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TSMC Expected to Begin 3nm Chip Production in Late 2022 Ahead of First M3 Macs

Freeangel1 said:
This may be the LAST and GREATEST chip.
I really doubt they can make a 2nm or 1nm chip that small and with lots of processing power.

The future from here is more cores.
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Why? They said that when we hit 1 micron, too. You can go well beyond 1nm by changing the gate structure, no problem. It’s just a matter of time.
 
Flight Plan said:
Thank you for the lesson in symbology. But how do I type that? No, don't bother; because I'm not going to start typing it. And neither will 98.9% of MacRumor people.
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Since you are half interested, just press and hold the capital A key on an iPad. A world of exotic characters beyond the experience of a mall rat awaits you!
 
gsmornot said:
It seems each year this is reduced by 1. Once they do hit 1nm what happens next. I know its not zero, it must become a decimal of the size or is there a smaller unit of measure to switch to. Must be option two now that I type it out.
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Eventually they will reach the classical limit and have to account for quantum effects.
 
StupidOpinion said:
so some of you are saying that the M2 is just a minor upgrade over the M1 and that the M3 is the "real" upgrade?
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Yes, that is the conclusion I have come to after reading all the press and reviews about the upcoming M2 chips. M2 seems to be a relatively minor performance/speed bump, while the M3 chips will get the 3nm process to take advantage (theoretically) of lower thermal benefits, more transistors, and increased speed/performance.
 
LV426 said:
Since you are half interested, just press and hold the capital A key on an iPad. A world of exotic characters beyond the experience of a mall rat awaits you!
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Thank you.

But I only use an iPad about 15% of the time to write in forums or emails. 85% is on a Windows PC, although I do have an M1 Max MBP coming to live with me in a couple months...
 
adamw said:
Yes, that is the conclusion I have come to after reading all the press and reviews about the upcoming M2 chips. M2 seems to be a relatively minor performance/speed bump, while the M3 chips will get the 3nm process to take advantage (theoretically) of lower thermal benefits, more transistors, and increased speed/performance.
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M1, M2, M3, M1X, these are just model numbers. Everybody is so damned fixated on them as if they mean something outside of being a name that we can use when referring to them. Apple could have just decided to call them "Tom", "Dick", and "Harry".

And in fact, right now only Tom exists today. Although he has two clones with bionic improvements: Tom Pro and Tom Max. ;) Another way to think of it is that we have Tom (M1). Mary (M1Pro). And Sonic (M1Max). Or pick Larry, Curly, and Moe if you like. Or Ricky, Ethel, and Fred.

They. are. just. names.
 
adamw said:
I guess I will skip buying any more M1 and M2 (including Pro and Max variants) and wait until M3 and M3 Pro, Max, or Quadro/Quattro Macs appear. It seems that the 3nm die-shrink will be necessary for the next major version of ultimate performance to be unleashed. M2 seems like a minor speed bump to me.
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I think this is the correct time to buy one, but incase you Mac is running strong then it makes sense to wait for proper 2nd or 3rd gen silicon. But if you Mac is aged out already then this is the right time, as it will give 3-4 years of easy mileage and by then M-series would've matured well enough.
 
adamw said:
Yes, that is the conclusion I have come to after reading all the press and reviews about the upcoming M2 chips. M2 seems to be a relatively minor performance/speed bump, while the M3 chips will get the 3nm process to take advantage (theoretically) of lower thermal benefits, more transistors, and increased speed/performance.
Click to expand...
after some time to think about it. i think the m1 pro/max may be a decent chips to buy from now until the we get closer to the next pro/max chips. we already know that apple is willing to charge $200 for 2 extra CPU cores. going from 10 cores to the possibly 40 cores that was said in that post, would possibly cost $6000 if they keep the price linear. even if it they decided to make it cheaper or not increase the price by linear amounts, at best, it'll only be half the price which would be $3000 which is still a ton on top of whatever other components you plan on getting. anyone who already NEEDS this kind of horsepower would already have bought the mac pro or a PC workstation. so it is in my opinion that if anyone wants a pretty fast mac computer with the intention to use for many years without having to upgrade, a 32gb RAM m1 pro/max is the way to go.
 
gingaman said:
I thought angstroms were a non-SI unit, hence I gravitated towards the use of pm. What do I know last time I did any design it was in μm

:-D
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Intel uses mils. VLSI designers use lots of non-SI units. We also use mhos instead of siemens. We don’t exactly take direction from some Unit Pope in france.
 
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I think I’m going to upgrade my 2019 5K iMac and 2019 16” MacBook Pro with a single M3 Max 14” MacBook Pro with a couple of those Mini LED Apple displays.
 
JPack said:
It's pretty clear that TSMC is starting to slip as they usually begin production of new major nodes in Q2.
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Could it not be due to other factors such as the increasing difficulty in going to ever smaller sizes?
Or the availability of key components from other suppliers because of the pandemic?
I would not be too quick to judge TSMC
 
Jarutais said:
The good thing of the Intel era was that you could buy a Macbook Pro and use it for at least 5 good years before it became sluggish and you get a new one… On Apple Silicon I expect that generations will become outdated faster like on iPhone
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Ha! The reason that the older Intel chips never felt sluggish is because Intel could only barely improve performance from one generation to the next! That's why my 2015 MBP was fine compared to the touch bar versions.

Hopefully, that won't be the case with Apple Silicon, and we'll want to upgrade for the perf.
 
gsmornot said:
It seems each year this is reduced by 1. Once they do hit 1nm what happens next. I know its not zero, it must become a decimal of the size or is there a smaller unit of measure to switch to. Must be option two now that I type it out.
Click to expand...
The 386 and 486 saw a similar transition from micrometers (µm) to nanometers, going from 1.5µm to under 0.8µm (or 1500nm to 800nm).

I used Macs back then but can't find the data for 68030 node sizes.

If they can get a node to work well under 2-3nm without bumping into atomic-level issues, we'll start seeing listings in picometers.
 
Eric_WVGG said:
Back in the nineties and early 2000’s, it seemed uncommon for a laptop to be useful for more than about two years. The rate of change was such that anything became unusable within that period, and often didn't even have the necessary specs to run new software.
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Even if that were true, how did the old software suddenly become unusable?
 
cmaier said:
Why? They said that when we hit 1 micron, too. You can go well beyond 1nm by changing the gate structure, no problem. It’s just a matter of time.
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Remember, just as the current naming.
They can "SAY" is any size in their marketing.
What things really are, and what they are called Unfortunaly have parted ways in recent years :(
 
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