Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
shamino said:
You're a real piece of work.

If Pa's harware store decides to take advantage of the legal benefits he's entitled to, you automatically declare him evil.

Tell me, do you also throw bombs through their windows?

Legal benefits, such as being able to market to teenagers cigarrettes, and, a century back, sell opium to the Chinese after Britain passed laws on banning of Opium consumption, and being able to obtain cheap oil because of massive military pile-ups and being able to put tariffs on import vehicles such as the Honda Civic, making what is a budget japanese car a mid class sedan/coupe here in north america so that your own domestic companies can compete better with much worse fuel economy and safety.
 
shamino said:
So you believe it's OK to steal from stores if your disagree with the manufacturer's politics?

Please stay out of my town. We don't like thieves here.

I believe its Okay to condone individuals to do it if you condone the corps doing it by supporting them in anyway possible. No double standards. And name calling is not necessary here.
 
10% restocking fee. You pay for an advertised set of specifications. If you happen to get better, cool. If you get what is printed on the box, well then, you get what you paid for.

This has been done before, specifically with the B&W G3s that can or can't recognize master/slave drives.

Doctor Q said:
Why would anybody not return a mini if they didn't get the new model? Or wait on their purchase now that it's clear an upgrade is in the works?
 
Maxx Power said:
Legal benefits, such as being able to market to teenagers cigarrettes, and, a century back, sell opium to the Chinese after Britain passed laws on banning of Opium consumption, and being able to obtain cheap oil because of massive military pile-ups and being able to put tariffs on import vehicles such as the Honda Civic, making what is a budget japanese car a mid class sedan/coupe here in north america so that your own domestic companies can compete better with much worse fuel economy and safety.


What are you talking about??? It's this simple.. The individual who was sold the iPod at the wrong price had two choices. Tell the store that they charged him for the wrong model, or say nothing pocket and the $140.. He picked the later of the two options. He has to live with his choice. This has nothing to do with the cost of gas, or the price of tea in China... It's about doing what's right, or doing nothing. He chose to do nothing....

That's all I have to say about this.. Now, where's the new Mac mini?? Hopefully Tuesday...
 
ack_mac said:
What are you talking about??? It's this simple.. The individual who was sold the iPod at the wrong price had two choices. Tell the store that they charged him for the wrong model, or say nothing pocket and the $140.. He picked the later of the two options. He has to live with his choice. This has nothing to do with the cost of gas, or the price of tea in China... It's about doing what's right, or doing nothing. He chose to do nothing....

That's all I have to say about this.. Now, where's the new Mac mini?? Hopefully Tuesday...

I was making a point that if the people who made his iPod themselves (Apple) is okay with their corporate irresponsibility in those things I talked about(environment, thirdworld exploitations, etc) then there is nothing against whoever it was that got an extra 140 dollars. When they do it, it's a business decision and it's called profit. Just look at all we consumers lost in warrenty and extended warrenty by not reading the fine prints and having a lawyer to decipher it for us. Just about all the most common sources of product failure have been excluded, yet they charge a huge amount of money for whatever skeleton of a warrenty left. When an individual does it, we call it thievery, scam, etc, which is a blatant double standard. Thats not to say I put my support in stealing from corps, however, I do judge it from a less traditional and more modern perspective that is fairer with respect to today's situations.

The longer they delay the announcement of new Mac minis while actually selectedly shipping them the more they demonstrate irresponsibility in the corporations. If you were serving cakes to your kids, how would you choose who gets the left over cakes from last week, and who gets new pieces of cake ? Apple is doing this to get rid of stock, something they know no one would want if they announced new mini's, which just reminds you that they are for profit, they do not care about you or me or whoever about how hard it was to earn our cash to pay for an item that they know you'll regret buying soon after. That's not saying I want or am going to buy an Apple product. I just support the people here who say it is unfair and unethical for Apple to conduct their business this way.
 
Maxx Power said:
If you were serving cakes to your kids, how would you choose who gets the left over cakes from last week, and who gets new pieces of cake ? Apple is doing this to get rid of stock, something they know no one would want if they announced new mini's, which just reminds you that they are for profit, they do not care about you or me or whoever about how hard it was to earn our cash to pay for an item that they know you'll regret buying soon after. That's not saying I want or am going to buy an Apple product. I just support the people here who say it is unfair and unethical for Apple to conduct their business this way.

Maxx Power, I feel sorry for you. You've obviously been on the short end of the stick when it comes to dealing with businesses. Perhaps you should voice your opinion in the political forums (if they still exist...don't bother checking them out, myself).

Let's take your cakes analogy and go with it:

My kids are having a little bake sale out in the front yard every day for two weeks. I stocked up on caramel cakes for them that I bought at, say, Costco in bulk. I notice that some of them have best before dates that are a few weeks before others and I hand those boxes to the kids first. Now am I going to burn for that? No.

Similar things happen all over the world in every culture: you try to get rid of the old stuff first. Ever notice that the newest cartons of milk are in the back? Yup. Same thing. Man, sometimes I feel sorry for Apple. They're damned if they do, and damned if they don't. If I had a dime for every post I read about the slow speed of the mac mini hard drives or the anemic VRAM, I'd be a wealthy man. And I'd try to help the environment and 3rd world countries and stuff.

Squire
 
shamino said:
No, you're just saying it's OK to steal from corporations, even if that "corporation" is a two-person business that's struggling to pay the rent.
If you don't agree with a corporations ethics, why desire their goods in the first place?
 
Squire said:
Maxx Power, I feel sorry for you. You've obviously been on the short end of the stick when it comes to dealing with businesses. Perhaps you should voice your opinion in the political forums (if they still exist...don't bother checking them out, myself).

Let's take your cakes analogy and go with it:

My kids are having a little bake sale out in the front yard every day for two weeks. I stocked up on caramel cakes for them that I bought at, say, Costco in bulk. I notice that some of them have best before dates that are a few weeks before others and I hand those boxes to the kids first. Now am I going to burn for that? No.

Similar things happen all over the world in every culture: you try to get rid of the old stuff first. Ever notice that the newest cartons of milk are in the back? Yup. Same thing. Man, sometimes I feel sorry for Apple. They're damned if they do, and damned if they don't. If I had a dime for every post I read about the slow speed of the mac mini hard drives or the anemic VRAM, I'd be a wealthy man. And I'd try to help the environment and 3rd world countries and stuff.

Squire

Thanks for your comments Squire, it helps put a good perspective on things. :cool:
 
Yes, great point squire. While I agree with one or two points Maxx Power has made, overall I think he is losing the argument through extreme examples, (I know, I often do that too). I also can't agree with anyone being dishonest yet attacking other people's ethics. If you agree with individual theft, how can you say it is wrong for corporations to effectively steal off their customers and workers?
 
~Shard~ said:
Thanks for your comments Squire, it helps put a good perspective on things. :cool:

You're welcome. ;)

This should be called The Analogy Thread. Well, I've got to finish off this Neo Citron and hit the sack. ~Shard~, you've got to take over the analogy duties for the next 8 hours. Understood? :confused:

Squire

<edit> Great point, steve_hill4. It's borderline hypocritical.
 
Squire said:
You're welcome. ;)

This should be called The Analogy Thread. Well, I've got to finish off this Neo Citron and hit the sack. ~Shard~, you've got to take over the analogy duties for the next 8 hours. Understood? :confused:

Understood, I'll do my best - it does get a bit messy at times! ;)

And yes steve_hill4, I also find it amusing how some people can admit to engaging in dishonest behavior themselves, yet feel free and justified to attack and question other people's ethics and behaviors. :cool:

Let's hope Apple makes the official announcement and switch so we can put all this to rest.
 
Squire said:
Maxx Power, I feel sorry for you. You've obviously been on the short end of the stick when it comes to dealing with businesses. Perhaps you should voice your opinion in the political forums (if they still exist...don't bother checking them out, myself).

Let's take your cakes analogy and go with it:

My kids are having a little bake sale out in the front yard every day for two weeks. I stocked up on caramel cakes for them that I bought at, say, Costco in bulk. I notice that some of them have best before dates that are a few weeks before others and I hand those boxes to the kids first. Now am I going to burn for that? No.

Similar things happen all over the world in every culture: you try to get rid of the old stuff first. Ever notice that the newest cartons of milk are in the back? Yup. Same thing. Man, sometimes I feel sorry for Apple. They're damned if they do, and damned if they don't. If I had a dime for every post I read about the slow speed of the mac mini hard drives or the anemic VRAM, I'd be a wealthy man. And I'd try to help the environment and 3rd world countries and stuff.

Squire

I'd spend my time voicing some opinions of mine on this forum whenever I see someone who makes a statement that is too misleading or too offending to pass by.

You don't need to feel sorry for me. I personally haven't been "short sticked" by the corporations, be it apple, or whatever. I've seen the world from a few different perspectives and been to a few places and have witnessed what it costs to sustain corporate profit, and like any decent man would, I am disgusted by it. I wasn't born with a distaste for certain concepts such as corporations, or corporately funded institutions, I don't think anyone is. It is uncomfortable to see people being very ignorant, like the US military people taking pictures next to charred corpses in Iraq. Back to the old quote, and I think it is very true, is that Evil triumphs when good men do nothing. So along those lines, I'd like to get people to read my posts, and besides, if you are here, aren't you urged to "Think Different", not that I believe any of Apple's ads.

Back to the food analogy, there exists a different when you are trying to feed a family, to when your concerns are about how to reap another million dollars off of dead technologies and driving around in your luxury car of choice. The idea was that first of all, this is not fair, even by economic market standards to the consumers. Secondly, I really don't think Mr. Jobs needs a second 90 million dollar jet. The concept of capitalism is supposed to bring us competitive goods, and the choices are made by the consumers, but if you release a product with out a competition, and without telling the consumers the differences, you are misguiding the consumers and manipulating the market which defeats the whole purpose of capitalism, at least for those who are not profiteering.

Personally, I think the best way to help third world countries is to not buy anything made there, and do a bit of research yourself about how a product is made and sold to understand the enormous strain some people are put under just so that a handful of people can keep their status quo.
 
steve_hill4 said:
I also can't agree with anyone being dishonest yet attacking other people's ethics. If you agree with individual theft, how can you say it is wrong for corporations to effectively steal off their customers and workers?

If you followed my posts, you'll see that I would agree with individual theft, if no one says it is wrong for corporations to steal. Not the backwards way around.
 
Maxx Power said:
If you followed my posts, you'll see that I would agree with individual theft, if no one says it is wrong for corporations to steal. Not the backwards way around.

Ya, actually, that's true.
 
Squire said:
Perhaps you should acquaint yourself with the info in this announcement:

https://forums.macrumors.com/announcement.php?f=4

I figure I'd inform you rather than do nothing.

Squire

About that, I hardly think my posts are off-topic. I was replying to someone on this thread. But thanks for the post though. People often mute others when comprehension is harder than rejection, the moderators are, and I quote "only human".
 
Maxx Power said:
About that, I hardly think my posts are off-topic. I was replying to someone on this thread. But thanks for the post though. People often mute others when comprehension is harder than rejection, the moderators are, and I quote "only human".

Post #162 seemed a bit off to me. Oh well. So are you in the market for a mac mini? Personally, I'd love to have one to hook up to my TV but the HD sizes (even with the 100 GB BTO option) are a bit smaller than what I'm looking for.

Squire
 
Squire said:
Post #162 seemed a bit off to me. Oh well. So are you in the market for a mac mini? Personally, I'd love to have one to hook up to my TV but the HD sizes (even with the 100 GB BTO option) are a bit smaller than what I'm looking for.

Squire


Yeah, that post, without fuel there is no fire.
Back to the Mac Mini, I'm about to start my masters anyday now, I was looking for a cheap computer to put in the basement of my parents resturant and make it into an office. I thought i'd give a mini a try, the idea it runs tops 20 watts from the AC outlet is very environment friendly, and I like that idea. Kinda like Japanese cars verses North American cars, I suppose. More finesse but less brute, which I think is a good thing.
 
Maxx Power said:
Yeah, that post, without fuel there is no fire.
Back to the Mac Mini, I'm about to start my masters anyday now, I was looking for a cheap computer to put in the basement of my parents resturant and make it into an office. I thought i'd give a mini a try, the idea it runs tops 20 watts from the AC outlet is very environment friendly, and I like that idea. Kinda like Japanese cars verses North American cars, I suppose. More finesse but less brute, which I think is a good thing.

Your parents own a business?!?!? But...but..you said...
Hey, just kidding. ;) Yeah, sounds like the mini would be a nice little addition. (Oh, I'd love to have a hybrid. Gas is about $1.50/liter here.)

Squire
 
Squire said:
Your parents own a business?!?!? But...but..you said...
Hey, just kidding. ;) Yeah, sounds like the mini would be a nice little addition. (Oh, I'd love to have a hybrid. Gas is about $1.50/liter here.)

Squire

Yeah, me and a few friends of mine are planning to leave this continent when we are done school, pretty fed up with it....

We'll see what Apple has to say about the Mac Mini early next week or so, maybe they will release something I can afford and use.
 
Guys guys... lets all calm down for a moment

This thing with Apple (to get a better product than whats advertised on the box) happens only once say twice in a life time.
Really what we should be bothered of here isnt that we get a better product than the one advertised, but whether the consumer gets: what he wants, what he is paying for and if he gets what he is told. We shouldnt be carried away with situations -like this one- i know this seems to suit us fine but it could be bad also. Imagine if there was a worse macMini inside instead of the one advertised. A worse or faulty product is the majority of situations that happen...you almost never get better stuff. So for me this situation is as if Apple would sell me a worse product in the meaning that i didnt get what i saw advertised. Why should some buyers get the old MacMini and some others get the new 1.5 model at same price? Now is that fair?
Lets not get carried away guys just because some things suit us. We are consumers we should all be treated fairly.

p.s. No i havent purchsed any MacMini yet, but i can imagine the feeling of the guys that got the “correct” model and now others at same price got the new “wrong advertised” model thats better equiped!
 
zoran said:
Imagine if there was a worse macMini inside instead of the one advertised. A worse or faulty product is the majority of situations that happen...you almost never get better stuff.

If that happened, you'd have every right to bring it back and have them fix the problem as you'd have gotten something worse than what you expected. Remember: here, everyone is getting what they expect or better.

Basically, anyone who forks over cash for a new mini right now, should expect a 1.42 GHz processor, 4200 rpm hard drive, and a 32 MB graphics card. That way, it's impossible for them to be disappointed. It sort of sucks for those who don't know but, really, that's no different from buying a week before a keynote, is it?

Squire
 
Squire said:
It sort of sucks for those who don't know but, really, that's no different from buying a week before a keynote, is it?

Squire

Well actually its not because we all have www.macrumors.com to be saved from those last minute keynotes. And thanx.
Honestly now, i dont know why Apple hasnt closed down the buyers guide section yet :) :D :) :D :) :D

However i have one recommendation to give...

Keep up the good rumor work you guys :D
 
What I meant is there will always be people who buy macs/iPods before a big event because they don't know that updates are imminent. Those are likely the people most affected by this little ploy. For us, it's no different from reading "Mac Mini Update Imminent" on the front page. We wait.

Squire
 
For once apple's not screwing their re-sellers

Now i have no idea if any one will read this being buried on page 7 or 8 in the thread but i'll give this a go anyway.

Now obviously some where in the supply chain they needed to change chips and/or were planing the change anyway. whether they were forced to or they decided to it doesn't really matter

Apple themselves don't keep a lot of inventory, build it ship it out, so once the new ones started being built they probably realized a bit too late the there are a lot of current Mac Mini's still in the retail supply chain, hmmm what to do.

The Mac Mini has been a WIDELY distributed computer compared to other apple computers. Their are a lot of the older versions out there in a LOT of stores. The profit margin on them is probably not great, so instead of screwing a LOT of retailers by forcing a price drop they decide to ride it out for a few weeks till the supply chain clears up, more retailers, more computers, longer for the supply chain to clear out.

Is apple's solution perfect... no but they avoid pissing off their re-sellers who will have a much longer memory about this, then the few consumers who care about this that will forget about once the new ones are rolling out officially anyway

Hell i feel stupid writing this since it'll be a non issue very soon i imagine.
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.