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malu05a

macrumors member
Original poster
Oct 15, 2015
34
69
Just putting this out there in case someone else get this problem.
Today when i opened the lit on my Macbook Pro the touchID bar said "Try Again" even thought i had not tried loggin in. The whole touchbar was frozen so i had to restart the machine.
Once i restarted the machine all my touchID fingers was gone, not only on my account but all the accounts on the machine.

Have no idea why this happened.
 

maflynn

Moderator emeritus
May 3, 2009
69,097
36,962
There seem to be quite a few of them. :(
Indeed, though in this case, it may be preferable then having a hardware issue.

No knock on apple, but this isn't terribly surprising, because it is a gen 1 product. It will take time to shake out some of these things
 
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T'hain Esh Kelch

macrumors 603
Aug 5, 2001
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Indeed, though in this case, it may be preferable then having a hardware issue.

No knock on apple, but this isn't terribly surprising, because it is a gen 1 product. It will take time to shake out some of these things
Data loss is always a very bad thing, no matter what. Despite being a 1. gen. product, this shouldn't happen.
 
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Ma2k5

macrumors 68030
Dec 21, 2012
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Indeed, though in this case, it may be preferable then having a hardware issue.

No knock on apple, but this isn't terribly surprising, because it is a gen 1 product. It will take time to shake out some of these things

I've been thinking about it, and although it is a gen 1 product, something within me can't seem to help but wonder why are Apple products in the last couple of years, been so buggy? What happened to "It just works".

I work in tech companies developing products/software and obviously understand why bugs etc happen in the SDLC - but Apple, compared to say other manufacturers, have QA oh so damn easy. They are catering only a handful of hardware specs - while Windows or Android have to cater to thousands of variations, maybe tens of thousands when you consider all the different hardware specs available on laptops over the last few years.

Apple have a tiny set of products/configurations, they must have a lot of regression packs, but why are such obvious bugs appearing? And so many? New Iphone/Mac releases seem to require 2-3 generations before they are not annoyingly buggy. It has come to the point where I find Apple products more buggy than Windows/Android, or just as much, but why? To boot, a lot of the bugs are just using popular/native apps, it's not like I am saying "Why didn't they see there is a bug when playing this 2 year old game from the AppStore at a certain resolution".

If I was a betting man, I would bet that, a lot of these bugs people have been mentioning past couple of months, have all been logged in the software team at Apple, and they decided to release it anyway. I just find it difficult to believe they missed out this many bugs, especially all those graphical glitches and Touch-bar issues, Time Machine Back ups, compatibility with USB devices etc, which would have been heavily tested.

Not saying they are the only company that does it, but, for the premium they charge and having it so much easier than the competition, they should up their game.
 

maflynn

Moderator emeritus
May 3, 2009
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I've been thinking about it, and although it is a gen 1 product, something within me can't seem to help but wonder why are Apple products in the last couple of years, been so buggy? What happened to "It just works".

I've had gen 1 apple products since the PPC days, and even then there were always some little nagging bugs. I'd not say this is a new phenomenon just one that shows how difficult it is to rollout machines as complex as these

I find Apple products more buggy than Windows/Android
This is a different issue, imo. In OS X vs. Windows, I find the forced annual update that has to be released in the fall, to be a major reason. I think they foregone quality to meet an artificial date. MS has no problem pushing back a release date to get it right. They've been down that path themselves and I think for the most part learned their lesson.

As for android, I find iOS to be a much better product over Android, so I don't get that comparison.
 
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Ma2k5

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Dec 21, 2012
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I've had gen 1 apple products since the PPC days, and even then there were always some little nagging bugs. I'd not say this is a new phenomenon just one that shows how difficult it is to rollout machines as complex as these

I do feel there are always bugs, but it is more of me noticing very huge hard hitting bugs being far more prevalent in recent years. Do you feel that this is the case at all?


This is a different issue, imo. In OS X vs. Windows, I find the forced annual update that has to be released in the fall, to be a major reason. I think they foregone quality to meet an artificial date. MS has no problem pushing back a release date to get it right. They've been down that path themselves and I think for the most part learned their lesson.

As for android, I find iOS to be a much better product over Android, so I don't get that comparison.

I agree that they are forgoing quality to meet an artificial date, you could say I am arguing against them doing this, when people pay so much.

When I go back to my iPhone 4S days, I did find the iPhone was vastly more superior to Android at the time - I am not saying it had no bugs, but it wasn't "annoyingly" buggy, like I sometimes find my iPhones having owned the iPhone 6s and the 7.

I am not intending to move to Android, but I feel iPhones are generally as buggy as Android phones - I feel that the iPhone experience should be vastly superior (bug-free wise) compared to Android just on the basis that, it is much harder to solve bugs on Android due to how many phones it caters for. But if I was to use both today, I think I'd find them equally usable. I wasn't comparing them on a preference basis by the way, I prefer iOS at the moment hands down, I meant on a "just works" basis. I no longer feel iPhone "just works" any better than Android devices, which in my opinion, shouldn't be the case. It should trump it on this basis, while Android is suppose to trump iOS on flexibility.
 

maflynn

Moderator emeritus
May 3, 2009
69,097
36,962
Data loss is always a very bad thing, no matter what. Despite being a 1. gen. product, this shouldn't happen.
I'm not disagreeing, but I am saying its better to be software bug where it can be easily remedied. Hardware means sending it in for repair and waiting.
 

raqball

Contributor
Sep 11, 2016
2,270
9,513
Mine did this this morning as well.. 13" TB base..

Open lid and same message. Reboot >> TouchID gone.. I only have one account and one figerprint registered on the machine though..

I think this seals the deal for me.. Returning it for a 2015 as this sucker is just not ready for primetime...
 
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cmaier

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Jul 25, 2007
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Data loss is always a very bad thing, no matter what. Despite being a 1. gen. product, this shouldn't happen.

I suspect this particular data is designed to be lost. If the touchbar boot up goes awry it purposely flushes the contents of the secure store in case the problem is some sort of attack.
 

leman

macrumors P6
Oct 14, 2008
16,084
13,209
Data loss is always a very bad thing, no matter what. Despite being a 1. gen. product, this shouldn't happen.

Its hardly your common data loss. The secure enclave is not designed to be retrievable data storage, nor does it store any unrecoverable data. Its essentially cache of identification information. In case of system malfunction, this information MUST be purged before there is even the slightest chance that this information could get extracted.
 
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Hankster

macrumors 68020
Jan 30, 2008
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Indeed, though in this case, it may be preferable then having a hardware issue.

No knock on apple, but this isn't terribly surprising, because it is a gen 1 product. It will take time to shake out some of these things

Very true. Same goes for cars, new devices, etc. There's always bugs to work out. Plus, the new MBP models are so thin there is less room for the hardware. This will lead to more issues.
 

Ries

macrumors 68020
Apr 21, 2007
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Its hardly your common data loss. The secure enclave is not designed to be retrievable data storage, nor does it store any unrecoverable data. Its essentially cache of identification information. In case of system malfunction, this information MUST be purged before there is even the slightest chance that this information could get extracted.

The secure enclave stores the encryption keys for the file by file encryption on iOS. Lose that and you data is gone. Not sure how much is in Mac OSX, but if anything is stored, good luck.

https://www.mikeash.com/pyblog/friday-qa-2016-02-19-what-is-the-secure-enclave.html

"The Secure Enclave performs all key management for encrypted files. File encryption applies to nearly all user data. Most system apps use it, and third party apps all use it by default if running on iOS 7 or later. Each encrypted file has a unique key, which is in turn encrypted with another key derived from the device UID and the user's passcode. The main CPU can't read encrypted files on its own. It must request the file's keys from the Secure Enclave, which in turn is unable to provide them without the user's passcode."
 

cmaier

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Jul 25, 2007
25,407
33,436
California
The secure enclave stores the encryption keys for the file by file encryption on iOS. Lose that and you data is gone. Not sure how much is in Mac OSX, but if anything is stored, good luck.

https://www.mikeash.com/pyblog/friday-qa-2016-02-19-what-is-the-secure-enclave.html

"The Secure Enclave performs all key management for encrypted files. File encryption applies to nearly all user data. Most system apps use it, and third party apps all use it by default if running on iOS 7 or later. Each encrypted file has a unique key, which is in turn encrypted with another key derived from the device UID and the user's passcode. The main CPU can't read encrypted files on its own. It must request the file's keys from the Secure Enclave, which in turn is unable to provide them without the user's passcode."

No. the secure enclave is only related to touchbar functions (e.g. touch id) on the mac. The file keys are handled by the intel cpu, not the arm processor.
 

enzo thecat

macrumors 6502
Apr 7, 2010
311
151
Midwest USA
I think this means you are supposed to immediately start a thread asking other members whether you should return it. We can count how many people bitch about the price and say for $$$$, it should be 10000% perfect.
 

malu05a

macrumors member
Original poster
Oct 15, 2015
34
69
So, first time booting up after loosing my fingerID's.
The screen is filled with white bars at the login screen, 2 sec later i get a BSOD (black screen of death).
I hard restart the machine, login, then the screen goes black and stays black.
I unplug the power coord and the screen goes back to normal again.

Ill report back if anything interesting happens =)
 

Balaamsdonkey

macrumors 6502
Jun 24, 2008
289
60
Washington
Data loss is always a very bad thing, no matter what. Despite being a 1. gen. product, this shouldn't happen.
I'd rather the fingerprints disappear than have this result in a security problem
[doublepost=1481228153][/doublepost]
One of the dumbest comments I've seen on here lately..

And you certainly added to the conversation with your own, didn't you?
 

raqball

Contributor
Sep 11, 2016
2,270
9,513
And you certainly added to the conversation with your own, didn't you?

Sometimes it's hard to bypass stupidity.. And you realize you just did the exact same thing you flung at me right?

Anyways, it's like a bad car wreck on the freeway, you don't want to look but you do it anyways...

Yeah I know I should not have posted but...... LOL
 

cmaier

Suspended
Jul 25, 2007
25,407
33,436
California
So, first time booting up after loosing my fingerID's.
The screen is filled with white bars at the login screen, 2 sec later i get a BSOD (black screen of death).
I hard restart the machine, login, then the screen goes black and stays black.
I unplug the power coord and the screen goes back to normal again.

Ill report back if anything interesting happens =)

I've had an issue a couple times where boot takes a long time, apparently because the touchbar boot is taking a long time because of some sort of network connectivity issue. Looks like there is a network access, and that needs to complete or time-out. After that, the touchbar is booted, and after that the main machine is booted.
 

raqball

Contributor
Sep 11, 2016
2,270
9,513
So, first time booting up after loosing my fingerID's.
The screen is filled with white bars at the login screen, 2 sec later i get a BSOD (black screen of death).
I hard restart the machine, login, then the screen goes black and stays black.
I unplug the power coord and the screen goes back to normal again.

Ill report back if anything interesting happens =)

Mine did not do that.. All I had to do was log back in after another boot and sign in with password. In settings my touchID was cleared out though and Apple Pay gone as well..
 

malu05a

macrumors member
Original poster
Oct 15, 2015
34
69
So, first time booting up after loosing my fingerID's.
The screen is filled with white bars at the login screen, 2 sec later i get a BSOD (black screen of death).
I hard restart the machine, login, then the screen goes black and stays black.
I unplug the power coord and the screen goes back to normal again.

Ill report back if anything interesting happens =)
the video version
..
 
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raqball

Contributor
Sep 11, 2016
2,270
9,513
Hence, my post. Hypocrite much?

Only when reading foaming at mouth fanatical fanboy posts.....

The OP came here with a legitimate issue that I also have experienced and you can't help yourself from injecting complete and utter nonsense into his / her thread?

Give it a rest dude.. Your over the top fanboy'ism is getting ridiculous..
 
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