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macrumors bot
Original poster
Apr 12, 2001
56,559
19,312
Spymac notes a small mixup which supressed early information about Exposé and inadvertantly brought Piles to the forefront in the rumor scene.

MacEdition first wrote about a new feature called "Piles" -- and even linked to weblog describing Apple's old patent -- Piles.

MacEdition, however, went on to describe Exposé in the same article:

Mac OS X 10.3 will finally see the implementation of the “piles” interface concept patented by Apple back in the dear, dead days of Copland but never delivered to the desktop. The feature, which has been lobbied for by Bruce Tognazzini and other interface curmudgeons, is designed to ease the clutter of windows in the Finder: The Blade’s sources indicate that extraneous windows will shrink and jump out of the way automatically, rearranging themselves into scaled-down tiles in response to the user’s movements.)

This description was later lost after more detailed descriptions of Apple's Piles Patent emerged, and overtook the rumors.
 

mityx

macrumors newbie
Jul 17, 2002
8
0
Better that we have Expose

When the Piles rumors were milling about I couldn't quite figure out the usefulness of it.

Sure it sounded cool....but what would you really use it for?
Folders accomplish the same thing.

I'm glad we've got Expose instead of Piles.
Expose rocks! That feature alone makes me want to plunk down the $129.
 

Mudbug

Administrator emeritus
Jun 28, 2002
3,848
1
North Central Colorado
You know, I wondered about this when it first disappeared from the rumor pipeline. I couldn't figure out how so much hubub could be started about something that simply didn't exist. but I'm still a little confused - is expose an implimentation of piles, or something else entirely?
 

arn

macrumors god
Staff member
Apr 9, 2001
16,299
5,569
Originally posted by Mudbug
You know, I wondered about this when it first disappeared from the rumor pipeline. I couldn't figure out how so much hubub could be started about something that simply didn't exist. but I'm still a little confused - is expose an implimentation of piles, or something else entirely?

something else entirely

arn
 

beatle888

macrumors 68000
Feb 3, 2002
1,690
0
that is FUNNY. how we can have the truth in our hands and disregard it. actually thats SCARY!
 

jimthorn

macrumors 6502a
Apr 24, 2003
580
2
Huntington Beach, CA, USA
That's interesting. I hadn't made the conceptual link between Piles and Expose... it would seem that the rumor community had a lot of info about Expose, but didn't realize it.

For my money, Expose is about 100 times more exciting and useful than I ever imagined Piles could be. Bring on Panther!

And for pure entertainment value, I loved the Expose demo in the Keynote:

Steve: Zoom in. *click* Zoom out. *click* Boom. *click* Boom. *click* And Boom. *click*
Entire audience: *stunned silence with big grins*
 

beatle888

macrumors 68000
Feb 3, 2002
1,690
0
piles is not exposé. read the post again. exposé functionality was mentioned in the same article (or whatever the source was) as piles....two different things....this time we got exposé.
 

daytona63

macrumors member
Feb 11, 2002
63
0
San Diego, CA
What I think...

I dunno, but when I saw Expose, I was instantly reminded of piles. I know they perhaps act different, what with the former having to do with windows and the latter to do with files and such (seemingly), but I think it's all the same concept. Perhaps this is just a better implementation of that basic concept, or perhaps Apple is looking to go further than just Expose.
As a sidenote, Expose also reminded me a little bit of the way that computers were navigated in the movie "Minority Report." Basically, Expose allows the user to stand back and get a general view of everything going on in his computer, then focus in on the task at hand, just like in the movie. So yes, perhaps Expose is just the beginning...
 

coolfactor

macrumors 603
Jul 29, 2002
5,428
6,076
Vancouver, BC
Originally posted by simX
So can we assume that the screenshots of the Piles features were faked?

Yes, someone simply rotated some text clipping icons to create that fake. Piles are neat idea that could further distinguish OS X from other OS's, but it's not doing anything more than folders already do.

However, just like packages have drastically simplified the use of applications by grouping a collection of files into a single icon, I think Piles could do the same for documents. As a web developer, I'm frequently working on groups of related files, so a double-click on a pile to open up one of those groups would be very handy.
 

Freg3000

macrumors 68000
Sep 22, 2002
1,914
0
New York
Originally posted by jimthorn

Steve: Zoom in. *click* Zoom out. *click* Boom. *click* Boom. *click* And Boom. *click*
Entire audience: *stunned silence with big grins*

I have 8 more words to add to that:

Boom Boom Boom Boom Boom Boom Boom Boom! :)
 

paulie

macrumors member
Jan 14, 2003
38
0
Saskatoon, Canada
Expose and Piles

Having spent the better portion of a day using Expose now, I can see how the original Piles idea spawned this fantastic little tool.

When I first heard the rumors about piles, I was excited because my desktop is a mess. I have at least 4 or 5 different projects I'm working on, and people are always coming up to me asking to see where any given project is at. I was hoping I'd be able to sort my daily work into different piles, so I'd be able to more quickly access data when I needed to.

Expose makes it easy for me to keep my work open, saving me the time and hassle of having to open and close apps. It keeps work I don't need to immediately deal with out of the way, but within easy reach when a co-worker comes up and needs some vital information in a hurry.

Instead of using the old idea of piles to have my data sorted but unavailable, Expose lets me keep the resources I need closer at hand.

Expose is piles done right, though I will say that hot-corners with my innacurate mousing have become a bit annoying, and I've already turned them off (except for keeping bottom-right to show my desktop).

Bravo Apple, I can't wait to move from this Developer's release to the real deal.
 

ezmobius

macrumors newbie
Jun 25, 2003
5
0
wa state
In the apple patent for piles, they describe it as being an additional way to organize docs in addition to folders. Piles is supposed to be able to see into all folders and organize docs according to kind, size,when created,etc... but it also can organize files according to content, such as a common name, address, http, or anything else you can think of. To me this sounds like an extremely usefull feature. So while i can see how piles and expose' are easily confused expose is something entirely different(and maybe even more usefull):p
 

soosy

macrumors regular
May 6, 2002
224
3
I could see piles working very similar to Exposé, except on files rather than application windows. Seeing window contents with Exposé is so much more useful than seeing File Icons though. Still I think it would be useful....

Hey all the sudden it reminds me of the way OS 9 did spring-loaded folders. If you did a "click and half" on a folder then it would spring open temporarily w/o having to drag a file in. This would be very similar to piles. The folder is the collection of documents. You click and hold to temporarily open it. When you release, it closes.

Hmmmm... makes piles seem a little less necessary—a folder is already have collections of files! Yeah so it would behave/appear a little differently, but not dramatically so.
 

sinclairZX81

macrumors member
Dec 21, 2002
47
0
RAMTOP
Re: Better that we have Expose

Originally posted by mityx
When the Piles rumors were milling about I couldn't quite figure out the usefulness of it.

Sure it sounded cool....but what would you really use it for?
Folders accomplish the same thing.

no they don't.
 

bretm

macrumors 68000
Apr 12, 2002
1,951
27
Originally posted by coolfactor
However, just like packages have drastically simplified the use of applications by grouping a collection of files into a single icon, I think Piles could do the same for documents. As a web developer, I'm frequently working on groups of related files, so a double-click on a pile to open up one of those groups would be very handy.

Gosh I hate packages! In the past, I used to keep all sorts of stuff related to a piece of sofware (downloaded updates, plugins, pdf manuals, freeware add-ons, .sit files, etc.) within the folder where the application was. For example in Final Cut Pro folder I had a folder called "not installed by final cut pro" and that was all the stuff like additional plugins. Every time I updated FCP, I just made sure I backed up that folder. Thank goodness Adobe hasn't implemented the package thing. I know I could put the packages in a folder, but then it might screw up software update.
 

bretm

macrumors 68000
Apr 12, 2002
1,951
27
Re: Re: Better that we have Expose

Originally posted by sinclairZX81
no they don't.

Right. Piles showed the documents in the pile as you moused over. Way to extrapolate. Although I did liike the straightforward - no they don't quite a bit.
 

MasonMcD

macrumors newbie
Jun 3, 2003
20
0
Seattle, WA
Piles and Exposé both act to solve the window mess by "fanning out the cards" so to speak.

Maybe this can be incorporated into browsing the file system, but now is relegated to open windows.
 

MhzDoesMatter

macrumors regular
Jul 1, 2002
176
239
Fort Lauderdale, Florida
Well if u look at it differently.

Originally posted by soosy
I could see piles working very similar to Exposé, except on files rather than application windows. Seeing window contents with Exposé is so much more useful than seeing File Icons though. Still I think it would be useful....

<snip>

a folder is already have collections of files! Yeah so it would behave/appear a little differently, but not dramatically so.

Well if piles was dynamic like expose is, it might be a great feature for me. Expose has two major actions. Organizing and clearing.

Sometimes, after going onto my network or intranet site, I copy/download so many files to my desktop that they fill the screen and begin overlapping. This is far from Organized or clear. But, if (my) Piles was tied into a hot-key or placed in a contextual menu, (dam useless function keys) then I'd be able press a single key and or right click a particular file, and all other files not that file type would vanish off of the screen and the remaining files would line up in order or the other files would simply "pile up". At the very least (my) Piles would be able to quickly organize the files by type, date created, or any criteria, by creating piles of them by their labels (reintroduced in panther), keywords in their comments, or even common filenames.

I don't know. I just think Piles as it was spread on the internet was a little to simple. Not nearly as "elegant" or purposeful as Expose. "My Piles," as I've begun to call it, is just what I think Piles should be.

-Hertz
 

sinclairZX81

macrumors member
Dec 21, 2002
47
0
RAMTOP
Re: Re: Re: Better that we have Expose

Originally posted by bretm
Right. Piles showed the documents in the pile as you moused over. Way to extrapolate. Although I did liike the straightforward - no they don't quite a bit.
]


the point is not the visual UI behaviour/representation of piles but the functionality. think iTunes smart playlists but for the finder.
 

spullara

macrumors newbie
Jul 23, 2002
7
0
San Francsico, CA
Piles... where did it go?

I think the piles concept was replaced with the fast search feature. These are essentially the same except that ad hoc searching is better and faster than the act of first organizing your documents by piles, then finding the right pile whenever you need a document. Fast searching is like Piles on steroids. Bookmarks for searches would make it that much faster and easier. Perhaps that is available. I am getting the beta tomorrow, we'll see.
 

mospeada

macrumors newbie
Jun 24, 2003
14
0
Originally posted by MasonMcD
Piles and Exposé both act to solve the window mess by "fanning out the cards" so to speak.

Maybe this can be incorporated into browsing the file system, but now is relegated to open windows.

I was thinking just that. Couldn't they do this with files?

Imagine if you will: you have a pile of files that are related to each other, say a bunch of Photoshop files or all files in a project you are working on (txt, email, spreadsheet, KeyNote, etc). You click-hold and BOOM, all of the files zoom out and show a preview of their contents. You hover and release the mouse over the file you want to launch.

Of course, the hard part would be generating a preview of all of the files without launching them and without a slowdown after you initiate the action.
 

owlicks

macrumors newbie
Jul 23, 2002
1
0
Window Shade X

Has anyone tried the latest version of Windowshade X by Unsanity perhaps? It's a Public preview of 3.0. Anyways, it has a feature very similar to piles in which you can minimize windows so they animate and shrink down, then when you mouseover they can expand to as big as you want, or you can click to make them full size. It's an interesting concept, but I'll stick with my window shading ;)
 

sinclairZX81

macrumors member
Dec 21, 2002
47
0
RAMTOP
Re: Piles... where did it go?

Originally posted by spullara
I think the piles concept was replaced with the fast search feature. These are essentially the same except that ad hoc searching is better and faster than the act of first organizing your documents by piles, then finding the right pile whenever you need a document. Fast searching is like Piles on steroids. Bookmarks for searches would make it that much faster and easier. Perhaps that is available. I am getting the beta tomorrow, we'll see.

yes a 'pile' is like a saved search (and is dynamic of course). its just a UI metaphor for a query basically.
 
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