UK Government Seeking Access to Encrypted Messaging Apps in Wake of London Attack

More people in London die from push-bike accidents each year (certainly if comparing over the last 10 years) than from any 'terrorist' attack.

Let's put this into perspective.

Would being able to have read any text message have stopped this murder? No.

We must fight for privacy.
 
Dagless said:
Hmm, I guess it's a funny situation that I trust not being attacked by terrorists more than a non-EU regulated Tory government.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't trust an EU regulated government any more than any other government. In fact, I'd probably trust them less.

The politicians are the power-hungry among us who want to control everyone else.
 
ibookg409 said:
Tim Cook doesn't mind when Radical Islamists destroy and terrorize. He will protect their privacy and has nothing to say on the subject. However, if you want to keep Men in the mens room and women in the womens room he will give the FBI, CIA, NSA, whomever all your passwords and encrypted data.

He is a man of integrity.
Click to expand...

Do we really need this style of pointless trolling on Macrumors?
[doublepost=1490624379][/doublepost]
centauratlas said:
I wouldn't trust an EU regulated government any more than any other government. In fact, I'd probably trust them less.

The politicians are the power-hungry among us who want to control everyone else.
Click to expand...
The EU is a huge coalition with diverse stances and opinions. I trust them far more than an insular government.
 
It's doubtful any smart evildoer is using (encrypted) text messages (iMessage, what's app) to communicate with fellow evil doers. Everyone knows there is no guarantee it's truly safe. There are far safer ways to communicate with evil comrades via code words on public forums in plain sight. Just like this site. For all we know, someone posting the words "that's pretty funny" is a code phrase to an operative to blow up the world.

There's no way to keep people from communicating secretly as long as the Internet exists.
 
Our government is the worst in the world, so this will pass and we will have incidents of mass hacks when it does get passed... it sucks but no one cares to protest in this country as they've learnt the government do not listen.
 
Too many people will just think "Oh, that's fair enough".

So tell them that if you replace the words "encrypted communication" with "front door lock" then more people will see the issue.

"Front door locks are preventing law enforcement from accessing houses easily! We are therefore going to ban all locks from front doors in the name of national security".

But what about burglars breaking in and stealing everything?

"Did you not hear me? NATIONAL SECURITY!!!"
 
Macs4u said:
This is so simple to solve yet these "elite" have no idea. Shall I suggest a solution???

Tim Cook has a way to access any iPhone, iPad or mac with a hidden way. He has a way to drop everything that's been done to a memory card. Anything like this happens, the country goes to Apple and on camera opens the product with a few witnesses from the general public and once they have the info needed, Tim Cook signs out and it's back to secure.

It isn't the back door that people fear, it's he back door open to every agency in the world, most of which they don't trust.
Click to expand...
No, no, no. That's not how this works.
 
I also wanted to add that encryption might not even be a needed thing in a few years. Why? Well, from what I understand—and I may very well be wrong because I'm no expert—is that the very nature of quantum computers means that their data cannot be intercepted because of entanglement. You wouldn't be able to just entangle hack your way into a device. And yes, I realize I'm not explaining this very technically, but these newer computers will be unhackable by default. The way they communicate is essentially outside of reality as we know it. It breaks light speed barriers. If you entangled two devices, there is nothing to intercept because nothing is being "sent" in the traditional sense. There is no electromagnetic communication whatsoever. We're reaching the end of Moore's law within the next 10 years and quantum computers are the obvious replacement. I guess the CIA will have to go back to working hard again with agents in the field. Poor CIA!
 
Politician (usually right-wing): 'Give us this new surveillance power and we'll make you safe.'
The citizenry: 'OK, we're too stupid or too lazy to vote you out of office, so whatever...'
[inevitable and unavoidable terrorist atrocity]
Politician (usually right-wing): 'Give us this new surveillance power and we'll make you safe.'
...

Lather, rinse, repeat
 
Coming from the Country that has cameras on every corner and still had no impact on stopping an attack.

Macs4u said:
This is so simple to solve yet these "elite" have no idea. Shall I suggest a solution???

Tim Cook has a way to access any iPhone, iPad or mac with a hidden way. He has a way to drop everything that's been done to a memory card. Anything like this happens, the country goes to Apple and on camera opens the product with a few witnesses from the general public and once they have the info needed, Tim Cook signs out and it's back to secure.

It isn't the back door that people fear, it's he back door open to every agency in the world, most of which they don't trust.
Click to expand...

Problem being, how does one define what a "terrorist" is. Erdogans definition is certainly different from most people for example so once you give in ...

just like the term "fake news" gets thrown around so easily nowadays to have an excuse for something.

is someone saying anyething against the government a terrorist or is he simply stating his opinion? Some would say so
 
Last edited:
Just put a moratorium on immigration and deport all non-indigenous Brits. But no, the government would rather find justification to snoop in our personal files than actually do something rational and for the greater good.
 
theBostonian said:
Just put a moratorium on immigration and deport all non-indigenous Brits. But no, the government would rather find justification to snoop in our personal files than actually do something rational and for the greater good.
Click to expand...
The attacker was a Brit, born and raised in the UK as Adrian Russell Elms. He did not change his name to Khalid Masood until decades later. No amount of blocking immigration would have prevented this.

It would have harmed the response to the attack, however, as a significant amount of British emergency crews and medical staff have an immigration background.
 
Yeah let's give Tim Cook, the guy who has spent more time on political advocacy than product development, the sole authority to make impartial decisions as to what's a threat to humanity and what's not. Lol
 
Macs4u said:
This is so simple to solve yet these "elite" have no idea. Shall I suggest a solution???

Tim Cook has a way to access any iPhone, iPad or mac with a hidden way. He has a way to drop everything that's been done to a memory card. Anything like this happens, the country goes to Apple and on camera opens the product with a few witnesses from the general public and once they have the info needed, Tim Cook signs out and it's back to secure.

It isn't the back door that people fear, it's he back door open to every agency in the world, most of which they don't trust.
Click to expand...

That's not a solution. That design would weaken the existing cryptographic implementation and is the precise thing governments want and we should fight against.

tl;dr

Doing this would open everyone to hackers everywhere.
 
theBostonian said:
Just put a moratorium on immigration and deport all non-indigenous Brits. But no, the government would rather find justification to snoop in our personal files than actually do something rational and for the greater good.
Click to expand...

Hey, I'm a non-indigenous UK resident, pay my taxes here, and I wouldn't hurt a fly (a midge, on the other hand....). :mad:

Seriously, though, I though the trade deal being discussed with the US would include freedom of movement between the countries, rather like the deal with the EU now....
 
It's funny to see the dichotomy in this thread between the rational, and the pants-wetting "I'll abandon any and all principles and rights to keep me safe from the boogeyman, daddy" posts.
 
Macs4u said:
This is so simple to solve yet these "elite" have no idea. Shall I suggest a solution???

Tim Cook has a way to access any iPhone, iPad or mac with a hidden way. He has a way to drop everything that's been done to a memory card. Anything like this happens, the country goes to Apple and on camera opens the product...
Click to expand...
First off, who are these "elite" you speak of? In what way are they elite?

Secondly, once you put such a mechanism in place, it's pretty much guaranteed that the government will stop by a short time later with a trunk load of phones they want access to, and a National Security Letter saying that Apple has to provide access to these phones, and has to not say anything to the public about it "because national security reasons" despite the widely publicized "we'll only do this while the public watches" agreement, and, oh, "could you please hurry, because some of these people think they misplaced their phones and we want to get the the phones back before they realize what's happening."
 
For once I agree with Jeremy Corbyn, who stated he felt that the government already has enough powers of investigation.

Here's hoping the House of Lords (who tend to be less reactionary since they are unelected) block any attempt at introducing new legislation against encryption.

How ironic it would be for an unelected chamber to champion liberty!
 
acedout said:
More people in London die from push-bike accidents each year (certainly if comparing over the last 10 years) than from any 'terrorist' attack.
Click to expand...
You're implying that terrorism is always low risk compared to cycling. That's not really the whole picture as you can't account for the behind the scenes efforts put in by the security services (even without these thoughtless security back doors in place) that is helping to keep the figures low in the U.K. I felt this was proven when this attack happened, it was last line of defence and the offender was dead in less than 90 seconds from the start. There's a lot of traditional police /security work that is protecting us.
[doublepost=1490632296][/doublepost]
danmart said:
For once I agree with Jeremy Corbyn, who stated he felt that the government already has enough powers of investigation.
Click to expand...
You've done it now, he'll be retweeting your post and using it in PMQ's!
 
MacRumors said:
Rudd's next step is summoning leaders of various technology companies to a meeting with the UK government on March 30 "to discuss what to do." The home secretary mentioned that the government would be willing to pass completely new legislation focusing on encrypted messaging and mobile apps if the talks this Thursday don't go her way.
Click to expand...
Why bother with the farce of having a meeting if you're just going to threaten to force them to do what you want anyway? Sounds more like something from The Godfather or Stalinist Russia, than a supposedly free country.
MacRumors said:
Rudd referred to WhatsApp, and similar apps, as potential "secret places" for terrorists to hide.
Click to expand...
Next up, the government realizes that private homes are also "secret places for terrorists to hide", so they'll be installing cameras inside every home to watch for potential terrorist activity - but don't worry, it's "for public safety."
MacRumors said:
While the police know Masood opened WhatsApp before the attacks, it is unknown whether or not he sent or received any messages.
Click to expand...
This is such weak justification - outside the US, WhatsApp is one of the world's most popular messaging clients. Police could just as easily say that it is known that the perp drank water in the days leading up to the attack, so... what... now we need a way to closely monitor everyone who drinks water "for public safety"?

She's either technologically clueless, or using other people's suffering as an excuse to make a power grab.
 
VulchR said:
[...]
Seriously, though, I though the trade deal being discussed with the US would include freedom of movement between the countries, rather like the deal with the EU now....
Click to expand...
Do you want to bet it will be a deal where Freedom of Movement only applies to Americans wishing to come to the UK but not the other way around?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.
Back
Top