The Apple Ecosystem: Why can't I do XXX with my Ipad/Ipod/Iphone/Mac???

Discussion in 'Apple, Inc and Tech Industry' started by johannn, Oct 31, 2010.

  1. johannn macrumors newbie

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    #1
    So amazingly enough, the boys that railed against "1984" in er, 1984 have very much a closed EcoSystem that only George Orwell could devise a story around. As a shareholder, this is great, fantastic, and super. Apple is very very clever at protecting future and current revenue streams.

    But as a user this can at times be somewhat frustrating.

    Please correct me if I am wrong here, this could be speculation on my part, but some of the reasons for "lock outs" are obvious... like trying to protect wireless providers/partners by hindering services like Skype from bypassing long distance charges (e.g. you can't make an iphone skype call over 3g). And where is my Skype video chat app for Iphone/Ipod-touch? All indications seem that Apple wants to enable Facetime first?

    I have a few examples of seeming features that could-be-but-aren't enabled that I do not understand... why not? You could argue that Apple only wants to do things that work and provide the simple user experience, but does that apply to:

    1) Why no syncing of Ipod/Ipads/Iphones to Mac/PC-running-Itunes over Wifi?

    2) Why does Airplay (at first rollout) only seem to support streaming from iOS device TO Apple TV? A much more interesting (to me) application is streaming my purchased/DRM'd itunes content FROM my Mac/Itunes TO my Ipad? As it stands now, I cannot stream Itunes purchased video content from my Itunes/Mac to my Ipad. One has to physically via USB sync whatever DRM'd video from Mac/itunes to Ipad.

    And please, this is NOT an Attack on Apple or its products. They are great. Steve is great. Brilliant. But often times the constraints Apple seems to put in place (on things which should be technically already doable) frustrate me a bit. So please, no histrionics over "Ixxx was not designed to do that".
     
  2. *LTD* macrumors G4

    *LTD*

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    #2
    Well I do know that, for example, if enabling xxx feature can in any way shape or form impact the User Experience apart from a way that Apple intended, or otherwise frustrate the user with too many options for configuration or an unnecessary (according to Apple) learning curve, then chances are that option will not be available, or it *will* be available later via a specific form/method of Apple's own choosing.

    Just look at the iPad screen-lock/mute button issue. A specific change was made for a specific purpose. We might not know what it is, but Steve already replied to someone (allegedly) in an e-mail that the change is going to stay.

    We know for a fact that Apple is famous for their attention to detail, so you can assume there is a more than even chance that there's probably a specific reason behind any feature or unavailable function that you might take issue with (as a tech-savvy user.) You can also assume that these things don't exist in vacuum and there was deliberation at Apple over the inclusion/exclusion of this feature and that there probably will be continuing deliberation about it, such as Google Voice, the implementation of somewhat more relaxed App Store rules, etc.
     
  3. roadbloc macrumors G3

    roadbloc

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    #3
    I wanna know why my iPhone can't send or receive files over bluetooth to other phones or my mac. Lacking that feature on a phone is plain stupidity.
     
  4. *LTD* macrumors G4

    *LTD*

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    #4
    As long as apple sells music via the music store, they aren't going to allow bluetooth file transfer. It's detrimental to their business.
     
  5. Rodimus Prime macrumors G4

    Rodimus Prime

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    #5
    You are going to have to work REALLY hard to explain that one because it is not like it is hard to move new music files into ones iTunes library to have it loaded up on to an iPod. Pirated music or music bought from another music store. Movies in correct codec. Hell I have and do take avi files and will have my computer re-encode them into an iPod format so I can watch them later on my iPod.

    So really LTD come up with a better excuse than that. That one is even weak for you.
     
  6. steve2112 macrumors 68040

    steve2112

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    #6
    Well, the short answer is "Because Steve Jobs said so".

    Ok, so it is more complicated than that.

    Facetime/Skype: It does seem to me they are protecting AT&T with not allowing it over 3G. The AT&T network is already being pounded by iPhone users, and that would just add to the problem. And it makes sense they will push Facetime over Skype, since they own it. Any company is going to push their own products first.

    As for the others:

    1) The no wi-fi thing baffles me. It apparently isn't that hard. Even the Zune allows it. It also makes no sense since Apple is all about mobility and getting people away from "trucks" (computers as opposed to iPhone/iPad/Touch) as Jobs calls them.

    2) Again, no idea. I mean, any Mac is going to have more storage space than an iPad. I'm with you in that I am much more likely to store stuff on my PC/Mac since I have lots of storage space on it.

    3) Bluetooth syncing. LTD is right because they view it as an anti-piracy measure. It's the same as not allowing syncing from the iPod to a computer. (Yeah, I know there are easy ways around that, but technically they don't allow it)

    One thing to consider is that Apple actually isn't that big of a company. They only have around 46000 full time employees and a number of them are support employees. So they really don't have that big a staff of developers. By comparison, Microsoft has over 80,000 employees. I was actually a bit surprised to find that Google only has just under 20,000 employees. An example of how Apple works is the Remote app. It went a while without updating and people were annoyed. It turns out that ONE person had developed it and he got re-assigned to another project for a while. After that project, he was able to go back and update the app. Microsoft probably would have assigned an entire team of developers and managers to the project.
     
  7. daneoni macrumors G4

    daneoni

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    #7
    You can make skype calls over 3G...at least i can

    No file transfer because we don't even have a user accessible file system plus the piracy thing. Many who transfer files over BT are usually transferring MP3s and Ringtones.

    WiFi is puzzling though
     
  8. *LTD* macrumors G4

    *LTD*

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    #8
    Certain apps give you a filesystem to use - such as AirSharing or other file-transfer systems that work via transfers through iTunes. I can download virtually anything with the Download and iCab apps and files would go into a folder ready for e-mailing or sharing and whatnot. But it's not a universal system as such - it's whatever storage and file management the app allows. Frankly, I find this to be more than enough. The App Store's got this one covered.
     
  9. roadbloc macrumors G3

    roadbloc

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    #9
    All I wanted to do is send a picture I'd taken to my mother. I think its silly how apple hasn't included one of the most used features on mobile phones today. Piracy risk or not, it's daft.
     
  10. steve2112 macrumors 68040

    steve2112

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    #10
    Just send it via email. NBD.

    -Steve

    Sent from my Powerbook.
     
  11. *LTD* macrumors G4

    *LTD*

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    #11
    Fixed. ;)

    He's got one somewhere, and when he checks out it's going with him.
     
  12. Rodimus Prime macrumors G4

    Rodimus Prime

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    #12
    I honestly would call that a piss poor workaround at best.
     
  13. *LTD* macrumors G4

    *LTD*

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    #13
    What??

    You can e-mail it from your iPhone (in full res, too), send it via MMS, post it to Facebook, Flickr or wherever else, you can probably include it in a Tweet as well, upload and send from MobileMe, or point her to your MobileMe Gallery, etc.

    There are numerous ways you can send files.

    Or if it's not on your iPhone but on your Mac and you're not at home, just use iTeleport VNC on your iPhone and send it from your Mac remotely.
     
  14. roadbloc macrumors G3

    roadbloc

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    #14
    Yes, there are a million and one ways I can share my picture on my iPhone. That doesn't help when most people I know deal in mobile phones and bluetooth. It isn't a big problem, its just an inconvenience. How do you think it'll sound when I say to a friend "Sorry, I can't accept that file over bluetooth on my iPhone. Could you please email or upload it onto my MobileMe public folder please?"

    Not very good for the iPhone to say the least. Suggest as many workarounds as you wish, bluetooth is still the most used way to share data on mobile phones, and the fact that the iPhone doesn't support it doesn't do it any favours to say the least.

    That saying, it's the only gripe I have with my iPhone. But it's a big gripe.
     
  15. AAPLaday Guest

    AAPLaday

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    #15
    Not everyone has email set up on their phone. Being able to bluetooth a file is much easier.
     
  16. wirelessmacuser macrumors 68000

    wirelessmacuser

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    #16
    First of all, Kudo's for an excellent post! Your points are well taken and I do agree with how you feel.

    Well said, of "Apple's own choosing is right, and very revealing of the lock down that Steve Jobs relishes and takes great pride in. He lives for Money & Control.

    I could not agree more.

    This is translated as "We... Apple, want all the money. We ... Apple are in charge, user choice is not on our menu. We dictate.

    Or as the fanboys love to say, if you don't agree.. get out! Actually they are usually much more profane, but I refuse to get down to their level.

    Yes indeed, it's all about Steve.

    You are spot on. You should be able to transmit the file the way _you_ want.

    I disagree that it's no big deal. It's a _very big_ deal. It's lack of freedom.

    What if the user on the other end is not very technically savvy and has prefers not to receive pictures via email. That should be their choice.

    Thank You... this is exactly the point.

    After it's all said and done, Apple is the Fisher-Price (toy maker) of tech. They make things easy for novices, and it's why they have a loyal following amongst the mainstream.

    Apple loyalists like to point out the superior "it just works" experience, yet it comes at a very heavy price with the forfeiture of choice. This is _not_ the way it _has_ to be, but rather the dictatorial control of one Steve Jobs.

    The man who envisions himself is supremely superior to all others.

    The man who "thinks he knows better" than everyone else... this makes him look like a dolt.
     
  17. *LTD* macrumors G4

    *LTD*

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    #17
    Well apparently he does. Which is why he and his company are succeeding unlike anyone else. Sorry to say, but this "dolt" is setting the pace of change within the industry.

    Where is this anti-Apple revolution in the market? Where is the uprising against Apple's "dictatorial" and "evil" practices. You're painting things in a fantastic, almost Tolkien-esque colour.

    There isn't any uproar. It doesn't exist, except in little tech circles on Apple fansites on the ass-end of the net. And a lot of loveable geeks and FOSS-proponents are still clamouring for headless macs you can take apart and play with, when retailers can barely sell traditional desktops as it is. You told us hackintoshes signalled the coming anti-Mac revolution. Nothing happened. What DOES happen is Apple moves more and more product each quarter. The fact is that consumers are gravitating toward Apple's particular way of doing things. They're no longer niche. People vote with their wallets. And they've opened them up to Apple to the tune of about $20 billion last quarter. And it's only going to increase as we move forward. Apple doesn't get a $280+ billion market cap by accident. They don't enjoy record quarters by accident. They're not #1 in customer satisfaction year after year after recession-filled year for nothing. There's a lot of really compelling things behind their products, and consumers are equating a lot of lasting value with Apple purchases. It's what's happening today, right now.

    Seems Apple has struck quite a chord and consumers are CHOOSING Apple. And the industry at large is gravitating toward and following Apple's lead. Even Microsoft, if you've read the news recently. Seems there's a lot to be said about a closed, locked-down and controlled system. It's all about a QUALITY experience, not necessarily a "free" experience where you can do whatever you want. You can always chuck your iPhone and go with a competitor, but when that isn't happening it kinda throws a wrench into your attempt to blend technological decisions by consumers with political and social freedom.


    Um . . . who the f doesn't??

    Everyone in business trying to show a profit IS looking for as much "Money & Control" as possible. The ultimate goal is to corner the market, to become the main, if not sole supplier. Competition laws exist to prevent anyone from reaching this goal illegally, but if it's done on the strength of their product(s), like Apple is doing, then it's all fair. If it's done illegally (like Microsoft did), then you can have your legitimate grievances.

    If Steve was in it JUST for the money, you would see a very different Apple, actually. They'd look and act more like HP, Acer, Toshiba, and the other also-rans. They wouldn't take huge risks and gambles (like with the iPad) and would instead compete in the race to the bottom, playing the volume game, not really innovating anything or attempting to revitalize markets.

    Yes, Steve Jobs makes money and has a lot of pull. And I'd say he's one of the few CEOs that actually deserves it.
     
  18. roadbloc macrumors G3

    roadbloc

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    #18
    *LTD* apple isn't under any threat... They will probably continue to grow. I think the point people (and myself) are trying to make in response to your defensive posts is that apple is not achieving it's full potential by it's restrictions. Apple may be owning the tech Market in America, but in Europe, they have a long way to go as apple products are scarce amongst people. I am actually considered a "posh applefag" amongst my techy friends due to the fact that I am the only person now with two apple products. There is only one more person I know with an apple product and that is a jailbroken iPhone 3GS.

    Apple is good, but the restrictions are making them unpopular.
     
  19. *LTD* macrumors G4

    *LTD*

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    #19
    But roadbloc, the numbers don't support this at all. Apple has never been more popular. Sure, we can get into an infinite progression scenario by saying "but if Apple did this, they'd grow even more" - that is not only not for certain, but judging by these unprecedented numbers we're seeing, the industry held in sway by this one company (who would have thought!), and record-breaking sales quarter after quarter, all we'll end up doing is arguing with success. If you want to, fair enough, go to it, you might have some good ideas. I just see no point in it at this time. Apple is doing everything right at the moment.

    Could they improve and branch out in other directions? Sure, that's always possible, but they've probably got a plan for that side of the game as well. We're seeing some of that radical thinking going on, such as bringing iOS to OS X as well as the App Store. That pretty much redefines the notion of "operating system" as well as traditional ideas about content/software distribution. It's really going to be a watershed moment.
     
  20. steve2112 macrumors 68040

    steve2112

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    #20
    Well, my answer was a spoof of the Jobs email responses, but I guess the humor went right over everyone's head.

    Anyway, you are correct. Apple is marketing their stuff toward the average consumer, because that's where they make most of their money. Apple makes a lot more money from iDevices than they do from Mac Pros, or sales of Final Cut, for example. Therefore, they market to that segment. And unless those consumers demand something, it isn't happening. Jobs once said "nobody wants to watch video on a small screen", until customers started calling for it, and the video iPod and iPod touch were born. He also said "nobody reads electronic books", until the Kindle became popular. Then every iDevice can do Kindle and Apple's on e-book app.

    Let's face it, everyone here is not the average consumer. Coming to a Mac enthusiast board, creating an account, and posting regularly means we are more involved than a typical consumer. Most people don't care about stuff that we gripe about.
     
  21. roadbloc macrumors G3

    roadbloc

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    #21
    I disagree with the numbers. They may be accurate for America or wherever, but not where I am at, right now. Numbers can be misleading, you can get contradictory statements on the same bloody site, look at that CNNMoney link you posted. A day later, Microsoft were up by 25% in profit. So much for a dying consumer brand.

    I agree that Apple are good with what they are doing. I agree that Apple will probably continue to grow. I agree that other companies can often fail to deliver. But so can Apple. My lack of Bluetooth file transfer is a great example. The fact that people have to jailbreak their devices to do what they wish with them is another. The fact that gamers are still waiting for the latest OpenGL support in OS X is yet another.

    Please, the majority all like Apple here. But there is no need to ram home what an appletistic wag you are with your posts. Microsoft and other companies can do good stuff. Windows 7 is excellent. Google is still the best search engine. Nintendo DS is actually britain's favourite mobile console. Spotify could just have the balls to kill iTunes in due time. And nothing about them successful products is 'mac like' or 'inspired off apple' like you claim.

    Companies can happily co-exist, and will continue to do so. Keep waiting for the 'rise of apple'. You will be disappointed. Apple will become popular, even maybe popular enough to be the majority in reality, not just through your questionable statistics. But companies rise and fall, Apple may be on a peak now, but in five years time, what's saying they won't be? Nothing.

    So, please, cut it out with your fanboyish posts. We all accept Apple is rather good at what they do. But as a fan of the company, you make my blood boil when you, at times, point blank to refuse Apple's bad factors and competitor's good factors. Your constant fanboyism is irritating.
     
  22. Compile 'em all macrumors 601

    Compile 'em all

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    #22
    If Apple seemingly restricts you from doing something then 9/10 times they have a very very good reason to do so. They don't restrict you just because they enjoy doing so.
     
  23. maflynn Moderator

    maflynn

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    #23
    They may think they have a good reason, but often when viewed from the outside, its not. For instance, OSX has been quite hostile towards themers, and generally apple in the past has seemingly gone out of its ways on updates to break theming programs. OSX had a burgeoning theming movement but apple effectively squashed it.

    I'd say apple has taken on Job's personality and to that end, they can be at times a control freak. They believe they know what's best for us, even when it restricts our our ability. It's apple's way or the high way
     
  24. *LTD* macrumors G4

    *LTD*

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    #24
    The small number of "themers" wanting to theme and customize OS X to that extent doesn't warrant Apple opening up that side of the OS and exposing it to potential vulnerabilities. We've already seen what Unsanity's APE can do. Bad code riding under the cute name of a haxie. There is no "burgeoning" theming movement. Just like there is no "burgeoning" hackintosh movement, nor is there a "burgeoning" headless-Mac-you-can-take-apart-and-f-with movement. The vast majority of users don't theme and have no desire to do so. What for? Again, there's a good reason behind Apple's decision. This isn't Windows.

    Apple believes they know what's best for us? It seems they do. And there's about 20 billion reasons they're probably right.
     
  25. maflynn Moderator

    maflynn

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    #25
    Yeah there was, I know of a lot of people, sites and some products that sprung up in the early 10.x days for theming.

    As for the hackintosh movement, just take a visit to insanelymac and you'll see a very lively site dedicated to creating a hackintosh. Its a very popular alternative to paying the $$ for macs.

    Just because you in your blind adoration of apple says its not so, does not make it the gospel truth. I was involved in the theming world and know first hand how it was embraced and growing - until apple squashed it.
     

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