The Macbook Neo is the best thing Apple has ever done for the Mac

[jclardy]

I bought a neo as a secondary machine, and I love it. It still doesn't match my old 12" rMB, but it is the closest thing we have to it right now.

But my post is less about the actual computer, and more about the mindset. The mac as a platform has been stagnant for years. Yes, we got Apple Silicon and now have the best top of the line laptops on the market by far. Great performance (Especially unplugged, which Windows users can't even conceive of), great battery life, solid hardware, etc. Basically - Apple Silicon came and fixed the Macbook Pro which was broken for a long time at the end of the intel era (Crappy keyboards, mediocre peformance, the forgotten touchbar, losing magsafe, jumping full in usb-c too quickly.) Because of that, Apple has been pushing the iOS narrative wholeheartedly for the past 10 years, trying to push the iPad into the pro market.

But now the Neo finally does the opposite, it brings the mac down to the entry level market. Before now, the jump to mac was a giant leap for most people. Committing $1000+ for a computer with a foreign operating system, not knowing if it'll run the software you need (coming from windows) meant you had to do a lot of research and planning to make the jump. Now at half that price, the Neo opens up the mac platform to millions of users that would have never even considered a mac. And for the platform itself, this is huge. That means more people looking for mac specific software, mac specific games, mac utilities.

And it isn't just a "one time" thing - these users being pulled into the low-end of mac are eventually going to want to "graduate" to the Air or the Pro. That means one important thing, we are going to see growing developer support for the mac, something which has been for the most part staying the same or on a slight decline. As a developer myself, I'm now looking at the mac as a real target for future apps, as it finally seems like Apple is fully invested in the mac lineup again.

 

[maflynn]

I can't agree with that assessment.

The Neo is not the greatest thing apple has done for the Mac. I feel that achievement was won by the bondi blue iMac. That mac helped save apple from bankruptcy. The Neo is a low cost computer, to be sure, but Apple did that already with the bondi blue iMac, This was an all in one computer that was much more affordable and very capable then nearly any other PC and Mac out there. Apple didn't stop innovating, as other iMacs through out the years had quite a number of innovations.

Then there was the MacBook Air, which largely created a whole new category that didn't exist.

Is the Neo a successful product? Yes, and it will have an impact in the greater industry as a whole, as PC makers now have to respond, but is the greatest thing apple has done? No, not even close.

 

[4sallypat]

....
But now the Neo finally does the opposite, it brings the mac down to the entry level market. Before now, the jump to mac was a giant leap for most people. Committing $1000+ for a computer with a foreign operating system, not knowing if it'll run the software you need (coming from windows) meant you had to do a lot of research and planning to make the jump. Now at half that price, the Neo opens up the mac platform to millions of users that would have never even considered a mac. And for the platform itself, this is huge. That means more people looking for mac specific software, mac specific games, mac utilities.

And it isn't just a "one time" thing - these users being pulled into the low-end of mac are eventually going to want to "graduate" to the Air or the Pro. That means one important thing, we are going to see growing developer support for the mac, something which has been for the most part staying the same or on a slight decline. As a developer myself, I'm now looking at the mac as a real target for future apps, as it finally seems like Apple is fully invested in the mac lineup again.

I agree!

Neo has been the best re-design for the EDU market and a huge revival for the masses.

In the past 20+ years in education IT, I have seen attempts at making Apple devices successful, but always had limitations.

2004-2009 PowerPC Macs were used only by administrative and some teachers but they were very expensive. I was issued a G4 PowerBook and that was good at the time, but still a 32 bit system and had CLI. Cost per device was the limiting factor.

2009-2012 Polycarbonate Macbook w/ Intel core duo was our first attempt for 1:1 student devices were only successful for the "wealthy side" of town - was not accepted on the "other side of the tracks". Price: $1200 each w/ AppleCare & Insurance.

2012-2015 iPad 2nd gen for special education students - $700 each w/ special cases and Apple Care. Newer more expensive generations came out and dropped further purchases.

2020-2026 Macbook Pro Intel i7 CTO - for all staff/faculty was an expensive per device cost ($1400) that did not last past 3 years after Apple Care ran out. Lots of problems even to this day and could not do in house repairs after Apple Care ran out.

2026: Neo Macbooks to replace the 1000 staff/faculty devices should last at least 6 years based on how well Apple products are designed and ease of repair using our in house GSX Apple certified techs. $499 price point is the most amazing ever in my Apple's device rollout history for EDU.

 

[jclardy]

I can't agree with that assessment.

The Neo is not the greatest thing apple has done for the Mac. I feel that achievement was won by the bondi blue iMac. That mac helped save apple from bankruptcy. The Neo is a low cost computer, to be sure, but Apple did that already with the bondi blue iMac, This was an all in one computer that was much more affordable and very capable then nearly any other PC and Mac out there. Apple didn't stop innovating, as other iMacs through out the years had quite a number of innovations.

Then there was the MacBook Air, which largely created a whole new category that didn't exist.

Is the Neo a successful product? Yes, and it will have an impact in the greater industry as a whole, as PC makers now have to respond, but is the greatest thing apple has done? No, not even close.

Maybe I should qualify my statement - best thing for the mac in the past 20 years. I'd easily put this over the original Air, it was a technological marvel at the time, but "thin was in" at the time, everyone was striving towards sleek technology as fast as possible, and the ideology is what lead Apple to some of it's worst laptop designs of all time (2016 era.)

 

[Corefile]

How can the title say it's the best thing Apple has ever done with the Mac yet you say it's not as good a your rMBP?

 

[judgeFire]

I support the enthusiasm, even though there have been many great Mac moments along the way. Every now and then Apple creates something unique that permeates the mainstream and is actually great.

 

[theluggage]

But now the Neo finally does the opposite, it brings the mac down to the entry level market.

Well, no, entry-level PC/Chromebook is more like $200-$400 new (with similar opportunity for deals, refurb, second-hand) - which is still a lot less than a Neo if you don't have $600 in loose change down the back of your sofa. OK, Windows/Chromebook - yuk - but outside of the reality distortion field, millions of people get their email/browsing/WP/red-eye-removal done on such things. Some of those come with bigger numbers for RAM and SSD for the Neo and - while we can debate how much more efficient MacOS is or how much RAM we think people need - the PC-using masses going to be reluctant to move to smaller numbers for RAM/SSD.

Maybe some of those super-cheap PCs with 16GB RAM or 512GB SSD are going to be the first casualties of the RAM/SSD scarcity - if Apple can keep their prices stable (by using iPhone components that they've secured vast supplies for) that could make the Neo even more attractive.

It is spectacularly cheap for a Mac laptop, which have rarely dipped below $900 new - but it's more like (say) a luxury German car company launching a small car which is "only" 50% more than a cheap K-mobile.

The mac as a platform has been stagnant for years. Yes, we got Apple Silicon and now have the best top of the line laptops on the market by far.

Well, Apple Silicon was probably the biggest upset in computing for a decade or so, and I'd hardly describe the procession of better and faster M-series CPUs since then as "stagnant". However, the Neo is the first "all new" Mac in terms of case design and target market since, maybe, the M2 Air re-design - I think that's whats generating interest among Mac users. We'll have to see how many "switchers" it produces.

It's a pity Apple couldn't have done this 6 months earlier to cash in on a wave of ticked-off Windows users being forced to buy new machines to run Windows 11.

The Neo is not the greatest thing apple has done for the Mac.

Well, no, that would be, er, the Mac itself...? 🙂

Or actually, the Newton, more specifically Apple's investment in ARM without which ARM might have been consigned to an embedded systems/set-top-box ghetto, no Apple Silicon & the iPhone would have ended up running Intel...

I don't think the Neo is going to be the kind of iconic product that compares to the original Mac, the iMac or the MacBook Air - and let's not forget the Powerbook 100/140/170 which basically fixed the design of the modern laptop computer. However... maybe it could be the turning point that pushes the Mac towards market dominance... Not holding my breath.

This was an all in one computer that was much more affordable and very capable then nearly any other PC and Mac out there.

Even in 1998 you could get a workable PC for under £1000, the £1300 iMac was never particularly cheap. Good value maybe - and more than the sum of its parts... and perfectly timed for the mass-market uptake of the Internet (it actually managed to sell the idea that it was good for the Internet, even though PCs had been internet capable for years). Plus it was the reason that every flipping USB device for the next 5 years had to have a translucent plastic case....

 

[Mainsail]

I would argue that the 2010 MBA was a more significant game changer and the best thing Apple has done for the Mac. It brought ultra portable laptop computing to the everyday consumer. Eventually, the price dropped to $999, and it was relatively affordable compared to other Apple offerings. Some of the innovations in 2010; wedge design, SSD, multi-touch trackpad, ultra thin, ultra light. I might also add that the inclusion of the M-processors in the Mac lineup has been more impactful for the Mac.

I am not knocking the Neo, but it's not innovative. It is just an economy laptop at $499 EDU price. That's great. But, it achieved its price point by eliminating some features; haptic trackpad, MagSafe, screen quality, battery size/life, ports, backlit keyboard, etc.. Nothing magical. Just good old fashion Industrial and Supply Chain Engineering to hit a price point. I don't think that qualifies as the "best" thing Apple has ever done for the Mac.

 

[Mainsail]

Maybe I should qualify my statement - best thing for the mac in the past 20 years. I'd easily put this over the original Air, it was a technological marvel at the time, but "thin was in" at the time, everyone was striving towards sleek technology as fast as possible, and the ideology is what lead Apple to some of it's worst laptop designs of all time (2016 era.)

I would put the Neo over the original Air (2008), but behind the subsequent Air (2010). It was a significant redesign at a much more affordable price. The 2010 MBA became the gold standard for ultra portable everyday consumer laptops. The 2008 was a niche product. The 2010 MBA was not.

 

[LIVEFRMNYC]

The bigger picture is, Apple is definitely going after the budget minded demographic.

One can get an IP 17e, MB Neo, AW SE3, and a pair of AP4 for $1576 (before tax). A base MBA alone is at minimum 2/3 that price.

Will this addition of a budget MacBook create a massive uptick of users in Apple's ecosystem? That is the question.
If Yes, then the Neo is the best thing Apple has done since the M chip. If No, then I don't see the Neo surviving more than 3 generations.

 

[1rottenapple]

I bought a neo as a secondary machine, and I love it. It still doesn't match my old 12" rMB, but it is the closest thing we have to it right now.

But my post is less about the actual computer, and more about the mindset. The mac as a platform has been stagnant for years. Yes, we got Apple Silicon and now have the best top of the line laptops on the market by far. Great performance (Especially unplugged, which Windows users can't even conceive of), great battery life, solid hardware, etc. Basically - Apple Silicon came and fixed the Macbook Pro which was broken for a long time at the end of the intel era (Crappy keyboards, mediocre peformance, the forgotten touchbar, losing magsafe, jumping full in usb-c too quickly.) Because of that, Apple has been pushing the iOS narrative wholeheartedly for the past 10 years, trying to push the iPad into the pro market.

But now the Neo finally does the opposite, it brings the mac down to the entry level market. Before now, the jump to mac was a giant leap for most people. Committing $1000+ for a computer with a foreign operating system, not knowing if it'll run the software you need (coming from windows) meant you had to do a lot of research and planning to make the jump. Now at half that price, the Neo opens up the mac platform to millions of users that would have never even considered a mac. And for the platform itself, this is huge. That means more people looking for mac specific software, mac specific games, mac utilities.

And it isn't just a "one time" thing - these users being pulled into the low-end of mac are eventually going to want to "graduate" to the Air or the Pro. That means one important thing, we are going to see growing developer support for the mac, something which has been for the most part staying the same or on a slight decline. As a developer myself, I'm now looking at the mac as a real target for future apps, as it finally seems like Apple is fully invested in the mac lineup again.

I totally agree. A computer that is accessible for many people with good quality screen, keyboard, body and software that is good, I can whole heartedly recommend this to my older cousin in their 60s and parents. It's just a good computer.

Sometimes people can't see (and I am guilty with this before) but many mainstream people like my cousin will Never spend 1k on mac computer. It doesn't matter if the mac will last 10 years or more. Never it just does not enter their brain but boy will they boy a HP PC that's cheap for 400-600.

 

[mlayer]

If I was young and in need of a first computer the Neo would be my first choice, hands down. It will bring many users into Apple stores and the Apple ecosystem. That's great that Apple is addressing a market segment long thought abandoned.

But it's not the greatest thing Apple's done in the last 20 years, not even among portables. The Air set the standard that the PC market was forced to chase for the last nearly 20 years, and pound-for-pound it's still easily the best especially when Amazon and Best Buy were blowing the base models for $749 last fall. Without the Air, there is no Neo. Judging from articles about the Neo's development, the process to get from the Air to the Neo was much longer than anticipated.

The best thing about the Neo was the timing of its release. Several weeks after CES, the Neo sucked up all of the oxygen from the tech press and competitors who laid down their cards in Vegas had no response.

 

[jclardy]

How can the title say it's the best thing Apple has ever done with the Mac yet you say it's not as good a your rMBP?

Because the best thing for the business is not equal to the best thing possible. If that was the case, they should just make $10k laptops with cutting edge tech that nobody can afford, as that would be the best thing possible. But it would sink the business completely.

 

[turbineseaplane]

@jclardy

I agree with you wholeheartedly.

They did an incredible job hitting a price point while still maintaining a very premium feeling (relatively speaking for the price point and with the known/required compromises).

I'd honestly run one for a bit, for the fun of it, if it could output 4k/120.

Maybe the next version will be capable of it.

I don't have major "power" needs, but I just can't go back off my 4k/120/OLED external.

 

[snipr125]

IMO for me the introduction of the M1 MBA was far more significant for the industry.

 

[DeepSix]

A friend of mine traded in his M4 Max for a neo and is more than happy. Says the Neo performs the same for a lot less money.

 

[joeblow7777]

How can the title say it's the best thing Apple has ever done with the Mac yet you say it's not as good a your rMBP?

“Best thing Apple has ever done for the Mac” and “Best Mac ever made” are two entirely different things.

 

[Lounge vibes 05]

“Best thing Apple has ever done for the Mac” and “Best Mac ever made” are two entirely different things.

Absolutely, I feel like people are completely misunderstanding the post, maybe even purposefully.
There has always been one big, huge, massive issue with Apple computers going all the way back to before the iMac, after the iMac, after the MacBook Air, even after the M1 that still caused the vast majority of people to ignore them. Even people with iPhones and iPads to ignore them.
The cheapest Mac laptop was $1000 when you could go to literally any retailer and get a Windows PC for $400-500. The Mac computer was never even an option for these people.
Now it absolutely is, and it’s honestly the best option for most of these people, especially as windows becomes less and less important from a consumer (not business of course but consumer) perspective.
Even back in 1998, the original blue iMac G3 was still $1300, or $2600 in today’s money. Even back then you could get Windows 98 PCs for significantly cheaper.

 

[snipr125]

A friend of mine traded in his M4 Max for a neo and is more than happy. Says the Neo performs the same for a lot less money.

Yep you gotta love the Neo it’s powered by magic. A friend of mine who works for Nvidia said they are now buying Neos on bulk to run LLMs to power their AI services, which will also solve the RAM crisis.

 

[maflynn]

A friend of mine who works for Nvidia said they are now buying Neos on bulk to run LLMs to power their AI services, which will also solve the RAM crisis.

You really need to add the /s for sarcasm, lol

A friend of mine traded in his M4 Max for a neo and is more than happy. Says the Neo performs the same for a lot less money.

Its single core performance is striking and surprising, no doubt, but there's no way a fanless laptop (that throttles at the drop of a hat) has the same overall performance as the M4 Max.

Here's how the Neo lines up against the Max processors with geekbench multi-core benchmark

 

[TechRunner]

I've enjoyed reading everyone's perspectives/opinions. Here's my slightly off-kilter take:

Personally, I think the best thing Apple ever did for the Mac was the iPhone. People who never had Apple on their radar suddenly knew who the company was and began exploring what other devices lived in the Apple universe.

 

[theluggage]

Personally, I think the best thing Apple ever did for the Mac was the iPhone. People who never had Apple on their radar suddenly knew who the company was and began exploring what other devices lived in the Apple universe.

It was the iPod and iTunes that really established Apple as a major consumer brand outside of personal computers.

The iPhone came out just in time: otherwise the iPod would have been displaced by
dumb-phones with music players (let's draw a kindly veil over the Apple/Motorola "iTunes Phone").

 

[fzJNotIBOxgnbqejSeVCvJScL]

It's also great timing, the ******tification of Windows 11 over the past few years has disenfranchised many loyal Windows users, including me. At the right price they can be persuaded to take a first dip in MacOS.

Apple might need to spend a little effort in helping Windows users transition to MacOS for the first time. There are tutorials and guides out there, but no official source yet.

Happiness is spending a day without touching one Microsoft product/service or one of its many acquisitions e.g. Skype, Linkedin.

For Google it's a bit harder since Google Maps is still the gold standard of maps, Google Translate is the gold standard of translation, you might need Google Drive now and then, and there's Youtube and Android. But for other things, including Gmail, they can be avoided.

Apple might need to market Pro MacBooks and Macs as competent gaming machines that justify the premium charged. Requires collaboration from game developers, game publishers and e-sports organizers.

 

[Zazoh]

It's also great timing, the ******tification of Windows 11 over the past few years has disenfranchised many loyal Windows users, including me. At the right price they can be persuaded to take a first dip in MacOS.

Apple might need to spend a little effort in helping Windows users transition to MacOS for the first time. There are tutorials and guides out there, but no official source

For years, Gary at Macmost.com has been doing this. Tremendous resource.

 

[fzJNotIBOxgnbqejSeVCvJScL]

It was the iPod and iTunes that really established Apple as a major consumer brand outside of personal computers.

The iPhone came out just in time: otherwise the iPod would have been displaced by
dumb-phones with music players (let's draw a kindly veil over the Apple/Motorola "iTunes Phone").

The iPhone singlehandedly destroyed Microsoft Zune, Creative Zen and various other mp3 player manufacturers. Even Samsung got into the action.

Then Microsoft went delulu and sought to build the 'third ecosystem' (Windows Mobile) to rival iOS and Android, even cannibalizing the carcass of Nokia to do so.

And the rest is history.