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IMHO, it’s a **** job with **** pay. Giving a buck to someone is just good karma in my book. Rich people tend to be worse. Can spend god knows how much on all night babysitting, dinner and room at fancy NYC hotel and can’t give the driver three dollars? These people are gonna tip waiter and bartenders all weekends.

Occasionally, when I was around after my mother fell ill, I would stand in for her on the 'collection day' (registered with the police and local authorities and perfectly legal) of certain charities she used to give time to, (these were usually charities raising money for cancer or cardiac, or women's shelters, or rape crisis stuff, or charities that worked with the homeless) and I was very struck by the inverse ratio of the better dressed an individual - especially male - the less likely it was that they would contribute anything whatsoever.

In my experience, women with families tended to be very generous (often sending the children with the money - children who were then imbued by the responsibility of the occasion and gravely walking over to me to donate), as were students, who generously donated time and money.

Young working people, and well dressed people of both genders - but, above all, middle aged well dressed men - rarely gave anything. It was an interesting experience to observe.
 
Must say I wouldn't take that job unless I were just about out of food and short on the rent too. It has the makings of a completely thankless job, and there appears to be a fair amount of churn. Using one's own vehicle for the deliveries... ugh.

I just don't see where the money is to be made for the drivers. I've used delivery services like that exactly twice:

1. I used DoorDash to have something delivered to my hotel when I was traveling for work. Weather was crap, and I didn't feel like going out. The restaurant was 20 minutes from my hotel. So this person had to drive from wherever he was, go pick up my food (which he may had to wait for), then drive 20 minutes in cold, rainy weather to my hotel, wait at the front desk to get a key for the elevator, and come up to my room (to be fair, if he called, I would've gladly met him in the lobby). I tipped him 5 bucks. The delivery fee was like $2 or $3 - waived since I was a first time user, but let's say DoorDash eats that, and gives every penny of that to the driver (which I doubt since they still need to make money). That's, at best, $8 for the driver for something which probably took the better part of an hour. I mean, it's above minimum wage, but barely.

2. I purchased something from the Apple Store, and opted to pay $9 to have it delivered via Postmates. When you buy something through the Apple Store app for same day delivery, you don't have an option to tip, so I didn't (I never have cash on me). Again, I assume Postmates takes a cut, so the driver gets less than $9. For that less than $9, they had to drive from wherever they were to the mall, find a parking spot (which can be a 20 minute affair on a Saturday afternoon, which this was), walk to the Apple Store which is nowhere near the entrance, wait in line to get my stuff, then drive to my house, which is another 15 minutes. All in all, I bet the Postmates driver spent more than an hour of their time from the second they accepted my order until when they handed it to me at my front door. For less than $9.

People think that because they already have a car, anything they make doing these side hustles is all extra money, but they're not taking into account gas, wear and tear, and extra car insurance which they're supposed to have since they're driving for business purposes. And since I think they're all considered independent contractors, and aren't having taxes deducted from their pay, they're going to be in for a huge shock in April.

I can't help but think that if you're about out of food and short on rent, you'd be better off working for minimum wage at a fast food restaurant. Your take home pay is lower, but you're not spending money on gas and vehicle maintenance.
 
I can't help but think that if you're about out of food and short on rent, you'd be better off working for minimum wage at a fast food restaurant. Your take home pay is lower, but you're not spending money on gas and vehicle maintenance.

There may be more to this matter than simply income, or money earned.

Perhaps some individuals prefer being 'independent' and autonomous; some people find nine-to-five (or clocked regimes) and rigid hierarchies in a work setting - very tedious and difficult.
 
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I can't help but think that if you're about out of food and short on rent, you'd be better off working for minimum wage at a fast food restaurant. Your take home pay is lower, but you're not spending money on gas and vehicle maintenance.

It's the kind of thing Instacart is having to wrestle with to keep the churn down, I am sure. They've been trying to keep their bottom line in mind but in tweaking stuff like how they pay, and service fee, and customer demand for a narrow "Scheduled delivery" time, they tried to monkey around with how they make the employees "flexible hours" less flexible... and ran into some stone walls I think. For awhile here there appeared to be a labor shortage, they didn't announce suspension of service but for two weeks all the delivery options were greyed out on the checkout menu, meaning you could not check out your order. So either a labor issue or a contractual issue with the stores serving the area after some trial period by the stores had ended, who knows. It caused grumbles by people who had liked the service meanwhile.

There are some people around here, say students and ag workers, who likely want to be able to make a few bucks for half a day in between studies and fixing fence posts or whatever, but when the company says yeah it's flexible but... flexible, but... so now maybe you gotta commit to two hours of sitting in a parking lot in your pickup truck during either the morning or afternoon, stuff like that. It starts to sound less like a quick way to make a buck if four people commit and only two orders come in then. You could be painting the doors on the barn before it rains but you're in a pickup in the sun on the asphalt outside a warehouse club surfing the net on a dicey connection to your phone... thinking about the last delivery you made where the guy tipped you zero because i dunno, it's thursday before payday same as you... ?

Personally I hope the store deliveries do become more competitive and eventually some of these outfits like Instacart are probably going to have to get real about the vehicle thing. In essence they are competing with UPS and FedEX drivers for Amazon and Walmart (who also deliver groceries to rural areas, just not perishables).

Soon it will be supermarkets in the nearby towns realizing they are losing money to Instacart next city over but if they delivered their own stuff in township by getting a couple trucks and promoting some baggers to shoppers and cart boys to drivers... and making the markup not quite like Instacart's...

It's happening already around here to some extent, and where they don't deliver, they do have online ordering and when you show up they bring your stuff to the car and load it in... so the competition is going to put pressure on the Instacart and similar, as well as on the other local retail grocery competitors. Eventually it's a win for at least the customers and the shopper/drivers but managing those middlemen as startups must be a rocky horror show.

As far as tipping, that becomes a wage issue, doesn't it. Of course it does. Instacart knows people are cheapskates so they put a service fee and a default tip and allow you as customer to monkey with the tip (even for awhile after delivery can change it). So but people are still cheapskates. Workers quit behind zero tips and driving in traffic or over a mountain in winter. Before they quit they get grouchy and sloppy on the job and the customers revolt.

So eventually the company has to let the shopper/driver have more of the service fee.. or pay them more to begin with as base pay, or build more tip into the service fee and not let the customer mess with it, or take the service fee out of a hiked set of subscriber options for how customer wants to pay for deliveries, by the each or monthly or annually... could go nuts juggling the what-ifs, eh?

But, bottom line there's no free lunch for a middleman, and trying to rip off the laborers to cover that lunch tab can generate backlash from both customers and workers. That goes for the ride-providing companies and the shop/deliver outfits as well.
 
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I don't use uber ... however, when I was a young boy, I used to work for a grocery store packing groceries and helping folks load them into their cars... I quickly noticed a difference in the personalities of those who gave me 10-25 cents for lugging their groceries into their cars to those who wouldn't even say thank you.

I learned early about what type of person I wanted to be... I always tip.

I also like to give money to people who are homeless and not actively panhandling.

There's just a good feeling when I give a few bucks to someone sitting outside a restaurant and see them go straight inside and get something to eat as soon as I give them the money.
 
This is all why I am implacably opposed to the concept of internships.

I understand what you mean, but I'd like to offer another point of view. It is from my own personal experience and obviously does not cover all types of internships.

I've been involved in internship programs in three very different roles--as an intern myself, as an employee working with interns, and as a political constituent.

As an intern, during my last two quarters of class before graduating from University, I worked a telecommunications company. The company accepted that school comes first--my work schedule would alter as much needed and as often as needed for me to attend to school classes and have study time. They also trained me on tools that I'd need to do my work, which was paid time, and which was also education that the University accepted as course credit. The university worked with the employer to ensure that the training was for tools and topics similar to those that I would have learned in class. The cherry on top is that during the internship they offered me a full time position to start after I graduated with no break in employment, and with all benefits and seniority back-dated to the start of my internship as if I had always been a full-time employee. It was also a much higher salary than other companies offered me, I assume because this company already knew I was a dedicated worker and was already trained on their specific tools, whereas I was an unknown greenhorn to everyone else.

It was an enormously positive experience for me, and beneficial to all parties involved. The school got to boost their job placement stats and freed up a seat on campus for any classes I would have been in. The employer got labor, a chance to "test drive" someone without full time commitment, and eventually they got a full-time employee they liked. I had a job that paid me about three times more than what most typical hourly part-time jobs would, I earned work experience in my chosen field, I received paid training that counted as course credit, and I got a great full time job right out of school.

As an employee (at a different company), I observed that we hired interns, we paid them fair wages, we worked around their school schedules (if needed), and if we liked them we offered them full time positions. If we didn't like them, we didn't need to fire them or lay them off, because the internship was inherently temporary like a contract worker.

As a political constituent, I've gone to my state capitol and lobbied on my own behalf (protesting, showing support, and testifying before senate committees). At the capitol during the school summer break there are hordes of unpaid interns referred to as "pages". Pages were basically high school students performing relatively unskilled administrative assistant tasks. I don't know much about the details of the job, but I did have lunch with a page, and I asked her why they were volunteering for politicians. She said that it would look good on a college application and it would count as college credit for civics class. But she also said that the main idea was that they got to be around powerful and connected people. If you were a good fit, you'd end up on their staff and having those connections would be an advantage for a future political career. Because the supply of pages was far higher than the amount of future staff positions, pages were extraordinarily competitive with each other, and so they "busted their asses off" so-to-speak.

-----------

To summarize, my experiences were counter to the stereotype that internships have. I'd say that internships in the private sector were fantastic in every way, and I'm glad that I was able to take advantage of the university/business internship program.

However, in the state government, internships seemed a little bit dirty. Politicians are essentially trading a slim possibility of future access to their inner circle and influence in exchange for highly motivated free labor. I suppose from a cynical point of view that this actually is good training for someone wanting a political career in the USA.
 
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I don’t appreciate the fact that Uber started off without tipping and then later instituted it. That was one of the many original benefits. Taxi drivers always demand tips even though frankly a lot of the time I don’t think they deserve it- filthy cars, rudely babbling on the phone while driving, and in Boston they often would take round about routes to extend the trip. In New York I love when they upped the pre-set tip amounts to very high percentages, which actually resulted in much higher tips.

I generally tip about 15% when it comes to Uber or Lyft unless they go above and beyond. I won’t tip if the drivers spend their entire time on the phone, blast music, or vastly screw up the trip. I also won’t tip if I’m being charged ridiculous surge pricing (which they’ve since stopped showing the rate increase).

Lyft/Uber used to be great before all the taxi drivers switched over. The customer service level was much better. Here in Boston there’s a bit a of an issue with drivers from outside Boston come into the city to drive and have no idea how to drive in Boston (in terms of navigating the complicated streets and being assertive enough to drive in the busy traffic).

When it comes to restaurants however I feel far more obligated to tip- generally 20-25%
 
Here in Boston there’s a bit a of an issue with drivers from outside Boston come into the city to drive and have no idea how to drive in Boston (in terms of navigating the complicated streets and being assertive enough to drive in the busy traffic).

lol driving in Boston bad enough anyway, it seemed as bad as parts of the Bronx, so cannot even imagine your cited scenario
 
Uber in NYC is as bad in terms cab prices. Though they're 1000x cleaner and safer.
 
lol driving in Boston bad enough anyway, it seemed as bad as parts of the Bronx, so cannot even imagine your cited scenario

I do as little driving as possible. Traffic aside there’s no where to park once you get where you’re going. Uber is great for a quick trip downtown. The T (trains) can be handy, but they too can be a nightmare. Thankfully there service has vastly improve over the past 5 years or so. Before that they were not something you could reoutinely rely on.

Our train situation is a lot like NYC. Everything is 100 years old and jerry rigged together. Some of our trains are 40 years old. Many of the trains have been extended past their life cycle a few times over now. It seems like they’ve finally invested in making upgrades and refuburshing old equipment. I think the S*** hit th fan several years ago when we got literally 7ft or snow in a month and the transit system literally got destroyed. Apparently all of their major snow removal equipment didn’t work because they never really needed it so it hadn’t been maintained. Boston relies on public transit more than every city except maybe NYC, so you’d think they’d keep things maintained.

Back in my Pharmacy School days it could take anywhere from 20 minutes to 1hr 20min to get to my internship location at the same time of day, on the same day of week. That’s how reliable things were. But alas, now I work outside of the city and my 5-6 mile commute takes 45min+ during rush hour :rolleyes:
 
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I'm hoping Uber will continue to take hold around here since otherwise getting a cab to come out from a "nearby" town and take one to another "nearby" town can run into a couple hundred bucks for one's own "20-mile round trip". Which is why everyone has tended to try to keep one halfway good car in their driveway plus some 20-year-old winter rat they can get triple-A to come jumpstart in a pinch if it has sat too long in the off season.

I tipped 15% generally on yellow cab fares in NYC, at least if they took my suggestion on how to get from work to my place and didn't half kill me getting there. I did prefer subways!

For Uber up here, I'd probably tip 20% out here in the boondocks just from sheer gratitude of knowing if I needed a taxi that it wasn't going to cost me RT 200 bucks (and the Uber fares to nearby towns are far, far less). I suppose by now the in-town cabs may have ceded the boondocks to Uber anyway so those sky high fares are receding to nightmares of the past.
 
I guess my issue with Uber is that the entire reason it was started was to be the anti-taxi. No shady drivers. No "Oh, there's a 10% credit card fee" after you arrive. No taking unsuspecting out-of-towners on longer than necessary routes to run up the meter. And no tipping. And now tipping is the norm.

This. You nailed it and now it feels like we are going back to the shady "taxi" service we were trying to get away from. Shady might be a bit extreme for this, but it does leave a bad taste.

I use Uber a lot and have tipped, when warranted.
 
I feel bad for drivers nowadays because Uber and Lyft are taking most of the cut I believe. It use to be good for drivers.
 
As a customer do you tip ?

If so how much normally ?

No I do not drive for Uber or Lyft.


I ALWAYS tip!!
At least $5.00 on small trips or $10-15 to airport.
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Agree. A tip is when the service is above and beyond.
Not when it's below par.

Here in the US we are taught to tip at least 15 to 18% for bad service and 20% + for good service!! True Story!!
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What is that based on?

.65 or 70 cents per mile for LA area drivers!!
Cabs in New Orleans made .80 cents per mile in 1979!!
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Some (taxi drivers) don't help, either.

I have struggled with suitcases, with large male drivers comfortably ensconced in their seats, unwilling and uninterested in helping. There and then, it is already clear (in my mind) that they cannot expect to receive a tip. Sulky attitudes, dirty cars, don't help.

Those that see me - short, middle-aged, with suitcases, - and immediately make a move to assist, will guarantee themselves something extra.

The best drivers treat their cars as an office; they drive neat, clean cars, and are well turned out, and appropriately, or well-dressed (in Kenya, my driver - and those he engaged to stand in when he was unable to be present) always wore pressed trousers and sometimes a shirt and tie; call me old-fashioned, but I'd prefer not to see shorts worn in a car which I have hired. This is a profession, a job, not a holiday.


I would have Treated you like Royalty!! All my customers were! :D
 
I am thinking of recording all my Uber and Lyft rides as a passenger. If it is legal.
 
I am thinking of recording all my Uber and Lyft rides as a passenger. If it is legal.

Assuming the USA, legality depends on which state you live in. For example in my state you do not need permission but you do need to disclose that you are recording to all parties if they have expectation of privacy. I would definitely expect privacy in a car.
 
I am thinking of recording all my Uber and Lyft rides as a passenger. If it is legal.
It’s legal but you can’t out the videos online as one driver did. He had a YouTube channel with all his passenger videos from Lyft and Uber on it. He was “let go” from Both companies.
 
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