The other "similar" small systems were never pitched as the machine with the best performance.
They were honestly pitched as stylish, rather than powerful.
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MP 7,1 Waiting for Mac Pro 7,1 A1991 (no more)
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They were honestly pitched as stylish, rather than powerful.
I've been looking into custom PC's lately not for work but for gaming. I won't lie. I have wondered what I could do to have a setup where I use both PC and Mac together.
Convenient thing for me is since I have a cheese grater Mac Pro the important things like GPU, ram, pcie cards can be kept no matter what I'm using.
Convenient thing for me is since I have a cheese grater Mac Pro the important things like GPU, ram, pcie cards can be kept no matter what I'm using.
I don't know where you get this info, but seems quite impossible to me.
The nMP is driving one CPU and 2 GPU, each GPU D700 is literally a downclocked 7970, nothing close to a low TDP GPU (the original 7970 is 250W TDP).
The iMac Pro even though can go up to Vega 64 (standard 295W TDP). I am 100% sure it will be downclocked like the D700. At the end, I don't think one Vega (iMac version) has higher TDP then 2x D700.
Also the nMP's fan can almost stay idle all the time, and none of those CPU / GPU will reach 100C like the iMac does. Even though the iMac pro's cooling system is improved, but it's just roughly improved proportionally to its TDP increase. That mean, cooling ability per TDP hasn't change. In this case, it means we can roughly using the current iMac's cooling ability as a reference. Which means, it's bad. Or much worse than any Mac Pro.
By considering both the nMP and the iMac Pro are using 500W PSU. I am sure the nMP's cooling system can handle only one higher TDP GPU, and most likely do it better than (if not much better than) the iMac Pro. Just Apple didn't give us this choice.
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The MP6,1 is 450 watt, even worse. (As in "the Imac Pro is 'bad', the MP6,1 is 'worse'".)
The MP6,1 "thermal core" is designed for one higher wattage CPU, and two lower wattage GPUs. Very asymmetric.
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Oh, I miss read that's 450W + 50W, but you are right, that's just 450W PSU.
Anyway, isn't that the thermal core a metal (thermal conductor)? It doesn't matter which side in contact with the thermal source. It should able to draw out the same amount of heat (obviously, any side is large enough to allow the GPU make full contact). It's just a shared heatsink. If the other short side will be wasted, then all the tower heat sinks on PC would not work well either (because there are lots of surface that are not in contact with the GPU / CPU).
The 2013 MP is a vertical wind tunnel. They could reduce the three logic boards to two logic boards, one for the GPU and one for the rest and organised the two boards parallel to each other. Couple that with some heat sinks on the processors to improve heat transfer from processors to air and an increased air velocity across the heat sinks using constrictions. Probably would work better that the iMac Pro design.
Of course they said the 2013 MP was in a thermal corner in order to smooth the way for a modular MP, to let the complainers have an easy win and distance the future modular MP from iMac Pro/2013 MP.
If the 2013 was a complete failure, they would not have built the iMac Pro as both computer share the same philosophy plus/minus a screen attached. Not all professionals need local massive compute power and massive local storage and for those, the iMac Pro/2013 MP is maybe a good option.
I guess the lowest end future modular Mac Pro plus an Apple designed screen will be >5000 USD.
Of course they said the 2013 MP was in a thermal corner in order to smooth the way for a modular MP, to let the complainers have an easy win and distance the future modular MP from iMac Pro/2013 MP.
If the 2013 was a complete failure, they would not have built the iMac Pro as both computer share the same philosophy plus/minus a screen attached. Not all professionals need local massive compute power and massive local storage and for those, the iMac Pro/2013 MP is maybe a good option.
I guess the lowest end future modular Mac Pro plus an Apple designed screen will be >5000 USD.
Agreed, as long as we also keep in mind that there's a lot of distance between a good design and a good implementation based on it. The former does not guarantee the success of the latter.
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Ah, I didn't mean that there will be problems with the iMac Pro's thermal envelope. It's just that it won't be a problem for future upgrades, since upgrades are impossible in iMac anyway.
I think another thing people aren't taking into consideration is that when you take the fan shroud off a full size card they are still long and wide but very thin. Thin enough to easily fit inside something like an iMac pro as long as it can be cooled properly.
However the market did not go in the direction of workstation grade short video cards. You would have to use the mobile laptop version to fit in a trash can Mac Pro.
The reality is that thermal restrictions or not you just can't fit a full length Nvidia or amd card into that trash can. They would be sticking out of the top.
[doublepost=1504733541][/doublepost]I think the Mac Pro 7,1 will be a system where those who need it will buy it. Those who don't will probably buy something else.
Then there will be those who really don't need it but want it anyway. They will have to decide if it's financially worth it.
However the market did not go in the direction of workstation grade short video cards. You would have to use the mobile laptop version to fit in a trash can Mac Pro.
The reality is that thermal restrictions or not you just can't fit a full length Nvidia or amd card into that trash can. They would be sticking out of the top.
[doublepost=1504733541][/doublepost]I think the Mac Pro 7,1 will be a system where those who need it will buy it. Those who don't will probably buy something else.
Then there will be those who really don't need it but want it anyway. They will have to decide if it's financially worth it.
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Does anyone think the existing 2013 macpro 6,1 will continue to be sold when the new 7,1 is finally out? Also will the price drop to reasonable range to take into account that it old tech?
That's an intriguing thought.
Keep it around as something stylish between a mini and the mMP.
I bought the 3,1 (after an opportunity to upgrade from a 2,1) for reasons of longevity. As a SysEng, and part time developer who dabbles in CAD in the off hours, my hardware demands are nowhere near 'pro' level. However spending 4k almost a decade ago on a reliable machine that I still use today to write this message on is quite a bargain. Especially compared to the near yearly upgrades or 'RMA situations' I have with the Dells/HPs that sit in the other rooms that run everything from NFS services, esxi, Mach3, and even games.
Given that a used 5,1 here still costs as much as the 6,1, I'm rather eagerly awaiting what the 7,1 will look like. If for whatever it costs, that investment will carry me for another decade, then it will be a sound financial decision for myself. Despite what a fair number of opinionated solipsists on here think in regards to semantics and usage cases.
To me it sounds like you are able to justify it. You got good use out of your machine.
I expect it will go into the Clearance Store for new stock remaining.
Even better, Apple should face the music and realize that the v2 processors and ancient GPUs in the MP6,1 aren't going to be available much longer. (Intel's stopped making v2 CPUs, and is selling inventory.)
Update the MP6,1 to a newer generation Core i7 (maybe X) and one newer generation ATI GPU with an option for dual GPU. Add T-Bolt 3 and USB 3.1. Motherboards are cheap to make.
But you're right - it makes too much sense for Apple to actually do it.
Just back after a long time away from this forum.
Very disappointed that Apple is not supporting the high possibilities.
Seems counter to their stated purpose.
I've seriously considered the viability of a low-to-mid-range spec nMP for home use, combining the ability to run a few relatively lightly loaded VMs (lifting them from my current AMD Turion-based Linux server) with running my most common tasks, all on a single machine. The current main drawback for that scenario is, of course, still paying retail price for 2013 vintage hardware.
But as another user mentioned, my personal computing needs (that is: Those not covered by my employer) change slowly enough that I can well imagine paying the equivalent of a few thousand dollars every tenth year for a machine that is built to last and which at the same time is silent and nice enough to look at.
I'd be happy with the 2009 cheese-grater chassis with updated tech.
Seriously, don't care if it looks new or cool. Just gimme power, legacy+new ports, ACCESS, and upgradability.
Seriously, don't care if it looks new or cool. Just gimme power, legacy+new ports, ACCESS, and upgradability.
About the only thing that could be saved would be the outer shell. Nothing else in the system is compatible with updated tech.
And, if everything on the inside is new - why compromise by using the same outer shell?
The cheese grater case is very large for what it delivers (like only 4 HDD mounts and only 4 PCIe slots). And its handles are uncomfortably sharp.