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pipetogrep

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Jan 27, 2021
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UPDATED 02/01/2023

  • Updated Tiger version to latest MacPorts with latest packages
  • Added the option to enable Quartz at the final build step if a Quartz compatible card is detected

Hi all,

After almost two weeks of working, building, compiling, and doing it all over again several times, I've created something that will hopefully be of use to the community. I give you the The Unofficial TenFourFox Development Toolkit. https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/the-unofficial-tenfourfox-toolkit

This is an installer I created to ease the installation of a TenFourFox build environment. Instead of needing multiple days to bootstrap a MacPorts environment, this will reduce it to less than 30. It is a meta-package that contains two installers. The browser itself will still take a long time to compile, though.

This installer provides:

  • A full MacPorts environment with everything required to build TenFourFox. It will not interfere with existing MacPorts installations as it uses a separate prefix.
  • An Automator app that executes a shell script installed at /opt/macports-tff/build_tenfourfox in a new terminal window.
The script at /opt/macports-tff/build_tenfourfox:
  • Asks if you would like to build TenFourFox or InterWebPPC
  • Downloads the latest copy of the browser's source code from GitHub
  • Asks you which kind of processor you would like to build it for
  • Modifies the source code to work with the alternate MacPorts prefix
  • Makes Leopard specific patches (Leopard version only
  • Compiles the code
  • Drops the fully built web browser on your desktop
  • If you have a Quartz compatible video card, it will ask if you want to enable it in the browser build
This is compatible with OS X 10.4.11 and 10.5.8. If you intend to distribute your own builds with this toolkit, please be sure to respect Dr. Cameron Kaiser's (the creator of TenFourFox) wishes by changing the name and icon of the application in the source code.

Please note, this project is in no way affiliated with FloodGap.com or Dr. Cameron Kaiser.

Special thanks to @wicknix and @alex_free for teaching me more about the MacPorts build process and giving me the inspiration to make this. Another special thanks to @Melchieor for testing. As always, I'm open to any input on how to make this better and easier.
 
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pipetogrep

macrumors 6502
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Jan 27, 2021
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Doesn’t the current build we got from Mr.Kaiser run under Tiger ? What are the changes ?
This isn't a build of TenFourFox and there are no changes. It is the full dev environment required for you to build it yourself. I created this because Dr. Kaiser will no longer be make new builds after September 7th 2021. Please see http://tenfourfox.blogspot.com/2020/04/the-end-of-tenfourfox-and-what-ive.html.

After that date, for my own use I will still make security patches backported from the new Firefox 91ESR publicly available on Github and possibly add any new features I personally need, but I won't promise these on any particular timeline, I won't make or release any builds for people to download, I won't guarantee any specific feature or fix, I won't guarantee timeliness or functionality, and there will be no more user support of any kind including on Tenderapp. I'll call this "hobby mode," because the browser will be a hobby I purely maintain for myself, with no concessions, no version tags (rolling release only), no beta test period and no regular schedule. You can still use it, but if you want to do so, you will be responsible for building the browser yourself and this gives you a few months to learn how.
Setting up the full MacPorts environment is long and arduous. This installer makes that process significantly shorter and provides a one-click application to runs the TenFourFox compile process for you. The goal is to make it easy to keep up with any future source commits after the "hobby mode" date.
 
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Macbookprodude

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But here is the thing and this is coming directly from Wicknix - TenFourFox should be fine for the next 15 years as TLS 1.4 won’t be standard till then. If google even exists by then.. by that time, I feel PowerPC Macs will have reached old age by then and barely able to do anything web related.. so, the only thing I can see with TenFourFox or whatever someone decides to call it will be nothing but bug fixes and updated security. The whole TLS 1.2, 1.4 won’t happen till far in the future..

According to Wicknix, we should be fine with internet browsing using TenFourFox for Tiger and Leopard for up to, at least the next 15 years.

I didn’t mean to go off topic a little, but just because Dr.Kaiser isn’t doing more, other than security updates, at least the TLS will remain 1.2 for several years to come.
 

Melchieor

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Jan 24, 2021
77
98
Guys . I just compiled the latest release of whatever this non”tenfourfox” release 32 and the process was smooth . I used a dual 1ghz MDD with no issues . Tremendous thanks to PipetoGrep! This means we can make our own changes as well to the browser as needed !
 

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wicknix

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Close, but... 1.3 is current and is replacing 1.2 more and more each day. 1.4 will replace 1.3 in 10-15 years. Either way it won't be hard to update TFF's source for future builds to stay viable.

@pipetogrep after work I'll grab it.

Should probably sticky this link here as well.
 
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pipetogrep

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Should probably sticky this link here as well.
I'm definitely working on that next.
 

Macbookprodude

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So, will someone have a website to let us know a new update to TFF or whatever it’s called be available ? Sorta like Cameron’s ? Anyone also working on updating Classila as well ?
 

pipetogrep

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Jan 27, 2021
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So, will someone have a website to let us know a new update to TFF or whatever it’s called be available ? Sorta like Cameron’s ? Anyone also working on updating Classila as well ?
The whole point of this is so you can build and do for yourself. Dr. Kaiser will still be making security updates for his personal use but won't be making builds. This will allow you to build those updates for yourself.
 

Macbookprodude

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The only PPC machine I have is a PowerBook G4 Titanium 1Ghz - certainly given how extensive the compiling of the code will take, I guess a 1Ghz titanium won’t work ?
 

pipetogrep

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The only PPC machine I have is a PowerBook G4 Titanium 1Ghz - certainly given how extensive the compiling of the code will take, I guess a 1Ghz titanium won’t work ?
How much RAM? It would probably take a full day (or two) to build given that constraint, but would be the biggest issue there.
 

Macbookprodude

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Ok, here is a question - the instructions sound simple enough, but what if you want to add new video codecs, or add TLS updates ?? For most of us, we are not all programmers and I certainly am not.. I am good with networking machines and basic IT stuff, but what about those who can’t program ?
 

pipetogrep

macrumors 6502
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Jan 27, 2021
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Ok, here is a question - the instructions sound simple enough, but what if you want to add new video codecs, or add TLS updates ?? For most of us, we are not all programmers and I certainly am not.. I am good with networking machines and basic IT stuff, but what about those who can’t program ?
I'm not either. The most I'll be able to do is follow wicknix's guide on rebranding, and maybe bake in TenFourFoxPep. I don't have the ability to add anything major like that either. But so long as there is commit activity on the main TenFourFox repo, we can build for ourselves until that comes to an end.

Best I can say is I hope someone else picks up the mantle.
 
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Macbookprodude

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Is there also or will there be a ready made to compile of Classila if those want to add or update Classila (injecting TLS 1.2 for instance), then compiling for use ? Basically, what it sounds like is - we are all on our own and if we the ones, who don’t program very well, we are SOL while everyone else will be ok.. that further causes the community to dwindle - compiling the code is not hard, but injecting into it (eg.. new TLS standards, new certs, etc...). Money is no object to be so therefore I would gladly pay someone to maintain the browser.. which is why I wanted to give away my G5 to Tobias, so he can continue to maintain LWK - I’d rather pay someone for their hard work, then doing it myself.. again, most of us in here can easily compile the code using the new toolkit, but to inject new certs or new TLS standards - that it something most of us DONNOT know how to do.

these are valid concerns for those of us on here who don’t know how to do these additions to the browser. I think I speak for the majority here.
 

Gamer9430

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Apr 22, 2014
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Is there also or will there be a ready made to compile of Classila if those want to add or update Classila (injecting TLS 1.2 for instance), then compiling for use ? Basically, what it sounds like is - we are all on our own and if we the ones, who don’t program very well, we are SOL while everyone else will be ok.. that further causes the community to dwindle - compiling the code is not hard, but injecting into it (eg.. new TLS standards, new certs, etc...). Money is no object to be so therefore I would gladly pay someone to maintain the browser.. which is why I wanted to give away my G5 to Tobias, so he can continue to maintain LWK - I’d rather pay someone for their hard work, then doing it myself.. again, most of us in here can easily compile the code using the new toolkit, but to inject new certs or new TLS standards - that it something most of us DONNOT know how to do.

these are valid concerns for those of us on here who don’t know how to do these additions to the browser. I think I speak for the majority here.

You sound like exactly the kind of person Dr. Kaiser was referring to in his closing down TFF/Classila post. You are DEMANDING someone to continue to work on a hobby. There’s only so many ways everyone on here can tell you that the stuff you are describing are just not possible without an incredible amount of time and effort, if it’s even possible at all. This is a hobby, this is not a lifestyle. You should not and cannot rely 100% on PowerPCs Macs in 2021 as your one exclusive method of getting on the internet. Yes, it may work fine for now, but they have reached the end of the line. They are beyond the life support stage that was given to us by Dr. Kaiser and his work on TFF.

Your thoughts are not representative of the majority here.

The ability to build new “releases” of TFF is also 100% reliant on a completely random release schedule from Dr. Kaiser, if he even chooses to do so. Everyone other than you seems to have a grasp on that, and the fact that this is just a HOBBY for FUN. You paying people and giving away hardware attaches a commitment and obligation to those payments/gifts that they HAVE to do what you asked them to do. No one in their right mind can commit to do these incredibly difficult things you are asking for, on the niche of a niche of a niche platform of computers. A hobby stops being a hobby when it’s no longer fun, then it becomes a chore, a job. That’s why Dr. Kaiser stopped, that’s why the majority of developers stopped, and that’s why you should stop. Do you genuinely believe this is fun still? You have said on multiple occasions that’s you are frustrated and angry with everything going on here. So why continue to torture yourself? Enjoy these machines for what they are and how far they come, don’t focus on what they can’t do 15-20+ years after they were built as the world of technology continued to evolve around them.
 

pipetogrep

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Jan 27, 2021
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@Macbookprodude You're using a thread meant to help others that want to learn how to build for themselves to ask who's going to build and update it for you. You say having to learn new skills will cause the community to dwindle, but I wouldn't have learned any of what I have in the past few weeks if TenFourFox didn't go mostly EOL. In fact it got me deeper into the community.

The reality is, the modern web has grown to be barely accessible to these machines. Nothing is going to change that. The fact that TenFourFox existed at all put these machines on bonus time. It was a passion project of mostly one person. We should thank him, and if we feel motivated enough, continue his work.

If you want to keep using TenFourFox long past its expire date and you want features built into it, nothing is stopping you from learning those skills. Once you have those skills, you could contribute your efforts to the community and others would benefit.

I've never even attempted to compile a web browser or make an OS X installer before building this toolkit. Learning, building, and sharing what you've learned is what this community is about. Saying, "I can't because I don't know how" is not.
 

Imixmuan

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Dec 18, 2010
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425
Is there also or will there be a ready made to compile of Classila if those want to add or update Classila (injecting TLS 1.2 for instance), then compiling for use ? Basically, what it sounds like is - we are all on our own and if we the ones, who don’t program very well, we are SOL while everyone else will be ok.. that further causes the community to dwindle - compiling the code is not hard, but injecting into it (eg.. new TLS standards, new certs, etc...). Money is no object to be so therefore I would gladly pay someone to maintain the browser.. which is why I wanted to give away my G5 to Tobias, so he can continue to maintain LWK - I’d rather pay someone for their hard work, then doing it myself.. again, most of us in here can easily compile the code using the new toolkit, but to inject new certs or new TLS standards - that it something most of us DONNOT know how to do.

these are valid concerns for those of us on here who don’t know how to do these additions to the browser. I think I speak for the majority here.
Wait...you have a Mac Pro AND a spare G5?....Really?

Scene ends: Man turns, falls to his knees and crawls to the exit, head shaking in confusion, never to return...
 

Macbookprodude

Suspended
Jan 1, 2018
3,306
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Wait...you have a Mac Pro AND a spare G5?....Really?

Scene ends: Man turns, falls to his knees and crawls to the exit, head shaking in confusion, never to return...
Well, I plan to DONATE my G5 quad to Tobias so he can keep LWK alive.. Mac Pro won’t compile PPC code.
 
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