general, in the country where your contract is based). That is the general rule in Europe. There might be exceptions, but I don't know of any specific ones.
Click to expand...
Ah ok, but even with this, the plan is a bad deal.

naroola said:
I just returned from Germany 2 weeks ago and I had the 15 Euro plan that I had from T-Mobile was a 24-hour usage plan over 30 days, i.e. you only have a total of 1440 minutes worth of time you can be online total within the 30 day period. Once you go over this time limit OR 30 days, the plan expires. This was the rate without having any additional T-Mobile cell phone or land line service. I got the rate of unlimited usage of $39.99/month from the T-Mobile US website which equals about 30 Euros (my initial estimate)... https://selfcare.hotspot.t-mobile.com/services_plans.do
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Yes, but with the iPhone plans the value is not there. They are a bit overpriced.
 
quigleybc said:
This is a theme.

Some Country gets the iPhone. Everyone's excited.

Then they release the prices. Everyone's Shocked.

then some token Canadian comes on here and talks about 'well at least you have the iPhone!".......oh wait that's me....


ya,

i'm jealous...
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Muahahaha, I like the way your mind works... hang in there. I hear Dec/Jan for Canada. I'm sorry you have Rogers, though. I think you will feel more pain than what the Germans just found out.:(
 
comebackdwn said:
so will apple and tmobile ever team up for the iphone in the usa?

or will it always be just att?
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It will be ATT for at least the next four and a half years (a story about this before the iPhone launched indicated that ATT has a 5 year deal). After that, anything's possible.
 
kuebby said:
...And to the poster who said wikipedia said the average US sales tax is 8.5%, that seems high to me. Maybe in some places but not many, even NYC is less than that.
Click to expand...

Yeah, but with the "fees" that ATT passes on to us, I pay 20% in "taxes & fees" out here in LA-LA Land! :mad:
 
With these plans, pulling an iPhone out of your pocket in Germany will make you look like a dumbass now. Who is seriously willing to pay a minimum of 1600 Euros for 2 years of iPhone with a watered-down flatrate (crawling after just 200MB per month), call costs from the cell phone stone age (even when calling a person on the same network) and a less than 2 hours of free call credit plus 40 lousy SMS?

The iPhone is great, but these prices are SO ridiculous that anyone who buys it there will be subject to laughter...
 
TVGenius said:
Sorry, but I'm still missing where Visual voicemail is a 'feature'.
Click to expand...

I would tell you but the Apple fanboys would kill me.


I don't understand why you would want an iPhone in europe on edge only. Just wait for v2 or so and get 3G so the data is worthwhile when not on a wireless network.

And the pricing debate seems to be both ways on yay or nay but it does seem to be on the high side. The WAP part is appealing but are you buying a phone that can access the internet or an internet tablet that can be used as a phone. As an internet tablet it is appealing in this setup, but still damn expensive.
 
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