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Newcastle. Not an easy tie these days.

No.

While (for now) they haven't won as many games as they might have thought would have been the case once their new owners (and bottomless purses or wallets) took possession, this season, they have lost very few games, equalling Arsenal with three defeats all season (so far), the fewest (joint) number in the table.

Where do you play them?

I suspect that the best you can hope for is a draw, although teams threatened by relegation can be much more motivated to obtain a good result when peril looms.
 
No.

While (for now) they haven't won as many games as they might have thought would have been the case once their new owners (and bottomless purses or wallets) took possession, this season, they have lost very few games, equalling Arsenal with three defeats all season (so far), the fewest (joint) number in the table.

Where do you play them?

I suspect that the best you can hope for is a draw, although teams threatened by relegation can be much more motivated to obtain a good result when peril looms.
It's at our place, so that might help, but I suspect not. We might have beaten Southampton last time out, but it was hardly a convincing win.
Yes I'd settle for a drawer if it was offered right now.
 
It's at our place, so that might help, but I suspect not. We might have beaten Southampton last time out, but it was hardly a convincing win.
Yes I'd settle for a drawer if it was offered right now.
Interesting cluster of games in the bottom half of the table tonight.

Yes, a draw against Newcastle would be a very good result (and not just for you, but, for anyone).
 
As the cellar dwellers played out a bunch of games today, it was pleasing as a Saints fan to see that nobody (other than Leeds) managed to pick up the points needed to really pull away from us.

A good 3-0 win at Man City should set us up nicely for the run-in.
In all seriousness though - only being a couple of points adrift, rather than several, is a slight relief, but the upcoming fixtures don't offer much hope...neither does our form.

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Well not for you! One hand on the trophy.....

You do have two games in hand over the othe rthreatened teams (granted, points on the board are better than games in hand, but, it should ease the pressure - a little - and give you a little longer to do what you need to be able to do before the last day of the season in May.)

One hand.......no, not quite.

I saw my favourite cousin at the week-end - at a family function commemorating his mother, who is now a year dead.

He is an Arsenal supporter, as is one of his two daughters (not the girl who is on the spectrum) - she graduated from university and had played soccer, and follows Arsenal, both the men's and women's teams, and her father - my cousin - had been instrumental in getting girls' soccer off the ground in the place where they live; anyway, there was a brief nail gnawing moment where they asked me: "Do you think that we'll do it this year?"
 
Which game?
I assume Chelsea v Liverpool.

A sharp tweet to the Guardian asked why they were covering an irrelevant mid-table game in such detail, when there is a compelling struggle taking place at the bottom of the table, with three games occurring tonight comprising teams threatened by relegation.
 
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The only one without a goal. Chel v Liv
Well, Chelsea had two disallowed goals, and I find myself not quite helpless with laughter contemplating thier fate.

As the cellar dwellers played out a bunch of games today, it was pleasing as a Saints fan to see that nobody (other than Leeds) managed to pick up the points needed to really pull away from us.

A good 3-0 win at Man City should set us up nicely for the run-in.
In all seriousness though - only being a couple of points adrift, rather than several, is a slight relief, but the upcoming fixtures don't offer much hope...neither does our form.

View attachment 2184523
Very interesting with such tight margins at the bottom.
 
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That table at the bottom is fascinating.

Southampton lie at the foot of the table in 20th place, with 23 points. Immediately above them, in 19th place, are Leicester, on 25 points.

Next, currently occupying 18th place, is Bournemouth, on 27 points.

The three teams lying immediately above Bournemouth, namely Nottingham Forest, Everton and West Ham, respectively, in ascending order, are all - also - on 27 points, with goal difference separating them.

Just above them again, one can find Wolves, in 14th place, who are on 28 points, and Leeds, found in 13th, on 29 points. Crystal Palace, with 30 points, are twelfth.

There are nine points - a very marked and striking gap, in other words, a gap that can be measured in terms of three wins - between the team lying twelfth, (Crystal Palace) and Chelsea, who are eleventh with 39 points.

But, there are only three points between the team at twelfth place (Crystal Palace), on 30, and the team in 18th place, (Bournemouth) on 27 points.

At this stage, some thoughts.

Firstly, Southampton - their stats are dire - are in deep trouble, and are now a troubling two points adrift at the foot of the table, two points below the next team, (Leicester) who themselves are a further two points beneath the team just above that: In other words, a single victory will no longer suffice to allow Southampton to leap clear of immediate danger.

They need four points just to reach 18th place, which still does not guarantee any degree of security or safety. At this stage of the season, with six victories, and five draws to their name, and with nine games remaining, to ask for at least another victory - or two, - and several draws, goes rather against what they seem capable of, or, at the very least is a tall order and a considerable challenge.

However, having said that, perhaps the perspective from the very bottom of the table may serve to concentrate their minds. Nevertheless, a gap - however small - between teams at the very bottom is deeply dangerous at this time of the season.

Secondly, Leicester's situation - lying in 19th place, with 25 points (seven victories, and a mere four draws) - is almost equally grim. They have only - not - suffered defeat, have only staved off defeat on eleven occasions. Both Leicester and Southampton have suffered 18 defeats this season. That is dire. Yet, one victory would see them - Leicester - scramble clear of immediate danger - for now.

Thirdly, that "clump", the "cluster" of teams bunched at the bottom on identical points, is no longer to be found at the very bottom of the table; instead, it has migrated upwards a little, to the bloc of teams clumped, or clustered together between 18th place and 15th. This signifies trouble for the bottom two teams, for they are now cut adrift to some extent, (although there are still eight or nine games to play, and the gaps between them are still sufficiently close for a few good results to have an outsized impact on one's place in the table), but it also spells sheer stress for the teams lying between 18th and twelfth place in the table.

Fourthly, the bunched teams at the bottom is a group that is growing; until a few years ago, this would have included the bottom three clubs, and, possibly the two or three teams lying above them; now, it comprises the bottom half of the table.

There are four teams - lying from 15th (West Ham) to 18th (Bournemouth) tying on 27 points, Wolves - 14th, with 28 points and Leeds - who are 13th, on 29 points. Crystal Palace, currently in twelfth place, on 30 points (one victory, one win - three points - separating them from the team in 18th position) are the top team of the cluster bunched at the bottom.

The relegation battle is extraordinary.
 
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Fascinating and extraordinary are two very good adjectives to use for this season's bottom half battles.
It's a rare thing to see the relegation battle stretch so far up the table.
So with my last statement in mind, what do you all think this means for the Premier League as a whole?

Does having half the table involved in a relegation battle mean that the league is now so competitive that it's anyone's guess as to who will finish where and who can beat whom, or does it mean (as I suspect) that there is a clear demarcation line between the "good" and the "utterly bereft of footballing talent and/or money"?
 
So with my last statement in mind, what do you all think this means for the Premier League as a whole?

Does having half the table involved in a relegation battle mean that the league is now so competitive that it's anyone's guess as to who will finish where and who can beat whom, or does it mean (as I suspect) that there is a clear demarcation line between the "good" and the "utterly bereft of footballing talent and/or money"?

The latter, to my mind.

And whatever talent they have, talent that they may have spotted and recruited (in lower leagues, internationally, or in the UK), and/or grown and nurtured themselves, generally has to be sold to wealthier, greedy suitors.

Actually, I think that it is more an unsettling reflection of the growing state of inequality in the Premier League, where the gap between the "good" teams (some of which are exceptionally well funded) and the rest is becoming ever wider.

In recent years, - over the past two decades - the pattern of club ownership has been transformed beyond all recognition, and that, in turn, has - inevitably - altered - the game, and has also transformed the competitions that the clubs participate in.

The old pattern of (sometimes unsavoury) local magnates gave way to (far wealthier) oligarchs and other international buyers (including the sort of outfit that owns Manchester United), and that, is in the process of being supersded by, or succeeded by, bodies with close ties to nation states with an ethics free attitude to human rights and an interest in sportswashing (funded by the bottomless purses and resources of wealthy, oil rich states). Even oligarchs cannot match the wealth of a rich nation state with an interest in soft power projection via sports washing. The Londonograd laundromat - while wealthy - will find it hard to compete.

In turn, these new seems to be generating what the Guardian described as the "multi club model", establishing "multiclub networks", an unsettling development, (777 Partners are one such example, MSP Sports Capital, another) where one company - brand focussed - owns several clubs (usually, in different countries, the current owners of Chelsea seem especially enamoured of this concept, while Everton and Newcastle are also eyeing it with interest) and where, according to one source, “It is possible that global brands would be more attracted to a global club network even if [the clubs] are individual brands.”

This has all meant that the game is - at the top - awash with money, and resources. For, fans on seats - gate receipts - no longer comprise a major part of the income of the top clubs, thus, their concerns can be dismissed, they exist to provide "local colour", and the traditional ties - and links - between a team and the community it emerged from have been severed, in a great many cases, by the construction of new stadia, physically removed from the old communities, and often far larger in order to be able to attract more people willing to pay for the experience.

It has also meant that a gap - in resources - exists between the exceptionally well funded teams, and the rest, but the real problem is that this gap (in resources) is increasing with the passing of each year and is becoming ever more pronounced and harder to bridge.

This has had the result that what used to be a relatively large number of teams that were neither competing for prizes nor threatened by relegation, teams that were safe by this stage of the season, but not challenging for anything - the teams found between roughly 7th place to somewhere between 12th and 15th - are being compressed, are shrinking.

The available space for 'mid ranking' teams is being compressed and squashed, while the gap between those at the very top and the potential for danger (relegation) at the bottom grows ever wider, while, simultaneously, the number of teams clumped, or clustered, or bunched together at the bottom, increase in number.

Until a few years ago, you used to have a few distinct strands in the Premier League.

First, there would be a battle at the very top between the top two teams for the title, most recently these two teams were Liverpool and Manchester City.

As is the case this year, they - this pair (this year Arsenal and Manchester City) - are by now well ahead of the pursuing pack; barring a complete collapse, I don't see either of them being caught.

Eight points separate Arsenal from Manchester City. Fourteen points separate Manchester City from the team in third place, which is Newcastle, who are glued to Spurs (on fourth) both with 50 points. That is, Arsenal are 22 points ahead of the team in third place - and 22 is roughly the total number of points accrued by some of the teams flirting with relegation - while there is a gap of 14 points between City in second and the teams immediately beneath them.

There are nine games remaining, and for City to be caught would require a totally improbable complete collapse - losing at least five games (thus, dropping 15 points); that is not going to happen.

The next strand, or level, is where the battle for CL places tends to take place, and you will often find up to four or five teams competing for these slots until the very end; those that do not succeed in landing a place in the Champion's League will find a place in the Europa Cup, or the next competition down.

However, it is the next level - what used to be the safety of mid table obscurity, teams that won nothing (except, perhaps, occasionally a Cup, the League (Carabao) Cup or FA Cup), and were neither challenging for places, positions, nor trophies, nor threatened with relegation that is being compressed or squashed. These were the teams you would find between 7th place and - roughly 14th or 15th.

Now, some of them are finding themselves uncomfortably close to the bottom half of the table.

The numbers (of points accrued during a season) are stretching at both ends of the table; in their marathon battles, both Liverpool and Manchester City re-wrote what was expected from aspiring champions, and the standards that they could be expected to attain. But, that also applies at the bottom.

The other thing - that this cluster at the bottom means - is that the number of points needed to secure safety, to guarantee safety, is dropping, and so are the points totals of the bottom three teams; it used to be that 40 points would (almost certainly) guarantee safety. In recent years, that has decreased; now, you can scramble to safety with around 35-36-37 points, as long as you can ensure that three teams are lying beneath you when the relegation trapdoor opens on the very last day of the season.
 
The latter, to my mind.

And whatever talent they have, talent that they may have spotted and recruited (in lower leagues, internationally, or in the UK), and/or grown and nurtured themselves, generally has to be sold to wealthier, greedy suitors.

Actually, I think that it is more an unsettling reflection of the growing state of inequality in the Premier League, where the gap between the "good" teams (some of which are exceptionally well funded) and the rest is becoming ever wider.

In recent years, - over the past two decades - the pattern of club ownership has been transformed beyond all recognition, and that, in turn, has - inevitably - altered - the game, and has also transformed the competitions that the clubs participate in.

The old pattern of (sometimes unsavoury) local magnates gave way to (far wealthier) oligarchs and other international buyers (including the sort of outfit that owns Manchester United), and that, is in the process of being supersded by, or succeeded by, bodies with close ties to nation states with an ethics free attitude to human rights and an interest in sportswashing (funded by the bottomless purses and resources of wealthy, oil rich states). Even oligarchs cannot match the wealth of a rich nation state with an interest in soft power projection via sports washing. The Londonograd laundromat - while wealthy - will find it hard to compete.

In turn, these new seems to be generating what the Guardian described as the "multi club model", establishing "multiclub networks", an unsettling development, (777 Partners are one such example, MSP Sports Capital, another) where one company - brand focussed - owns several clubs (usually, in different countries, the current owners of Chelsea seem especially enamoured of this concept, while Everton and Newcastle are also eyeing it with interest) and where, according to one source, “It is possible that global brands would be more attracted to a global club network even if [the clubs] are individual brands.”

This has all meant that the game is - at the top - awash with money, and resources. For, fans on seats - gate receipts - no longer comprise a major part of the income of the top clubs, thus, their concerns can be dismissed, they exist to provide "local colour", and the traditional ties - and links - between a team and the community it emerged from have been severed, in a great many cases, by the construction of new stadia, physically removed from the old communities, and often far larger in order to be able to attract more people willing to pay for the experience.

It has also meant that a gap - in resources - exists between the exceptionally well funded teams, and the rest, but the real problem is that this gap (in resources) is increasing with the passing of each year and is becoming ever more pronounced and harder to bridge.

This has had the result that what used to be a relatively large number of teams that were neither competing for prizes nor threatened by relegation, teams that were safe by this stage of the season, but not challenging for anything - the teams found between roughly 7th place to somewhere between 12th and 15th - are being compressed, are shrinking.

The available space for 'mid ranking' teams is being compressed and squashed, while the gap between those at the very top and the potential for danger (relegation) at the bottom grows ever wider, while, simultaneously, the number of teams clumped, or clustered, or bunched together at the bottom, increase in number.

Until a few years ago, you used to have a few distinct strands in the Premier League.

First, there would be a battle at the very top between the top two teams for the title, most recently these two teams were Liverpool and Manchester City.

As is the case this year, they - this pair (this year Arsenal and Manchester City) - are by now well ahead of the pursuing pack; barring a complete collapse, I don't see either of them being caught.

Eight points separate Arsenal from Manchester City. Fourteen points separate Manchester City from the team in third place, which is Newcastle, who are glued to Spurs (on fourth) both with 50 points. That is, Arsenal are 22 points ahead of the team in third place - and 22 is roughly the total number of points accrued by some of the teams flirting with relegation - while there is a gap of 14 points between City in second and the teams immediately beneath them.

There are nine games remaining, and for City to be caught would require a totally improbable complete collapse - losing at least five games (thus, dropping 15 points); that is not going to happen.

The next strand, or level, is where the battle for CL places tends to take place, and you will often find up to four or five teams competing for these slots until the very end; those that do not succeed in landing a place in the Champion's League will find a place in the Europa Cup, or the next competition down.

However, it is the next level - what used to be the safety of mid table obscurity, teams that won nothing (except, perhaps, occasionally a Cup, the League (Carabao) Cup or FA Cup), and were neither challenging for places, positions, nor trophies, nor threatened with relegation that is being compressed or squashed. These were the teams you would find between 7th place and - roughly 14th or 15th.

Now, some of them are finding themselves uncomfortably close to the bottom half of the table.

The numbers (of points accrued during a season) are stretching at both ends of the table; in their marathon battles, both Liverpool and Manchester City re-wrote what was expected from aspiring champions, and the standards that they could be expected to attain. But, that also applies at the bottom.

The other thing - that this cluster at the bottom means - is that the number of points needed to secure safety, to guarantee safety, is dropping, and so are the points totals of the bottom three teams; it used to be that 40 points would (almost certainly) guarantee safety. In recent years, that has decreased; now, you can scramble to safety with around 35-36-37 points, as long as you can ensure that three teams are lying beneath you when the relegation trapdoor opens on the very last day of the season.
I think it’s hard to draw conclusions based on this season. The WC break has mixed things up significantly.

I didn’t pay as much attention to the bottom half of the table the last few years as we were at the other end.

The good news is we have two games in hand.
The bad news is they are against Newcastle (tonight) and City!
1680717687526.png
 
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Actually, I had entirely forgotten about the possible impact of the World Cup break on the season; mind you, with the pandemic, and the conditions under which games were played during the pandemic, the last few seasons haven't been exactly normal, either.
 
Lampard looks set to return to Chelsea as interim manager...not sure why

Absolutely bizarre, if true.

Actually, insane.

Myopia. Pure myopia. Ridiculously self-indulgent nostalgia.

No matter what the Chelsea faithful may believe, a great player does not always succeed in becoming a great manager, quite the contrary if anything.
 
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