The "I'm waiting for an iMac refresh" thread

Discussion in 'iMac' started by Robert Grant, Jun 12, 2010.

  1. Robert Grant macrumors member

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    #1
    Yeh thought we could all discuss opinions on updates/group hugs etc. all here. :p Share the painnn. At least only 12 days til the new iPhone. :)
     
  2. glen8 macrumors newbie

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    Jun 12, 2010
    #2
    Great idea for a thread.

    This is my first post so I'd like to say Hi to the Mac community. I'm a PC user, been a sys admin for the past 10 years but due to various personal changes in my home life I'm ditching the family PC computer in favor of a new iMac. Really don't want to bring my work home with me and when I do sit infront of a computer at home I just want to be able to do what I want to do on it.

    I've been looking at the 21.5" and 27" iMacs and think I'll be waiting for the refresh. I'd really like to see the following:-

    Reintroduction of the 24" model. Personally I find the 21.5" too small, but the 27" too big.

    Intel Clarkdale i3 and i5 processors. I'm really not sure who these iMacs are supposed to be aimed at but I originally thought the i stood for Internet. The original iMac was aimed at those consumers wanting fast and easy access onto the Internet. That said, do we really need i7 processors and high end graphics cards? Which leads me onto my next point

    ATi Radeon 5000 series GPUs. I'm not sure if apple should be including mid to high end GPUs as gaming (IMHO) is moving away from the PC and going more and more towards consoles. If you want to play games, buy a console! Apple should use GPUs to compliment their software for OS/APP hardware acceleration in video encoding, desktop and browser acceleration etc etc..That's my opinion anyway, I'm sure there's many iMac users who enjoy gaming.

    eSata and USB3.0 connectivity. USB2 backups HDDs are too slow.

    2 x 3.5" HDD bays. It would be great to have the option of a second internal HDD for storage. Keep HDD1 for the OS/Apps and store your media on HDD2. I'd prefer this option over an external. That's if the iMac has room for an additional disk in its casing. If they can, perhaps a Raid0/Raid1 option although maybe Apple feel that's only for the PowerMac range.

    My next two I'm really on the wall with....SSD and Blu-Ray. I've owned an SSD drive and IMHO it's not worth the price to storage/performance ratio. Maybe they can at least offer it as an option though? Blu-Ray is fantastic for optical storage. I'm not keen on watching Blu-Ray movies on a computer. That's what I have a 42" Plasma for in the living room for. However, for storage it would be great. I have 23gb of photos I'd like to backup and not keen on just keeping them on a backup HDD incase that fails!! DVD-9 is not enough anymore. again...maybe include it as an option?
     
  3. Sargiel macrumors member

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    Jan 2, 2005
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    West Sussex, England
    #3
    I currently have a 24" iMac 2.33Ghz C2D, 3GB RAM with a 7600GT and I'm looking with envy at the top of the line 27"'s :D

    Just really looking for a graphics refresh from the 4850 to the 5 series. Can't wait to ditch the NVIDIA with it's flakey driver support .. ATI do a much better job of working with Apple on drivers.
     
  4. MathijsDelva macrumors regular

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    Feb 28, 2008
    #4
    I too am waiting for the iMac refresh. I have a white unibody late 2009 MacBook (free replacement from Apple after 3 years! :D) and i've been working 4 years on a 13.3" screen as my main computer at home. I've been talking about an iMac for over 3 years now (at first, wild dreams) and i really wanted to get one from the current revision. From the moment i saw the new design update and form factors and said to myself, omg i'm getting one. But i just started working and didn't have enough money. I decided to wait until i have enough money. Then the whole 'i' architecture came around and the current GPU isn't al that great. So i'm still waiting to get my 'i' iMac 21.5" with a 5xxx GPU. If not this month, then this summer we'll get it. I don't really care about USB 3.0 (although great!); i just want an i5, 5xxx @ 1349 EUR.
     
  5. Hellhammer Moderator

    Hellhammer

    Staff Member

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    Finland
    #5
    I doubt they'll make 3 models. 21.5" isn't that much smaller plus its resolution is almost the same as 24"s. There are still 24" refurbs ;)

    Well, iMac is meant for a lot people. Low-end serves most people just fine as long as you don't do any heavy stuff such as gaming. I find high-end 21.5" being the best "gaming Mac" as it's not that expensive and offers decent GPU (gaming performance is about the same as high-end 27" due resolution). I really hope they put good GPU, at least as an option to the 21.5" so the people who want to game have possibility to do it, without jumping for $3k Mac Pro.

    Low-end 27" I find being the option for 27", with reasonable price tag. For 300$ more, the quad core is something you should really jump to as it's almost twice as fast let alone the better GPU. High-end 27" has really hit the Mac Pro market as it's faster than quad core Mac Pro, for 500$ less plus enormous display. The only disadvantage is the lack of upgradeability. No PCIe cards, no other than USB and FW HDs etc. iMac with ExpressSlot and user-upgradeable HD would probably kill Mac Pro.

    The problem is that software, especially huge software suites like Final Cut and Creative Suites are extremely slow to update. Some day the power of GPUs will be unleashed for general tasks. OpenCL is great tool for that but support for it is still pretty bad.

    Many people prefer PCs for gaming over consoles, that's totally dependent on person. PC gaming market is still pretty huge and now due introduction of Steam for OS X, there will be a lot more games available straight for OS X. iMac is the only reasonable desktop Mac for gaming thus Apple should make it even better.

    eSATA has been available since 2004 so Apple would have used it already if they wanted. Problem with USB 3.0 is that Intel is avoiding it and not integrating it to their chipsets before 2012 thus Apple would have to use dedicated chip for USB 3.0. It's not impossible but Apple has never been a fan of adding anything extra.

    Currently there is no space for dual 3.5". If Apple made it thicker, it would be possible. Many people would still prefer SSD over second HD so 2.5" SSD + 3.5" HD is something most of us if hoping for.

    Blu-Ray technology exists so it's only up to Apple do they want it, or not. Currently they haven't and Mac Pro would likely get it first.

    I'm just killing some time (waiting for my train) so no offense meant :cool:

    My guess of what will the next gen have:

    Low-end 21.5"

    Intel Core 2 Duo 3.06GHz (option for 3.33GHz)
    NVidia 320M
    4GB RAM
    500GB HD

    High-end 21.5"

    Intel Core i3 "Clarkdale" 2.93GHz (option for 3.2GHz Intel Core i5 "Clarkdale")
    ATI 57xx with 256MB GDDR3
    4GB RAM
    1TB HD

    Low-end 27"

    Intel Core i3 "Clarkdale" 2.93GHz (option for 3.2GHz Intel Core i5 "Clarkdale" and 2.66GHz Intel Core i5 "Lynnfield")
    ATI 57xx with 256MB GDDR3 (option for ATI 58xx with 512MB GDDR5)
    4GB RAM
    1TB HD

    High-end 27"

    Intel Core i5 "Lynnfield" 2.66GHz (option for 2.8GHz Intel Core i7 "Lynnfield")
    ATI 58xx with 512MB GDDR5
    1TB HD

    All models have option for up to 2TB HD and up to 16GB RAM. Apple may not use the exact models I mentioned so e.g. 3.06GHz i3 instead of 2.93GHz and 3.33GHz i5 instead of 3.2GHz etc. Can't tell more about the GPU other than mid models will get "Redwood" based GPU and high-end will get "Juniper" based GPU

    Just my guess
     
  6. gelie macrumors 6502

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    Mar 7, 2010
    #6
    When was the last time apple came out with a new iMac ? Are most people still guessing the new iMac will come out in October?
     
  7. NintendoFan macrumors regular

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    Massachusetts
    #7
    Could careless about a second hard drive. I'd like to see the ability to access the drive as easily as the RAM.
     
  8. Hellhammer Moderator

    Hellhammer

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    #8
    October the 20th, 2009. I would say September as there has never been 12 months without update, usually 11 months max
     
  9. easepease macrumors regular

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    Colorado
    #9
    Well as far as gaming goes I know people like "all in ones" especially if they are buying imacs... however I built a pc (i know i know... evil) for under $400 with good graphics (where most of the cost was) and an i3 2.93 ghz, and 4 gb memory. That and or a ps3 can allow you to keep your imac free of windows.

    Also it lets me have a windows machine for random windows only use. Overall a good $350 to $500 can get you your gaming machine, and lets the imac do the big boy stuff.

    On another note I too am waiting for a refresh, I bought an i7 with a bad screen and just chose to wait till a refresh now. I have a macbook pro 2.16 core duo thats on its last legs (dropped a few times) so hopefully sometime soon, but I can wait until fall if need be. Would be nice to get a free ipod though from BTS... I just want that 27 inch for that awesome screen :)

    For me an option for a second ssd would be AWESOME, that or usb 3.0 or blue ray or... none of that will happen though :( I just read what hellhammer posts and go with that, he seems to be pretty accurate most of the time!
     
  10. henrikrox macrumors 65816

    henrikrox

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    Feb 3, 2010
    #10
    I agree with you, though i do think the base/low end 27" will also have a upgradle gpu as a option. As the current base 27" imac has
     
  11. Hellhammer Moderator

    Hellhammer

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    #11
    Ahh, good point, totally forgot that! Will edit it now :cool:
     
  12. antster94 macrumors 6502a

    antster94

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    May 2, 2010
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    London, UK
    #12
    I just hope in the next update Apple put an HDMI input in, it's near impossible to get hold of a Kanex XD adaptor here in the UK so that would be very welcome!
     
  13. MathijsDelva macrumors regular

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    Feb 28, 2008
    #13
    I agree Hellhammer, except i think that Apple will jump to 512MB versions of the GPU and not 256MB.
     
  14. pilot1226 macrumors 6502a

    pilot1226

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    Mar 18, 2010
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    USA
    #14
    +1

    It was mentioned above that you could build an i3 system for around 400 bucks. I'm not so sure of that. Maybe if you're upgrading and reusing existing parts, but you're looking at 100-150 for a motherboard, around 100-250 for your processor, another 100-200 for your memory, another 75-125 for your HD, another 50 for your case, another 50 for your power supply, etc. The prices just add up and up and up.
     
  15. easepease macrumors regular

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    Colorado
    #15
    with the i3 system i guess $400 is hard for most... for me I already had a professional windows 7 key... so thats a lot of savings.

    Then a good deal on a case for $40 with built in 500W power supply, and no its not a plastic pice of junk i just searched for a deal. $89 for 4 gb ram... got a good deal on a motherboard for $80, $99 for the i3, then $90 for my graphics card... and yes I had a lot of extra harddrives so that was also not in the price. Not an i7 imac... but for $400 it sure does great with all the games i have throw at it!

    So i guess $600 for someone that needs to get a harddrive and windows 7... So thats quite a bit, but my point being PC for gaming is sooo much cheaper and its almost easier to just build one just for gaming and not worry so much about the imac's gaming ability cause apple charges a lot for hardware... but in the end the software and usability pays for itself in anything but gaming... but thats or another thread. sorry my post was missleading
     
  16. henrikrox macrumors 65816

    henrikrox

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    #16
    Not to throw ****. But the i3 isnt that great for gaming, no turbo mode. Also a 99 dollar graphics card isnt the greatest around. If you want a proper gaming PC you reach 1000 dollars and more. Also 40 dollars for a PSU and a case, i dont think so. I would never buy cheap stuff, a cheap case, doesnt have good airflow, and its not sound dampend etc, the power supply isnt modular, so theres cables everywhere.

    Then you need a display, imac comes with one of the best displays out there, and ips of the same quality is a 1000 bucks more. So of all the mac products i think the imac is the best deal around, easily.

    Also, you have one cable going from the imac, not 10 that you do from a custom built PC. And again, the imac is so beautiful.

    I used to build gaming PC's before. Never again. But now we are going offtopic, sorry.
     
  17. dal20402 macrumors 6502

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    Apr 24, 2006
    #17
    I'll add myself to the chorus.

    The current 27", especially if you buy a refurb, is a fantastic deal. You can't even get a better monitor without spending about $1000. But I've gotten spoiled by the responsiveness of the SSD in my 13" MBP and want an SSD/HD combo. I'd even be happy if they would just run two SATA connectors to the current HD bay, so I could use a 2x2.5" to 3.5" adapter and have an SSD and a large 2.5" HD.

    Other welcome changes would be USB3 and a graphics upgrade.
     
  18. dwarnecke11 macrumors 6502

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    Nov 29, 2009
    #18
    Count me in! I bought a 27" i5 last November but returned it due to the screen flicker problem, color temperature inconsistency and a grumbly Seagate HD. Now I wait and wait as I use my old Mac mini 1.42 Ghz G4 with 10.3. I'm hoping to get an i7 for the same price as the current i5, plus a more powerful GPU, etc.
     
  19. iMacmatician macrumors 601

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    Jul 20, 2008
    #19
    Overall I think they are fairly reasonable.

    There's a recently released 3.07 GHz Lynnfield (replacing the current 2.93 GHz), and given the tentative placement of 6 and 8 core Sandy Bridge CPUs, the 3.07 GHz Lynnfield's successor may be the low end of the 6/8 core Sandy Bridge line. Even if Apple uses the 3.07 GHz (probably not), I doubt Apple will use any Sandy Bridge with more than 4 cores in the 2011 revision, due to different sockets between 2/4 and 6/8 core SBs and a possible 130 W TDP.
     
  20. trephineartist macrumors newbie

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    South Of France
    #20
    I was originally waitin on the new MBP earlier in the year but managed to get my old PBG4 working (just about!) with a new HDD & RAM. I'd like the MBP but am considering an imac to share with my girlfriend (who's HP PC laptop is almost gone!), we are both visual artists and do image & video editing so the big screen & power of the imac is appealing.

    I'm very tempted to go down to my local Fnac store and buy/order in the top spec 27" imac with 8g RAM. It's priced at 2159 euros, and with the storecard I can choose either 5% off in cash or for this weekend only 10% in euros on my card.not bad.

    All this waiting is a killer, not sure what to do! MBP now & imac later? Aaarrghgh.
     
  21. whokilledkaji macrumors member

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    Oct 21, 2008
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    Hikone, Japan
    #21
    I'm waiting too... For now at least!
    It seems that Apple likes to introduce stuff in time for educational buying or the holiday shopping season... That's not based on fact, just my feeling, but I'm sure there is data to back that up, I'm just too lazy to check... Since the iPod offer just started, I bet we are looking at fall too... When does the iPod deal end again? Would Apple think to release something during that promo's running time?

    I may break down and get the top end 27" iMac. It is a nice piece of kit!
     
  22. Hellhammer Moderator

    Hellhammer

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    #22
    I agree. Can't see Apple putting +500$ CPU in iMac and performance gain is pretty small too, around ~10% for almost 300$ more. Depends on how cheap i7 870 is now, it's possible that Apple could use it but again, 5% better performance ain't worth it.

    Agree on Sandy Bridge as well. Can't see Apple using LGA 2011 and ~500$ (my guess of 6-core SB price) CPU in iMac, it would jump on Mac Pros toes too much. Also, now that Sandy Bridge brings us first quad core 32nm chips, we could expect pretty high clock, possibly +3.2GHz in iMac thus what's the gain from lower clocked six core as most software is still single or dual threaded?

    I first thought that Apple would use 512MB and 1024MB but then thought that Apple is so bitchy about VRAM as it costs them more. I would love to see 512MB and 600-800MB cards in iMac, especially in 27" as the resolution demands VRAM. I first had 512MB and 1GB but then edited, but as I said, just my guess and I really hope Apple uses more VRAM.
     
  23. iMacmatician macrumors 601

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    Jul 20, 2008
    #23
    Something tells me 6 core Sandy Bridge probably won't be much lower clocked than highest quad-core, especially if it's 130 W rather than 6/8*(130 W) = ~98 W. 95 W quad-core + 2 extra cores - GPU could easily be within 130 W (binning/yields aside). But since the iMac uses 95 W CPUs, I agree there will be clock decreases. Going from 95 W to 82 W with Lynnfield S series gives a clock drop similar to the TDP drop (~17%). 95 W is 73% of 130 W. 73% of a possible 3.2 GHz 6-core is 2.4 GHz. That's not too much better than 3.2 GHz 4-core in multithreaded tasks.

    It's worth noting that Lynnfield doesn't have an integrated GPU, while 4-core Sandy Bridge will have one, which takes up some TDP.

    There's also the die size issue. 8-core Sandy Bridge die is likely close to 400 mm^2 (Lynnfield is "only" 296 mm^2). Even with salvage parts I don't think it'll end up anywhere below Bloomfield/Gulftown territory until the 22 nm shrink.
     
  24. m0nkeyb0y macrumors member

    m0nkeyb0y

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    Jun 16, 2009
    #24
    My wife and I share two old computers, an archaic Dell and a kind functional 4-yr old Macbook. We'll get the education discount AND the back-to-school deal.
    Problem is, wife doesn't want to spring for the i5, too much $$ she says. I refuse to buy a C2D, so I'm hoping the speed bump will bring some i3/i5 joy in lower prices. Entry-level 27, she might go for.

    I just hope they do it before the back-to-school runs out, cause we can't wait that long. :(
     
  25. easepease macrumors regular

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    #25
    yes agreed its not an AMAZING machine but it does the job. Its not modular however the i3 pulls barely any power. But yes I understand the IPS cost and all, thats why the the next high end imac will head my way as soon as its refreshed! Anyway yes lets not steal the thread with this.

    I just hope that the 27 actually sees a decent spec bump and not just the 21.5... I know its already a good deal but I just can't see myself buying a machine thats nearing a year old... Would be nice to have the i7 be put in the $1999 model.
     

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