The Secondhand Mac market is having a rough time

[RumorConsumer]

As somebody who sells Macs quite often on the secondhand market whether it be eBay or craigslist I am noticing recently that the degree of depreciation seems to be accelerating. I’m not sure if this is because of corona and the economy or because maybe the most recent 15 inch MacBook Pro is so similar to the newer 16” but the prices are kind of ridiculous. Example - 15” 2.4ghz 8c 32gb ram and 1tb ssd new for $3800, selling for between 2k and 2400. That seems absurdly low. Even 16” machines are low. Go on eBay and see for yourselves. Thoughts?

 

[1rottenapple]

Damn I’m going to sell my 2017 13 in soon. Not a good this to hear.

 

[RumorConsumer]

Damn I’m going to sell my 2017 13 in soon. Not a good this to hear.

Yeah. I am the new hardware junkie myself and I help many friends sell their old macs which puts me on the seller side. Its honestly about 1 or 2 a month as we're all writers in a company together. Ive just watch the values start to decrease.

 

[2984839]

My guess is a lot of people who are out of work are selling their high end Macs, and because a lot of other people are out of work, there's nobody to buy them. These are luxury items for almost everyone. Apart from the very tiny minority who actually need a $3k laptop, you can do everything you want on a 10 year old computer, so when times are tough, they are not in demand.

 

[senttoschool]

My guess is a lot of people who are out of work are selling their high end Macs, and because a lot of other people are out of work, there's nobody to buy them. These are luxury items for almost everyone. Apart from the very tiny minority who actually need a $3k laptop, you can do everything you want on a 10 year old computer, so when times are tough, they are not in demand.

Laptop demand has increased since Covid.

My guess is that the 2016-2019 15" Macbook Pro is so bad that people don't want it. No one wants to spend decent money on a used butterfly keyboard Macbook Pro that might stop working without warranty.

 

[iRun26.2]

Agreed! The old models with the butterfly keyboard are not going to be easy to resell. Additionally, there have been enough problems reported with the new 16" version that their market is probably flooded too. Apple has a ton of 16" refurbished units on sale (probably from people who bought it and were not happy with it).

 

[n-evo]

My guess is that the 2016-2019 15" Macbook Pro is so bad that people don't want it. No one wants money on a used butterfly keyboard Macbook Pro that might stop working.

That shouldn't be that much of an issue with a 2017 model and onward since Apple is offering people a 4-year extended warrantee on the keyboard. I had some keys replaced about a year ago. Haven't had any issues since. Time on the 2016 model is starting to press in that regard.

 

[senttoschool]

That shouldn't be much of an issue with a 2017 model and onward since Apple is offering people a 4-year extended warrantee on the keyboard. I had some keys replaced about a year ago. Haven't had any issues since.

But the typing experience still sucks. The touch bar doesn't have a physical key. And four years isn't that long for a Macbook. I'm still using my 2015 which is now approaching 6 years old. Still works great.

I'm not surprised by the poor resale market for 2016-2019 Macbook Pros. They're some of the worst computers I've ever used. Bad keyboard, poor typing experience, useless touchbar, no escape key, oversized touchpad, dongle hell, stuck on old 14nm Intel CPUs, and extremely expensive.

 

[n-evo]

But the typing experience still sucks. The touch bar doesn't have a physical key. And four years isn't that long for a Macbook. I'm still using my 2015 which is now approaching 6 years old. Still works great.

Most of my work consists of writing. Coming from a 2015 MacBook Pro, which I sold, I don't think my MacBook Pro 2017 keyboard offers a poor experience at all. I don't really miss the physical escape key either, it's not something I use on a frequent basis. It's just a shame the keyboard is more sensitive to debris.

Anyway, you talked about getting a used keyboard that might fail. I'm just saying that doesn't have to be an issue per se since you're covered by an extended warrantee. Which is something not everyone realizes. I highly recommend any seller to include that fact in their description when putting their MacBook Air or Pro online. When getting a second hand MacBook Pro 2016 (or later) I would just bring it in claiming to have issues and have it checked out. They're not not especially difficult at the Apple Store when it comes to this. Probably because Apple got so much crap for it (rightfully so).

 

[senttoschool]

Most of my work consists of writing. Coming from a 2015 MacBook Pro, which I sold, I don't think my MacBook Pro 2017 keyboard offers a poor experience at all. I don't really miss the physical escape key either, it's not something I use on a frequent basis. It's just a shame the keyboard is more sensitive to debris.

Anyway, you talked about getting a used keyboard that might fail. I'm just saying that doesn't have to be an issue per se since you're covered by an extended warrantee. Which is something not everyone realizes. I highly recommend any seller to include that fact in their description when putting their MacBook Air or Pro online. When getting a second hand MacBook Pro 2016 (or later) I would just bring it in claiming to have issues and have it checked out. They're not not especially difficult at the Apple Store when it comes to this. Probably because Apple got so much crap for it (rightfully so).

Yes that's fine. But I think in general, the 2016-2019 laptops were hated for more than just the keyboard - hence the really poor resale value.

 

[n-evo]

Yes that's fine. But I think in general, the 2016-2019 laptops were hated for more than just the keyboard - hence the really poor resale value.

I've been selling second hand Macs, iPhones, iPads and iPods since 2003. Selling my top-of-the-line 13-inch 2015 MacBook Pro wasn't exactly a picknick either. Something I experienced in 2017 for the first time. People just kept bidding unrealistically for a Core i7 model with 16 GB memory or were trying to scam me. Selling my iPhone X past January was a similar crap experience. So to be honest, I feel like there's a broader issue going on for the past three years now. At least here in The Netherlands. But yeah, the keyboard issue doesn't do much to help.

 

[senttoschool]

I've been selling second hand Macs, iPhones, iPads and iPods since 2003. Selling my top-of-the-line 13-inch 2015 MacBook Pro wasn't exactly a picknick either. Something I experienced in 2017 for the first time. People just kept bidding unrealistically for a Core i7 model with 16 GB memory or were trying to scam me. Selling my iPhone X past January was a similar crap experience. So to be honest, I feel like there's a broader issue going on for the past three years now. At least here in The Netherlands. But yeah, the keyboard issue doesn't do much to help.

You're going to get some lowball offers no matter what you sell. We're talking about just overall resale value here.

The 2016-2019 have low resale value relative to their original price.

 

[pshufd]

I'm seeing a lot of 2008-2012 Mac Pros on Craigslist in my area. I have my eye on one that's a nice configuration and dirt cheap. I'd have to do some work but this is normal. I get the feeling that some people are buying these up on the cheap, upgrading them with fast CPUs, modern video card and maybe USB 3 and reselling for $1,200 - $2,000. It's not a bad way to make some money but maybe there are too many of them out there.

My 2014, 2015 MacBook Pros are running fine. I expect that they will die at some point and the replacement would be a new 16 unless I hear of problems (my impression is that they are fine - a lot of problems are reported here but I think that those are generally not systemic issues but individual QA problems).

You can probably tell that I'm looking at Mac Pros. I have not decided on whether to buy a 2012 or a 2020. I'd kind of like the 2012 to work on it but the 2020 would mean no effort required.

COVID-19 is an issue. I have a friend in NYC who is getting rid of 2 Mac Pros. I would make an offer but he had someone in his household with COVID and she was in the hospital for a while - so that gives me pause on buying a used machine. I guess I would have to quarantine it for a few weeks and nobody wants to do that with a new system.

 

[maflynn]

That seems absurdly low.

I'm not surprised, I mean Apple's had a rough patch these past 4 or 5 years with quality and bad PR. The biggest reason imo, is the butterfly keyboard, especially for 2016 machine, they're rolling off the repair program, so buyers will have a higher risk, which translates to lower prices.

 

[pshufd]

I've been selling second hand Macs, iPhones, iPads and iPods since 2003. Selling my top-of-the-line 13-inch 2015 MacBook Pro wasn't exactly a picknick either. Something I experienced in 2017 for the first time. People just kept bidding unrealistically for a Core i7 model with 16 GB memory or were trying to scam me. Selling my iPhone X past January was a similar crap experience. So to be honest, I feel like there's a broader issue going on for the past three years now. At least here in The Netherlands. But yeah, the keyboard issue doesn't do much to help.

Our standard corporate model was 2015 13", 16 GB/512 GB/3.1 Ghz. These will be replaced once the pandemic is over and we're back in the office as our upgrade cycle is five years for Macs. We're a large company so a lot of these are going to hit the market. I think that we were giving out these models until 2018. The corporate world dumps tons of these things on the resale market. I see 15s from the corporate market. My 2015 15" is a former corporate laptop. Those 15s seem to last forever.

 

[maflynn]

The corporate world dumps tons of these things on the resale market.

Do they still? My company destroys them

 

[pshufd]

Do they still? My company destroys them

I found an ad for a used 2015 two years ago on Craigslist. I went to the place - a non-descript building in an industrial area in the kind of place where you don't want to be when it's dark out. I was buzzed into the packed parking lot and walked up the stairs and there was a huge room with Macs all over the place. On the floor, on tables, on shelves. They had PCs but a lot more Macs than PCs. So I asked them where they got them - the Boston corporate world. They refurb them and sell them with a warranty. My guess on the refurb part is that they also clean the SSDs. That's the important thing in the corporate world - that they get cleaned off. The value of the data is typically far greater than the value of the machine.

BTW, I could have gone Kid in a Candy Store at that place.

 

[PBG4 Dude]

Do they still? My company destroys them

The biggest independent computer store in my area (and it is big) refurbishes bulk corporate purchases and resells them to the public via a retail store front and at all the area computer shows. One of the few places that has used macs all the time too.

 

[avz]

You're going to get some lowball offers no matter what you sell. We're talking about just overall resale value here.

The 2016-2019 have low resale value relative to their original price.

Some lowball offers are actually do make some sense as I see a lot of sellers are being way out of touch with reality, like asking AU$450 for a 13inch 2009 MacBook Pro.
At the same time when I was asking AU$125 for a Mid-2010 13inch MacBook Pro, I still got lowball offers, so I guess the TS is right about general depreciation of Macs across the board.

 

[maflynn]

as I see a lot of sellers are being way out of touch with reality,

That seems more to be the case, though there is a segment of people on Swappa who tend to low ball for the sake of low balling and then turn around and sell it for a profit

 

[PBG4 Dude]

I’m going to guess that Apple doubling SSD storage this year without raising the price Reduced used prices as well.

 

[maflynn]

I’m going to guess that Apple doubling SSD storage this year without raising the price Reduced used prices as well.

Yeah, but isn't that offset by Apple doubling the price of ram? Its hard to determine the configuration moves made by apple that would have an impact on the used computer market. I'd probably say its more likely that for used computers, anything pre-16" represents a higher risk for buyers.

 

[pshufd]

Some lowball offers are actually do make some sense as I see a lot of sellers are being way out of touch with reality, like asking AU$450 for a 13inch 2009 MacBook Pro.
At the same time when I was asking AU$125 for a Mid-2010 13inch MacBook Pro, I still got lowball offers, so I guess the TS is right about general depreciation of Macs across the board.

Clearing price depends on supply and demand and I'll put in a lowball price myself and just leave it there for a month or two. I have spare Macs that I can use now but may want to buy a replacement for whenever.

 

[avz]

That seems more to be the case, though there is a segment of people on Swappa who tend to low ball for the sake of low balling and then turn around and sell it for a profit

Yes, this is true. I personally have no issues with a reasonable lowball offers as I know it is not easy to resell a C2D Macs.

 

[leman]

Example - 15” 2.4ghz 8c 32gb ram and 1tb ssd new for $3800, selling for between 2k and 2400. That seems absurdly low.

Why do you think this is low? You can get a new 16" with the same performance and a better GPU for $800 more (or 30%). I don't think that 70% from the current price is at all a bad deal for a used laptop.