The EyeSight thread (MERGED)

[Timpetus]

I think it needs eye contact. The guy next to you isn't looking at you constantly.

If you're lucky, that is. I take public transit daily, so I get constant reminders of the abysmal state of many people's social etiquette/skills.

Edit to add my other thought: as a Subaru owner, I instantly wondered whether the name EyeSight was actually up for grabs, given its use in their cars for over a decade...

 

[tobyringle69]

I think that model made funny face, that is partly why it looks weird.

Btw. That woman they use as model. She has big hair to balance the VP. So it sticking out wouldn’t be that noticeable. LoL.

I think you have a point there. I do believe her hair style was purposely chosen to make the VP not look so big. In the Guided Tour, the VP looks pretty normal sized, almost "cool". But on some others.....really really big. In the end, I guess it doesn't matter as it's not something we are wearing out in public. As long as it's relatively comfortable, I'll be happy.

 

[Crow_Servo]

By drawing that comparison, you're certainly not selling its importance. Perhaps the Touch Bar is a better comparison—introduced as a differentiating factor, beloved to the point of mania by some, ignored by everyone else, eventually abandoned.

It's a marketing parlor trick. A cool one, and one with the short-term utility to train people to not be afraid of someone wearing a face-mounted computer, but... come on now. To be so amazed by a silly eye display is missing the forest for the trees of what makes the AVP such an interesting and potentially future-illuminating device. It's the least important part of the whole package.

I see your point in relation to my comparison, but my point goes far beyond it being some superficial gimmick. It’s like you said, it helps make the experience less off putting for people around you, which benefits everyone in the situation.

Dynamic Island has pretty much proven to be a marketing gimmick in its actual execution, but it’s a temporary solution to the problem that Apple doesn’t have a way of hiding the Face ID sensor and camera and all the things that are on the front of the phone. They’re dressing it up to make it more palatable, and it happens to look different from the simple hole punch design of the front camera on most other smartphones now.

This EyeSight doesn’t have to exist. All the other headsets out there just have a blank front that basically tells everyone around them to either leave them alone or yell loudly at them to get their attention. Apple has come up with a way to tell people that you are still able to see them and interact with them. It’s not perfect. It looks artificial, which could still make interactions awkward, but it’s better than the competition IMO.

 

[WingingIt]

Apple has come up with a way to tell people that you are still able to see them and interact with them. It’s not perfect. It looks artificial, which could still make interactions awkward, but it’s better than the competition IMO.

Exactly.

Look, you can say that Apple’s attempt to make the Vision Pro somewhat sociable by simulating eye contact is over-engineered, but it’s got to be better than some kind of “I’m in AR mode and can see you” status light. Unless you bump into another person on the street who happens to own the same headset, no-one is going to actually pick up on that. Whereas humans have evolved to instantly spot and understand eye contact, so I think trying to simulate what people already do to show they are paying attention isn’t a bad idea and at least worth a try.

Maybe it won’t work in reality, but I suspect Apple have paid a vast number of human body language experts and academic specialists in this stuff to advise and consult. They’re probably at least making a somewhat educated guess about whether it’ll work before they spent so much money on developing it.

 

[tweaknmod]

So if I fall asleep with the VP on my face, will the other person see my rendered sleeping face or will it shut down ?

It will scan your brain and show a livestream of what you’re seeing as you dream.
I imagine waking up to a very annoyed version of my wife…

 

[4sallypat]

It will scan your brain and show a livestream of what you’re seeing as you dream.
I imagine waking up to a very annoyed version of my wife…

Wow, that would be quite an invention: livestream your dreams!

Mine would be very disturbing and require psychiatric intervention 🤣

 

[Eso]

I suspect if someone kindly asked me to remove my headset, I would kindly exercise my right not to continue talking with them.

Yeah see how well that works for you.

This entire feature should have been eliminated early on in development and the price reduced by $500.

If you need to interact with someone in any way more meaningful then yelling across the room, then the headset gets pulled up to your forehead. Just like how you would look up from your computer or lower your phone for a moment. It’s extremely disrespectful to do otherwise.

 

[WingingIt]

Yeah see how well that works for you.

I’m sure you didn’t mean that to sound like a threat, because threatening someone from behind the safety of your keyboard would be so tragic that you’d surely be too embarrassed.

 

[Eso]

I’m sure you didn’t mean that to sound like a threat, because threatening someone from behind the safety of your keyboard would be so tragic that you’d surely be too embarrassed.

Oh ok, you’re just an irrational person. No, it’s clearly an implication that if that is how you react to someone asking you to take off a headset to talk to them in person, that they are likely to be offended by your behavior and become upset with you. I can’t even comprehend how you could take it as a personal threat over a headset you don’t own yet, through a medium in which wearing one isn’t applicable.

 

[WingingIt]

Oh ok, you’re just an irrational person. No, it’s clearly an implication that if that is how you react to someone asking you to take off a headset to talk to them in person, that they are likely to be offended by your behavior and become upset with you. I can’t even comprehend how you could take it as a personal threat over a headset you don’t own yet, through a medium in which wearing one isn’t applicable.

Good. Just checking 😘

***edit***

Actually, you know what, I will engage with this ridiculousness…

<stranger walks up to me in public>

Me: “Hi, can I help you?”

Them: “Please could you take off your headset?”

“It’s ok, I can see and hear you with it on. Can I help you with something?”

“I don’t want to talk to you with that headset on, please can you take it off?”

“Uh… ok, well, I’m not sure what this is about anyway so I’m going to get back to what I was doing. Thanks.”

Why do I owe it to some random stranger to follow their pointless take off your headset instructions?

Incidentally, I’m also a motorcyclist and don’t take my helmet off when some random person wanders up to me while I’m standing near my motorcycle and starts talking to me either. You want to strike up a conversation with someone wearing something on their head, you be polite and do it on their terms rather than asking them to conform to your preferences.

 

[Crow_Servo]

Yeah see how well that works for you.

This entire feature should have been eliminated early on in development and the price reduced by $500.

If you need to interact with someone in any way more meaningful then yelling across the room, then the headset gets pulled up to your forehead. Just like how you would look up from your computer or lower your phone for a moment. It’s extremely disrespectful to do otherwise.

It sounds like you’re inventing etiquette for a device that isn’t out yet. Apple has already thought about the possibility that a person might want to converse with others while wearing the Apple Vision Pro. They came up with a solution called EyeSight. Welcome to the conversation.

I know this response will annoy you, but your insistence that people shouldn’t be allowed to converse while wearing the Vision Pro is also annoying. Sure, the commercials make it look easy to put the Vision Pro on your face, but there’s also going to be minor adjustments, I imagine, and it might be quite annoying for someone to have to put it on and take it off during a session.

For all we know, it won’t be easy to just lift it up all the time. I know it’s not convenient to remove the PSVR2. You basically have to completely remove it and set it down somewhere. There has been no reenactment so far of someone lifting the Vision Pro off their face while keeping it on their head. I’m thinking Apple realizes this would be inconvenient, so they have it to where you don’t have to.

Unless that person is talking to you, and they need to remove it completely off their head and set it down because that’s your rule.

 

[subjonas]

I hope not. It allows you to be more interactive with the people physically around you when you’re separated by this enclosed device on your face.

People are suggesting that a future version should omit this aspect. I don’t see it as a “pro” feature that remains exclusive only to the premium edition. I see it as a part of the outward identity of the Apple Vision device, like the iPhone had the notch and now Dynamic Island.

It’ll very likely evolve and Apple could possibly find a simpler way to add it to a lower cost version, but I don’t see it being removed entirely.

Yeah I’ve seen/heard Apple on more than one occasion call EyeSight a core feature of VP. So I don’t think it’s going anywhere.
I hope and think it will get better in future iterations of the Pro, so that it looks more normal as far as proportion and position in relation to the rest of face.

 

[subjonas]

By drawing that comparison, you're certainly not selling its importance. Perhaps the Touch Bar is a better comparison—introduced as a differentiating factor, beloved to the point of mania by some, ignored by everyone else, eventually abandoned.

It's a marketing parlor trick. A cool one, and one with the short-term utility to train people to not be afraid of someone wearing a face-mounted computer, but... come on now. To be so amazed by a silly eye display is missing the forest for the trees of what makes the AVP such an interesting and potentially future-illuminating device. It's the least important part of the whole package.

I don’t think the goal of the feature is to train people, I think it’s to relay information critical to social cues and communication. Knowing when someone is looking right at you and seeing information expressed in their eyes is a necessity for even the most basic social interactions, so much so that I don’t think Apple is willing to give it up to bring the cost down a few hundred dollars.

 

[subjonas]

Yeah see how well that works for you.

This entire feature should have been eliminated early on in development and the price reduced by $500.

If you need to interact with someone in any way more meaningful then yelling across the room, then the headset gets pulled up to your forehead. Just like how you would look up from your computer or lower your phone for a moment. It’s extremely disrespectful to do otherwise.

It’s not necessarily disrespectful. People who work with masks/head gear on don’t always remove them for every interaction with people around them. It’s too impractical. So it depends on context and the seriousness of the conversation. For shorter exchanges, I don’t think most people mind them keeping it on. For longer more serious conversations, head gear should probably come off. The EyeSight feature simply allows people to have the shorter exchanges without having to take the headset off every time, but also do so without losing the ability to see each other’s eyes which is a critical part of almost all social interactions. Otherwise either it would be too annoying taking off and putting on the headset every time, or social interaction would be too hampered (ie. talking to a person with a blindfold on that is sometimes see through sometimes not, but you can’t tell).

 

[Piggie]

I'm still getting Apple Touch Bar vibes with this part of the Vision Pro.
I may be wrong, but I feel it's an idea that they came up with and thought it would be cool, but after a while the realisation will be that, it's not a feature that in reality gets used much, and just adds to cost and weight, and after a certain amount of time will simply get dropped, and we will then mostly all agree it was a fun, but pointless in reality concept that we'd good to get rid of.

 

[Piggie]

What happens when two people who are wearing Vision Pro with Eye-Sight on, sit next to each other, look and talk to each other?

 

[Crow_Servo]

What happens when two people who are wearing Vision Pro with Eye-Sight on, sit next to each other, look and talk to each other?

The honest, serious answer is I don’t know. I assume it would look the same to each of you as it would someone who is looking at you and they are not wearing a Vision Pro.

The joke answer is nobody’s going to be in a room with another person wearing a Vision Pro.

 

[CookItOff]

I talk to people with dark sunglasses on all the time and it doesn't bother me one bit. When I know they can see me I don't need to see their eyes.

I hope there is an option to turn the large outward facing display completely off to conserver battery. I don't need swirly lights flashing my room while I'm watching a movie.

 

[subjonas]

What happens when two people who are wearing Vision Pro with Eye-Sight on, sit next to each other, look and talk to each other?

Maybe you see their persona haha

 

[subjonas]

I talk to people with dark sunglasses on all the time and it doesn't bother me one bit. When I know they can see me I don't need to see their eyes.

Sunglasses is ok in many situations but the crucial difference from a headset is with sunglasses you know they’re not looking at YouTube. With a headset they could be looking at literally anything. There’s a lot to be said for knowing if you have someone’s attention or not, and with a headset without Eyesight, you don’t.

 

[CookItOff]

There’s a lot to be said for knowing if you have someone’s attention or not, and with a headset without Eyesight, you don’t.

When they turn their head to me and start talking then I know I have their attention. The literal same thing could apply for sunglasses. The person could have their eyes closed while looking at me. If we are interacting and they don't want to see me then that's on them not me. I actually purposely have conversations while wearing my sunglasses and close my eyes during. The conversations go extremely well. Sorry Bob if you're reading this, yes I usually have my eyes shut when we talk. lol

"Sorry could you repeat that, I had my eyes closed."

 

[AbblePC]

The honest, serious answer is I don’t know. I assume it would look the same to each of you as it would someone who is looking at you and they are not wearing a Vision Pro.

The joke answer is nobody’s going to be in a room with another person wearing a Vision Pro.

I will be, I bought one for my wife and I so that we can both simultaneously enjoy what we’re are both watching at times. Like now we go on meta and share 360 walking tours in other countries etc..

 

[dotnet]

This absolutely cries out for a snorkel. I wonder who will be the first to offer one in a matching design. It could serve as an innovative input device…

 

[AbblePC]

View attachment 2340951

This absolutely cries out for a snorkel. I wonder who will be the first to offer one in a matching design. It could serve as an innovative input device…

I’m awaiting the option to display an alternate face. The VP App Store will maybe have persona faces you can buy or download for free, like Darth Vader, Betty Davis eyes, or that crazy looking guy on Adam Sandler movies, lol. And all the while they will mimick your facial and eye movement - I get it Darth Vader wouldn’t, but it would be funny to look at someone to see Darth face.

 

[subjonas]

When they turn their head to me and start talking then I know I have their attention. The literal same thing could apply for sunglasses. The person could have their eyes closed while looking at me. If we are interacting and they don't want to see me then that's on them not me. I actually purposely have conversations while wearing my sunglasses and close my eyes during. The conversations go extremely well. Sorry Bob if you're reading this, yes I usually have my eyes shut when we talk. lol

"Sorry could you repeat that, I had my eyes closed."

Someone with a VR headset can at any time be watching or reading a screen off to the side while talking to you and you could never be sure, but not so with sunglasses unless it’s a physical screen that you’re both aware of. Whether or not that possibility of them dividing their attention while talking to you bothers you is of course a personal preference, but just pointing out that there is a difference that will matter to others.