Time to stop calling the MBAir "slow."

[clayj]

The MBA is a marvel -- consider the fact that it is only 40% of the size of an MBP.

Like I said here previously, on a power-to-weight-and-volume basis, the MBA is one of the most powerful machines Apple makes.

If you had to compare the various Mac desktop and notebook models to cars, the MBA would be like a Lotus Elise... a small two-seater with a high power-to-weight ratio and no trunk to speak of. It ain't an SUV, it ain't a coupe, and it ain't a supercar like a Ferrari or a Lamborghini.

 

[mashoutposse]

Like I said here previously, on a power-to-weight-and-volume basis, the MBA is one of the most powerful machines Apple makes.

If you had to compare the various Mac desktop and notebook models to cars, the MBA would be like a Lotus Elise... a small two-seater with a high power-to-weight ratio and no trunk to speak of. It ain't an SUV, it ain't a coupe, and it ain't a supercar like a Ferrari or a Lamborghini.

Yep.

Basically, if you want to know the towing capacity of that Exige, chances are it's not for you

 

[tstarks33]

"Powerbooks are overpriced and underpowered, get over it. If you wish to fall for Steve's tricks, then go ahead, but don't pretend that the machine is something it's not. It's portable... that's it"



Why can't people understand that there has always been a premium on increasingly smaller form factors? That's why no one compares a $3k MBP to a $3k Mac Pro.

The MBA is a marvel -- consider the fact that it is only 40% of the size of an MBP.

I totally understand the price premium for size. But that's just it - it's not THAT MUCH smaller than a MB to justify the extra cost, decreased features, and slower harddrive/proc. If we were talking about a 12 inch laptop, then I could get behind the price and specs. But at the same footprint as a macbook, I just can't get behind the product.

Sure, it's 40% the size of the MBP, but what, exactly, does that mean? How much smaller is it than the more powerful macbook?

I like the MBA solely for what it means for future apple laptops.

 

[tstarks33]

Like I said here previously, on a power-to-weight-and-volume basis, the MBA is one of the most powerful machines Apple makes.

If you had to compare the various Mac desktop and notebook models to cars, the MBA would be like a Lotus Elise... a small two-seater with a high power-to-weight ratio and no trunk to speak of. It ain't an SUV, it ain't a coupe, and it ain't a supercar like a Ferrari or a Lamborghini.

On a power-to-weight/volume basis? I thought I've heard it all...

One good thing about the MBA is listening to the crazy justifications its buyers tell themselves (and us), trying, apparently, to justify the cost.

Bottom line: MBA is the slowest computer apple sells. This is not in dispute. If the decreased size is enough to compensate for this fact, then enjoy your new macbook air If you just surf the net, any processor and hard drive would suffice anyways.

 

[heatmiser]

From the other thread...

On a power-to-weight/volume basis? I thought I've heard it all...

One good thing about the MBA is listening to the crazy justifications its buyers tell themselves (and us), trying, apparently, to justify the cost.

Bottom line: MBA is the slowest computer apple sells. This is not in dispute. If the decreased size is enough to compensate for this fact, then enjoy your new macbook air If you just surf the net, any processor and hard drive would suffice anyways.

There's a lot of denial among the MBA crowd, if you haven't noticed. It can't be compared to *anything* except to the Macbook and Macbook Pro, in which case the comparison must be made on "thickness" and "weight" instead of on, you know, anything else (like performance or price). They keep saying it's the "best in its class", and I guess they're right, because they've effectively placed it in a class of one. Every notebook that outperforms it in speed, features, weight, or performance can't be compared to it, and isn't meant to compete with it. I doubt even SJ would be this detached from reality, but apparently, lots of the MBA's defenders are.

 

[clayj]

On a power-to-weight/volume basis? I thought I've heard it all...

Isn't that what a lot of people are griping about? "It's too small." "It doesn't have the ports I need/want." "It doesn't have a built-in optical drive." "It doesn't have a big enough hard drive."

We're talking about sacrificing power for small size. If that sacrifice is one that you (or others) are not willing to make, no one is forcing you to. And if you insist on having an überpowerful machine, there are choices that should make you happy.

One good thing about the MBA is listening to the crazy justifications its buyers tell themselves (and us), trying, apparently, to justify the cost.

There's no justification required; neither you nor anyone else here is the boss of my bank account. Apple has made a new product which appeals to me (and others) and I've decided it will be a better choice for me than my current MBP.

Bottom line: MBA is the slowest computer apple sells. This is not in dispute. If the decreased size is enough to compensate for this fact, then enjoy your new macbook air If you just surf the net, any processor and hard drive would suffice anyways.

Yes, it's the slowest machine Apple currently makes. Yes, this is not in dispute. And yes, thanks, I will enjoy my new MacBook Air.

I just fail to see why all the naysayers feel like they need to crap all over the MBA because of what they see to be its shortcomings. Honestly, it's like some of you are bitching because the Audi R8 doesn't seat 6 people; it's not meant to.

 

[HLdan]

Wow, I know there are two camps on this whole thing . . . but . . .

When it comes right down to it, there are a looooooooooot of users for whom the MBA will represent way MORE power than they need.

Take me, for example. I'm a doctor, I work in an academic setting. I go to national meetings and give lectures on stuff. (Yes, stuff. ) I use my laptop for, get this . . . email, web surfing, and Keynote/PowerPoint. Oooooooooh. I have a good friend who's a lawyer. Want to know what he does with his laptop? Email, websurfing, and word processing. Ooooooooooh, again.

GET REAL, folks.



Stuart

Agreed, the reason you see such a battle on this here about the MBA not being powerful enough is because a lot of this forum is made up of pizza-faced, milk on the breath teenagers aged 13-18 that have nothing better to do than to play Bioshock or some other game and they can't see that the MBA is for a lot of people rather for business or personal.
These kids have zero responsibilities so a notebook of the AIR's caliber feels beneath them when it's actually far above them.

 

[heatmiser]

I just fail to see why all the naysayers feel like they need to crap all over the MBA because of what they see to be its shortcomings.

A lot of it is simply backlash toward people who've started acting as if the MB/Ps are Terribly Heavy Laptops that were Impossible To Bear before the Macbook Air came along. I can't count the number of threads where people have started recommending MBAs to high schoolers looking for all-in-one college laptops under the pretext that "business professionals don't need optical drives". As long as MBA fanboys keep treating the MBA as the second coming, plenty of people will be only too happy to pull them back into cold, hard, reality.

 

[tstarks33]

Isn't that what a lot of people are griping about? "It's too small." "It doesn't have the ports I need/want." "It doesn't have a built-in optical drive." "It doesn't have a big enough hard drive."

We're talking about sacrificing power for small size. If that sacrifice is one that you (or others) are not willing to make, no one is forcing you to. And if you insist on having an überpowerful machine, there are choices that should make you happy.

There's no justification required; neither you nor anyone else here is the boss of my bank account. Apple has made a new product which appeals to me (and others) and I've decided it will be a better choice for me than my current MBP.

Yes, it's the slowest machine Apple currently makes. Yes, this is not in dispute. And yes, thanks, I will enjoy my new MacBook Air.

I just fail to see why all the naysayers feel like they need to crap all over the MBA because of what they see to be its shortcomings. Honestly, it's like some of you are bitching because the Audi R8 doesn't seat 6 people; it's not meant to.

Hey buddy, my machine is not uberpowerful - I just have a black macbook! For the record, this is my first mac machine and I've had it for...almost a week now I was prepared to purchase ANY laptop Apple announced this month. However, for me, the MBA didn't cut it for many of the reasons covered in this thread and other threads. A particular issue I faced, and which you don't face, is that this is my only machine. As an only machine, the MBA doesn't cut it for me. For you, it would make more sense (though many of the other issues I have with the machine still exist) because it's not your only machine.

Sure, you wouldn't bitch that an Audi R8 doesn't seat 6 people, but wouldn't you bitch if it came with only a 120 horsepower engine or you couldn't change the tires unless you went to an Audi dealer (I know a great dealer in DC area if you need one)? I'd buy an R8 anyways, because I love Audi so much. Perhaps that's what's going on here.

 

[ctt1wbw]

Until the MBA has a proper graphics chip like the MBP, it will forever be "speed-challenged".

The Macbook Air has a better graphics card than my Dell Inspiron 1720. Does that make my Dell "speed-challenged"? It also has the same cpu.

 

[clayj]

A lot of it is simply backlash toward people who've started acting as if the MB/Ps are Terribly Heavy Laptops that were Impossible To Bear before the Macbook Air came along. I can't count the number of threads where people have started recommending MBAs to high schoolers looking for all-in-one college laptops under the pretext that "business professionals don't need optical drives". As long as MBA fanboys keep treating the MBA as the second coming, plenty of people will be only too happy to pull them back into cold, hard, reality.

Well, I don't see the MBA as any sort of "second coming", and I've tried to be realistic about what it will do well and what it will NOT do well. I'm not a fanboy by any means, but I do like the MBA.

Should everyone buy an MBA? Absolutely not. Why? Because, as has been pointed out repeatedly, it is missing a LOT of what you expect to find in a notebook: No built-in optical drive, no built-in Ethernet, no FireWire, only one USB port, small hard drive, etc. It is clearly not a machine which a typical person should have as their only computer.

But if you are like me and have taken a close look at what the MBA offers, and if you've determined that you don't need a lot of that stuff, then there is absolutely nothing wrong with the MBA. It eliminates a lot of components that are, for many people, unnecessary and which add unneeded weight and volume to the machine.

Was my MBP heavy before? Not really. But I will appreciate how much lighter my MBA will be, and a lot of the stuff my MBP had (optical drive, FireWire port, extra USB ports, etc.) will not be missed.

 

[AstrayCliche]

I say: don't knock it until you've actually spent time with it. Is this a Mac vs PC argument, or what?

 

[HLdan]

On a power-to-weight/volume basis? I thought I've heard it all...

One good thing about the MBA is listening to the crazy justifications its buyers tell themselves (and us), trying, apparently, to justify the cost.

Bottom line: MBA is the slowest computer apple sells. This is not in dispute. If the decreased size is enough to compensate for this fact, then enjoy your new macbook air If you just surf the net, any processor and hard drive would suffice anyways.

I think you need to go back to computers 101. Surfing the net is all the Air's power is capable of? Tell me what the current owners of the old Powerbook G4's are doing? I happen to have one with 1.0Ghz PPC CPU and 256k L2 Cache with a 60GB 4200 rpm HDD and I do music recording with Reason, movie editing with Final Cut Express and do a lot of Photoshop work as well and encoding of avi files on a daily basis.

Let's see, the Air is 1.6 or 1.8 Ghz Dual Core system, 80 GB 4200 rpm HDD and 4MB L2 Cache. Hmm, your right those specs don't seem to hold up to what my Powerbook is capable of, guess it's only good for web surfing.

 

[tstarks33]

I think you need to go back to computers 101. Surfing the net is all the Air's power is capable of? Tell me what the current owners of the old Powerbook G4's are doing? I happen to have one with 1.0Ghz PPC CPU and 256k L2 Cache with a 60GB 4200 rpm HDD and I do music recording with Reason, movie editing with Final Cut Express and do a lot of Photoshop work as well and encoding of avi files on a daily basis.

Let's see, the Air is 1.6 or 1.8 Ghz Dual Core system, 80 GB 4200 rpm HDD and 4MB L2 Cache. Hmm, your right those specs don't seem to hold up to what my Powerbook is capable of, guess it's only good for web surfing.

And you need to review your 3rd grade notes on reading comprehension. Can you please show me where I say that surfing the net is all the MBA is capable of? Please don't post again if you are going to just take someone's post and twist it around and read into it whatever you want.

 

[mashoutposse]

I totally understand the price premium for size. But that's just it - it's not THAT MUCH smaller than a MB to justify the extra cost, decreased features, and slower harddrive/proc. If we were talking about a 12 inch laptop, then I could get behind the price and specs. But at the same footprint as a macbook, I just can't get behind the product.

The MBA is 43% the size of an MB.

Concerning the footprint, the reality is that there are generally three sizes: pocket-size (iPhone), bigger than pocket-size but smaller than a typical sheet of paper (MBA and most ultraportables fit here), bigger than a typical sheet of paper.

If the unit can't fit in your pocket but is smaller than a typical folder, there is very little PRACTICAL difference between the various possible footprints. No matter what size it is, a bag will be required and a smaller footprint doesn't help since you still need a bag big enough to fit your papers. That's why Apple's approach of building the smallest computer with the biggest possible screen and keyboard within the "paper as the benchmark" footprint makes the most sense. Thin will definitely be noticeable here.

On a power-to-weight/volume basis? I thought I've heard it all...

One good thing about the MBA is listening to the crazy justifications its buyers tell themselves (and us), trying, apparently, to justify the cost.

Bottom line: MBA is the slowest computer apple sells. This is not in dispute. If the decreased size is enough to compensate for this fact, then enjoy your new macbook air If you just surf the net, any processor and hard drive would suffice anyways.

OK.

The Sony TZ is the slowest computer Sony makes.

The Toshiba R500 is the slowest computer Toshiba makes.

The Lenovo X300 is the slowest computer Lenovo makes.

And on and on and on. Note that none of the above models are in any way value priced, either. No "crazy justifications;" that is simply the nature of the beast!

 

[deezie]

compared to PowerPC iMac?

I have a 20" iMac G5, 2.0GHz PowerPC. How much slower should I expect the Macbook Air to be? Only programs I really need to use are iWork/Office, Matlab, and (hopefully) Starcraft 2.

 

[clayj]

I have a 20" iMac G5, 2.0GHz PowerPC. How much slower should I expect the Macbook Air to be? Only programs I really need to use are iWork/Office, Matlab, and (hopefully) Starcraft 2.

I think you should expect the MBA to be faster than the G5 iMac.

Does Starcraft 2 require direct access to the CD/DVD drive? Because that could be a problem.

 

[deezie]

Well that's refreshing to hear. From all the complaints about how miserably slow it is compared to the MB and what-have-you, I expected the MBA to be slower than my iMac.

As far as SC2 goes, Blizzard just released a patch (finally) that allows you to play SC1 w/o the CD. So I doubt they'll require the DVD to play SC2.

I just hope I'll be able to handle the MBA as my only computer for a few months (giving my iMac to my parents and buying a new 24" iMac this summer).

 

[kuwisdelu]

I have a 20" iMac G5, 2.0GHz PowerPC. How much slower should I expect the Macbook Air to be? Only programs I really need to use are iWork/Office, Matlab, and (hopefully) Starcraft 2.

How much RAM do you have? If it's less than the MBA's 2GB, then the MBA will probably feel a little faster to you. Other than that, I wouldn't think you'd notice too much of a difference except maybe with Starcraft*. In many of the benchmark tests, the MBA scored only slightly less than the current MacBooks, which have faster CPUs than your G5, so except for heavy disk writing, the MBA should feel at least as fast.

I'm assuming you got the standard disk HD. If you got the SSD, then the MBA will feel quite a bit faster than your G5.

*Correct me if I'm wrong, but I *think* Starcraft isn't a Universal Binary yet, so if it's only written for PowerPC, then that will keep it from running too well, if at all, on the MBA, due to the Intel chip rather than the PPC chip. Check up on that, since I could be completely wrong.

 

[butterfly0fdoom]

Does Starcraft 2 require direct access to the CD/DVD drive? Because that could be a problem.

I think the bigger question is will SC2 run on GMA?

As far as SC2 goes, Blizzard just released a patch (finally) that allows you to play SC1 w/o the CD. So I doubt they'll require the DVD to play SC2.

Where's this patch I hear of? I desires it.

 

[Consultant]

I'm not holding out a lot of hope for the SSD model to benchmark significantly faster in real-world tasks. OTOH, it would be funny to see what the "performance is everything" MBA-haters would have to say if the SSD benchmarked faster than their fat MBP machines. I might even put off my purchase to see the benchmarks, and perhaps the SSD premium will drop a bit.

SSD drives are typically much faster than fast desktop Raptor 10k drives. Think about that.

And for anyone who are in the poor house and cannot afford cool toys:
The price of MBA is on par with other laptops in the class (Cnn.com)

 

[deezie]

Where's this patch I hear of? I desires it.

Patch 1.15.2

 

[kockgunner]

Of course the air is apple's slowest computer. All their other computers are fast! When you look at all the HPs and Toshibas at best buy, only 1-2 computers even have a 2.0 ghz C2D (as oppsed to SR 2.2 ghz C2D on the macbooks). Back to the air, all the other manufacuters' midrange models have 1.6 ghz amd turions and they dont even have 2 ghz of RAM. So actually, apple's ultraportable stacks up pretty well with other "desktop replacement" laptops. Apple's in a whole other league.

 

[island]

My reason for getting the Air is that I want a small Aluminum Apple, not some cheap plastic hunk of garbage Macbook.

Just like some people pay a premium for the Black Macbook which makes no sense to some people right?

 

[QCassidy352]

Wow, I know there are two camps on this whole thing . . . but . . .

When it comes right down to it, there are a looooooooooot of users for whom the MBA will represent way MORE power than they need.

Take me, for example. I'm a doctor, I work in an academic setting. I go to national meetings and give lectures on stuff. (Yes, stuff. ) I use my laptop for, get this . . . email, web surfing, and Keynote/PowerPoint. Oooooooooh. I have a good friend who's a lawyer. Want to know what he does with his laptop? Email, websurfing, and word processing. Ooooooooooh, again.

/snip

GET REAL, folks.



Stuart

Excellent post.

No doubt about it, you get less for your money with the Air than with the MB.

OTOH, the same could be said about the iPod Nano vs. the Classic. And I don't see anyone making this complaint about the Nano.

The Air is simply the Nano of laptops. Nothing more, nothing less. It will have a market because of its limited size and weight compared to the MB.

Ditto.


I've been saying this for 2 weeks now, but I'm going to keep saying it as long as people keep complaining about the MBA - design is a feature. It's a feature you pay for on your house, your car, your furniture, your clothes, your ipods, and nearly everything else. Maybe the MBA's design isn't worth the tradeoffs to SOME people, but it clearly is to others.

In short... stop assuming that your needs are everyone's needs... and start realizing that design is a feature!

(and I say this as someone who won't buy a MBA because it wouldn't meet my needs... but that doesn't mean it's not great for people with different needs!)