the MBP Vega pricing is ridiculous

[Pangalactic]

The cheapest possible MBP with Vega 16 graphics:


Dell XPS 15 with Windows Pro upgrade, 4K screen upgrade, 2TB SSD upgrade and 4 years of premium Dell support upgrade (I had to throw in Windows Pro as a literally ran out of any other upgrade options)

 

[leman]

(wrong reply, sorry)

 

[Never mind]

Or one can get the Lenovo ThinkPad X1 Extreme for $ 2,418.00 15 inch / 32 gb ddr-4 ram / 1 Tb ssd / 4K monitor / 1050ti gpu / 4 yr warranty on sale for the holiday ..... just pointing this out

 

[204353]

The upgrade prices are pretty crazy, yes. An additional £315 to upgrade to the Vega 20 here. Potentially worth it if you do a lot of production workloads that benefit from the GPU power and you're on the road a lot. Definitely not worth it for most people. All depends on use case, of course.

I ordered my custom MacBook Pro about a month ago and I'm in a way glad that the option wasn't available to me at the time. It was already a big stretch to upgrade the RAM and storage for me, so another £315 would've been impossible (although I would've wanted it).

Besides, I only really use the graphics power for gaming, which seems to only be about 20% faster with the Vega 20? Really not worth it for the price in my case and I'm happy with the 560X for most titles. I'm just gonna build a mid-range gaming PC next year, anyway. My Mac is for daily computing tasks, travelling, coding and media production hobbies.

 

[scubachap]

Or one can get the Lenovo ThinkPad X1 Extreme for $ 2,418.00 15 inch / 32 gb ddr-4 ram / 1 Tb ssd / 4K monitor / 1050ti gpu / 4 yr warranty on sale for the holiday ..... just pointing this out

Oh, please don't!

I need a new computer and I'm pretty locked into the Mac ecosystem (squillions of type 1 fonts, lots of previous artwork etc etc) and I've lost count of the number of times I've priced one up and hovered over the buy button in recent weeks... I then go on a pc site and spec one up there just to torture myself... and don't start me on multicore desktop machines for rendering... It's feeling like the mid nineties all over again but I didn't think there's likely to be any clone options coming along this time!

 

[LeeW]

I've lost count of the number of times I've priced one up and hovered over the buy button in recent weeks... I then go on a pc site and spec one up there just to torture myself...

I'm sure we all do that.

 

[leovilma]

Vega cards should be standard component 100%

This is just Apple milking its customers, 560x is basically 3 year old card. It's the same story as iPhone X ($999) pricing compared to its predecessor iPhone 7 ($649). I mean did iPhone 6 ($649) cost 30% more than iPhone 5s ($649) ?

It's standard product evolution, nothing exceptional, nothing revolutional.

 

[maflynn]

Or one can get the Lenovo ThinkPad X1 Extreme for $ 2,418.00 15 inch / 32 gb ddr-4 ram / 1 Tb ssd / 4K monitor / 1050ti gpu / 4 yr warranty on sale for the holiday ..... just pointing this out

The X1E wis a fine machine with a much better keyboard. Had they come out with that when I was making my buying decisions, I would have snapped one up in a new york minute.
Here's the configuration that closely matches my current MBP - 15 4k display / 16 GB of ram / 512 GB storage /1050ti GPU. All that for 1,952 dollars. My MBP cost me 2,500

My MBP is a great laptop, but in all honesty the keyboard feels delicate, and the issues with the T2 have me spooked so that I'm not even willing to upgrade to Mojave, as I don't want to increase the risk of instability. I don't see anything I want in Mojave so there's that motivation as well.

This is just Apple milking its customers, 560x is basically 3 year old card

As far back as memory goes, Apple has always put anemic GPUs into the computers, I'm not disagreeing with you that the Vega should be standard, but its not the Apple way, nor was it ever.

 

[Ma2k5]

The X1E wis a fine machine with a much better keyboard. Had they come out with that when I was making my buying decisions, I would have snapped one up in a new york minute.
Here's the configuration that closely matches my current MBP - 15 4k display / 16 GB of ram / 512 GB storage /1050ti GPU. All that for 1,952 dollars. My MBP cost me 2,500

My MBP is a great laptop, but in all honesty the keyboard feels delicate, and the issues with the T2 have me spooked so that I'm not even willing to upgrade to Mojave, as I don't want to increase the risk of instability. I don't see anything I want in Mojave so there's that motivation as well.

If you think that was bad, £2,086 for 4k/32GB/1TB/1050TI XPS 9570 in UK right now including 4 years premium warranty/accidental. That is around a £2,000 saving for equivalent spec'd MBP 15...

I would have been happy with the premium of Apple if their product was better quality/more reliable than the Window's equivalent (even if performance was a little lower), but as you said, keyboard issues, T2 chips, stuck with TouchBar and some people having speaker trouble - why pay that premium if they have just as many issues as Window's laptops?

 

[maflynn]

I would have been happy with the premium of Apple if their product was better quality/more reliable than the Window's equivalent (even if performance was a little lower), but as you said, keyboard issues, T2 chips, stuck with TouchBar and some people having speaker trouble - why pay that premium if they have just as many issues as Window's laptops?

I don't have buyer's remorse, but I have been tempted to sell the MBP, and get a windows machine that may offer more longevity. I do enjoy the macOS operating system, and/or being in the apple ecosystem that I'll probably not go through the hassle of trying to sell the MBP. The last couple of times I sold stuff on swappa for instance, was a nightmare. I had some really needy, high maintenance buyers that made the whole experience horrible.

Like I said, my MBP is fully functional, its a good laptop, but I do wonder how long the keyboard will hold out, I suspect I'll be looking to buy a new laptop a lot sooner then I'm wanting too because of the keyboard.

 

[Ma2k5]

I don't have buyer's remorse, but I have been tempted to sell the MBP, and get a windows machine that may offer more longevity. I do enjoy the macOS operating system, and/or being in the apple ecosystem that I'll probably not go through the hassle of trying to sell the MBP. The last couple of times I sold stuff on swappa for instance, was a nightmare. I had some really needy, high maintenance buyers that made the whole experience horrible.

Like I said, my MBP is fully functional, its a good laptop, but I do wonder how long the keyboard will hold out, I suspect I'll be looking to buy a new laptop a lot sooner then I'm wanting too because of the keyboard.

It is a great laptop, the screen is great and the little things like the speakers being by the far best (when you don't have the crackle issue), the bottom surface being more lap friendly, the integration with iPhones, great battery life (15"), 16:10 aspect ratio, general form factor/build quality - there is a lot that it does so well. At this price, it just had to do a little more...

 

[maflynn]

It is a great laptop, the screen is great and the little things like the speakers being by the far best, the bottom surface being more lap friendly, the integration with iPhones, 16:10 aspect ratio, general form factor/build quality - there is a lot that it does so well. At this price, it just had to do a little more...

No question, I had a FHD 15" Razer and the screen difference is quite surprising. I'm not sure how well a 4k screen will perform in windows, as windows scaling is not the best. I can and do use the MBP on my lap, something that I couldn't do with the razer. I don't know how well other laptops like the Lenovo handle the perpetually hot running coffee lake chips, but since supplemental update 2, my MBP has been running fairly cool.

Edit: let me add, that I've been impressed by the battery of the MBP as well, its by far one of the longer running laptops.

 

[Ma2k5]

No question, I had a FHD 15" Razer and the screen difference is quite surprising. I'm not sure how well a 4k screen will perform in windows, as windows scaling is not the best. I can and do use the MBP on my lap, something that I couldn't do with the razer. I don't know how well other laptops like the Lenovo handle the perpetually hot running coffee lake chips, but since supplemental update 2, my MBP has been running fairly cool.

Off the power, I believe the MBP would be the most comfortable/enjoyable to use.

 

[leman]

Off the power, I believe the MBP would be the most comfortable/enjoyable to use.

I think thats the main point. Yes, you can buy a laptop of similar performance for much less (although battery life will suffer). But overall usability... I'd happily pay $2000 more to make the experience better for me. In the end, I spend a lot of time on a computer, its my work tool for both professional and private projects, my research and organisation station, and on top of that, its also an entertainment source that I use many hours every single day. From that perspective, even $4500 is not too much over three years of ownership ($125 per months — thats like 6% of my monthly rent...). I pay three times as much for health insurance.

 

[Ma2k5]

I think thats the main point. Yes, you can buy a laptop of similar performance for much less (although battery life will suffer). But overall usability... I'd happily pay $2000 more to make the experience better for me. In the end, I spend a lot of time on a computer, its my work tool for both professional and private projects, my research and organisation station, and on top of that, its also an entertainment source that I use many hours every single day. From that perspective, even $4500 is not too much over three years of ownership ($125 per months — thats like 6% of my monthly rent...). I pay three times as much for health insurance.

I have similar thoughts as you - I am happy to pay more for an enjoyable experience, but that experience can very easily be soured with keyboard or T2 issues. Coil whine and backlight bleed would be more acceptable flaws to me as they won't kill my productivity, but these two issues can very much do so.

 

[maflynn]

Off the power, I believe the MBP would be the most comfortable/enjoyable to use.

I don't know how other laptops like the Lenovo are with heat management, and "lap-ability" but I am pleased that I easily get 8+ hours on my MBP and it runs very cool on the battery. That is when I'm working from home, its driving an external monitor. While using. the iGPU, the temps are cooler and the battery is long lasting. The razer struggled to give me over 4 hours.

 

[leman]

I don't know how other laptops like the Lenovo are with heat management, and "lap-ability" but I am pleased that I easily get 8+ hours on my MBP and it runs very cool on the battery. That is when I'm working from home, its driving an external monitor. While using. the iGPU, the temps are cooler and the battery is long lasting. The razer struggled to give me over 4 hours.

And I think thats exactly the unique selling proposition of the MBP. Its simply the most well-rounded laptop out there. Its not the fastest, not the smallest, not the one with the longest battery life, but it delivers a very balanced mix of all of them. Its a laptop that you can use for demanding video editing or scientific work and then hop on a couch with it on your lap and video chat with a family member. Or write papers while spending 8 hours on a train as I have to do sometimes.

I am simply not aware of any other product that can be so flexible. You either get a lightweight package with great battery life but lower-end performance, or a lightweight package with great performance, but bad battery, or its fast and bulky AND has a bad battery. Whats the point of Razer fitting a 1070 GTX in a 2.2kg chassis if to achieve it they literally had to cut out holes in the bottom of the laptop?

 

[Howard2k]

The cheapest possible MBP with Vega 16 graphics:


Dell XPS 15 with Windows Pro upgrade, 4K screen upgrade, 2TB SSD upgrade and 4 years of premium Dell support upgrade (I had to throw in Windows Pro as a literally ran out of any other upgrade options)

Doesn't the MBPro crush the Dell in most of the performance comparisons?

I'm not saying it's worth the extra money (hell, I'm not buying one) but ultimately it comes down to how much performance matters I suppose.

 

[maflynn]

And I think thats exactly the unique selling proposition of the MBP

To a degree, but I think the high price will come back and bite apple in the long run. We are seeing this occur with the iPhones as apple is cutting production of the Xr, they actually reduced the price in Japan to try to jump start sales.

I think apple has misjudged the willingness of its customers willing to pay large sums of money. If the durability of the computer is inferior to prior years, there's even less reason to plunk down 3k. I'd rather get a laptop that costs 40% less and may very well last longer then what the MBP. Only time will tell regarding the keyboard but it does not feel sturdy.

Its simply the most well-rounded laptop out there

While the screen is great, and I'm very happy with the battery, I have to disagree. There are plenty of other laptops that offer better screens, GPUs, keyboards and have very good battery life. The compelling part for me is that I'm enmeshed in the apple ecosystem. I also have a clear preference to macOS. That does not mean there no other laptops that equal its design, build. I've personally have not tried the Lenovo, but the Dell has better components the battery performance is good and costs less the MBP.

 

[Plutonius]

I don't have buyer's remorse, but I have been tempted to sell the MBP, and get a windows machine that may offer more longevity.

I can't imagine the resale value is that good on the 2018 MacBook Pro.

 

[Never mind]

I think thats the main point. Yes, you can buy a laptop of similar performance for much less (although battery life will suffer). But overall usability... I'd happily pay $2000 more to make the experience better for me. In the end, I spend a lot of time on a computer, its my work tool for both professional and private projects, my research and organisation station, and on top of that, its also an entertainment source that I use many hours every single day. From that perspective, even $4500 is not too much over three years of ownership ($125 per months — thats like 6% of my monthly rent...). I pay three times as much for health insurance.

I know it’s the holidays and all, and people do drink, however I would never pay $2000 more. I will pay just a bit more for better hardware however. Of coarse that’s not gonna happen with Apple, and they seem to be going down the slippery slope of failed or glitchy hardware. That is why I am considering something else that is a bit more reliable, even if its windows.

Ports, ports and more ports.....nice

 

[Ma2k5]

I think apple has misjudged the willingness of its customers willing to pay large sums of money. If the durability of the computer is inferior to prior years, there's even less reason to plunk down 3k. I'd rather get a laptop that costs 40% less and may very well last longer then what the MBP. Only time will tell regarding the keyboard but it does not feel sturdy.

I think this is it really. If I had no worries about reliability/longevity, as I didn't with my mid-2014 rMBP 15" (without dGPU), the high price is justifiable. I can't justify high price for a good all-rounder if it's weakness is reliability. Anything but that!

I probably would upgrade my laptop by year 3, but it doesn't feel like a laptop I can hand off to someone and expect it to carry on working for years to come without a failure.

I could buy an XPS 9570 now, have it completely fail in 3 years, buy a new XPS in 2021 and still have spent the same as a single MBP 2018 purchase.

 

[SoyCapitanSoyCapitan]

The cheapest possible MBP with Vega 16 graphics:


Dell XPS 15 with Windows Pro upgrade, 4K screen upgrade, 2TB SSD upgrade and 4 years of premium Dell support upgrade (I had to throw in Windows Pro as a literally ran out of any other upgrade options)

Dell throws OEM PC components into a case.

Apple commits billions of dollars in research and development to create their own chips and software. Of course they have to charge a premium otherwise they will also have to use OEM parts and cut their research work.

Stop making comparison between them. It’s crazy that people keep doing this.

 

[Ma2k5]

Dell throws OEM PC components into a case.

Apple commits billions of dollars in research and development to create their own chips and software.

Stop making comparison between them. It’s crazy that people keep doing this.

It is perfectly comparable. Unless you are getting much better performance, reliability or otherwise, merely spending billions doesn't make any difference. There are area's this spending has served the MacBook's well, but it is also bested in many area's too by the competition.

A good haircut which took 10 minutes is still better than a rubbish one where they spent 30 minutes on it.

 

[SoyCapitanSoyCapitan]

It is perfectly comparable. Unless you are getting much better performance, reliability or otherwise, merely spending billions doesn't make any difference. There are area's this spending has served the MacBook's well, but it is also bested in many area's too by the competition.

Just stop please. You are comparing Roscosmos to NASA.