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The 2013-2014 Football Thread

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Lord Blackadder said:
Dear me, England. They didn't look terrible, but just didn't really step up when they needed to either. Time for the British media to go into full-on self-loathing mode. Or, more likely, blame Roy Hodgson for everything.

Suarez showed up all of England's stars tonight.
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Hodgson should be criticized; a Liverpool level back four and put the Liverpool two in front of them, big surprise goals have been conceded. He bought into the second place finish, forgetting it was the forwards who'd done the job. Suarez helped beat England before the teams arrived in Brazil.

Cheers,
OW
 
Probably should've used any of Cleverley, Wilshere or Chambo alongside Henderson in central midfield. Play Sturridge, Milner/Sterling, Lallana/Welbeck as a front 3 and Rooney/Barkley behind.

But i'm no Manager so what do i know.
 
Cleverley isn't a DM, he's about quick one twos and laying it off to the forwards - others doing the defensive work.

Would've played Lallana behind Rooney - one twos and the Southampton player making runs into the box. Was the wandering reduced using Sturridge instead of Rooney?

Cheers,
OW
 
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mojolicious said:
ITV declared that 'England are on their way home'. I think FIFA would take a dim view of us conceding the final fixture.

It was a grim night, after the promise of the Italy match, but again on another day England would have got something (or everything) from the game.

I really wouldn't be that shocked to see England progress. Italy will beat Costa Rica to ensure their own progress, leaving them on 6pts, Uruguay and Costa Rica on 3pts, and England on 0pts going into the last round.

I trust Italy to try and beat Uruguay, and I'd fancy them to do so.

This basically means that if England beat Costa Rica by two goals then they'll finish the group in second place; a simple win will be enough if Costa Rica have been well beaten by Italy.

It's not *that* improbable a scenario; sadly the least likely of the three events is England beating Costa Rica. I'm sensing a Joel Campbell hattrick...
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i hope italy comes to play.

but don't fool yourself, costa rica is no pushover.
 
Meanwhile, domestic matters...

The Club's new kit won't be out until next month apparently, but in the early hours of this morning its new crest was unveiled...

new-crest-shield-4-3116-1650705_478x359.jpg

From the Club's website...

The Club is pleased to reveal its new official crest which will be used on all club collateral from the start of the 2014/15 season.

The new crest retains the familiar tiger at the heart of it whilst also adopting a clean, stylish and modern feel as we continue to evolve during this exciting era. Another nod to the heritage and history of our great Club comes with the inclusion of the year ‘1904’ at the base of the crest, which makes the most of current trends in business branding.

Speaking at the unveiling of the new crest, Vice-Chairman Ehab Allam said: “We are delighted to unveil our new crest for 2014/15.

“This is a more stripped back and modern approach which still celebrates the Club’s heritage and history by focusing on our famous and well established Tigers head. We have also introduced ‘1904’ to the crest to document the year our club was formed.

“Our first ever step into European competition is a new era for us all and we are all excited about the season ahead.”

The new crest will be used on our new playing kit for the 2014/15 season, which will be revealed next month, and will also feature on our official merchandise, marketing, communications and commercial ventures going forward.

Due to the timescales involved in approval and production of our new playing kit, and due to the late nature of the decision on our application to change the Club’s name, consultation with the fans about the new crest wasn’t possible, but the importance of retaining the ‘tigers head’ logo, which has been synonymous with the Club for many, many years, was central in the design process.


It's worth pointing out that the new crest doesn't feature the Club's name, something that is no surprise at all. After the application to change its name was rejected by the FA, the Club's name has disappeared off all communications it issues - such as the above press release. Indeed, the season pass renewal campaign currently underway doesn't mention the name of the Club at all.

As such, the Club's name is as absent as the consultation its owners promised.
 
mojolicious said:
This basically means that if England beat Costa Rica by two goals then they'll finish the group in second place; a simple win will be enough if Costa Rica have been well beaten by Italy.

It's not *that* improbable a scenario; sadly the least likely of the three events is England beating Costa Rica. I'm sensing a Joel Campbell hattrick...
Click to expand...

My pre World Cup prediction was England to loose to Italy & Uruguay and draw with Costa Rica. So far I'm wishing I'd put my money where my mouth is!
 
Kariya said:
Probably should've used any of Cleverley, Wilshere or Chambo alongside Henderson in central midfield. Play Sturridge, Milner/Sterling, Lallana/Welbeck as a front 3 and Rooney/Barkley behind.

But i'm no Manager so what do i know.
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Wilshire was way out of his league against Italy and just like Cleverly isn't really a DM

after all it's the defense that really was the problem so far.
 
With all due respect, I guess it wouldn't be all that bad if England went back with 0pts. Germany had that moment 2000 when we managed one meagre goal and a real shift could take place afterwards without any excuses.

There is a serious lack of proper talent on about every single position. Rooney can be great but he doesn't get better while getting older. Sturridge is up there imo (and could have formed a great partnership with Rooney - but that didn't happen, maybe mostly Hodgson to blame here?)
Sterling is promising but if he's about the most prolific one you know there is something wrong. Lallana, Barkley, Wilshere...but then? Shaw to Chelsea - will he even play? Walcott was definitely missing but he's always injuried so can't be counted in. Of course there are some others but not anywhere near the level that would be needed too meet expectations. Problem imho lies within the all so spectacular PL, no idea how that could change but it will take much more time than just to sort out Gerrard. Starting with a new manager of course (Moyes? :D, hope not )...
 
oscillatewildly said:
Hodgson should be criticized; a Liverpool level back four and put the Liverpool two in front of them, big surprise goals have been conceded. He bought into the second place finish, forgetting it was the forwards who'd done the job. Suarez helped beat England before the teams arrived in Brazil.

Cheers,
OW
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Henderson and Gerrard had a very good season together at Liverpool; it was completely logical to play them as the holding mids BUT after the first match, where their performance was so-so, Hodgson should probably have made a change.

It's easy to try and stick this on Liverpool players since they were so well represented and I admit I'm disappointed that they didn't do better. But the team as a whole was disappointing. Rooney boosters can point to the fact that he scored against Uruguay and was played out of position against Italy yet still provided a good assist. But surely this is his last World Cup and so far he still has justice goal in this competition.
 
twietee said:
With all due respect, I guess it wouldn't be all that bad if England went back with 0pts. Germany had that moment 2000 when we managed one meagre goal and a real shift could take place afterwards without any excuses.
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agree.
the worst that can happen now is a 2:0 vs costa rica (the 2:0 scored by some header in the 87th minute) and italy winning both their games and england slipping through on the goal difference.

The english press would praise their palyers up into the stratosphere for their fighting spirit and after the unavoidable exit in the knock out phase would file it under "bad luck" etc.

twietee said:
There is a serious lack of proper talent on about every single position. Rooney can be great but he doesn't get better while getting older. Sturridge is up there imo (and could have formed a great partnership with Rooney - but that didn't happen, maybe mostly Hodgson to blame here?)
Sterling is promising but if he's about the most prolific one you know there is something wrong. Lallana, Barkley, Wilshere...but then? Shaw to Chelsea - will he even play? Walcott was definitely missing but he's always injuried so can't be counted in.
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Rooney needs to be played as striker.Period.
Also there needs to be a focus on the defensive/central midfield ... by playing Rooney as part of 3 person midfield the others were always outnumbered there, which meant we saw very few "triangle passing".

There were so many gaps in the midfield.. it wasn't even funny.

Also i think in the english attacking play is too sterotypical at times: if an english players moves to the wing in an 1 on 1 agaisnt an opponent he will try to go a for a cross. Every single time. Doesn't even think about cutting inside or perhaps even shooting with a weaker foot.
How many attacks were through the middle ? Very few if any.

That's what makes the Dutch, German attacking line-up so dangerous, they always have multiple attacking options. They always have a plan B.
 
takao said:
Rooney needs to be played as striker.Period.
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Leaving Sturridge on the bench? Didn't Rooeny had some good games for Utd. behind RvP last season, could be wrong though. Rooney and Sturridge weren't bad yesterday imho, but when Sturridge went onto the wing there was someone missing in the center and vice versa. Rooney could have score more than once yesterday. They desperately needed someone connecting defense and offense systematically - job of a classical "8". Maybe Wilshere could be the answer, dunno maybe just aimless activism. Not too informed about English talent.

Also i think in the english attacking play is too sterotypical at times.
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Agreed.
 
twietee,

The league has had non-English players for a while - from Ireland, Northern Ireland, Scotland, and Wales - and performance has been mixed; not even qualifying for the finals of 1974 and '78. I don't blame the Premier League. Perhaps coaching quality and numbers from the bottom? And that isn't instant. Mind, who will they follow? We've had France, Germany, and Spain. Back to France/Germany, or something new, Chile...?:)

Lord Blackadder,

Gerrard and Henderson - 50 goals against says otherwise.

I'm sticking it on Hodgson first - for thinking it's a good idea, the performances follow. Henderson has been carrying Gerrard. The back 7 have been poor - some overall, some concentration.

Rooney next World Cup - maybe a starter if he can adapt to midfield, 3rd or 4th forward if he can't. Phew for Messi! Scoring the goal the other day will fool people into thinking he is decent.

takao,

I was hoping for Lallana behind Rooney, think it would've offered more centrally. As for cutting in; Sterling, Welbeck, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Sturridge, and Lallana are all capable. Sterling had more attention plus an off day - happens with young players.

Cheers,
OW
 
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twietee said:
Leaving Sturridge on the bench? Didn't Rooeny had some good games for Utd. behind RvP last season, could be wrong though. Rooney and Sturridge weren't bad yesterday imho, but when Sturridge went onto the wing there was someone missing in the center and vice versa. Rooney could have score more than once yesterday. They desperately needed someone connecting defense and offense systematically - job of a classical "8". Maybe Wilshere could be the answer, dunno maybe just aimless activism. Not too informed about English talent.
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perhaps , it depends on if england can come up with better offensive midfielder who isn't a striker.
Rooney had chances because he was in a central position.
One of his chances was a header from a free kick. Another his his own freekick.
How many chances did he create, or did he set up for others ? How often did he made crucial passes together with the other midfielders. How many through passes on Sturridge, or the wingers did he play. Those are the job of a number 10 position.
Rooney can't play a pressing game on opposite players either (Arturo Vidal, Prince Boateng for example)

Rooney scored, but the midfield was outnumbered and thus chanceless.
He is still best as a striker.


Sterling was englands best player in the italy game on the "10" position. I didn't get why he had to play on the wing and rooney got his position in the center.
Because of that Sterling was more or less fixed to the right and easily taken out of the game instead of drifting left and right overloading the defense.
 
oscillatewildly said:
I was hoping for Lallana behind Rooney, think it would've offered more centrally. As for cutting in; Sterling, Welbeck, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Sturridge, and Lallana are all capable. Sterling had more attention plus an off day - happens with young players.
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I know they are capable it's just that they hardly ever go for that shot ;)

i would exclude Welbeck though. A real hard working player, but he isn't a dribbler.
Him playing on the left wing i didn't understand either .. he was quite good on the right against Italy, also helped covering the defense line nicely. On the left he isn't as good.

Sturridge made a total of 3 dives in the second half. Apart of a few good turns with the ball he hardly is what i consider a dribbler either. I doubt we will see him again 4 years from now.
 
oscillatewildly said:
twietee,
The league has had non-English players for a while
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Yes, last semifinal was '96 though, right? Something has to change - and I doubt it stops at the manager and change a player or two. But hey, I certainly know jack about English football in any form of detail and sure don't want to pretend to know it. Just some thoughts. :)

Young English players aren't good enough to make it into starting XI at the club? They still stay at home on the bench because of high wages and the weather.
 
takao said:
Wilshire was way out of his league against Italy and just like Cleverly isn't really a DM

after all it's the defense that really was the problem so far.
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oscillatewildly said:
Cleverley isn't a DM, he's about quick one twos and laying it off to the forwards - others doing the defensive work.

Would've played Lallana behind Rooney - one twos and the Southampton player making runs into the box. Was the wandering reduced using Sturridge instead of Rooney?

Cheers,
OW
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Then maybe Hodgson shouldn't have left Gareth Barry at home after all.
 
Fizzoid said:
He was probably hoping Gerrard would at least bring his league form to the WC...
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Maybe that game against Chelsea left even more scars than thought. I could think so, highly unlikely to come that near in his professional career once more. Only if Suarez stays and has another supreme saison at Anfield, which is rather doubtful imo.

Add that unfortunate header yesterday, some sad saison for him.
 
twietee said:
...

Young English players aren't good enough to make it into starting XI at the club? They still stay at home on the bench because of high wages and the weather.
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The weather? :D

Is there a demand on the Continent for young English players - even in Europe's lower leagues? Then as you question, would they go?

Suarez; latest silly season rumour - to Barcelona and Sanchez to Liverpool as part payment.

---

takao,

Cutting in; I was thinking more escaping one player than having to beat a couple - turning 90 degrees, running parallel re the penalty box to just before the start of the 'D', and curling it beyond the keeper's right hand into the net. ;)

Tilpots; UK team - decision by national FAs. They were worried enough about the GB team at the London Olympics.

Kariya; Barry - didn't see much of his game time at Everton - supposed to have done well. Hodgson probably took Phil Jones as right back and midfield cover.

Cheers,
OW
 
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Massive fan of Costa Rica. They know what they are and aren't pretentious, and they play to their strengths. Showing no fear or nervousness.

I hope they win. Sorry England but you shouldn't be relying on others in the first place.
 
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