This is why there isn't a Remote App for the new AppleTV

Discussion in 'Apple TV and Home Theater' started by ipedro, Nov 26, 2015.

  1. ipedro, Nov 26, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2015

    ipedro macrumors 68040

    ipedro

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    #1
    I was just as surprised as everyone else when the new AppleTV didn't work with the Remote App.

    Meanwhile, I had been frustrated at how there were always 2 ways to listen to music on the AppleTV, one where you'd have direct control from your iPhone or Watch, another where you'd have to open the Remote App which has a completely different UI.

    For example, you could ask your Watch to play a song then AirPlay the music to your AppleTV. In that way, you can control the volume on your AppleTV by turning the digital crown on your Watch or have complete control by using Siri on your Watch: Hey Siri, I like this song, Hey Siri, play the rest of this album, Hey Siri, play that song again.

    If however, you started playing music sitting down on your couch with your AppleTV's remote then got up and walked around the house, to change the volume or like a song, or set up the next song, you'd have to go to the TV and change it or open the Remote App to do so in a completely different UI than what you're used to.

    Then the realization hit. Apple is simplifying this setup, building AppleTV control into an ecosystem of devices through handover and AirPlay. In iOS10, watchOS3 and tvOS2 (or hopefully before then), whatever is playing on your AppleTV, will be available for handover on to your Watch and iPhone/iPad with full hardware control being passed on to your iPhone/Watch. Whatever was playing on the TV will now be showing in your Music app with the music still being played on your AppleTV.

    Conversely, there's currently an AirPlay button on the Watch's Settings glance that does nothing. With this set up, whatever is playing on your iPhone/Watch's music app, when you press the AirPlay button, it'll play on the AppleTV with full hardware controls of your music on the Watch.

    [​IMG]

    The same will apply to video of course. The Now Playing glance on your Watch and Control Center on your iPhone will show what's playing on your AppleTV. No need for a separate app.

    As for the most missed feature from the Remote App, a full touch keyboard, that's also solvable with Handover. If a keyboard appears on your AppleTV, simply double click the home button on your iPhone and AppleTV will appear in your Handover corner or you can swipe it up from the lock screen.

    Perhaps there'll still be a simplified Remote App that replicates the Siri Remote's functionality but it's clear that the old Remote App was overly complex and redundant. It's likely that Apple is going to build those functions right into iOS rather than as a separate app.
     
  2. Mac... nificent macrumors 6502

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    #2

    Only Apple knows for sure. Hopefully something like this will be done. They will most likely incorporate the Apple Watch into the Apple TV fold, which is a great idea.
     
  3. chuyn macrumors 6502

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    #3
    The one point that I don't like about this is airplaying music from the watch/phone to the Apple TV means the phone/watch battery is dying while I'm listening to music. It turns the Apple TV into a "dumb" receiver while my phone is doing all the work. I don't want that. I usually listen to my home library right on the Apple TV (through wired home sharing or now, Apple Music), and I want it to be doing the heavy lifting since it's the one plugged in, not my watch or phone.
     
  4. ipedro thread starter macrumors 68040

    ipedro

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    #4
    It won't necessarily have to AirPlay. Handover is the key technology here. Your AppleTV is simply aware of what is playing on your Watch/iPhone and vice versa and it takes over streaming. If I recall correctly, this is actually how it works now since an AppleTV software update a couple of years ago.

    The point is that there is no need for a duplication of functionality in a separate app when Control Centre on iPhone/iPad and the Now Playing glance on AppleWatch can perform that functionality by simply being aware of what the other devices are doing.
     
  5. chuyn macrumors 6502

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    #5
    Oh yeah, I know what you're talking about. I can't seem to find confirmation, but I thought when it does this, like say I AirPlay a movie I own to my Apple TV... the Apple TV itself will stream the movie from the cloud. I'm not aware that it can instead find it on my home share network and stream it locally instead. That's my main issue... I can stream from the cloud just fine, but my data cap isn't the highest and would always prefer to stream over my own locally connected Mac when I can.
     
  6. UKgaryb macrumors regular

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    #6

    I agree, seems like a natural extension to continuity, video and audio.
     
  7. TrueBlou macrumors demi-god

    TrueBlou

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    #7

    Depends how you're doing it. I use the current remote app on my iPhone to stream music from my Mac to my Apple TV. The iPhone is just a go-between to control what's playing, the Mac does all of the work so the iPhone's battery isn't affected. Even if you completely power off your iPhone the music will continue playing as it's coming straight from the Mac.
     
  8. ctyrider, Nov 26, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2015

    ctyrider macrumors 6502a

    ctyrider

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    #8
    Handoff functionality via AirPlay is a completely different thing than a Remote app.

    I don't want to redirect video or music content to my iPhone. I simply want to control what's already playing on my TV via IOS based remote. When a Siri remote isn't handy - I want to use my iPhone to accomplish the same functions. Nothing else.

    I am hoping Apple will eventually update its Remote app to control ATV4. I don't need Handoff.
     
  9. boston04and07 macrumors 65816

    boston04and07

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    #9
    Huh. This is really smart! You know, the old system of having both a Remote app and Airplay always kind of bothered me. I never really thought of why, but I think you've hit the nail on the head. I often would have music playing through my speakers via the Apple TV, and would usually have to stop and think - did I play this locally on the Apple TV via the Remote app, or am I airplaying this? And if I'm airplaying this, which one of my 3 devices is it coming from, again? :confused: Not the worst thing, but sort of inelegant, and it made me stop and think every time I wanted to so much as pause a song or whatever.

    I can totally see Apple moving toward having each device owned by a single user display a unified "now playing" song/TV show/movie/whatever as well as a label (via the Airplay menu) as to where the user wants it to play. Not only would that solve the problem you described of having conflicting ways to control content on the Apple TV, but it could also allow for seamlessly picking up where another device left off. It's always bugged me that when I switch to a playlist or radio station from one device to another, it doesn't pick up where I left off. This could solve that, and seems like the natural next step to Continuity.

    Good thinking, @ipedro. Hope we see this at some point!

    Only thing I'd add is, I hope they bake this into OS X as well. Then again, I don't see why they wouldn't!
     
  10. McGiord macrumors 601

    McGiord

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    #10
    This doesn't change the fact that the main reason to use the Remote App for many of us was to be able to quickly type when performing searches, Siri still sucks and most of the times I don't want to be talking to it.
    I'm still not convinced to get the watch yet.
     
  11. ipedro thread starter macrumors 68040

    ipedro

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    #11
    It's too bad that you didn't read the entire post. I'll be happy to discuss once you have.
     
  12. boston04and07 macrumors 65816

    boston04and07

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    #12
    So I think what the OP was alluding to was that all that functionality would really be there, just in individual Music/Movies/Podcasts/etc apps instead of separated into their own Remote app, with typing abilities being handled via Handoff. Definitely different, but the ability to quickly type when searching (and the ability to scroll through your stuff as well) would technically still be there, just not in the remote app anymore.
     
  13. McGiord macrumors 601

    McGiord

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    #13
    I see. I read the post again. And sounds good if it actually works.
    I haven't had any experience with handsoff, and I guess it never shows up in any of my devices because I have 2 separate Apple IDs, the iCloud from the MobileMe days and the iTunes one from even before, or maybe I'm using it wrong?
    Obviously we need the security to control who can be controlling the Apple TV but the simplification from Apple regarding how to authenticate the user across devices is still convoluted for the former loyal customers and maybe not so for the new customers that created their Apple IDs a few months ago.
     
  14. ipedro thread starter macrumors 68040

    ipedro

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    #14
    Handoff didn't work very well in iOS8 but since iOS9, it's been solidly consistent. I use it routinely when on my iMac, moving to my iPad or iPhone and vice versa.

    It's a natural progression to get it on AppleTV and Apple Watch. There's no need for a separate app if you could have continuity between your AppleTV and iPhone/iPad/AppleWatch. Need a keyboard on your AppleTV? It's there waiting you in Handoff on your iPhone/iPad. Just slide up.
     
  15. McGiord macrumors 601

    McGiord

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    #15
    After searching on handoff, I see that indeed I was "using it wrong", as I normally have Bluetooth off in my iPhone and iPad, I wasn't aware that it requires Bluetooth on for handsoff to work. Do you know if there are other Apps that work well, I hope the news App as well as Netflix, Hulu, Amazon Prime Video and so on...
     
  16. ctyrider macrumors 6502a

    ctyrider

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    Jul 15, 2012
    #16
    You seem confused about the purpose of Handoff vs the function of Remote app.

    Let's say, I want to wake my ATV4, launch Netflix app, and start new a episode of Jessica Jones. Something I can easily do with my iPhone, Remote app and ATV3. How exactly would one accomplish this with Handoff?
     
  17. ipedro, Nov 28, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2015

    ipedro thread starter macrumors 68040

    ipedro

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    #17
    "Hey Siri, play Jessica Jones on AppleTV". It shows on your TV. The AppleTV icon appears in your handoff corner in the iPhone lock screen or by double clicking Home. Drag it up and it'll show you the options on screen.

    Handoff is just one of the tools in Continuity. It's not the entire picture. iPhones, iPads and Macs have all been brought into Continuity. AppleTV is no longer a hobby and is now a full fledged member of the Apple family and so it is likely going to be integrated into that system. Simply put, all of your devices will be aware of one another and easily carry on functions on one device that was started on another.

    The Remote App created a redundant control system with a separate UI that isolated AppleTV into itself. Continuity brings it into the larger ecosystem.
     
  18. ctyrider macrumors 6502a

    ctyrider

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    #18
    So Siri on iOS devices is the way to control ATV4? If that's in fact Apple's direction - they have LONG way to go, as Siri capabilities are currently very limited.. even with ATV4 Siri remote. You can initiate certain basic things via Siri / voice, but you can't control the entire UI, and it's really no replacement for a remote.

    You may be right in that Apple will in fact deprecate the Remote app.. But I'd still rather just have a dedicated Remote app, which lets me do everything, without having to reach for a hardware remote.. As opposed to jumping through hoops with Siri and voice control.

    My whole family uses Remote app on a variety of iPhones and iPod Touches to control our 3 Apple TVs, and no one ever found it particularly confusing.
     
  19. inkahauts macrumors regular

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    #19
    If this is all in fact correct and the direction they are heading, it's still no excuse for not making the remote app work today till they are ready to implement all these handoff advancements. No excuse at all.

    It annoys the heck out of me. It's a dang good thing I could enter my iTunes password once which is 30 some characters long (I have all long difficult passwords for everything) once and turn off it needing to be entered again to buy apps on the Apple TV or I'd have had to change my dang password to buy apps then change it back again. And that would cause a nightmare across all my apple devices. I wish you could have a control panel that would allow you to crate different passwords for iTunes for every device after authentication of the device belonging to your iTunes account.
     
  20. ipedro thread starter macrumors 68040

    ipedro

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    #20
    Apple is known to sometimes take a step back in order to take several steps forward. Final Cut Pro and iWork are notable examples.

    The Remote app isn't a critical feature to the functioning of AppleTV. At best, not having it is an inconvenience.

    Deciding to not update an app for an entirely new OS was a call made with that in mind. Is it necessary to expend development time to rebuild this app to work on an OS that it wasn't designed for? Working on an app that will soon be deprecated was probably thought of as a poor allocation of resources.
     
  21. inkahauts macrumors regular

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    #21
    Then the new app should have been ready then.It is critical, there is no easy way to search (needed more than ever now with a App Store) or enter passwords and it's a nightmare for that purpose till this gets fixed. There is no excuse at all no matter how much what you said might make sense. Bringing a product to market that needs a keyboard more than ever and not having it even though the previous one did is inexcusable. No reason they couldn't have had something in place already.
     
  22. ipedro, Nov 28, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2015

    ipedro thread starter macrumors 68040

    ipedro

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    #22
    Siri is one way to interact with your AppleTV. It does happen to be a flagship feature of the new AppleTV so it would make sense to be given that kind of significance in the Apple Continuity ecosystem.

    It could just as easily be integrated into Search on iOS. Drag the home screen down to show your search bar and type "Jessica Jones". If you are paired with an AppleTV it would show up in your search results under "On AppleTV" and you could hit play and it would play on your TV.

    To take control of playback, it could either be playing in your Now Playing in Control Centre or you can hand it off to your phone by dragging it up from your Handoff icon on your iPhone's lock or multi tasking screen like all other Handoff functions.
     
  23. ianrip macrumors 6502

    ianrip

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    #23
    I agree with the new integration using handoff, but it’s not ready, that’s the biggest bug, I’ve disabled my password for ATV app store, which isn’t right.
    Touch ID for app store is required, but only after the product was launched is really bad, can you imagine if another company launched a product like this, we would all say how unprofessional it was
     
  24. downingp macrumors 6502a

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    #24
    The main reason why I enjoyed using the remote app is I was able to choose and play music in different areas of my home using an Apple TV, airport express and iTunes library.
    Is there anyway to do this with the current system?
     
  25. Aluminum213 macrumors 68040

    Aluminum213

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    #25
    They made such a huge deal out of this remote that having an iPhone app defeats the purpose of it, especially with the Siri integration of remote

    the apple remote on the old apple tv was horrible so they gladly made an app for it, I actually really like this new remote and would not want to use a 100% touch screen device as a remote, having actual buttons to press to press down on feels much better
     

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