The Car Thread ... !

[JoeG4]

You shouldn't need to have to charge them in your garage. Nobody has a gas pump in their garage. It's just nobody wants to sit around 20 to 30 minutes for them to charge up. That's inconvenient.

If the lithium batteries in cars are anything like the lithium batteries in your phones or other devices, a slower charge is better for the battery than a fast one.

Most people are not going to drive the entire range of their car every night, so you're also right that people usually don't need to charge their car every night. But the upshot here is that if you do, your car will always be fully charged and ready to go. No need to stop at gas stations.

 

[Apple fanboy]

I know nothing about the UK related to EVs.
Here in the USA the government was giving big tax breaks to buy a EV but they have made that tax break not as good now and EV sales have slowed.

Our new President to be in Jan, he isn't a big supporter of EVs so he probably will slow that tax break more or altogether.

I never said ICE cars don't catch fire, they both do but a EV fire is much worse. For me EVs just have a long way to go to be as convenient as gas cars and our power in our nation needs upgrading to accommodate. In CA they are already putting charging restriction times to charge your car.

You shouldn't need to have to charge them in your garage. Nobody has a gas pump in their garage. It's just nobody wants to sit around 20 to 30 minutes for them to charge up. That's inconvenient.

Also here is a tidbit from a article:


How many electric car owners go back to gas?


A survey conducted by McKinsey Center For Future Mobility reported that 46% of U.S. car owners who drive electric vehicles would shift back to an internal combustion engine. The percentage was the second highest behind electric car owners from the United Kingdom, 49% of which would switch back.Jun 27, 2024

So again with the incorrect information. Nobody wants to go to the gas station to fill up. It’s not convenient.
Now imagine every time you went to bed someone came and filled your car up for you. It also cost a lot lot less than going to the gas station.
That would be perfect wouldn’t it?

That’s what driving an EV is like. I hated going to the gas station as it smells, it’s not on my way to work and takes time out of my day.


As for 49% of EV drivers wanting to switch back that is definitely not true. I speak to lots of EV drivers and never met one who wanted to or has switched back.

Don’t believe everything you read. Think about who benefits from misinformation about EV’s.

It’s true that tax breaks have helped with EV sales on both sides of the ocean. But the government has benefited in reduced air pollution for example which helps reduce the burden on hospitals etc.
EV’s are not 100% of the solution as there will always be edge cases. But the more people that make the switch the better it is for all of us.

 

[Apple fanboy]

If the lithium batteries in cars are anything like the lithium batteries in your phones or other devices, a slower charge is better for the battery than a fast one.

Most people are not going to drive the entire range of their car every night, so you're also right that people usually don't need to charge their car every night. But the upshot here is that if you do, your car will always be fully charged and ready to go. No need to stop at gas stations.

I charge about once or twice a week. But I rarely charge at home. I have free charging at work so use that. I plug in when I arrive and it’s usually done by lunchtime.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

I know nothing about the UK related to EVs.
Here in the USA the government was giving big tax breaks to buy a EV but they have made that tax break not as good now and EV sales have slowed.

Our new President to be in Jan, he isn't a big supporter of EVs so he probably will slow that tax break more or altogether.

I never said ICE cars don't catch fire, they both do but a EV fire is much worse. For me EVs just have a long way to go to be as convenient as gas cars and our power in our nation needs upgrading to accommodate. In CA they are already putting charging restriction times to charge your car.

You shouldn't need to have to charge them in your garage. Nobody has a gas pump in their garage. It's just nobody wants to sit around 20 to 30 minutes for them to charge up. That's inconvenient.

Also here is a tidbit from a article:


How many electric car owners go back to gas?


A survey conducted by McKinsey Center For Future Mobility reported that 46% of U.S. car owners who drive electric vehicles would shift back to an internal combustion engine. The percentage was the second highest behind electric car owners from the United Kingdom, 49% of which would switch back.Jun 27, 2024

Most journeys don’t require charging, they begin and end at the home. And when you do have a longer journey that can be measured in poronkusema units 😉 then just plug it in before you empty your bladder, and whilst you do that and get a croissant and coffee it’s ready to go again.

It’s been explained to me that with an ICE you have to stay with your car before you can enjoy the facilities, and thus it takes not only extra time, it’s time wasted that one can use to do other things.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

I know nothing about the UK related to EVs.
Here in the USA the government was giving big tax breaks to buy a EV but they have made that tax break not as good now and EV sales have slowed.

Our new President to be in Jan, he isn't a big supporter of EVs so he probably will slow that tax break more or altogether.

I never said ICE cars don't catch fire, they both do but a EV fire is much worse. For me EVs just have a long way to go to be as convenient as gas cars and our power in our nation needs upgrading to accommodate. In CA they are already putting charging restriction times to charge your car.

You shouldn't need to have to charge them in your garage. Nobody has a gas pump in their garage. It's just nobody wants to sit around 20 to 30 minutes for them to charge up. That's inconvenient.

Also here is a tidbit from a article:


How many electric car owners go back to gas?


A survey conducted by McKinsey Center For Future Mobility reported that 46% of U.S. car owners who drive electric vehicles would shift back to an internal combustion engine. The percentage was the second highest behind electric car owners from the United Kingdom, 49% of which would switch back.Jun 27, 2024

I don’t think I’ve ever charged our EV on the drive and thought, ‘I shouldn’t have to do this’ lol. That is a major convenience and selling point along with being able to go 250 miles for £5.

If 46% of EV drivers on a US survey admit to wanting to go back to ICE, that’s a sad reflection I’d say.

 

[I7guy]

[…].

Also here is a tidbit from a article:


How many electric car owners go back to gas?


A survey conducted by McKinsey Center For Future Mobility reported that 46% of U.S. car owners who drive electric vehicles would shift back to an internal combustion engine. The percentage was the second highest behind electric car owners from the United Kingdom, 49% of which would switch back.Jun 27, 2024

I read something , actually many some things, about that article which called it ********. But people who hate evs will cling on to anything.

 

[3237187]

My beloved 2008 Chevy HHR SS (my DD) is developing some rust on the lower doors, and it looks to be a pita to fix. I will get it fixed, but I've been told it could be a reoccurring problem. Which is too bad, but so it goes.

As a result, I'm going through the mental exercise of selling it, and getting something with similar utility, e.g., cargo carrying capacity, as well as being fun to drive. Not sure if there's an EV that fits that profile, but I'll certainly consider it if such a thing exists. I don't really need it for road trips, so charging at home isn't an issue.

 

[quagmire]

I don’t think I’ve ever charged our EV on the drive and thought, ‘I shouldn’t have to do this’ lol. That is a major convenience and selling point along with being able to go 250 miles for £5.

If 46% of EV drivers on a US survey admit to wanting to go back to ICE, that’s a sad reflection I’d say.

I think that 46% is a bit misleading cause it doesn't qualify the data as they replaced the EV with ICE, or just their next car purchase was ICE.

Would I be included in that 46% statistic because the car I bought after my Model 3 was a Corvette? I didn't replace the Model 3 with the 'Vette, but was an addition to my garage. But as long as that stat is just what was their next car purchase, I would count in that.

 

[JT2002TJ]

I think that 46% is a bit misleading cause it doesn't qualify the data as they replaced the EV with ICE, or just their next car purchase was ICE.

Would I be included in that 46% statistic because the car I bought after my Model 3 was a Corvette? I didn't replace the Model 3 with the 'Vette, but was an addition to my garage. But as long as that stat is just what was their next car purchase, I would count in that.

Exactly. I would say most EV households are single EV households. The EV purchase was made, their next purchase is likely replacing their ICE with another ICE or ICE/Hybrid. There are 2 major hurdles, 1) buying one’s first EV and 2) becoming a full EV household. Not all EV buyers make the jump to 2 like my house did.

There are those that buy an EV and realize it isn’t for them. Nothing wrong with that, but I 100% guarantee it is NOT high 40% of actual EV buyers.

There is so much these studies leave out, like you said. Also, does it include people who lease (they may not find a deal they want, and are forced to go ICE)? People who live in apartments/houses without access to chargers? Who did they survey, did they get a true representation of the population, or did they seek the results they wanted to make their biased point?

 

[Apple fanboy]

Exactly. I would say most EV households are single EV households. The EV purchase was made, their next purchase is likely replacing their ICE with another ICE or ICE/Hybrid. There are 2 major hurdles, 1) buying one’s first EV and 2) becoming a full EV household. Not all EV buyers make the jump to 2 like my house did.

There are those that buy an EV and realize it isn’t for them. Nothing wrong with that, but I 100% guarantee it is NOT high 40% of actual EV buyers.

There is so much these studies leave out, like you said. Also, does it include people who lease (they may not find a deal they want, and are forced to go ICE)? People who live in apartments/houses without access to chargers? Who did they survey, did they get a true representation of the population, or did they seek the results they wanted to make their biased point?

Exactly. If you read from multiple sources you get a truer picture (if that is what you want to achieve of course!).

All the people I know that bought an EV are either on their first, second or third one by now. None of them ever plan to go back to ICE cars.

Yes for some people they might change their mind and go back to the old way of doing things, but I would say they would be in the very low percentages.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

Exactly. If you read from multiple sources you get a truer picture (if that is what you want to achieve of course!).

All the people I know that bought an EV are either on their first, second or third one by now. None of them ever plan to go back to ICE cars.

Yes for some people they might change their mind and go back to the old way of doing things, but I would say they would be in the very low percentages.

The biggest hurdle for manufacturers to convince consumers of is batteries I think. From many of the negative comments I see online, it’s batteries that concern people. The worry is they’ll buy a 3+ year old EV and the battery will fail and they’ll be faced with a huge bill, the sort of bill that would mean the car gets scrapped. My boss is currently going through a bit of a fight with Kia over a Niro he bought for his wife over in the Netherlands. It’s a 2018 and the battery has failed at 90k. It’s amazing how a manufacturer will try and dodge obligation and action all that small print in a warranty when a big bill presents itself lol.

I’ll be honest, although I love our EV and have no problem using one from new, I am dubious about secondhand EV’s to some degree. It would be good if sellers could produce battery reports to ensure confidence in what people buy, much like a service history on an ICE car. I also think repairs need to be a lot cheaper than they currently are as very few people are going to be willing to pay £6k-£10k on a repair. That’s report it stolen and set it on fire on waste ground territory lol.

 

[Vegastouch]

I don’t think I’ve ever charged our EV on the drive and thought, ‘I shouldn’t have to do this’ lol. That is a major convenience and selling point along with being able to go 250 miles for £5.

If 46% of EV drivers on a US survey admit to wanting to go back to ICE, that’s a sad reflection I’d say.

That isn't the point. It's expensive to get a charger in your garage. Agree it's convenient, til it catches fire. Unless they want to use a basic 120v power that takes hours and hours to charge the car,....and it's 49% UK people that said they would go back to ICE. That's even more than us.
You like it and that's great but half the people seem to not be sold on it.

I think what they do and the electronic info is cool on the inside and it's cheaper than had to charge at a charge station but as of now, I've no plans to buy a EV anytime soon..

 

[Apple fanboy]

The biggest hurdle for manufacturers to convince consumers of is batteries I think. From many of the negative comments I see online, it’s batteries that concern people. The worry is they’ll buy a 3+ year old EV and the battery will fail and they’ll be faced with a huge bill, the sort of bill that would mean the car gets scrapped. My boss is currently going through a bit of a fight with Kia over a Niro he bought for his wife over in the Netherlands. It’s a 2018 and the battery has failed at 90k. It’s amazing how a manufacturer will try and dodge obligation and action all that small print in a warranty when a big bill presents itself lol.

I’ll be honest, although I love our EV and have no problem using one from new, I am dubious about secondhand EV’s to some degree. It would be good if sellers could produce battery reports to ensure confidence in what people buy, much like a service history on an ICE car. I also think repairs need to be a lot cheaper than they currently are as very few people are going to be willing to pay £6k-£10k on a repair. That’s report it stolen and set it on fire on waste ground territory lol.

Most reports I read suggest batteries are lasting a lot longer than anticipated. Mine has an 8 year warranty. When the 8 years is up it will probably be something I’d be moving on anyway. But that’s just about how long I keep a car, nothing to do with battery confidence.
The most likely scenario is a battery will lose some range. But that isn’t the end of the world. I mean the next recipient is likely to drive it even less miles than I do.
Yes some batteries will completely fail. But so do some engines. Got a quote to replace one of those lately? Depending on the car that is often not economical to do either.

 

[Apple fanboy]

That isn't the point. It's expensive to get a charger in your garage. Agree it's convenient, til it catches fire. Unless they want to use a basic 120v power that takes hours and hours to charge the car,....and it's 49% UK people that said they would go back to ICE. That's even more than us.
You like it and that's great but half the people seem to not be sold on it.

I think what they do and the electronic info is cool on the inside and it's cheaper than had to charge at a charge station but as of now, I've no plans to buy a EV anytime soon..

No I’m sorry the 49% UK people want to go back to an ICE car is fake news. That is completely made up (not necessarily by you), but that just doesn’t play out in the real world. Like I said. Don’t believe everything you read online.

 

[Vegastouch]

So again with the incorrect information. Nobody wants to go to the gas station to fill up. It’s not convenient.
Now imagine every time you went to bed someone came and filled your car up for you. It also cost a lot lot less than going to the gas station.
That would be perfect wouldn’t it?

That’s what driving an EV is like. I hated going to the gas station as it smells, it’s not on my way to work and takes time out of my day.


As for 49% of EV drivers wanting to switch back that is definitely not true. I speak to lots of EV drivers and never met one who wanted to or has switched back.

Don’t believe everything you read. Think about who benefits from misinformation about EV’s.

It’s true that tax breaks have helped with EV sales on both sides of the ocean. But the government has benefited in reduced air pollution for example which helps reduce the burden on hospitals etc.
EV’s are not 100% of the solution as there will always be edge cases. But the more people that make the switch the better it is for all of us.

You talking to EV drivers is a very small sample. I don't make the polls.
You liking EVs is great but it's not for everyone.
It's the same as Apple phone users and Android users. iOS isn't for everyone and vice versa.
And I'll add, for me i don't know many people that own a EV. I do know a few but it isn't many and obviously I see them in the road.

 

[Apple fanboy]

You talking to EV drivers is a very small sample. I don't make the polls.
You liking EVs is great but it's not for everyone.
It's the same as Apple phone users and Android users. iOS isn't for everyone and vice versa.

The polls? Which polls? Please provide links.

 

[Apple fanboy]

You talking to EV drivers is a very small sample. I don't make the polls.
You liking EVs is great but it's not for everyone.
It's the same as Apple phone users and Android users. iOS isn't for everyone and vice versa.

To save you time here are some.

Like I said you have to check your source. What Car? for example are very reliable UK source.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

That isn't the point. It's expensive to get a charger in your garage. Agree it's convenient, til it catches fire. Unless they want to use a basic 120v power that takes hours and hours to charge the car,....and it's 49% UK people that said they would go back to ICE. That's even more than us.
You like it and that's great but half the people seem to not be sold on it.

I think what they do and the electronic info is cool on the inside and it's cheaper than had to charge at a charge station but as of now, I've no plans to buy a EV anytime soon..

You keep mentioning about home chargers catching fire and I have never heard of this happening. Surely a circuit breaker prevents this? In the UK we use 240v as standard in our homes too, so operate on a higher output. I’m guessing we have better systems which are more highly regulated if yours are catching fire.

49% of UK EV owners wanting to go back to ICE now, can you share this data please? EV uptake is healthy in the UK with 1 in 5 new vehicle registrations being EV, so if popularity is growing, I have no idea where half are as you say, going backwards.

It’ll be interesting to see your link to this survey as I know I’ve never been asked or seen it mentioned on any of the motoring channels I follow. Please source it, I’m very interested.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

Most reports I read suggest batteries are lasting a lot longer than anticipated. Mine has an 8 year warranty. When the 8 years is up it will probably be something I’d be moving on anyway. But that’s just about how long I keep a car, nothing to do with battery confidence.
The most likely scenario is a battery will lose some range. But that isn’t the end of the world. I mean the next recipient is likely to drive it even less miles than I do.
Yes some batteries will completely fail. But so do some engines. Got a quote to replace one of those lately? Depending on the car that is often not economical to do either.

I see the same reports but my concern is the examples where those batteries aren’t lasting longer and you can’t just take it to the local garage to get a few parts replaced. My boss paid €15k for a car and has a €10k bill potentially and that’s unrealistic I think. Work needs to be done on consumer confidence and costs need to come down massively. My cousin has a 2013 Model S on its original battery and it’s pushing 300k miles, so that’s the flip side.

My wife would never go back to ICE now she’s used EV’s for the past 18 months. My next car will probably be ICE though as I have my eye on a couple of cars I want to own before it’s too late.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

That isn't the point. It's expensive to get a charger in your garage.

Compared to the cost of the car, the cost of a home charger is negligible. When you add the savings to it with an average mileage, the return on investment is measured in months, not even a year. If you add the value it adds to selling your house, it is a no-brainer.

Agree it's convenient, til it catches fire.

You don't seem to want to have a discussion when you introduce silly ad-hominem like that. If an electrical appliance catches fire, it wasn't installed correctly. There is no reason for it to catch fire when installed correctly and in line with building regulations.

Unless they want to use a basic 120v power that takes hours and hours to charge the car

The ROW runs on 240V, my house in the UK is at 240V with 32A. It is 7kWh that it would supply. Our home in the Netherlands is at a three-phase supply, it can do 22 kWh pending the car, our car built-in charger is limited to 11kWh 🙂 In the UK we have a night tariff of 5 hours with very cheap energy, it is plenty to fill up the car for above average daily mileage, and in the rare event we use more, it will top it up by the second day. How long it takes is actually irrelevant as you'll be asleep 🙂 For our home in the Netherlands it is a more complicated and smart system where it not only combines with solar generation, but also with national grid balancing, and home battery storage. Basically the operating costs are as good as zero, and at times actually makes money 🙂 Sure an investment was required, but as that house did not have anything yet, literally nothing, no heating, no electricity, no floor, no ceilings, no running water, it had to be done anyway. So may as well do it in a modern sustainable manner.

,....and it's 49% UK people that said they would go back to ICE. That's even more than us.
You like it and that's great but half the people seem to not be sold on it.

The devil is in the details. I've never met anyone who made the move to EV to return to ICE. The ones I hear complain about is where they got a company car, have no charging at home, and can only charge in public. And I do have sympathy for that.

I think what they do and the electronic info is cool on the inside and it's cheaper than had to charge at a charge station but as of now, I've no plans to buy a EV anytime soon..

I understand that, you are clearly still very much in the stage of where you believe the misinformation published, likely as it provides confirmation that you are making the right decision. yet here you are, clearly interested.

 

[Vegastouch]

,

You keep mentioning about home chargers catching fire and I have never heard of this happening. Surely a circuit breaker prevents this? In the UK we use 240v as standard in our homes too, so operate on a higher output. I’m guessing we have better systems which are more highly regulated if yours are catching fire.

49% of UK EV owners wanting to go back to ICE now, can you share this data please? EV uptake is healthy in the UK with 1 in 5 new vehicle registrations being EV, so if popularity is growing, I have no idea where half are as you say, going backwards.

It’ll be interesting to see your link to this survey as I know I’ve never been asked or seen it mentioned on any of the motoring channels I follow. Please source it, I’m very interested.

Didn't say home chargers. It's the lithium batteries that catch fire. Seems they catch fire in an accident easy but its just what i see in the news here.
You can search for those too, it happens.

Here is one that mentions the % but not sure this is the exact one. I don't recall where it came from.
Not sure why it matters so much unless you are a keep up with the Jones type and think it's the cool thing to do.
There are several articles and you could find it yourself if you are so interested. Also not sure why it matters, which car. Its an overall survey. Again, you want details, you can look that up. I just did a quick search. But here's one. I am in the USA so its going to mostly talk about us in the USA with a mention of other areas.

https://www.newsnationnow.com/automotive/half-us-ev-owners-switch-back-normal-cars-study/

 

[Vegastouch]

Compared to the cost of the car, the cost of a home charger is negligible. When you add the savings to it with an average mileage, the return on investment is measured in months, not even a year. If you add the value it adds to selling your house, it is a no-brainer.

You don't seem to want to have a discussion when you introduce silly ad-hominem like that. If an electrical appliance catches fire, it wasn't installed correctly. There is no reason for it to catch fire when installed correctly and in line with building regulations.

The ROW runs on 240V, my house in the UK is at 240V with 32A. It is 7kWh that it would supply. Our home in the Netherlands is at a three-phase supply, it can do 22 kWh pending the car, our car built-in charger is limited to 11kWh 🙂 In the UK we have a night tariff of 5 hours with very cheap energy, it is plenty to fill up the car for above average daily mileage, and in the rare event we use more, it will top it up by the second day. How long it takes is actually irrelevant as you'll be asleep 🙂 For our home in the Netherlands it is a more complicated and smart system where it not only combines with solar generation, but also with national grid balancing, and home battery storage. Basically the operating costs are as good as zero, and at times actually makes money 🙂 Sure an investment was required, but as that house did not have anything yet, literally nothing, no heating, no electricity, no floor, no ceilings, no running water, it had to be done anyway. So may as well do it in a modern sustainable manner.

The devil is in the details. I've never met anyone who made the move to EV to return to ICE. The ones I hear complain about is where they got a company car, have no charging at home, and can only charge in public. And I do have sympathy for that.

I understand that, you are clearly still very much in the stage of where you believe the misinformation published, likely as it provides confirmation that you are making the right decision. yet here you are, clearly interested.

Look, those of you that think EVs are great, That's nice. Its the all new thing. Doesnt mean its better but it can be and still has a way to go.

It was a interesting thought at first for me till thinking about it more. Id only be interested in a self driving car which i tell it where I want to go, and I sit back and watch TV or do whatever. ..take a nap. We are far from that being perfected.
I've driven golf cart type vehicles many times over the years and I just prefer gas engines cars for driving around town and long trips. Im just more a car enthusiest than an adapter.
My guess is Gen Z is the most interested in EVs but even they have to shell out the money and they like convenience more than anyone.
I don't knock anyone for wanting an EV it's just for me, they have a way to go and I'm not an early adopter of most things.
Hec I don't even care if I have the latest phone or the latest update that some go crazy over.
Just because I am here and replied to this, doesn't mean I'm in the market for a EV.

You call it mis information because it doesnt suit your purchase of one. Everybody wants to be verified they did the right thing.

 

[Chuckeee]

It's the lithium batteries that catch fire. Seems they catch fire in an accident easy but its just what i see in the news here.
You can search for those too, it happens.

It is all a matter of perspective. Gasoline is frighteningly flammable and extremely dangerous. That is why large trucks and jet aircraft don’t use gasoline. Diesel and aviation fuel (kerosene) are much safer than gasoline. But gasoline is still the most common fuel for ICE vehicles.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

Look, those of you that think EVs are great, That's nice. Its the all new thing. Doesnt mean its better but it can be and still has a way to go.

It was a interesting thought at first for me till thinking about it more. Id only be interested in a self driving car which i tell it where I want to go, and I sit back and watch TV or do whatever. ..take a nap. We are far from that being perfected.
I've driven golf cart type vehicles many times over the years and I just prefer gas engines cars for driving around town and long trips. Im just more a car enthusiest than an adapter.
My guess is Gen Z is the most interested in EVs but even they have to shell out the money and they like convenience more than anyone.
I don't knock anyone for wanting an EV it's just for me, they have a way to go and I'm not an early adopter of most things.
Hec I don't even care if I have the latest phone or the latest update that some go crazy over.
Just because I am here and replied to this, doesn't mean I'm in the market for a EV.

You call it mis information because it doesnt suit your purchase of one. Everybody wants to be verified they did the right thing.

Well it is verifiably mis information. I’ve even quoted the official source for you in the USA. All this talk about more likely to catch fire is absolutely false.

It’s not even new either. Relatively it is of course. But several people are on their second or third iteration now based on keeping the car for like three to four years.

Most people in this thread are car enthusiasts. A true enthousiast can appreciate all sorts. You can see several of mine in this thread. I don’t recall you ever posting what you do like, let alone photos of your amazing vehicles, just negativity about what you don’t like. 🤷‍♂️

 

[Vegastouch]

Well it is verifiably mis information. I’ve even quoted the official source for you in the USA. All this talk about more likely to catch fire is absolutely false.

It’s not even new either. Relatively it is of course. But several people are on their second or third iteration now based on keeping the car for like three to four years.

Most people in this thread are car enthusiasts. A true enthousiast can appreciate all sorts. You can see several of mine in this thread. I don’t recall you ever posting what you do like, let alone photos of your amazing vehicles, just negativity about what you don’t like. 🤷‍♂️

Lol, well sorry I didn't even know this thread existed til recently. I don't think it's misinformation, you just don't like it.
I'm not being negative, just saying I'm not going to buy an EV based on they have a ways to go ,....for my liking. Didn't say, I didn't like anything.
I haven't told anyone they made a bad choice and I won't.
Don't be so sensitive.