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Webkit is officially dead

M

Macbookprodude

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Original poster
Jan 1, 2018
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Hello,

So, I went to use Leopard Webkit only to find out that websites aren't opening. I think the certificates need to be updated.. This is why I am heavily against this shutting out older good working browsers.. While I do use TenFourFox on my Titanium 1ghz G4, I think Leopard Webkit works much faster. Is there a way to update the certificates, so Leopard Webkit can work again ?
 
No, it's not dead. Not remotely. Leopard Webkit works.

I'm replying to you from LWK. MacRumors works. I tried Amazon and eBay before that - they work.

If you're having problems with certain sites, it's those sites that are the problem.
 
Raging Dufus said:
No, it's not dead. Not remotely. Leopard Webkit works.

I'm replying to you from LWK. MacRumors works. I tried Amazon and eBay before that - they work.

If you're having problems with certain sites, it's those sites that are the problem.
Click to expand...
Thanks for quick reply.. it seems Wikipedia doesn't work for some reason.. and several other sites don't. Is there a way to update the certificates, or is there an updated Leopard Webkit available ?
 
Macbookprodude said:
Thanks for quick reply.. it seems Wikipedia doesn't work for some reason.. and several other sites don't. Is there a way to update the certificates, or is there an updated Leopard Webkit available ?
Click to expand...
Yes, I had the same problem with Wikipedia. It works with TenFourFox, and Arctic Fox.

LWK's certificates are up to date with Safari 11 from 2018. I just tried Safari 11.1.2 on El Capitan and it opened Wkikpedia just fine. Interestingly, Safari 9.1.3 on Mavericks had the same problem as LWK, and wouldn't open it.

I don't know what the problem is, but it's not likely to be certificates. The problem is on Wikipedia's end, and either they'll fix it or they won't. But coming on here and declaring something that a lot of us use as "officially dead" isn't helpful to anybody.
 
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Raging Dufus said:
Yes, I had the same problem with Wikipedia. It works with TenFourFox, and Arctic Fox.

LWK's certificates are up to date with Safari 11 from 2018. I just tried Safari 11.1.2 on El Capitan and it opened Wkikpedia just fine. Interestingly, Safari 9.1.3 on Mavericks had the same problem as LWK, and wouldn't open it.

I don't know what the problem is, but it's not likely to be certificates. The problem is on Wikipedia's end, and either they'll fix it or they won't. But coming on here and declaring something that a lot of us use as "officially dead" isn't helpful to anybody.
Click to expand...
Never used LWK, but I bet it would be trivial to update the certificates using the Mozilla CA certs (which I use in Links2 and PowerPC Media Center 7).

Links2 can still browse Wikipedia (and any non-javascript site).
 
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alex_free said:
Never used LWK, but I bet it would be trivial to update the certificates using the Mozilla CA certs (which I use in Links2 and PowerPC Media Center 7).

Links2 can still browse Wikipedia (and any non-javascript site).
Click to expand...
I hate to continue this abominably-titled thread, but...

@alex_free, that seems a worthwhile thing to do, and you're certainly capable of such a feat. However, here's why I don't think a security certificate will solve the issue:

If a certificate was the problem, shouldn't the browser return some kind of warning or at least information such as this (from Safari 5.1 on Snow Leopard):

Safari Screenshot 1.jpg


Instead, the Wikipedia site looks like this (again, Safari 5.1 on Snow Leo, but LWK on Leo is doing the exact same thing):

Safari Screenshot 2.jpeg


It just hangs there, without going any further. I'm no browser developer, so I could be all wrong. But shouldn't it at least alert you to the problem, if the problem was security-related?
 
Wikipedia is an odd one. It'll only open on certain old browsers. I can't remember specific versions but it works fine with some 2000s browsers then doesn't work with some mid-2010s browsers. Wouldn't say it's a sign of Webkit being dead.

check your CMOS time too, doubt that's the problem but that will instantly break most of the web.
 
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Raging Dufus said:
I hate to continue this abominably-titled thread, but...

@alex_free, that seems a worthwhile thing to do, and you're certainly capable of such a feat. However, here's why I don't think a security certificate will solve the issue:

If a certificate was the problem, shouldn't the browser return some kind of warning or at least information such as this (from Safari 5.1 on Snow Leopard):

View attachment 1698670

Instead, the Wikipedia site looks like this (again, Safari 5.1 on Snow Leo, but LWK on Leo is doing the exact same thing):

View attachment 1698673

It just hangs there, without going any further. I'm no browser developer, so I could be all wrong. But shouldn't it at least alert you to the problem, if the problem was security-related?
Click to expand...
It indeed is not a certificate problem, seems like TLS to me. I wonder what TLS version is actually required now on Wikipedia.
 
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alex_free said:
It indeed is not a certificate problem, seems like TLS to me. I wonder what TLS version is actually required now on Wikipedia.
Click to expand...
Is there a way to by pass and or deactivate the TLS with Wikipedia ? What site needs this if its an online ENCARTA ??? Its stupid.
 
Ok, so i TRIED to re-install LWK latest version, and its still not working.. I may try to download the updated 2020 certs from the above website and fuse them into LWK.
 
wicknix said:
You would be correct. It's not the certs. Lots of sites are moving to TLS 1.3 these days. Our LWK is only capable of up to TLS 1.2.
View attachment 1699035
Click to expand...
Picture_7.png

That's links2 above, I'm pretty sure TLS 1.3 support needs to be backported into LWK before it would work. Even if the OpenSSL was updated LWK wouldn't know how to handle TLS 1.3 connections as is. The best thing to do I guess would be to find the commit that added TLS 1.3 to webkit originally and go off that. Kind of insane TLS 1.3 is now required.
 
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wicknix said:
Times change. Remember back when SSL was the top dog? It doesn't surprise me one bit. Why wikipedia now requires it is beyond me though.
Click to expand...
One can almost make the argument that for logged in users it is useful. But only allowing an http override on certain browsers sporadically? If your removing the s from https I think you know what your getting into.
 
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Get the LWK source, backport TLS 1.3, add the new TLS 1.3 code to the LWK source and rebuild LWK. There really is no other way. To make things even worse, i know no 3rd party who ever successfully built LWK, including myself. It's not even remotely as straight forward as building mozilla based browsers.
 
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Oh, well, I guess I will use TenFourFox.. as this is the only browser which will work well under Leopard. Wish Tobias would update LWK. Its a shame to lose such a faster web browser.
 
Well now i'm not sure if it's TLS related. Just tested AF on XP and it doesn't have TLS 1.3 support either, yet it has no issue with wikipedia or hyperion-entertainment which both fail with LWK. *shrug*

hmmmm.jpg
 
Hi all,

I've been able to build some of the 53x versions of LWK but I did it in SL PPC
and they do not work properly so I do not know if it's SL PPC and the security
framework at fault or LWK the reason.

forums.macrumors.com

Snow Leopard on unsupported PPC machines

Hi all, So I've managed to build Webkit and the Webkit launcher app on my G5 running Leopard. I've also found what needs to be changed in the WebCore framework source code to get the builds from 537.32+ running on SL PPC. But now I'm facing a very strange problem every time I start loading a...
forums.macrumors.com forums.macrumors.com

Building the 6xx versions is harder/impossible following Tobias's instructions
because the sources retrieved from github do not match what they are supposed to
be.
Unfortunately Tobias has no interest in building them anymore and does not
have a "detailed" instruction set to do it.

@wicknix how far did you go?

Best regards,
voidRunner
 
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Then, tenfourfox is the only one we have left. While it is not too bad on my 1GHz titanium, it’s still sluggish in other areas.
 
Have you tried the new TenFourFox specific version of foxPEP? Heard good things about it, unless you already have a custom config it's definitely worth a try at least.
 
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