Verizon and iMessage

[DCIFRTHS]

When your phone is not connected to Wi-Fi:

If you are on a call, and someone sends you an iMessage, does the message get queued, and delivered when you disconnect from the call?

What if you attempt to send an iMessage while in a phone call? Does the message sit queued, and then go on its way when the call is disconnected?

 

[I7guy]

If your connected to wifi it should just arrive and be sent directly. Cell service I'll try it later.

 

[DCIFRTHS]

If your connected to wifi it should just arrive and be sent directly. Cell service I'll try it later.

Agreed - So I updated my post to reflect that I am looking for answers to my questions when the phone is
not connected to Wi-Fi... thanks for pointing that out. And thanks for testing!

 

[aneftp]

https://forums.macrumors.com/archive/index.php/t-1244339.html


Seems like they would convert to text if you call takes too long for iMessage to deliver.

 

[CEmajr]

When your phone is not connected to Wi-Fi:

If you are on a call, and someone sends you an iMessage, does the message get queued, and delivered when you disconnect from the call?

What if you attempt to send an iMessage while in a phone call? Does the message sit queued, and then go on its way when the call is disconnected?

If someone sends you an iMessage it sits in queue and waits until after you get off the call to deliver. If you try to send one while on a call it will automatically go ahead and send as a text message.

 

[DCIFRTHS]

https://forums.macrumors.com/archive/index.php/t-1244339.html


Seems like they would convert to text if you call takes too long for iMessage to deliver.

I wonder how long is too long? See my next post for more information. BTW, Thanks for the link.

 

[DCIFRTHS]

If someone sends you an iMessage it sits in queue and waits until after you get off the call to deliver. If you try to send one while on a call it will automatically go ahead and send as a text message.

You're correct, but your second statement depends on who initiates the iMessage.

The reason I have posted this topic is because I am almost ready to make the move from AT&T to Verizon, but there are two things delaying my departure. Verizon's lack of simultaneous voice and data, as well as, AT&T's faster HSPA speeds when LTE isn't available on Verizon.

Okay - Both phones are on active calls during all of my tests, running the latest versions iOS 7.x, with read notifications turned off.

When sending an iMessage from an iPhone 4 on AT&T to an iPhone 5 on Sprint: iMessage immediately sends, and a second or two later shows the message status as "delivered". Unfortunately, the message is not yet delivered to the phone on the Sprint network yet.

I'm guessing the message is either sitting on an Apple server, or it is sitting on a Sprint server. The reason I thought it may be a Sprint server is because the status is showing as "delivered". After reading the thread at the link in the previous post, I am now convinced that the message is sitting on Apple's server. If it is on Apple's server, then I would classify this as either a bug, or poor coding on Apple's part because the message was not "delivered" - it was queued for delivery, and it's status should reflect that.

After the Sprint call is disconnected, the message is then delivered to the Sprint phone. Obviously, there is no change to the status of the message on the sending phone as it already shows the message as "delivered".

Doing a 180, and sending the iMessage from the Sprint phone, that has an active voice connection, it is not sent as an iMessage, but rather as an SMS text, and is delivered to the AT&T phone as a text message - without delay. No delivery confirmation, on either phone, as expected.

I'm wondering if iMessage works the same way using a Verizon phone instead of a Sprint phone, but I don't have access to a Verizon phone to test with. I'm guessing it's the same - both Sprint, and Verizon are CDMA - and neither support simultaneous voice and data, with an iPhone 5s, but you never know...

Am I asking too much from iMessage? Possibly... but I text a lot, and rely on the "delivered" message to know that the message I sent has been delivered to the phone I have sent to. Apple even goes the extra mile by offering the bubble that shows the other person is typing an iMessage, so they obviously tired to make it as user friendly as possible - too bad they missed the mark in a phone that can't do data and voice simultaneously.

If anyone that can test with Verizon, and post the results, that would be awesome, and greatly appreciated.

 

[I7guy]

If you require simultaneous voice and data verizon is not for you. That said it is rumored that verizon will release some updates to its lte network that will allow simultaneous voice and network.

(Been in meetings haven't had a chance to test)

 

[CEmajr]

You're correct, but your second statement depends on who initiates the iMessage.

The reason I have posted this topic is because I am almost ready to make the move from AT&T to Verizon, but there are two things delaying my departure. Verizon's lack of simultaneous voice and data, as well as, AT&T's faster HSPA speeds when LTE isn't available on Verizon.

Okay - Both phones are on active calls during all of my tests, running the latest versions iOS 7.x, with read notifications turned off.

When sending an iMessage from an iPhone 4 on AT&T to an iPhone 5 on Sprint: iMessage immediately sends, and a second or two later shows the message status as "delivered". Unfortunately, the message is not yet delivered to the phone on the Sprint network yet.

I'm guessing the message is either sitting on an Apple server, or it is sitting on a Sprint server. The reason I thought it may be a Sprint server is because the status is showing as "delivered". After reading the thread at the link in the previous post, I am now convinced that the message is sitting on Apple's server. If it is on Apple's server, then I would classify this as either a bug, or poor coding on Apple's part because the message was not "delivered" - it was queued for delivery, and it's status should reflect that.

After the Sprint call is disconnected, the message is then delivered to the Sprint phone. Obviously, there is no change to the status of the message on the sending phone as it already shows the message as "delivered".

Doing a 180, and sending the iMessage from the Sprint phone, that has an active voice connection, it is not sent as an iMessage, but rather as an SMS text, and is delivered to the AT&T phone as a text message - without delay. No delivery confirmation, on either phone, as expected.

I'm wondering if iMessage works the same way using a Verizon phone instead of a Sprint phone, but I don't have access to a Verizon phone to test with. I'm guessing it's the same - both Sprint, and Verizon are CDMA - and neither support simultaneous voice and data, with an iPhone 5s, but you never know...

Am I asking too much from iMessage? Possibly... but I text a lot, and rely on the "delivered" message to know that the message I sent has been delivered to the phone I have sent to. Apple even goes the extra mile by offering the bubble that shows the other person is typing an iMessage, so they obviously tired to make it as user friendly as possible - too bad they missed the mark in a phone that can't do data and voice simultaneously.

If anyone that can test with Verizon, and post the results, that would be awesome, and greatly appreciated.

Yeah that's what I was saying. Verizon works that same way just like Sprint. When you're on a call it will automatically send as an SMS from your Verizon phone and deliver to the other person as an SMS without delay.

I used to be on Verizon and the lack of simultaneous voice/data was one of the reasons I left. I didn't have very much problem with only being able to send SMS while on calls, but it was the first part that irritated me. The receiving of them. The fact that people who were sending me iMessages, I would always get a barrage of them right after ending my phone call. To the person who is sending you an iMessage while you're on a call it will still show "delivered" but you won't be able to actually receive it on your end until you end the call or go into a WiFi area.

Another thing is that my friends and I use the group messaging feature a lot. You won't be able to send or receive group SMS on Verizon while on a phone call even if you have a WiFi connection.

If iMessages being delivered is a big deal to you I would not go to Verizon nor Sprint.

 

[scaredpoet]

I'm guessing the message is either sitting on an Apple server, or it is sitting on a Sprint server. The reason I thought it may be a Sprint server is because the status is showing as "delivered". After reading the thread at the link in the previous post, I am now convinced that the message is sitting on Apple's server. If it is on Apple's server, then I would classify this as either a bug, or poor coding on Apple's part because the message was not "delivered" - it was queued for delivery, and it's status should reflect that.

While to be totally accurate, Apple should be marking queued messages as such, the reality is that getting a "queued" status would likely cause a lot of complaints by users who aren't familiar with the nuances of CDMA networks, and their inflexibility with voice and data running simultaneously on a single channel.

It boils down to who would complain more: the informed users who know what's going on and wish the status would be more semantically accurate, or the vast majority of users who don't know and don't care about the differences in cellular networks, and get easily confused over the difference between an iMessage that failed, and an iMessage that's going to get there eventually, it's just waiting for someone to get off the phone first.

I imagine the likes of Verizon would also be unhappy with this feature clearly showing the limitations of their network, and Apple would probably have gotten some push-back there.

In any case, changing the status labels doesn't resolve the issue: iMessages won't deliver on a CDMA-connected iPhone during a voice call, if not also connected to WiFi. The lack of ability to do data and voice on the CDMA channel is still a huge reason why Verizon isn't even a consideration for me. CDMA would have to be completely gone for me to consider them at this point.

 

[T5BRICK]

I used to be on Verizon and the lack of simultaneous voice/data was one of the reasons I left.

My wife just switched from her individual Verizon account and I added her to my AT&T plan. In the past she would make comments like "why does it matter, if you're on a call you don't need to be browsing the internet..."

Just a few days after switching she commented on how useful it is being able to use voice and data at the same time.

 

[Applejuiced]

One of the many inconveniences of CDMA tech...

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If you require simultaneous voice and data verizon is not for you. That said it is rumored that verizon will release some updates to its lte network that will allow simultaneous voice and network.

(Been in meetings haven't had a chance to test)

That will require a new phone, not just an update on the carriers side.
You will need a phone that will be able to use LTE for voice and data.

 

[rockitdog]

My wife just switched from her individual Verizon account and I added her to my AT&T plan. In the past she would make comments like "why does it matter, if you're on a call you don't need to be browsing the internet..."

Just a few days after switching she commented on how useful it is being able to use voice and data at the same time.

I disagree. I switched to Verizon 2 weeks ago thinking I would miss this functionality but I haven't had to deal with it even once. The only time I would be doing this is most likely when I'm at home on Wi-Fi where I am able to do this with Verizon. Not like I can talk/surf while I drive.

I think this is one of the more overrated aspects of AT&T vs. Verizon, IMO.

 

[Applejuiced]

I disagree. I switched to Verizon 2 weeks ago thinking I would miss this functionality but I haven't had to deal with it even once. The only time I would be doing this is most likely when I'm at home on Wi-Fi where I am able to do this with Verizon. Not like I can talk/surf while I drive.

I think this is one of the more overrated aspects of AT&T vs. Verizon, IMO.

Keep telling yourself that
Its a deal breaker for sure for me.
I rather be able to use apps that need data, get imessages and just do stuff in general when on a call without anything else not working till I hang up.

 

[rockitdog]

Keep telling yourself that
Its a deal breaker for sure for me.
I rather be able to use apps that need data, get imessages and just do stuff in general when on a call without anything else not working till I hang up.

For me, I'm guessing that honestly talking on my phone is probably is something that I do for 5-10% of the time. I hardly talk on my phone these days, go figure, right?

 

[Applejuiced]

I talk about 400 minutes a month but you never know when or where you will be or what you'll be doing when someone does call you I guess.
If Im using gps navigation I shouldn't have to hang up and not be able to take a call so I don't get lost for example and many other things.

 

[I7guy]

When your phone is not connected to Wi-Fi:

If you are on a call, and someone sends you an iMessage, does the message get queued, and delivered when you disconnect from the call?

What if you attempt to send an iMessage while in a phone call? Does the message sit queued, and then go on its way when the call is disconnected?

Tested this and the imessage goes through. My friend has a 5. I called and then imessaged whilst on the call. imessage went through, I saw the notification pop-up while we were on the phone.

edit: had wifi on. My bad.

Turned wifi off and imessage went as SMS.

 

[I7guy]

I talk about 400 minutes a month but you never know when or where you will be or what you'll be doing when someone does call you I guess.
If Im using gps navigation I shouldn't have to hang up and not be able to take a call so I don't get lost for example and many other things.

I've had verizon for 15 years and somehow this never popped up on the list of must haves. I guess to each their own; while I can see it might be useful to use data and voice at the same time...it is coming to the iphone 5s at some point in the future.

 

[DCIFRTHS]

...Turned wifi off and imessage went as SMS.

I believe the reason your iMessage went through without being queued is because you are sending from Verizon, so while you are on a call, iMessage is not available - iOS knows this, and sends it as an SMS.

When I send from AT&T, to Verizon or Sprint, the message does not get sent as an SMS - it stays in "limbo" because iOS sees iMessage as being available, so it doesn't send it as an SMS.

 

[DCIFRTHS]

My wife just switched from her individual Verizon account and I added her to my AT&T plan. In the past she would make comments like "why does it matter, if you're on a call you don't need to be browsing the internet..."

Just a few days after switching she commented on how useful it is being able to use voice and data at the same time.

I use it all the time, and I love it

My issue is that while AT&T has improved their network by leaps and bounds in my area (I used to drop calls whenI had 4 or 5 bars, and data was often unusable) Verizon still has a slight edge in voice quality, and in a few areas, coverage.

The downside to Verizon is their lack of concern for allowing the customer to lock down their femtocell (network extender) which I need in my apartment, and no simultaneous voice and data.

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I talk about 400 minutes a month but you never know when or where you will be or what you'll be doing when someone does call you I guess.
If Im using gps navigation I shouldn't have to hang up and not be able to take a call so I don't get lost for example and many other things.

Good point. I hadn't thought of GPS. I use a dedicated GPS, so this wouldn't affect me, but I'm glad you brought it up.

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For me, I'm guessing that honestly talking on my phone is probably is something that I do for 5-10% of the time. I hardly talk on my phone these days, go figure, right?

I don't make many calls, but when I do, they are usually long ones, and I am checking email, looking things up on the web, and texting at the same time. The most important is the texting... oh yeah, and looking up movie times

 

[T5BRICK]

I think this is one of the more overrated aspects of AT&T vs. Verizon, IMO.

This is exactly the kind of thing my wife used to say..."who cares, it's not like it's THAT important." And now that she has the ability, she thinks it's great. I use it all the time and it's enough to prevent me from switching to Verizon.

I guess to each their own; while I can see it might be useful to use data and voice at the same time...it is coming to the iphone 5s at some point in the future.

Is it? I've read that the iPhone 5/5c/5s lack the needed hardware to do this.

 

[DCIFRTHS]

This is exactly the kind of thing my wife used to say..."who cares, it's not like it's THAT important." And now that she has the ability, she thinks it's great. I use it all the time and it's enough to prevent me from switching to Verizon.



Is it? I've read that the iPhone 5/5c/5s lack the needed hardware to do this.

I believe the iPhone 5/5c/5s all lack the additional antenna and RF path needed for simultaneous voice and data. Anandtec

Maybe I7Guy is referring to VoLTE? Is Verizon planning an imminent release of VoLTE? I'm not sure if VoLTE is something that requires different hardware. I'm off to check...

 

[I7guy]

This is exactly the kind of thing my wife used to say..."who cares, it's not like it's THAT important." And now that she has the ability, she thinks it's great. I use it all the time and it's enough to prevent me from switching to Verizon.



Is it? I've read that the iPhone 5/5c/5s lack the needed hardware to do this.

There are several web articles that explain voice over lte. Don't need additional phone hardware.

I think simultaneous voice and data is overrated, however:

1. iPhone is popular, FaceTime audio is available.
2. As people with 10 gig caps on family share plans keep saying wifi is all over the place. In the tri state area my cable provider has blanketed the area with wifi hotspots. Most hotels have free wifi.
3. Voice over lte will essentially be hd voice, so that will be cool.

As I said, to each their SVD is not important to me, but to others it's a deal breaker.

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I use it all the time, and I love it

My issue is that while AT&T has improved their network by leaps and bounds in my area (I used to drop calls whenI had 4 or 5 bars, and data was often unusable) Verizon still has a slight edge in voice quality, and in a few areas, coverage.

The downside to Verizon is their lack of concern for allowing the customer to lock down their femtocell (network extender) which I need in my apartment, and no simultaneous voice and data.

----------



Good point. I hadn't thought of GPS. I use a dedicated GPS, so this wouldn't affect me, but I'm glad you brought it up.

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I don't make many calls, but when I do, they are usually long ones, and I am checking email, looking things up on the web, and texting at the same time. The most important is the texting... oh yeah, and looking up movie times

Did you see my reply about the network extender? It's true it's not locked down but:

1 have to be within 15 feet to activate your phone.
2 only one unmanaged phone number is allowed to connect at one time if you have a managed device.

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Yeah that's what I was saying. Verizon works that same way just like Sprint. When you're on a call it will automatically send as an SMS from your Verizon phone and deliver to the other person as an SMS without delay.

I used to be on Verizon and the lack of simultaneous voice/data was one of the reasons I left. I didn't have very much problem with only being able to send SMS while on calls, but it was the first part that irritated me. The receiving of them. The fact that people who were sending me iMessages, I would always get a barrage of them right after ending my phone call. To the person who is sending you an iMessage while you're on a call it will still show "delivered" but you won't be able to actually receive it on your end until you end the call or go into a WiFi area.

Another thing is that my friends and I use the group messaging feature a lot. You won't be able to send or receive group SMS on Verizon while on a phone call even if you have a WiFi connection.

If iMessages being delivered is a big deal to you I would not go to Verizon nor Sprint.

Coverage and quality is my first priority, which is why I would never consider ATT or tmobile. Some if the places I go verizon has the best coverage.

To me I could care less about SVD. As I keep saying, to each their own.

 

[DCIFRTHS]

Did you see my reply about the network extender? It's true it's not locked down but:

1 have to be within 15 feet to activate your phone.
2 only one unmanaged phone number is allowed to connect at one time if you have a managed device.

Yes. I did see your message, and thanks for answering my questions. I have another one for you, so I will post it in that thread.

 

[rockitdog]

This is exactly the kind of thing my wife used to say..."who cares, it's not like it's THAT important." And now that she has the ability, she thinks it's great. I use it all the time and it's enough to prevent me from switching to Verizon.

Again, I make most of my calls when I'm in the car and therefore not able to browse the web or use data or am in a WiFi area where I can do both. So for me, this is really a non issue. Having a Ferrari that goes 200 mph would also be great but its not going to stop me from buying a more affordable car that does what I need it to do.