Tile Writes to EU Accusing Apple of Abuse of Power

[Websnapx2]

Were tile forcing you to buy their product?

Obviously the people who do buy Tiles do want to be, it's not about you

No, tile just wants you to put aside your privacy concerns because unlike everyone else — you can trust them

As a customer, you should have control of your personal information while still wanting to try or take advantage of products like Tile — the control should be in the hands of the user. It's disingenuous to say "Did they force you to be a customer", as it's the assumption that they want people to buy their products and if they do then they should take user privacy into consideration.

 

[gsurf123]

If Tile or Spotify get anywhere with their complaints we all will lose. If their product is so great then go after the entire Android market. Way more people have those devices all over the world. Apple is just a blip on the screen.

 

[Exile714]

I think the point is the pop-up no longer offers an "Always Allow" option, so they'd have to use a deep-link to Settings (see my previous question).

Are you sure that can’t be an option? It’s been months since I did this, but I’m pretty sure it was an option on DarkSky, which is the only third party app I would give permission to have always on location.

Why does Tile need this, anyway? If I’m not missing a thing, I’m not using the app, it doesn’t need to know where I am... unless they have a phone finding service like FindMy? Or do they just want to sell my location data?

 

[Karllake]

Correct me, but I’ve never really understood arguments like this. Surely it’s the equivalent of someone by a Windows PC and saying that there’s a monopoly because they can’t download Final Cut Pro?

Microsoft got into big trouble for shipping internet explorer with windows so that for me is a closer comparison.

I hate tiles privacy policy and can’t wait for Appletags but I think there is some merit in the complaint,
A) Apple didn’t allow access to iPhone technology to tile, from a consumer perspective I own the phone and the hardware once purchased and should be able to use it for all services not just apples
B) not sure the App Store priority is true but if it is I wouldn’t consider this to be ‘playing fair’ other can argue Apple doesn’t have to

the only reason to support tile is it sets a dangerous precedent for the big guy getting away with overpowering the little guy.

 

[1144557]

Proof that if your company has a competiting product with Apple, Google and Microsoft, you are in real trouble.
At some point this will become unbearable and it will have to be broken up by new laws.

Really? Tell that to makers of phone cases, wireless charges, cables, wall chargers, etc. There is a bounty of competing products to what Apple sells.

IF you have a good product and keep innovating it; if.

People wont suddenly decide they need to track their lost stuff that couldnt do so before. They will do so (or swtich from Tile) because Apple does it in a privacy-centric and unique way, likely with AR from the leaks. If Tile was so good no one would be compelled to switch.

 

[deeddawg]

Why does Tile need this, anyway? If I’m not missing a thing, I’m not using the app, it doesn’t need to know where I am... unless they have a phone finding service like FindMy? Or do they just want to sell my location data?

Tile does location crowdsourcing -- reporting the location of any tile devices detected nearby (bluetooth) -- so they want the app to have location enabled even when in background.

 

[Karllake]

Are you sure that can’t be an option? It’s been months since I did this, but I’m pretty sure it was an option on DarkSky, which is the only third party app I would give permission to have always on location.

Why does Tile need this, anyway? If I’m not missing a thing, I’m not using the app, it doesn’t need to know where I am... unless they have a phone finding service like FindMy? Or do they just want to sell my location data?

tile “needs” it so if you pass by a lost tile it know where you and it are to upload and tell that person, the ‘real’ reason in my view is the commercialisation of data.

 

[Saturnine]

I'm a Tile owner. I find their products pretty useful as I used to always leave my keys in the office and not realise until I got home.

With that said, this does seem like childish whining on their behalf. In the iPhone, Apple has created a product and a software ecosystem from scratch. Tile shouldn't automatically expect to get the same levels of access to that ecosystem that Apple have. Apple have invested millions, if not billions, of dollars to create their own platform and should be able to reap benefits from that without having to hand over the keys to their competitors. Tile are entirely free to create their own platform if they should choose to do so.

Ultimately I believe the choice is down to the customer. If they accept that Apple will restrict third parties from doing certain things in order to promote their own products and services then they will continue to buy iPhones. If not, there's always Android.

 

[tkukoc]

I don't buy into anything Tile says.. these are the same guys who were freaking out before when they thought Apple was announcing their own trackers. Sending out emails saying "don't forget about us". They knew this was going to happen and they did nothing to come up with a plan. Same type of guys who would build an app, charge a straight fee.. then whine because well now I didn't budget right and I don't have any other ideas to make another app so of course I have to go subscription. Straight up nonsense! They had a good idea, but they didn't evolve it correctly. But of course that is all Apple's fault for coming up with a better way? I'd be curious to know if at some point in the past a conversation between Tile and Apple occurred in terms of buy out? But we'll never know.

 

[roar08]

Tile is a feature, not a product. They'd be smart to pivot or license their IP to manufacturers and hedge the very inevitable threats to their consumer model. E.g. "Tile Inside".

 

[timber]

EU investigations are usually on abuse of dominant position.

Apple, obviously, hasn't got a dominant position.

So complaining to the EU won't get them anywhere and they probably know it.

 

[SigurTom]

Tile either needs to make a better product or one that’s cheaper than whatever hypothetical tracker that Apple comes out with. Improve or die.

 

[Sedulous]

I would imagine the “tracking” behavior will work the same for Apple’s product. Isn’t this as easy to solve as “only allow while in use”?

 

[glowplug]

Wish Apple would hurry up and release AirTags so I can stop reading these Tile threads.

 

[ericwn]

Wah! We didn't evolve to make anything better and now Apple is going to take our marketshare, poor us!

Yeah, it’s all good vs evil. Thanks for that in-depth analysis!

 

[carrrrrlos]

Tile could be better, great to find keys - if you’re within range.

 

[imnotthewalrus]

Don't confuse disagreeing with Tile's stance as defending Apple.

If Tile can't educate their users to set up their products correctly, that's on them.

Even if the user messes up the initial setup, Settings->Privacy->LocationServices isn't exactly difficult to find.

Especially when settings has a search bar! 🤣

 

[Unregistered 4U]

They still have the android market to target,

AND, for tracking purposes, there are physically MORE Android devices out there. But, yeah, comes down to them requiring a subscription to make money.

Remember, this is the company that won’t let Spotify, Netflix, Amazon and others mention the existence of a website to sign up.

They.... don’t? I mean, it’s not very hard to download those and give it a try. I downloaded Spotify and...

Tile does location crowdsourcing -- reporting the location of any tile devices detected nearby (bluetooth) -- so they want the app to have location enabled even when in background.

And this is what I think is their real problem. When Tile first burst onto the scene, the landscape around privacy and tracking was a little different. But when you consider how it works, and add to that, that people better realize the value of their privacy/location, the feature better offer a superior experience. From what some others have posted, Tile hasn’t improved to the level where they deserve folks enabling tracking for them.

I have tracking turned on for Dark Sky and the OS pings me saying “Hey, Dark Sky has been tracking you in alllll these places”. I’m fine with that and click OK. Tile is afraid folks will see that and go ”NO I DON’T WANT THEM TRACKING ME, I JUST WANT TO KNOW WHERE MY DEVICES ARE” and turn it off.

Tile is a feature, not a product. They'd be smart to pivot or license their IP to manufacturers and hedge the very inevitable threats to their consumer model. E.g. "Tile Inside".

I only know of a few devices with ”Tile Inside”. That’s where they should have been pushing all this time, but either their sales guy wasn’t good at b2b sales OR none of the businesses wanted it onboard.

 

[falainber]

Yes, from their perch as the minority market platform that has much less than 50% of the smart phone market, Apple is abusing its position.

Just like when Burger King won’t let me sell hamburgers inside its stores.

That's a flawed analogy. Burger King owns the stores. Apple does not own the iPhones, we do.
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They.... don’t? I mean, it’s not very hard to download those and give it a try. I downloaded Spotify and...
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And this is what I think is their real problem. When Tile first burst onto the scene, the landscape around privacy and tracking was a little different. But when you consider how it works, and add to that, that people better realize the value of their privacy/location, the feature better offer a superior experience. From what some others have posted, Tile hasn’t improved to the level where they deserve folks enabling tracking for them.

I have tracking turned on for Dark Sky and the OS pings me saying “Hey, Dark Sky has been tracking you in alllll these places”. I’m fine with that and click OK. Tile is afraid folks will see that and go ”NO I DON’T WANT THEM TRACKING ME, I JUST WANT TO KNOW WHERE MY DEVICES ARE” and turn it off.

I only know of a few devices with ”Tile Inside”. That’s where they should have been pushing all this time, but either their sales guy wasn’t good at b2b sales OR none of the businesses wanted it onboard.

"to learn more" is not the same as "to subscribe". It's a big difference. Not to mention that the apps should be able to simply have a button for easy subscriptions using any mechanism they want (the one offered by Apple being one of the options)

 

[mazz0]

Thank God. I don't need Tile to ever know my location. The stupid popups complaining about location and not being able to run in the background are the most annoying things about tile. When did I consent to letting Tile use my battery life and privacy so they could sell their "premium" service to other people?

But that's how Tile works? If it doesn't know your location how is it supposed to keep track of where your things were when you lost them, or where other peoples' things near you are?
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If you look in your settings, the "Find My" app doesn't have "always-on" as an option either.

It doesn't need it yet though does it? They might add it if they want to do what Tile does. Although even then, it may be a system process rather than the Find My app that does the tracking.
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Are you sure that can’t be an option? It’s been months since I did this, but I’m pretty sure it was an option on DarkSky, which is the only third party app I would give permission to have always on location.

Why does Tile need this, anyway? If I’m not missing a thing, I’m not using the app, it doesn’t need to know where I am... unless they have a phone finding service like FindMy? Or do they just want to sell my location data?

I'm not sure at all, and I haven't tested, but from what I read pole removed Always Allow from the default pop-up when an app requests location data. Now you have to go to settings and turn it on manually.

Tile needs to know your location when you're not using the app so that it knows the location of each of your tiles. They don't have their own GPS, it gets their location from your phone when they're in Bluetooth range. When you lose your Tile there are two things that happen:

a) You open the Tile app and see the lost Tile's last known location. This is when it was last in bluetooth range and your phone was sharing it's location with the app. If when the Tile was last in bluetooth range your Tile app couldn't access location data, then it won't have been able to record the location. The location shown, therefore, would be the last location where you were in bluetooth range of the Tile and had the app open in the foreground, which is pretty useless.
b) Somebody else with the Tile app gets into bluetooth range of your lost Tile. Their phone connects to it, and sends their phone's location (and by implication the Tile's location) to Tile's servers (anonymously I assume) so that you can find out where your Tile is. Again, to be useful this has to work all the time, so just passing near a lot Tile is enough to send a location for it. If it only works when people have the app in the foreground it isn't much use.

That's my understanding anyway.

 

[longofest]

Please correct me, but I’ve never really understood arguments like this. Surely it’s the equivalent of someone buying a Windows PC and saying that there’s a monopoly because they can’t download Final Cut Pro?

Not at all the same thing.

Apple used to give developers less restrictive rights. They are now curtailing it, yet they are allowing their own first-party apps and devices to have the less restrictive rights that they used to provide the developers.

While there are no exact parallels that I'm aware of, what Apple is doing reminds me most of what Microsoft did with Internet Explorer and Windows, and if you recall, Microsoft got their asses handed to them in court.

 

[NufSaid]

Sorry tile....that is business.

Want a better model - create your own phone company to connect the tile to. You play with someone else's ecosystem then you don't to set the rules.

 

[BvizioN]

Is this the new “Spotify “? If you can’t stand the heat from the serious competition, just up the game and make yourself stand out. What a bunch of crybabies.

 

[pt75]

I have been a Tile user for over one year and I can say their products completely fail in their basic function, i.e. advise immediately when you leave behind something.

I bought the tiles plus paid the annual fee for their app, but when I leave my wallet behind I got advice 1h later... Completely useless and false advertising on their side.

Hopefully, Apple will get it right.

 

[alexandr]

they just won't quit. i remember when they first came out, people who were unfortunate enough to get tiles, were complaining that you have to keep the app open, which drained the battery. was apple also responsible for this, as a very very proactive abuse of power?.. clowns.