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The 2019-2020 Football Thread
- Thread starter Lord Blackadder
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Yes, I'd imagine so, but this silly traditional hatred of Spurs (and its occasional attendant anti-Semitism) is something I've never had any time for. You can support a team without choosing to carry all of their silly tribal baggage.
Let Arsenal focus on improving themselves, rather than relishing the misfortunes of others; there have been times - including the present, when they have only been the third best club in London.
Personally, I'm actually genuinely sorry that Spurs never managed to collect any silverware - and have little to show, in terms of tangible rewards - while Pocchettino was their manager; he was a first rate coach and had them playing attractive football at a level above which they could have been reasonably expected to reach with the resources to hand.
They reached the CL final last year, for Heaven's sake.
Actually, to my mind, the Spurs team under Pocchettino reached levels of performance - pity they didn't have more to show for it - that they hadn't reached since their double winning team of 1960-61.
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Atleti get one over on Liverpool in Madrid, winning 1-0. A bruising encounter against an old-school side who are masters of the grinding 1-0 win.
It spoils my afternoon, but I imagine Klopp will not be panicking, since Simeone's boys still have to go to Anfield and do something there if they want to progress. I've always admired Atleti's toughness, though nothing is more frustrating than playing against them when they are on their game. And Diego Costa is a terrible human being.
Dortmund beat PSG but the latter do get an away goal. 2-1 the final.
Liverpool will be smarting a bit from that loss and eager to hammer the next team that comes their way...
It spoils my afternoon, but I imagine Klopp will not be panicking, since Simeone's boys still have to go to Anfield and do something there if they want to progress. I've always admired Atleti's toughness, though nothing is more frustrating than playing against them when they are on their game. And Diego Costa is a terrible human being.
Dortmund beat PSG but the latter do get an away goal. 2-1 the final.
Liverpool will be smarting a bit from that loss and eager to hammer the next team that comes their way...
Commiserations, but I am sure that Klopp and Liverpool will plan - and think - and respond accordingly for the second leg at Anfield.
However, I was surprised that Atleti scored, and put one past Liverpool (and, apparently, could have scored more); had I been asked in advance, I'd have assumed that this leg would have ended in a nil all draw.
This match reminded me of some of the Liverpool-Chelsea matches of yore, cagey matches that turned on very small margins - though Klopp's Liverpool is more proactive than Benitez's was. Atleti won't win the Champions League, but they are still an excellent spoiler team.
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City may not be what they were, but I am sure that they all be formidable opponents, smarting egos, (cultivated) sense of victimhood, wounded pride and all.
@Apple fanboy watching your match, it might be tough for you, also will dual-screen the Spurs match against Leipzig when it comes on.
A very unfortunate schedule. Still, perhaps Pep and the squad have been unsettled and distracted by their ban...Maybe an upset loss against West Ham would push him over the edge.
And not even Pyrrhic.
City are certainly a lot less clinical than would have expected from a team infuriated (but possibly distracted) by the position of the two year ban.
No, agreed.
And it is 2-0 now; can't see West Ham coming back from that.
Whatever about the rest of Manchester City shown signs of being disgruntled and distracted, Kevin de Bruyne seems to be having an exceptionally good game.
Pep has been adamant that the suits at Man City have reassured him that the club has not broken any rules, and that as a result all he can do is continue going about his job and not comment on the ongoing investigations and appeals. He has stuck tight to that story, but he's no fool and I assume he does not believe what his bosses say or, at least, has his suspicions. Then again, maybe the level of privilege he enjoys has actually blinded him to the reality of the situation.
Of course, IF Man City lose their appeals and are banned from Europe, what then will Pep say about the ethics of Man City's business model? We now live in a world where personal opinion trumps rule, fact and precedent, so maybe even then he'll stay the course.
I suspect that Pep's principles on such issues might become a little more pressing should the ban, firstly, be upheld, (or not substantially reduced) on appeal, and secondly, that Manchester City fail to cover themselves in glory in the CL by actually winning - or coming exceptionally close to winning that competition.
After all, Liverpool not only claimed that title last year, they were finalists the year before. And Spurs were the defeated finalists last year.
What does that say about Manchester City - if, for all of their fabled brilliance - if two of the teams beneath them in the Premiership over the past two seasons when they, themselves were champions, managed to become finalists (and then, one of them, Liverpool, was actually victorious the second time they reached a CL final in two years) in successive years when they didn't?
I think at this stage, while it may seem to be tempting fate to actually express such a sentiment, that it is highly unlikely that Manchester City will be in a position to defend their title in the Premiership this season.
And thirdly, traditionally, Pep doesn't linger long at clubs; I think the apex of his arc of (superlative) achievement at Manchester City has already been reached, and that he will see out the season, possibly to see how whether the CL, which has eluded hm thus far, may yet lie within reach.
However, I will admit to surprise if Pep is still wth Manchester City in a year's time.
After all, the transfer window doesn't apply to managers or head coaches; they can be fired (or appointed) at any time during a particular season.
Guardiola, in his most recent interviews, has been adamant that he will see out his contract at Man City. That could be seen as a vote of confidence from Pep, but it could also be interpreted as a signal that he won't bail after this season but has no intention of staying past his current contract.
It will be interesting to see where he lands after City (and, perhaps, after a hiatus). Barca again?
Hm.
If he does so, will that have been longer than he has stayed anywhere else?
And - if City are unable to qualify for the CL for two seasons - what does that do for ambition and motivation within the club?
What benefit arises from coming first (apart from winning the Premiership, which has already been achieved twice, once almost flawlessly, with an astonishing and improbable points total of 100 points), or aiming, as first to fourth do, for a CL place?
Pep may well claim that he shall stay put and see out his contract (but I suspect that he may well reconsider his position if the appeal case is lost), but what of the players?
An exodus of the talented is not beyond possibility should City lose their appeal.
And then, if Pep stays, he shall face a different challenge: Namely, how to construct a team where not all of the parts are perfectly functioning cogs in a meticulously assembled machine?
Jordan Henderson is out for three weeks with a hamstring injury picked up against Atleti.
The press are making a big deal out of it, but it won't have an impact on Liverpool's title campaign. Though it could be a factor in the tilt at the "invincible" record, and of course who knows how much he will be missed in the second leg of Liverpool's tie with Atleti. On the other hand, if Liverpool can't beat Atleti convincingly at Anfield without Jordan Henderson, they don't deserve to progress in the CL.
Kante is also out for a similar period for Chelsea, which will change the complexion of the midfield battle when they face Liverpool in a couple weeks.
To an outsider Liverpool's season has become boringly predictable, but for a fan this is a critical period where the title can be won very early and the season enshrined as an all-time high for the Reds. Every fan of every club experiences a moment where they get a feeling that this might be as good as it ever gets...the peak of one's fortunes. That happened to me in 2008 when Columbus won MLS Cup (the league title) and the Supporters' Shield. it feels like it could be happening now with Liverpool.
The press are making a big deal out of it, but it won't have an impact on Liverpool's title campaign. Though it could be a factor in the tilt at the "invincible" record, and of course who knows how much he will be missed in the second leg of Liverpool's tie with Atleti. On the other hand, if Liverpool can't beat Atleti convincingly at Anfield without Jordan Henderson, they don't deserve to progress in the CL.
Kante is also out for a similar period for Chelsea, which will change the complexion of the midfield battle when they face Liverpool in a couple weeks.
To an outsider Liverpool's season has become boringly predictable, but for a fan this is a critical period where the title can be won very early and the season enshrined as an all-time high for the Reds. Every fan of every club experiences a moment where they get a feeling that this might be as good as it ever gets...the peak of one's fortunes. That happened to me in 2008 when Columbus won MLS Cup (the league title) and the Supporters' Shield. it feels like it could be happening now with Liverpool.
I have been saying all season that the title is Liverpool's to lose.
However, I know the feeling which you describe; for that pretty much how I felt during the year of sustained success enjoyed by The Invincibles with Arsenal.
To my embarrassment, I recall my complacency at the time, how I had become used to winning with verve and almost effortless excellence and confidence, how I had come to expect it as something that happened almost automatically.
Do take the time to savour and enjoy this experience.
I’m SURE the invincible thing won’t be an issue after your next match!
I’m SURE the invincible thing won’t be an issue after your next match!
I was arguing with another Liverpool fan the other day, and I am convinced Liverpool will lose at least one league match this season. Arsenal fans will hate me for saying this, but no matter how good a team is, finishing a season undefeated comes down as much to luck as it does to skill. There are so many ways a fluke loss can happen, there is no other way to describe an invincible side other than lucky. Perhaps Liverpool will be lucky, but the odds are still quite literally against it.
No, I don't hate you saying this, because it contains more than a little truth.
I wouldn't go so far as to say "it comes down to luck as much as skill", but to deny that luck may lend a hand, and may more than lend a hand, in these circumstances, would be exceedingly foolish, and wilfully myopic.
However, what I have noticed is that luck often favours teams that are already playing exceptionally well, and are on a sustained run where games - and decisions, - and often, the very bounce of the ball, will all go their way; fortune (and sometimes, referees) favour them.
Actually, in the days when Manchester United were a successful team, regularly laying siege to the top spot, under Sir Alex, it used to infuriate me how often they scored around the improbable 99th minute (I exaggerate, but not by all that much) of a match.
I think that Liverpool will win the Premiership (and have said that since the start of the season); however, while it is an admirable ambition to wish to do so without losing a game, it is more important to win the Premier League, and lift that trophy, than it is to worry about whether (or how long) it is possible to sustain an undefeated record.
On a related topic, a charming and quite delightful story was reported in today's Irish Times, of how a ten year old youngster from County Donegal, who is a Manchester United supporter, wrote to Jurgen Klopp to ask him to stop winning matches.
According to the report in the Irish Times, the schoolboy's letter ran as follows: “Liverpool are winning too many games. If you win nine more games then you have the best unbeaten run in English football. Being a United fan that is very sad. So the next time Liverpool play please make them lose. You should just let the other team score. I hope I have convinced you to not win the league or any other match again.”
To his complete credit, (and it doesn't really surprise me, as Klopp is an absolute gentleman), Klopp replied with a beautiful and utterly charming letter, which opened by thanking the boy for having written to him, and, while noting that he hadn't wished him good luck, added that he was always pleased to hear from football fans.
His letter, (which was printed by The Irish Times), then came to the core issue under discussion:
“Unfortunately, on this occasion, I cannot grant your request, not through choice anyway. As much as you want Liverpool to lose it is my job to do everything that I can to help Liverpool to win as there are millions of people around the world who want that to happen so I really do not want to let them down.
“Luckily for you, we have lost games in the past and we will lose games in the future because that is football.
“The problem is when you are 10 years old you think that things will always be as they are now but if there is one thing I can tell you as 52 years old it is that this most definitely isn’t the case.”
With that matter addressed, the letter continued:
“Having read your letter, though, I think I can safely say that one thing that will not change is your passion for football and for your club. Manchester United are lucky to have you.
“I hope that if we are lucky enough to win more games and maybe even lift some more trophies you will not be too disappointed because although our clubs are great rivals we also share a great respect for one another.
“This, to me, is what football is all about. Take care and good luck, Jürgen.”
Class. Pure class.
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