Ventura's the best update I've ever used. It's gonna be a big one y'all

[Spaceboi Scaphandre]

So some background, I've only been using macOS for one and a half years. I switched from a lifetime of Windows and hating Macs because of the M1 chip impressed me to the point I gave it a shot last year with an M1 Mac Mini. Using Big Sur I fell in love with macOS and it became my daily driver.

Then once I got comfortable with macOS I wanted something stronger so I got a 14 inch Macbook Pro, which is hands down the best laptop I have ever used. Well...except for one thing: macOS Monterey. Using Monterey over Big Sur has been a mess. Universal Control being delayed for months and the OS causing so many audio issues, made me so angry and disappointed after how much of a positive change Big Sur was for me coming from Windows.

Enter Ventura. Ventura comes in with so many new features that has me so excited. Continuity Camera to use my iPhone as a webcam, the reworked settings, Metal 3 (lmao,) and the thing that had me the most excited: Stage Manager to clean up my desktop view. These features had me so excited I opted in to participate in an Apple public beta for the first time. My impression? I LOVE IT

This beta is absolutely amazing. I'm shocked at how stable it is especially after the disasters that was the 2021 Apple OS updates. Everything has been so smooth, Stage Manager has made my desktop so clean and organized and I can easily move through my windows. I can actually find things in my system settings now! The audio issues I had on Monterey are now gone. AND THIS IS ALL JUST IN BETA.

In the other camp I look at Windows 11. Aside from the new start menu and taskbar (which is a good change I actually love the new start menu) Windows 11 is in general a downgrade compared to 10, an OS update that clearly was not ready. The most recent update finally added tabs for File Explorer...something macOS and Linux have had for over a decade. It's just...lame. Meanwhile I just look at the update my Mac just got and it added so much new stuff and has improved my computer usage so much...in beta no less...

So yeah, this update has me pogging out of my mind. Ventura is gonna be a good one. I absolutely love this update's beta and I cannot go back to Monterey.

Anyone else try out the beta?

 

[dinobear]

Good to hear. although it would certainly have more weight if you werent brand new to mac OS. Big sur was a big departure from the previous OS's I'm curious what you'd think about catalina if you came from that.

I'm thinking about upgrading to Ventura from Catalina. Not sure I want an iOS operating system for my computer though... Good to hear it's stable though.

 

[fisherking]

Good to hear. although it would certainly have more weight if you werent brand new to mac OS. Big sur was a big departure from the previous OS's I'm curious what you'd think about catalina if you came from that.

I'm thinking about upgrading to Ventura from Catalina. Not sure I want an iOS operating system for my computer though... Good to hear it's stable though.

this isn't an ios OS, it's a mac OS. does it share qualities with ios? sure. and vice versa

 

[Spaceboi Scaphandre]

Good to hear. although it would certainly have more weight if you werent brand new to mac OS. Big sur was a big departure from the previous OS's I'm curious what you'd think about catalina if you came from that.

I'm thinking about upgrading to Ventura from Catalina. Not sure I want an iOS operating system for my computer though... Good to hear it's stable though.

I actually did try Catalina, and I thought it was hot steaming garbage.

Gutting 32 bit app support, how slow it was, how Sidecar was underwhelming and is now pretty much a forgotten gimmick now that Universal Control is here, and in general was a massive step back from High Sierra and Mojave. If anything Catalina proved my anti-Mac bias I had at the time and highlighted the Intel era perfectly: A wash that Apple left to languish. Catalina ended the Intel era not on a bang, but a whimper. It's only saving grace is how it finally killed iTunes and split it into three separate nonbloated apps.

I'm so glad my first proper experience was with Big Sur and not that garbage.

 

[ponzicoinbro]

Calm down it’s just a minor update.

The only thing that interests me is Metal 3 and if there are any benefits on Apple Silicon.

 

[Spaceboi Scaphandre]

Calm down it’s just a minor update.

The only thing that interests me is Metal 3 and if there are any benefits on Apple Silicon.

Bruh I wouldn't call a new window management system, a reworked system settings, and the ability to use your iPhone as a webcam as a "minor update." Monterey is a minor update in comparison.

 

[Wokis]

I actually did try Catalina, and I thought it was hot steaming garbage.

Gutting 32 bit app support, how slow it was, how Sidecar was underwhelming and is now pretty much a forgotten gimmick now that Universal Control is here, and in general was a massive step back from High Sierra and Mojave. If anything Catalina proved my anti-Mac bias I had at the time and highlighted the Intel era perfectly: A wash that Apple left to languish. Catalina ended the Intel era not on a bang, but a whimper. It's only saving grace is how it finally killed iTunes and split it into three separate nonbloated apps.

I'm so glad my first proper experience was with Big Sur and not that garbage.

You should keep in mind that gutting the 32-bit support and forcing developers to adhere to newer libraries, rules and standards ahead of the ISA change is what allowed the M1, the chip you love so much, to exist and be as good as it is. It carries pretty much no baggage because it didn't need to.

 

[Spaceboi Scaphandre]

You should keep in mind that gutting the 32-bit support and forcing developers to adhere to newer libraries, rules and standards ahead of the ISA change is what allowed the M1, the chip you love so much, to exist and be as good as it is. It carries pretty much no baggage because it didn't need to.

And in turn nuked the majority of all Mac software since the bulk of those developers either abandoned the Mac platform because they got sick of Apple's draconian policies or it was not profitable to update their legacy software for 64 bit especially with the lower numbers their software did on Mac compared to on Windows. Windows 11 no longer has 32-bit support, but still has a compatibility layer for 32 bit apps, especially games since Windows is king for gaming.

Apple already has an optional compatibility layer for the Apple Silicon Macs to run x86 apps, so why can't they include an optional one for 32 bit apps as well, especially since a lot of professionals lost a lot of their tools with the update to Catalina since those tools were 32 bit apps?

 

[cschmelz]

And in turn nuked the majority of all Mac software since the bulk of those developers either abandoned the Mac platform because they got sick of Apple's draconian policies or it was not profitable to update their legacy software for 64 bit especially with the lower numbers their software did on Mac compared to on Windows. Windows 11 no longer has 32-bit support, but still has a compatibility layer for 32 bit apps, especially games since Windows is king for gaming.

Apple already has an optional compatibility layer for the Apple Silicon Macs to run x86 apps, so why can't they include an optional one for 32 bit apps as well, especially since a lot of professionals lost a lot of their tools with the update to Catalina since those tools were 32 bit apps?

Nuked the MAJORITY? Not sure what apps you use but I sure haven't seen this to be true AT ALL.

 

[KoolAid-Drink]

I'm impressed as well. Settings ended up not as bad as it appeared to be in the first developer beta, and the OS as a whole seems to perform very smoothly. Monterey was decent over Big Sur, and Big Sur was way better than Catalina. Stair step OSes, you'd say. However, I'm waiting until the final launch of Ventura to judge, because anything can change at this point.

 

[Wokis]

And in turn nuked the majority of all Mac software since the bulk of those developers either abandoned the Mac platform because they got sick of Apple's draconian policies or it was not profitable to update their legacy software for 64 bit especially with the lower numbers their software did on Mac compared to on Windows. Windows 11 no longer has 32-bit support, but still has a compatibility layer for 32 bit apps, especially games since Windows is king for gaming.

Apple already has an optional compatibility layer for the Apple Silicon Macs to run x86 apps, so why can't they include an optional one for 32 bit apps as well, especially since a lot of professionals lost a lot of their tools with the update to Catalina since those tools were 32 bit apps?

Because there is a considerable cost in CPU transistor budget and memory allocation related to having such compatibility layers as well as adding to size bloat of the OS installation. Apple has never cared about backward compatibility to the same level as Windows if it means they have to keep old libraries, support for legacy commands and such. If they did they would lose a competitive edge that makes them stand out.

They were telling developers already by the end of the PowerPC-era that the future of OS X would be 64-bit. (Thus a bit embarrassing when Intel gave them 32bit-only chips the first go-round, lol. That's another story.) There sure were a couple snags when Catalina, ~14 years later, finally dropped 32bit, but it made sure that the following year the introduction of AS instead went surprisingly smooth.

 

[tmoerel]

And in turn nuked the majority of all Mac software since the bulk of those developers either abandoned the Mac platform because they got sick of Apple's draconian policies or it was not profitable to update their legacy software for 64 bit especially with the lower numbers their software did on Mac compared to on Windows. Windows 11 no longer has 32-bit support, but still has a compatibility layer for 32 bit apps, especially games since Windows is king for gaming.

Apple already has an optional compatibility layer for the Apple Silicon Macs to run x86 apps, so why can't they include an optional one for 32 bit apps as well, especially since a lot of professionals lost a lot of their tools with the update to Catalina since those tools were 32 bit apps?

So why don't you leave this horrible mac world and go play in your great windows sandbox. You won't be missed!

 

[gpat]

Good to hear. although it would certainly have more weight if you werent brand new to mac OS. Big sur was a big departure from the previous OS's I'm curious what you'd think about catalina if you came from that.

I'm thinking about upgrading to Ventura from Catalina. Not sure I want an iOS operating system for my computer though... Good to hear it's stable though.

People have been saying this for literally 11 years, since Launchpad and Autosave debuted on Lion.
11 years later, it turns out that Apple wanted to keep iOS and macOS very separate from one another, even though other people started asking for the opposite to happen, sometimes also quite loudly.

 

[ponzicoinbro]

Bruh I wouldn't call a new window management system, a reworked system settings, and the ability to use your iPhone as a webcam as a "minor update." Monterey is a minor update in comparison.

LMAO

It’s an optional windows management system that is janky and ugly and almost every one on this forum hates it.

System settings makes no difference. I go in settings once a month maybe once every 6 months.

I don’t want a super high megapixel webcam. Most people would be super paranoid for every acne and nose hair to show.

 

[fisherking]

LMAO

It’s an optional windows management system that is janky and ugly and almost every one on this forum hates it.

that represents... what; infinitely less than 1% of the mac user base.... 🤔

 

[izzy0242mr]

Bruh I wouldn't call a new window management system, a reworked system settings, and the ability to use your iPhone as a webcam as a "minor update." Monterey is a minor update in comparison.

The new window management system isn't that good. It's basically a simplified mobile-based task switcher. I think you'll find that the majority of people on these forums find it fairly useless. And yeah, while we're a minority, SM is so hidden that genuinely only people like us will even know it exists. Your average Mac user will not find it buried in Control Center - nor would they have much use for it.

System settings *looks* different, but it's just one app. It's not that crazy an upgrade

And ditto with using an iPhone as your webcam. Cool, but like, external webcams have existed for decades. Using your phone as one is just like...okay, cool? Kinda more an admission that Apple's built in webcams are cheap quality.

Those are basically nice things but nothing crazy innovative or groundbreaking.

Big updates are things like introducing a 64-bit OS (Snow Leopard), an App Store (also Snow Leopard), full disk encryption (Panther), system wide search (Tiger), systemwide UI overhaul and Quick Look (Leopard), reopening quit apps in their previous state/"Resume" (Lion), Notifications (Mavericks), High Sierra (new file system), etc. Those are more major upgrades that fundamentally change critical components of the macOS experience and function.

Stage Manager is more akin to, like, adding the Photos app (which Apple did a while back to sort of replace iPhoto, which still exists). It duplicated existing functionality but is a little different and worse in some ways.

System Preferences is like changing the look and feel of the Dock. Yeah, it's very noticeable, but at the end of the day everything still works the same.

And using your iPhone as a webcam...I've said enough about that.

 

[MarineBand5524]

So some background, I've only been using macOS for one and a half years. I switched from a lifetime of Windows and hating Macs because of the M1 chip impressed me to the point I gave it a shot last year with an M1 Mac Mini. Using Big Sur I fell in love with macOS and it became my daily driver.

Then once I got comfortable with macOS I wanted something stronger so I got a 14 inch Macbook Pro, which is hands down the best laptop I have ever used. Well...except for one thing: macOS Monterey. Using Monterey over Big Sur has been a mess. Universal Control being delayed for months and the OS causing so many audio issues, made me so angry and disappointed after how much of a positive change Big Sur was for me coming from Windows.

Enter Ventura. Ventura comes in with so many new features that has me so excited. Continuity Camera to use my iPhone as a webcam, the reworked settings, Metal 3 (lmao,) and the thing that had me the most excited: Stage Manager to clean up my desktop view. These features had me so excited I opted in to participate in an Apple public beta for the first time. My impression? I LOVE IT

This beta is absolutely amazing. I'm shocked at how stable it is especially after the disasters that was the 2021 Apple OS updates. Everything has been so smooth, Stage Manager has made my desktop so clean and organized and I can easily move through my windows. I can actually find things in my system settings now! The audio issues I had on Monterey are now gone. AND THIS IS ALL JUST IN BETA.

In the other camp I look at Windows 11. Aside from the new start menu and taskbar (which is a good change I actually love the new start menu) Windows 11 is in general a downgrade compared to 10, an OS update that clearly was not ready. The most recent update finally added tabs for File Explorer...something macOS and Linux have had for over a decade. It's just...lame. Meanwhile I just look at the update my Mac just got and it added so much new stuff and has improved my computer usage so much...in beta no less...

So yeah, this update has me pogging out of my mind. Ventura is gonna be a good one. I absolutely love this update's beta and I cannot go back to Monterey.

Anyone else try out the beta?

Absolutely a great OS. Especially now with the 3rd Beta and things coming back, getting used to the new redesigned System Settings and needing to search for things like DNS now which is odd.

But I just formatted and reinstalled yet again due to a bug not allowing me to install Little Snitch. Since I did that, I took the time to reinstall all the apps and install HomeBrew on Monterey so when I upgraded I had more than when just installing off a beta.

I've been using MacOS since Vista came out. I was sick of the Blue Screens of Death and the lack of tech support Windows and makers had for that time. Apple had just come out with the newly redesigned iMac and their Genius Bar. So I bought one finally and in 5 minutes had it out, and set up, it was fully updated and I couldn't believe it took me so long. I didn't even miss one thing about Windows, which says a lot being an IT professional and Windows being a majority of my work at the time.

 

[ponzicoinbro]

that represents... what; infinitely less than 1% of the mac user base.... 🤔

Not a good way to see it.

The forum base as you know are very often the long term dedicated users who upgrade like maniacs.

The 99% percentile are normals who don’t even know what a kernel is and most upgrade every 4-5 years. Most of these don’t even know Spaces exists.

 

[fisherking]

Not a good way to see it.

The forum base as you know are very often the long term dedicated users who upgrade like maniacs.

The 99% percentile are normals who don’t even know what a kernel is and most upgrade every 4-5 years. Most of these don’t even know Spaces exists.

i have no idea what you mean. and not sure what 'normals' are, but the world is full of macusers who do professional work on their macs, or just surf the web and send email. 'everyone on the forum' is still less than 1% of the mac user base... and i stand by what i posted.

 

[Spaceboi Scaphandre]

LMAO

It’s an optional windows management system that is janky and ugly and almost every one on this forum hates it.

As someone who's only used macOS a year after a lifetime of Windows, I love Stage Manager so much. It's very helpful for laptop setups which is what I use since my Mac is a secondary companion device to my gaming PC. I have Twitter, Steam, Finder, and any other desktop windows nicely organized in the stage manager so my desktop is no longer a cluttered mess. I can actually get to desktop icons now a lot easier too.

But hey, if you don't like it, guess what: It's an optional toggle you can leave off. I'm keeping mine on though as it's made using macOS so much more comfortable for me.

System settings makes no difference. I go in settings once a month maybe once every 6 months.

Congrats. I do have to go into settings a lot however, especially when I plug my Macbook Pro into other people's TVs for Jackbox nights, so I have to adjust the display settings everytime I do. This new settings menu also makes that more easy and organized.

I don’t want a super high megapixel webcam. Most people would be super paranoid for every acne and nose hair to show.

Okay now you're capping and trying to be contrary for the sake of standing out from the crowd.

 

[Fishrrman]

"Ventura's the best update I've ever used"

If you've only been using Macs for 18 months, how in heck are you going to know "what the best Mac OS's" were?

<-- been using Macs 35 years, so I've seen plenty of OS's come and go...

 

[Spaceboi Scaphandre]

"Ventura's the best update I've ever used"

If you've only been using Macs for 18 months, how in heck are you going to know "what the best Mac OS's" were?

<-- been using Macs 35 years, so I've seen plenty of OS's come and go...

Keyword: The best update I've used.

I didn't say it was the best macOS version. I said it was the best OS update I have used. That includes ALL OS updates I've used over my lifetime. You assumed I was only talking about macOS when I mentioned how disappointed I was with Windows 11

 

[DHagan4755]

"Ventura's the best update I've ever used"

If you've only been using Macs for 18 months, how in heck are you going to know "what the best Mac OS's" were?

<-- been using Macs 35 years, so I've seen plenty of OS's come and go...

Very true my friend. You've been using Macs longer than me (I've been using the Mac since system 7 in 1994) so you know the lineage of past betas being either gnarly or complete dog poop & wondering how it was even going to get to "golden master." Regardless, it's good to hear from a relative newcomer that their experience has been positive with a beta. Hopefully this bodes well for the final release in September.

 

[mikecwest]

Bruh I wouldn't call a new window management system, a reworked system settings, and the ability to use your iPhone as a webcam as a "minor update." Monterey is a minor update in comparison.

Does anyone WANT to use their iPhone as a webcam?? I have less than zero desire to do this, even if I used a desktop, with a Mac Pro, a Mackintosh, or what ever...This feature seems more like a gimmick than anything else.

 

[Mr47]

Does anyone WANT to use their iPhone as a webcam?? I have less than zero desire to do this, even if I used a desktop, with a Mac Pro, a Mackintosh, or what ever...This feature seems more like a gimmick than anything else.

Yes I do, I have a Mac Studio and a Dell display and some ****** Chinese webcam so it's a great option. If you don't like something doesn't mean the whole work thinks the same, that is the error most people make these days.