Think of all the apps with buttons along the top that would be blocked by a notch.

[8CoreWhore]

Does Mac OS Monterey apps have toolbars that accommodate a notch that is in the middle where current items are? No? Then there won't be a notch.
Go full screen on so many apps that have toolbars, etc, that go right to the top of the LCD and have items in the middle. If devs are not required to accomodate that, then that's it, guys... no notch. Thankfully. Might there be more stuff in the bezel? Yeah, but not in the LCD screen. Am I missing something about this? Let me know.

 

[zakarhino]

Am I missing something about this? Let me know.

You are. You're missing the most obvious solution: Apple will make either sides of the notch black (this will look acceptable with mini-LED I'm guessing) and put menu bar items up there along with widgets/notifications/or something else. Essentially everything below the notch area will operate as 'the screen' just like you're used to, so when an app goes full screen the top of the full screen window doesn't go above the bottom of the notch. Right now going full screen causes the menu bar to hide itself to get maximum content real estate; with the notch it won't have to, it can use up the same 16:10 space it currently does on MBP but it won't have to hide the menu bar -- for that reason I actually consider the notch to be a huge win.


Current: Big top bezel, lots of wasted space. Less space on the main screen without hiding the menu bar which is a nuisance and defeats the purpose of having live informational data on the menu bar (WiFi status, music controls, Little Snitch, etc.)

What the anti MBP notch crowd want: No notch, keep the big top bezel. Essentially keep everything the way it is. The people that have to hide the menu bar to get more real estate will continue to have to do so.

Hypothetical notch scenario: No huge top bezels, imagine your current MacBook Pro except the wasted space either side of the camera now has permanent menu bar stuff so you get the benefits of hiding the menu bar on a current Mac without having to actually hide the menu bar. It's not that the notch is cutting into your content, it's that the area around the camera is being reclaimed to serve a purpose and solve a problem.

If Apple do that ^ I think the notch will actually be a huge win for the crowd of people that want maximum real estate without the current compromise of hiding the menu bar.

For the crowd worried about Linux/Windows native booting compatibility, Apple can probably create a kernel level workaround that only activates the screen area below the touch bar when booting into an alternative OS (like how the touch bar shows function buttons when you boot up Windows). If they don't do that on Linux then it's not like Linux doesn't already require three million drivers to get Apple devices to work so I imagine someone will create a fix for it quickly.

 

[Total Respray]

Apple will make either sides of the notch black (this will look acceptable with mini-LED I'm guessing) and put menu bar items up there along with widgets/notifications/or something else.

I hope in this scenario that they actually use the space to include the battery percentage…

 

[8CoreWhore]

Interesting, Zak... if so, I hope the menu bar items turn off if I'm watching a movie, etc. What about a slim bezel like the iPad with the tech built in, etc.

 

[Jorbanead]

Apple has one of the best UI teams on the planet. They paved the way for a ton of modern designs that all tech companies use today. Surely they tested a million and one ways the notch could be implemented. I’m sure one of the best UI teams in the word knows what they are doing.

It’s the same story every year. Apple does something people don’t fully understand and gets a ton of hate at first. Years later people see how it’s implemented and don’t even really think about it anymore.

 

[zakarhino]

Interesting, Zak... if so, I hope the menu bar items turn off if I'm watching a movie, etc. What about a slim bezel like the iPad with the tech built in, etc.

yep if the menu bar doesn’t turn off when watching movies I’ll be super annoyed.

 

[altaic]

So I thought this thread is about listing apps with menu bars that would interfere with the notch. Movies already get letterboxed. Full screen apps can be sized correctly at the OS level.

I use the lowest magnification (smallest fonts), and my apps have lots of space. Anyone with bad eyesight have apps with menus that cross the center of the screen?

I personally don’t think the notch will happen on the MBP, but I really don’t mind if it does— assuming Apple’s user interface team is on top of it (should be a given).

 

[thenewperson]

If the menu bar simply resides in the full length area the notch takes up part of and the rest of the screen is 16:10 then this functionally changes nothing. In fact this may be better for a lot of people (after the initial shock) since they won’t have to use full screen or hide the menu bar to make an app take up all the screen (as 16:10).

 

[stinkhorn9]

...like rhinoceroses, tigers, cats and mink...

 

[Nermal]

I’m sure one of the best UI teams in the word knows what they are doing.

*Looks at Safari 15*

 

[8CoreWhore]

So I thought this thread is about listing apps with menu bars that would interfere with the notch. Movies already get letterboxed. Full screen apps can be sized correctly at the OS level.

I use the lowest magnification (smallest fonts), and my apps have lots of space. Anyone with bad eyesight have apps with menus that cross the center of the screen?

I personally don’t think the notch will happen on the MBP, but I really don’t mind if it does— assuming Apple’s user interface team is on top of it (should be a given).

Not list them, think of them... lots of apps have tool bars with items in the middle at the very top of the LCD in full screen. If there was a notch coming this month, Apple would have to tell those devs to accommodate it months ago at WWDC just like they did for the iPhone - or - as Zak wrote above reserve the LCD left and right of the notch for OS usage only.

So a video in fullscreen mode would still have a black bar above it (even if not a letterboxed video). And the menu bar would still be visible in full screen mode unlike now. It's possible Apple would do that... but they would have to if there's a notch. Apple's user interface team can be on top of it, but the devs weren't notified like they were for the iPhone.

 

[altaic]

Not list them, think of them... lots of apps have tool bars with items in the middle at the very top of the LCD in full screen. If there was a notch coming this month, Apple would have to tell those devs to accomadate it just like they did for the iPhone - or - as Zak wrote above reserve the LCD left and right of the notch for OS usage only.

So a video in fullscreen mode would still have a black bar above it. I doubt that would happen, so I doubt they'll be a notch that comes down into the LCD. Apple's user interface team can be on top of it, but so would all the devs and they weren't notified like they were for the iPhone.

You keep saying “tool bar” but I thought you meant “menu bar”— which is it?

 

[altaic]

*Looks at Safari 15*

While I agree, I feel like you signed into the wrong account…

 

[8CoreWhore]

You keep saying “tool bar” but I thought you meant “menu bar”— which is it?

(I did some edits in the post you are quoting as you were writing... full disclosure, and I just now changed title of post... the intent is the same) The OS has a menu bar there... is that what the apps call there stuff on top? I can't remember. Menu bar, Toolbar... the stuff along the top. With Brave browser for instance, they have tabs there....

 

[altaic]

(I did some edits in the post you are quoting as you were writing... full disclosure) The OS has a menu bar there... is that what the apps call there stuff on top? I can't remember. Menu bar, Toolbar... the stuff along the top. With Brave browser for instance, they have tabs there....

The notch would be in the center of the menu bar at the top of the screen. Windows can’t be moved into that area, so tabs have never been able to be there.

 

[8CoreWhore]

The notch would be in the center of the menu bar at the top of the screen. Windows can’t be moved into that area, so tabs have never been able to be there.

The menu bar disappears when apps are in full screen mode... all apps? I don't know. Safari? Yes. Brave? Yes. Chrome? Yes. It's possible this could change though. IDK.

 

[senttoschool]

Apple has one of the best UI teams on the planet. They paved the way for a ton of modern designs that all tech companies use today. Surely they tested a million and one ways the notch could be implemented. I’m sure one of the best UI teams in the word knows what they are doing.

I used to think this. Then they released the 2016 Macbook Pro which made me believe they do almost no user testing.

Recent Safari changes/roll-backs reinforce this idea.

 

[Andropov]

The menu bar disappears when apps are in full screen mode... all apps? I don't know. Safari? Yes. Brave? Yes. Chrome? Yes. It's possible this could change though. IDK.

The idea is that the menu bar would become always visible (even in full screen) so the notch area would never be available to app windows.

 

[xmatic_4]

The idea is that the menu bar would become always visible (even in full screen) so the notch area would never be available to app windows.

this is what will happen

 

[senttoschool]

The idea is that the menu bar would become always visible (even in full screen) so the notch area would never be available to app windows.

This won't happen. The menu bar is a huge distraction when watching a full-screen video or playing a game.

What will happen is by default, the notch will move into the full-screen. Then, users can choose an option to have the notch and its horizontal space blacked out.

iOS does the same thing. Open the Youtube app. You can either zoom into the video so that the notch is blocking some video or zoom out so that the entire notch space is not showing anything.

 

[Andropov]

This won't happen. The menu bar is a huge distraction when watching a full-screen video or playing a game.

This... already happened. Until Mac OS X 10.7 (Lion) the menu bar was always visible. It was only when full-screen apps were introduced that the menu bar became hidden by default.

Obviously games and full-screen video would use an API or a custom solution to hide the menu bar (either by rendering it black or by extending under the notch), just like those apps did pre-Mac OS X 10.7. Very few games or video players use the native full-screen mode anyway.

 

[dugbug]

Do you want a bezel or a notch or no webcam. Those are the ONLY choices given the thinness of laptop screens.

If they can push the screen out to the absolute limits, carve out space for a webcam, and use macos HMI design to work around the notch then you are gaining screen not gaining a notch.

This is a place windows laptop manufacturers cannot go without microsoft to coordinate.

 

[oldmacs]

What about those of us who use a lot of menu bar items? Not too happy about loosing menu bar real estate

 

[darngooddesign]

Does Mac OS Monterey apps have toolbars that accommodate a notch that is in the middle where current items are? No? Then there won't be a notch.
Go full screen on so many apps that have toolbars, etc, that go right to the top of the LCD and have items in the middle. If devs are not required to accomodate that, then that's it, guys... no notch. Thankfully. Might there be more stuff in the bezel? Yeah, but not in the LCD screen. Am I missing something about this? Let me know.

Several things could happen;

1. There is a separate build which holds that code and Apple has been keeping it internal to hide the feature.
2. Full screen apps may simply have a persistent menu-bar or blacked-out notch-bar.
3. There is no notch.

 

[darngooddesign]

View attachment 1869471What about those of us who use a lot of menu bar items? Not too happy about loosing menu bar real estate

If you don't need to see all those icons regularly, you can use Bartender to hide them in a collapsable drawer until you mouse-over the menu bar. I permanently hide the Search icon because CMD+Space is quicker. Bartender can be configured to display an icon when its state changes, for example, my Time Machine icon is only displayed when it is actively backing up.

So if there is enough blank space in the menu bar, mousing over the bar just expands the Bartender drawer, and if there isn't enough space due to a lot of Photoshop menu items, for example, clicking on the three dots expands the Bartender drawer on top of the menu bar items.