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6-10 months, according to the buyer's guide.


Several of us long-time Mac users on the boards are seriously checking out other PC laptops, such as the Envy 14. It makes no compromises. And frankly, a 13" platform is too small to put good hardware in. Look at how much the 13" Vaio Z costs for its hardware. The MBP 13" will most likely keep the 320M or something similar next round, and get a Core i3 (no i5 with the current cooling system). So if you're willing to wait 6-10 months for that kind of minimal upgrade, do so. But if you really need power in a small chassis, you'll need to look in something other than a Mac laptop. The choice is yours.

But I just don't associate HP with quality .. maybe it's just me and my personal experiences with HP.
 
My kind of dilemma

i'd probably wait as well in your position.
i just had to replace my dead macbook and the 13'' was unsatisfactory (for the C2d as you said).

ended up with a vaio z.
i miss OS X, but the hardware compensates :)
regarding the command line,, i've found that cygwin is a viable option.

when the sony will die, i can hopefully go back to a powerful and updated mac .

I'd be interested in hearing what your overall user experience is with Sony down the road. I have Ubuntu Lucid Linx running on my son's laptop and find that I'm liking it more and more even if it's on an HP. But OS X still remains my first choice.
 
I would love to see a 13" MBP with an i3 CPU and a high-resolution (1440x900) antiglare display. Couldn't be more ideal than that for me.

In any case, if Apple doesn't make clear by mid-June (WWDC) when it will [truly] refresh the 13" MBP then I will end up purchasing a ThinkPad, which I expect to last me at least a couple of years.
 
I'd be interested in hearing what your overall user experience is with Sony down the road. I have Ubuntu Lucid Linx running on my son's laptop and find that I'm liking it more and more even if it's on an HP. But OS X still remains my first choice.

my plan is to install linux as well, i like fedora.

let me start with the bad news first:

linux is not fully working on the z, the main issue being the graphics switching.
you're basically stuck with the nvidia and there are problems with sleep/hibernate.
this means you can say goodbye to the battery life, right now linux is good only when on AC.

on the plus side, in the linux world things move fast, it shouldn't be long before a solution comes out.

in the meantime you can either virtualize linux, or "improve" windows 7 for free.
you have cygwin offering all the useful *nix tools on the command line, and an xorg server (the integration level is similar to what you get on OS X).
i've found virtuawin to provide a working no-frills multiple desktops solution.

the user experience is exactly as it is supposed to be.
despite the low weight, the feeling is of a very high build quality.
it wakes up from sleep immediately, and an excellent lcd welcomes you (1600x900 on mine, in my opinion the higher-res is a bit of a stretch on a 13'').
you launch a program, it's there in a blink. start working -keyboard is a pleasure to use-, leave some job in the background..
repeat n times and it does not skip a beat, i guess raid0 ssd is helping.
with some checkboxing, w7 leaves you doing your stuff without disturbing;
no stability issues until now.
close the lid, instantenous sleep.

the only instance in which you have to wait (up to 5 seconds), is when switching graphics intel<->nvidia. i do this every once in a while, not an issue.

sony engineering did some magic here, you can use the laptop on your lap all the time,
the exhaust is doing its job of blowing out the heat on the left side.
i don't know how they did it, it may also depends on the choice of hybrid plastic-carbon fiber on the bottom.

noise: everybody agrees on the fact that the fan is clearly audible during high loads. not a big surprise to me, but it's better to know this in advance.

THREE WARNINGS:

1) some users are complaining about the fan noise at low load. i cannot hear it unless i'm in a completely silent room and even there i find it not disturbing.
you may want to check this personally.

2) one user with the i7 found cpu throttling when both the cpu and gpu are at 100% load.
this to me would be an extremely serious flaw.
i've tested this thouroghly and i don't have this problem. (mind, i have an i5).
just to be on the safe side, be sure to have a return option if you opt for the i7.

3) it looks like driving an external monitor at 2560*1600 can be tricky/not doable.
i have not researched the issue because i simply don't care.
again, something to check if you're interested.

i'll avoid all the stuff you can easily find in reviews, plus this post is becoming huge anyway :)
let me know if you need some specific info.
 
Anyone care to guess when the next refresh might be? I'm going to plug away on my 12" PB until I see a worthy replacement. I do not want to pay for C2D technology at this point
I don't see anything wrong with C2D for this model and neither does Apple. Especially for "command line work". One can wait and guess forever. If you need a new laptop now is the time. There will never be a perfect model.
 
But I just don't associate HP with quality .. maybe it's just me and my personal experiences with HP.

Well said!

I have several laptops of different brands for different uses. I've had two HP business class machines. They've been true disappointments to say the least. Also HP consistantly ranks at the bottom for reliability and tech support.

My experience as a multiplatformist has taught me the finest laptops are MacBook Pro's and ThinkPad's (if you want a PC).
 
Anyone care to guess when the next refresh might be?

I'm going to plug away on my 12" PB until I see a worthy replacement. I do not want to pay for C2D technology at this point in the product life cycle. I've been patient this long and can wait a bit longer. I don't know if Intel and Nvidia will shake hands, Apple will dump Intel in favor of something AMD may be coming out with or whatever other variables are in the equation.

But I do want an MBP that's not using end of life technology and that fits into 12-13 inches. 15" is not my choice. Mobiliy with power is. OS X and the command line is where I want to be.

This board is so great! Any thoughts on how long Apple will wait to refresh the 13"?

Reading the news mate AMD seem to be on the up. A LOT of new PC laptops seem to be using the new AMD chips along with Intel.
But I think Intel will still be more powerful yet I also think the new AMD's will stomp on the C2D's.
So, knowing Apple and Jobs I would not be surprised one little bit to see core i3 or low end i5's in the 13 inch MBP by the end of the year and certainly no later then mid next year. No reason for a Intel Core i5-430M not to be offered if not as a BTO at least and have a i3-350M as standard. I don't know what the thermals would be like though at the 13" only has one fan a opposed to two in the 15" and 17" models.
 
I think people are forgetting that the key idea for the 13" MacBook Pro is portability and ease of use. Therefore these additional performance gains aren't really necessary.

Right, let's go over a few things and see why they can't be added (Steve Jobs even said most of this himself and of course he isn't lying becase he knows i5 chips in the 13" would hav probably made him more money.

1. First of all, an i3 chip is pretty much pointless. It has no turbo boost so th performance is pretty much the same as a C2D chip, maybe with a slightly better battery life over the Duo but Ill come on to that later.

2. Core i5s in a 13" machine. Where do you think it's going to fit? Yes, other companies may use this chip in there 13" machines but do they look as sleek as the MBP? You can answer that one for yourself. Apple knows
it's hit a gold mine with the latest design and they're sticking with it. Furthermore, the i5 would require discrete graphics (because the Intel HD graphics are even worse than the 320M) and this wouldn't be able to fit due to the laptops size.

3. A higher resoluton and anti glare display. In my opinion a higher resolution would only make things worse on a 13" display, anyway we all know Apple make they're LCDs look amazing even though they might not have the best resolutions available. Regarding the anti glare option, I think that try are only offering on the higher machines because the black bezel is the main design feature across all it's products at the moment, so they want you to pay more
if you want to go against how they style thier products.

4. Once again the 13" was made for portability so most of these performance upgrades were probably not implemented because they would decrease the incredible battery life that this machine already has.

Written on an iPod. :apple:
 
Well said!

I have several laptops of different brands for different uses. I've had two HP business class machines. They've been true disappointments to say the least. Also HP consistantly ranks at the bottom for reliability and tech support.

My experience as a multiplatformist has taught me the finest laptops are MacBook Pro's and ThinkPad's (if you want a PC).

Agreed. HP's products and support are dismal. That's why even though they bought Palm I don't think they'll threaten Apple in the tablet market. Even their printers aren't what they used to be.
 
Z's sounding like a legit option save for batt

Thx Burp .. I'm going to seriously consider the Z.
 
I would love to see a 13" MBP with an i3 CPU and a high-resolution (1440x900) antiglare display. Couldn't be more ideal than that for me.

In any case, if Apple doesn't make clear by mid-June (WWDC) when it will [truly] refresh the 13" MBP then I will end up purchasing a ThinkPad, which I expect to last me at least a couple of years.

Apple isn't going to "make clear" anything regarding the 13" MBP by mid-June. Buy the ThinkPad and be done with this 'waiting for what I want' nonsense!
 
I don't see anything wrong with C2D for this model and neither does Apple. Especially for "command line work". One can wait and guess forever. If you need a new laptop now is the time. There will never be a perfect model.

I'm not so sure Apple had many options at this point. C2D is fading out and not for me. On the other hand when a truly viable refresh exists I'd be stuck waiting again to avoid a Rev A release. Might really need to look at the Z when Linux is fully there which probably won't be long ... but then that battery life ... arggg

I'm on the command line but need the power when I have to get GUI'y.
 
HP not an option

Well said!

I have several laptops of different brands for different uses. I've had two HP business class machines. They've been true disappointments to say the least. Also HP consistantly ranks at the bottom for reliability and tech support.

My experience as a multiplatformist has taught me the finest laptops are MacBook Pro's and ThinkPad's (if you want a PC).

I really would like to stay with mac. Any thoughts on the Z?
 
I really would like to stay with mac. Any thoughts on the Z?

Someone at my work is into Linux as a hobby and he brought a 12" or 11" can't remember exactly HP notebook of Ebay for about $200 or so to use Linux on. Maybe worth thinking about? It has a Centrino chip in it but he says it runs Linux just fine.
Perhaps you could get a Mac for normal use and find a cheap second hand Sony Vaio for your Linux?
 
have fun waiting for 2011!

hardware will always improve with progression of time

Apple sure are taking their sweet time catching up. I really want a MBP but can't justify buying a 13" right now considering it's not much more powerful than the MB I'm currently using. I'd love for them to shoehorn an i5 into that 13" MBP.
 
This board is so great! Any thoughts on how long Apple will wait to refresh the 13"?

For the love of... this again, already? I think it is safe to say not this year, not likely to the middle of next year. I was waiting for a 13" and ended up going with a 15" model. I am very happy with it. Sure I would have liked it to be a little lighter, but the graphics and speed is worth the increase in size.
 
I must say, putting C2D processors in the 13" was a very smart marketing move by Apple. I was going to buy a 13" MBP when I thought they would have an iX processor, but when the refresh came and the 13"es had C2Ds, it pushed me into buying a 15" MBP.

Damn you, Apple.
 
I think people are forgetting that the key idea for the 13" MacBook Pro is portability and ease of use. Therefore these additional performance gains aren't really necessary.

Isn't that what the 13" Macbook is for? When they added a 13" model to the MBP family, I assumed they would try to max out performance like in the 15" and 17". The leaked refreshed Macbook has the exact same specs except for the 8gb RAM that the Pro is capable of. I'm not trying to complain because I realize the architecture of the 13" doesn't allow for a i5+CPU, but I find it disturbing to see the base Macbook is almost as powerful as the base 13" MBP
 
Isn't that what the 13" Macbook is for? When they added a 13" model to the MBP family, I assumed they would try to max out performance like in the 15" and 17". The leaked refreshed Macbook has the exact same specs except for the 8gb RAM that the Pro is capable of. I'm not trying to complain because I realize the architecture of the 13" doesn't allow for a i5+CPU, but I find it disturbing to see the base Macbook is almost as powerful as the base 13" MBP

If the new MacBook does appear to have those specs from the rumors then I wouldn't be surprised if the price went up, just like the 13" MBPs. That would make the price difference not that much anyway, so more people are likely to spend that little bit extra to get the more "Pro" features.
 
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