Your own math examples show these statements to be incorrect.
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Trump Responds to Apple Keeping Diversity Policies
- Thread starter MacRumors
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
Your own math examples show these statements to be incorrect.
Sigh. A doctorate in math and you make statements like "You cannot have an average where the majority is WAY above it." That's nonsense. (For example, [100,100,100, -1000000])
And it has nothing to do with the data I was referring to.
As I've posted multiple times, on average, minorities make significantly less than white males with the same qualifications. For many different reasons, some legal (lack of opportunities) and some illegal (discrimination), that's what the data shows. That's what good DEI programs seek to address.
That certainly doesn't mean that the the majority of companies are doing something illegal, because the illegal discrimination can be concentrated in a minority of companies.
Last edited:
Why do companies love their racist DEI policies so much?
It's no wonder Apple tech is lacking.
It's no wonder Apple tech is lacking.
Can we get back on topic folks? This thread is entitled "Trump Responds to Apple Keeping Diversity Policies"
I'm as guilty as anyone because I have strong opinions. I'm also well aware of foreign interference in US- and our allies' politics using the internet.
Maybe everyone posting here should state where they actually live? I live in upstate NY USA, how about you? Thank you.
I'm as guilty as anyone because I have strong opinions. I'm also well aware of foreign interference in US- and our allies' politics using the internet.
Maybe everyone posting here should state where they actually live? I live in upstate NY USA, how about you? Thank you.
Last edited:
This is a binary situation, not something that has a value between int min max for goodness sake. They are either doing illegal activity or not. So yes, in a series of 1s and 0s, yes it has to be roughly 50% of them having 1s. Which I even explained in my post.
(1+0+0+0+0+0+0+1+0)/9 = 0.22
Only two here show Yes they perform illegal activity. But you would not call that "On average those companies are performing illegal activities". Its a connection from math to english, and it is about roughly ~50% that allows you to make that connection in proper discussions. Believe me, I was SEVERELY called out in a presentation for stating something that was occurring on average when it clearly was not because it was happening only 20% of the time. Almost lost my job which is why I am so passionate about this.
I acknowledge your example, again this isn't math class. Of course there will be examples that do not fit. But come on, in the context of this argument and closer to a binary issue that should not even come into play in this topic at all. When you are discussing in terms of something happening X on average, that is mostly targeted to occurring 50% or more. Especially when you are discussing businesses actions or issues. As I said, I almost lost my job for stating and advocating something that was not true. "BUT MUH MATH!!!!" You need to learn how to translate it. Not have several 100 values and a negative 1 million....that is just ridiculous. If you have such an example you must perform more analysis and math to determine which numbers are doing more of the "heavy lifting".....known as contributions and influence scores.
Let's get back on topic....provide proof that on average companies are performing these illegal activities to where they need DEI programs.....You have yet to post this but keep attacking my math knowledge. Typical....
Last edited:
Yes, don't know why people feel the need to attack someones Math knowledge instead of providing the proof I have asked for in about 4 posts now....
I am in Wisconsin USA.
Again, you’re just making stuff up, while ignoring the clear explanation of the data I was referring to.
How about we just move on because I am not. I will ask a 5th damn time:
Let's get back on topic....provide proof that on average companies are performing these illegal activities to where they need DEI programs.....You have yet to post this but keep attacking my math knowledge. We could be done with this damn conversation if you have the proof I am asking for.....
Last edited:
You are. You’re pretending that I am referring to data on the number of companies with illegal hiring practices. However, I clearly explained that the average I was referring to was the average compensation for minorities vs white men with similar qualifications.
I’ve already posted evidence multiple times in this thread. Here is an example.
Wages Are Unequal Between White and Black Men Even When Other Factors Are Comparable
White men are paid more than black men, even when they share similar educational backgrounds and are from affluent families, according to a new report from the Equality in Opportunity Project.
www.shrm.org
Okay, now where in that study did it list that this is happening on average? I did not see any indication of "We polled 1000 or 10,000 or .... companies and they ALL are doing this" type of data set. They could have just found two companies that did this.You are. You’re pretending that I am referring to data on the number of companies with illegal hiring practices. However, I clearly explained that the average I was referring to was the average compensation for minorities vs white men with similar qualifications.
I’ve already posted evidence multiple times in this thread. Here is an example.
Wages Are Unequal Between White and Black Men Even When Other Factors Are Comparable
White men are paid more than black men, even when they share similar educational backgrounds and are from affluent families, according to a new report from the Equality in Opportunity Project.
Furthermore back on topic, where is the evidence that Apple WAS doing this where they need their DEI program to remain?
Again it is strictly illegal since Civil Rights Act of 1964 to do this type of action. Such a DEI program is not necessary. Just fire the individuals, back-pay the person's raises so they are compensated fairly and when you hire a replacement properly train them (AS I WAS 20+ years ago....) on how to properly do this.
I never claimed any of that. Again I clearly stated the average I was referring to.
You’re so close to getting it here. Identifying discrimination and properly training hiring managers is DEI. You seem confused by the fact that it has a different name than 20 years ago.
Not it isn't, DEI is something different. We don't need DEI as this type of action is already illegal. 20+ years ago it wasn't labeled DEI or come with any of the extra fluff that DEI carries today.
Even if that were true, so is Trump's "Merit System" approach....if you are a minority and are doing an excellent job, guess what you get properly compensated since your work speaks to it. Merit based doesn't discriminate either.
There is the root of the problem. What is your definition of DEI?
I already posted a source showing that this isn’t happening on average.
I will play the average game too.....my clients on average ever since adopting the DEI programs within the last four years required me as part of that program to put pronouns in my signature, some of them even updated my name in Active Directory to include them and updated my outbound name from Outlook to include them in my name.
Again, ever since DEI came up in the last 4 years some of my friends and colleagues that are hiring managers told me their quotas. They would still interview white males to give the impression they don't have quotas but they would never hire them or advance them to second+ interviews.
As I said in my original post on this, I have seen a lot of the bad of DEI and not much of the good. And it doesn't make any sense as since 1964 this should be a requirement anyway.
There you go. Anecdotes over data. And choosing to ignore whatever doesn’t fit your argument. The MAGA playbook.
I hate Trump. I didn't want to vote for him....but this stuff just pushed me over the edge. You want evidence? Look at all the big company's employees on Twitter (well most of them deleted it now since Trump). Suddenly over the last four years have been pronouns this pronouns that.
Heck even Bernie Sanders said the Democrats did it to themselves and I would have voted Democrat.
Obviously there is no hard evidence because even my friends/colleagues are TERRIFIED that what they told me gets back to them.
Again. Anecdotes over data.
As I told you at the start of our conversation, I’m against quota-based affirmative action. But, again, you’re doing the thing you complained about in your original post where you are putting two extremes as the only options.
My whole point is there does not need to exist a DEI program. It is already illegal to do such acts since the 1960s.
I’m well aware. But that’s based on a faulty understanding of what DEI programs do and a lack of understanding of the data that shows why they are needed.
Again, you yourself acknowledged the need to identify discrimination and properly train hiring managers. Which is part of DEI.
Maga propaganda, a.k.a. lies, unless you can provide verifiable sources.
A peak behind the DEI curtain
https://glennloury.substack.com/p/a...are&triggerShare=true&isFreemail=true&r=gz1jf
https://glennloury.substack.com/p/a...are&triggerShare=true&isFreemail=true&r=gz1jf
It's a very exciting time in our country to know that we have a president who is actually working to improve our country in so many ways. I'm glad that Apple is on board and will contribute greatly to this effort.