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'We No Longer Have Moral Compass'

E

ErikCLDR

macrumors 68000
Original poster
Jan 14, 2007
1,795
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I highly suggest you watch the accompanying surveillance video. This is also being showed on national news including shows like Inside Edition.

Video on this page: http://www.wfsb.com/news/16497579/detail.html
HARTFORD, Conn. -- Hartford Police Chief Daryl Roberts questioned the city's "moral compass" a week after bystanders and drivers maneuvered around the motionless body of 78-year-old victim of a hit-and-run crash.

Angel Torres was crossing Park Street after purchasing milk from a local grocery store on Friday evening when he was struck. Police said Torres was hit by a dark Honda that was chasing a tan Toyota.

Chief Roberts Responds To Hit-And-Run

Both vehicles then fled the scene, leaving Torres lying in the roadway's lane of oncoming traffic.

Surveillance video captured the crash and the startling response of witnesses.

The video captures Torres being thrown like a rag-doll by the car, which crossed the double yellow line before hitting Torres.

Roberts said that perhaps the most shocking part of the crime is the response it garnered from bystanders.

Nearly a dozen cars are seen driving around Torres' motionless body in the minute and 30-second long video, including one that stops and turns around as it approaches him.

"No one came to his aid," Roberts said. "There were actually people looking at him … and driving away."

Numerous pedestrian bystanders are seen gawking at the scene, but doing nothing.

"At the end of the day we've got to look at ourselves and understand that our moral values have now changed," Roberts said. "We have no regard for each other."

Police said Torres was found lying in the road by an officer responding to an unrelated call. He was transported to Hartford Hospital and is paralyzed from the neck down. He remained in critical condition on Thursday.

Police released the video on Wednesday in hopes that it will help lead to an arrest.

"My father is fighting for his life," said Torres' son, Angel Arce. "I would like the public right now to help us in identifying the car and the person that did this."

Roberts said the hit-and-run is the latest in a string of incidents that show the callousness of the city.

On Monday, former Deputy Mayor Nicholas Carbone, 71, was beaten and robbed while walking to breakfast. He remains in critical condition. Read the full story

"There was a time they would have helped that man across the street. Now they mug and assault him," Roberts said. "That's not a police problem. We no longer have a moral compass. Anything goes."

Anyone with information regarding the crash is urged to contact the Hartford Police Department by dialing 860-757-4225.
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Not only did those two jerks that hit the guy run away. No one even went over to help the guy and then cars just turn around or drive by. I know people from CT are jokingly stereotyped as snobby ******s but this really supports that stereotype. It's really shameful to see how people act sometimes.
 
I couldn't believe it when I read it. :(

This reminds me of that video of the guy who was punching an old man in the face, it was caught on camera and nobody nearby did anything. :mad:
 
iShater said:
I couldn't believe it when I read it. :(

This reminds me of that video of the guy who was punching an old man in the face, it was caught on camera and nobody nearby did anything. :mad:
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Recent studies have shown that whether anyone stops and does anything is closely related to how many people there are on the scene.

A solitary person coming across another person in distress like that will almost always stop and try to render assistance. The percentage that won't do so is actually very very small. If on the other hand it's a crowded area, it's common for dozens of people to walk right by and not help at all.

I don't have the link handy, but the authors of the study concluded that in a crowded situation, most people are basically thinking "someone else will get that." Whereas if it's just you and the victim on a lonely road somewhere, the imperative to offer assistance is greater because it's obvious that it's up to you and no one else, to do something.

I'm not defending those people's behaviour, but humans are not always as evil as they appear to be. ;)
 
Virgil-TB2 said:
I'm not defending those people's behaviour, but humans are not always as evil as they appear to be. ;)
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I don't think it's apathy either. If I saw this kind of event, I have to admit I'd wonder 1) is it some candid camera stunt? 2) is this some setup for a scam/robbery? Paranoid? Yes. Cynical? Yes. Indecisive? I'm not sure.
 
Dartholomew said:
I don't think it's apathy either. If I saw this kind of event, I have to admit I'd wonder 1) is it some candid camera stunt? 2) is this some setup for a scam/robbery? Paranoid? Yes. Cynical? Yes. Indecisive? I'm not sure.
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Actually there was a very unfortunate event maybe 10 years ago in Connecticut in a town near me. There was this haunted house that was open every Halloween season. A lady was crossing the street and was hit by a drunk driver and was killed (she may have been prego too but I can't remember). People thought it was just part of the Haunted House horrors and people complained to the people running it that it was very upsetting. Then they found out it wasn't part of the show.
 
ErikCLDR said:
Not only did those two jerks that hit the guy run away. No one even went over to help the guy and then cars just turn around or drive by. I know people from CT are jokingly stereotyped as snobby ******s but this really supports that stereotype. It's really shameful to see how people act sometimes.
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That is a well-known psychological phenomenon: The more people there are who could possibly help, the less each of them feels responsible. If the same thing happened on a lonely road, chances are very good that the first driver who passed by after an hour would have stopped and helped, because there was nobody else to help. With hundreds of people there, everyone thinks that someone else should do it.

And the same thing would have happened thirty years ago.
 
It makes me sick, but I'm not surprised.

I would have stopped and helped regardless of whether the street was packed or empty.

I once saw someone get beaten in London on a Friday morning near Kings Cross, a very busy area. This is in front of a major street, a bank, and CCTV. I don't want to sound self-righteous, but I helped, as did 2 other younger guys my age. Everyone else walked by. I had always thought maybe it had something to do with age, and naivety, like maybe I could change the world or something. Everyone else was older, possibly with children, and lived a comfy life and didn't want to "risk it all" on a stranger.

But I'm probably wrong. What Virgil-TB2 said makes sense to me.
 
Virgil-TB2 said:
Recent studies have shown that whether anyone stops and does anything is closely related to how many people there are on the scene.

A solitary person coming across another person in distress like that will almost always stop and try to render assistance. The percentage that won't do so is actually very very small. If on the other hand it's a crowded area, it's common for dozens of people to walk right by and not help at all.

I don't have the link handy, but the authors of the study concluded that in a crowded situation, most people are basically thinking "someone else will get that." Whereas if it's just you and the victim on a lonely road somewhere, the imperative to offer assistance is greater because it's obvious that it's up to you and no one else, to do something.

I'm not defending those people's behaviour, but humans are not always as evil as they appear to be. ;)
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There have been studies showing this phenomenon going back to the 60s, after Kitty Genovese was stabbed to death in full view of many (dozens?) of her neighbors in New York City (so this really isn't about society changing, as the police chief suggests). The attack went on for minutes, and at one point the attacker left for several minutes before coming back. One onlooker yelled, "you let that girl alone," and nobody else did anything. Part of that situation probably had to do with fearing for their own safety - but these people didn't even call the police from the security of their homes.

After the Kitty Genovese murder, there was an outcry from across the country, and the people in her neighborhood were branded as "evil." It was around that time that social psychologists began looking in to why having more people around seems to lead to less help.

So what I would say is that, as Virgil says, these people aren't necessarily "evil." Many are thinking, consciously or unconsciously, that 1) there are lots of other people around, many of whom are probably better qualified to help, 2) professional help has probably already been called, 3) if I intervene I could make things worse, and maybe end up getting sued.
 
To this day, if I encounter someone in distress or need of aid and I don't see police/fire/meds on scene already, I always stop and stay until relieved. I don't know any other way. Maybe it's because I was a firefighter & EMT (so long ago!) and the training & commitment stuck with me, or the way I was raised, or something else altogether, but I simply cannot comprehend people not coming to the aid of others.
 
hello, im from wethersfield CT, and im disgusted with the people in my capitol city a mere 5 miles away. The footage has been on the news and im disgusted with what happened.
 
Since the dawn of civilization, when have we ever been "moral"? "Morality" only improves vis a vis the incentives provided by society.
 
NT1440 said:
hello, im from wethersfield CT, and im disgusted with the people in my capitol city a mere 5 miles away. The footage has been on the news and im disgusted with what happened.
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I live up in the Farmington Valley. Wethersfield is a nice place (and where everyone moved to when they moved out of Hartford)

Hartford is in really tough shape. They have way too much crime- this, people getting murdered on a regular basis, yesterday there were the teens that stole a van and got chased by the cops and 1 of them ended up dying after rolling the car in the chase, and was it yesterday Nicholas Carbone (former Deputy Mayor of Hartford) was mugged for his wallet and now has a broken face and needs brain surgery. It's out of control down there and something really needs to be done. It seems to be getting worse. Street racing on in the streets of Hartford is nothing new either.

I mean, I see how people would be scared to do anything but there were so many people around and none of them did anything and no one called the police. I think that is just shameful. I think it's even worse just the fact that the people of Hartford are stuck in such a poor city with such bad people (not the people that didn't help, but the people that commit the crimes in the first place). My school "imports" Hartford kids to help give them a chance at a better education and create diversity in my 98.6% white town. Unfortunately most of them slack off, get in trouble, and don't integrate well with the upper middle class white suburban kids. It's sad.
 
So you go over, you have a look, you think perhaps you should roll up onto his back...

6 months later you're in court as he has sued your ass for $4m for causing total paralysis by mobilizing a fractured spine.

I don't know what I'd do in that situation, but I would imagine that I would halt traffic, I wouldn't touch him, I would ask someone to call 911, and shout for a nearby medical professional.

And not calling the police? 'Someone will already have called, I'd just get told off for wasting their time'

Not saying it's justified, right, or the actual reason - just playing devils advocate here. We live in a world, a world created by the US legal system, where anybody who does something that isn't utterly perfect, no matter how good their intentions, can get their ass sued to the middle of next year. People have been scared into doing nothing rather than anything, because anything might not be the right think.


Doug
 
This thread is quite sad, particularly regarding the fear of getting sued. That has NEVER crossed my mind in any sort of situation. It's probably naivety, or maybe Americans think about it more often because they're forced to. :confused:
 
People hear ONE story about some BS lawsuit that worked, but honestly 9/10 its a friend of a friend story...

and they think OMFG THEY GONNA SUE EVERYBODY FOR STEALING MY SHOES! (jerky boys ref FTW)

As a sound mind and body person, would YOU allow someone to sue a good Samaritan when in the same situation you would have done the same (or at least thought you would)? I highly doubt it.

Frivolous lawsuits abound, its no reason to be a callous-not-my-problem-person.
 
CNN
However, Roberts and other city officials backtracked on Thursday. After initially saying he was unsure whether anyone called 911, he and other city officials appeared at a news conference in which they said that four people dialed 911 within a minute of the accident, and that Torres received medical attention shortly after that.
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Lethal
 
You've got what looks like a hit and run - in a bad bit of town. Maybe they're going to come back and finish it off, maybe they're going to go after any do-gooders who might be witnesses, maybe the guy's injured in a way whereby moving him makes it worse, maybe he's armed, maybe the only sensible thing to do is phone the police ( which happened ) and leave the guy alone ( which happened )

To be honest, I see a whole lot of moral outrage here, when in my I'd wager those same people ranting against all of society, wouldn't do a damn thing differently

Doug
 
Torres is paralyzed and remains in critical condition in Hartford
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Don't know if I'd want to get involved with somebody hurt bad enough to be paralyzed.

I'm too afraid to worry about getting sued for inept help, and having to deal with police and media on the other end.
 
djellison said:
To be honest, I see a whole lot of moral outrage here, when in my I'd wager those same people ranting against all of society, wouldn't do a damn thing differently
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I'd take your bet......and likely win.


Don't assume that just because you wouldn't do anything about it, other people would do nothing as well. It's baseless. You probably just want to believe that because it would justify your own feelings on the situation. I'm certain that I wouldn't go around him in my car.
 
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