Sidebar Sidebar
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

TSA Source: Armed Agent Slips Past DFW Body Scanner

C

codymac

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Jun 12, 2009
449
2
Wanted to bring this up since I haven't seen it in the national news yet. It's relevant to everyone since it's one of the busiest airports in the world.

It doesn't matter how many millions we spend on security - when we pay $8/hr. for security, we get $8/hr. security.

http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local-be...gh-DFW-Body-Scanner-With-a-Gun-116497568.html

Feb. 18, 2011

NBCDFW said:
An undercover TSA agent was able to get through security at Dallas/Fort Worth International Airport with a handgun during testing of the enhanced-imaging body scanners, according to a high-ranking, inside source at the Transportation Security Administration.

The source said the undercover agent carried a pistol in her undergarments when she put the body scanners to the test. The officer successfully made it through the airport's body scanners every time she tried, the source said.

"In this case, where they had a test, and it was just a dismal failure as I'm told," said Larry Wansley, former head of security at American Airlines. "As I've heard (it), you got a problem, especially with a fire arm."

Wansley said covert testing by the TSA is commonplace -- although failing should be rare.

The TSA insider who blew the whistle on the test also said that none of the TSA agents who failed to spot the gun on the scanned image were disciplined. The source said the agents continue to work the body scanners today.

Wansley said that is a problem.

"This was only a test, but it's critically important that you do something, because if that person failed in the real environment, then you have a problem," he said.

The TSA did not deny that the tests took place or the what the results were.

The agency would only provide the following statement:

"Our security officers are one of the most heavily tested federal workforces in the nation. We regularly test our officers in a variety of ways to ensure the effectiveness of our technology, security measures and the overall layered system. For security reasons, we do not publicize or comment on the results of covert tests, however advanced imaging technology is an effective tool to detect both metallic and nonmetallic items hidden on passengers."

TSA agents who spoke to a reporter agreed that the body-imaging scanners are effective -- but only if the officers monitoring them are paying attention.
Click to expand...
 
This is a common pyschology problem.

Looking for something which appears in an incredibly small percentage of scans results in low(er) accuracy.

(you have to keep in mind it's different to look at one scan, and miss a gun, rather than looking at thousands with one gun and missing it)

Our mind just does not do this well.
 
I've read several times that the TSA fails to detect 40% of the weapons and simulated bombs used in these tests. Feel secure now?

Looking through the job listings for TSA screeners, it seems the pay for new hires ranges from $13.96/hr to over $17/hr depending on location.
 
LynnW said:
Looking through the job listings for TSA screeners, it seems the pay for new hires ranges from $13.96/hr to over $17/hr depending on location.
Click to expand...

What does this have to do with anything? The real problem is the expectation that people staring at screens for hours on end is ineffective. Too bad profiling is politically incorrect. Israel does it, and it works pretty well for them.
 
miles01110 said:
What does this have to do with anything? The real problem is the expectation that people staring at screens for hours on end is ineffective. Too bad profiling is politically incorrect. Israel does it, and it works pretty well for them.
Click to expand...

The OP wrote that the TSA screeners are paid $8/hr. That is not true.

I agree with you about profiling. I doubt that the four year old girl or the elderly Japanese woman in a wheelchair I saw pulled aside for full body searches were really much of a threat to airline safety.
 
codymac said:
They miss guns all the time?
Click to expand...

yes, undercover FBI and similar have been able to get guns through security consistently since 9/11. All the security at airports is for show, to make the public feel like the government is on top of the threat.
 
QCassidy352 said:
yes, undercover FBI and similar have been able to get guns through security consistently since 9/11. All the security at airports is for show, to make the public feel like the government is on top of the threat.
Click to expand...

And if they screw-up once in a while, Corporate America just puts it down to the cost of doing business.
 
Loaded Handgun Found At Calgary Airport Screening

Yet certain Congress-people (Jeff Duncan, for example) still believe that Canadian security is lax, and is a threat to the US.

I'm not concerned about the number of weapons that can slip by security. Nobody believes that the system is 100% foolproof. The point is that members of a group that are trying to smuggle a weapon through security need to believe that the risk of getting caught is high enough that they get nervous. Nervous people make mistakes. Nervous people talk.

That nervousness will show at the security screening, or at least they will be worried their nevousness will evident - which causes more stress. And/Or members will be worried enough about being caught that during the planning phase that they will talk to somebody about their stress. I'm convinced that the various security agencies are close to, or actually involved in, just about every domestic group thinking about terrorism.
 
LynnW said:
The OP wrote that the TSA screeners are paid $8/hr. That is not true.
Click to expand...

You're right, I rounded down.

$17083 is the bottom grade, based on a 1920 hour year, that's $8.90/hr.

Got any links regarding effectiveness? Other stories about how many guns are missed, etc.? It's fine if it's "BFD, it's common," please show me.

Seems to me we did a better job of it before we started relying on the scanners.

ender land said:
This is a common pyschology problem.

Looking for something which appears in an incredibly small percentage of scans results in low(er) accuracy.

(you have to keep in mind it's different to look at one scan, and miss a gun, rather than looking at thousands with one gun and missing it)

Our mind just does not do this well.
Click to expand...

Seems like it would make more sense to implement something like the facial recognition systems in Vegas.
 
Last edited:
Besides being invasive, there's really no need for security beyond metal detectors-- everything else fails miserably due to human error in the end.

I'm not quite sure why profiling is so taboo however, if they're already going to see me naked, it's really not a big issue in my opinion.
 
darkplanets said:
Besides being invasive, there's really no need for security beyond metal detectors-- everything else fails miserably due to human error in the end.
Click to expand...

Ceramic weapons are becoming more main-stream now.

darkplanets said:
I'm not quite sure why profiling is so taboo however, if they're already going to see me naked, it's really not a big issue in my opinion.
Click to expand...

This is a political issue, and has nothing to do with security.

As already stated here, Israel cares not for PC, instead opting for actual results.
 
Wow to everyone saying "Scanning is ineffective" you are 100% wrong. Its obvious most people here have never flown in and out of hostile countries before. You'd be amazed some of the things you see confiscated.

If just one disaster is prevented by scanning its all worth it. For those who think its not imagine if it was your loved ones on the plane where the disaster was prevented.

Sure the TSA is far from perfect but I'm glad they are doing what they are doing. Its better than nothing and definitely acts as a deterrent.
 
chrono1081 said:
Wow to everyone saying "Scanning is ineffective" you are 100% wrong. Its obvious most people here have never flown in and out of hostile countries before. You'd be amazed some of the things you see confiscated.

If just one disaster is prevented by scanning its all worth it. For those who think its not imagine if it was your loved ones on the plane where the disaster was prevented.

Sure the TSA is far from perfect but I'm glad they are doing what they are doing. Its better than nothing and definitely acts as a deterrent.
Click to expand...

I don't actually disagree with the first and third paragraphs, and therefore - I think - the main argument of the post. But the "If just one ... " argument always gets my teeth grinding.

By this logic you are saying that: Everyone flying (including you and your loved ones) should be subjected to full body-cavity search, strapped into a strait-jacket, and then sedated before flying - because it can be proven that at least one of the several past incidents would have been prevented if the passengers had been searched, tied, and gagged before hand....

That "Just one .... " argument can be extended beyond flying. Cars should not be able to move faster than 20 km/h - to prevent a single loved one dying in a car crash. All citizens should give up privacy rights to the security services to prevent just one criminal act against a loved one.... etc etc

I agree that nothing is foolproof, TSA searched included. That a mostly effective security measure, in this case, is better than none. But that "Just One ... " point doesn't do the rest of your message justice.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.
Top Bottom
Back