What happened, why is MacRumors so full of negativity lately?

[MacDaddyPanda]

The niceness must have been way before my time. I've been on and off since 2018 and that's always been that way to me. But I see that in every single forum and other social media platform. That just seems like human nature. I bet even a Martha Stewart Forum is got some nastiness, lol.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

The niceness must have been way before my time. I've been on and off since 2018 and that's always been that way to me. But I see that in every single forum and other social media platform. That just seems like human nature. I bet even a Martha Stewart Forum is got some nastiness, lol.

Actually, I think that things changed, and changed for the worse (as a number of others have already pointed out) after the iPhone was released.

 

[Analog Kid]

Do you mean the 'Like' button?

Or are you referring to a time before the Upvote and Downvote buttons. The forum software that was here when I registered in 2011 had the upvote button (and for a short time the downvote button).

There were wars then and whole threads had to be removed. I don't think this is anything new.

Unless your frame reference is from earlier than 2011?

My time frame does extend further back than that, and far enough back that I may be a bit muddled, but I remember the upvote button sort of blinking in and out of existence for a while but not really taking hold until the multi-option emoji version we have now. It was originally anonymous as I recall and meant as a remedy for all the "+1" posts (which were expressly forbidden in the forum rules, I believe).

Of course there were heated arguments for as long as MR has existed (Apple should/shouldn't move to Intel, should/shouldn't license MacOS, should/shouldn't lower their price to increase market share, etc) but what feels different from the old days is how many comments are just reiterating meaningless tropes without providing anything conversational.

It doesn't matter what the topic is, there's almost certainly a comment on the first page saying some variation of "Timmy's greed is ruining Apple" with 50 likes and loves. It adds no value, but the first person to say it reaps the most reaction score. That doesn't mean there isn't a cache of likes to be gained from repeating it on pages 4 and 12, but page one is prime real estate.

The point seems to me to be to generate bile and declare a team affiliation. I feel like before snark was king, the conversations were hot and people had entrenched opinions, but the discussion was more informative and mutually respectful.

Now cynicism substitutes for intellect-- "I'm on an Apple forum throwing shade on Apple, see how independently I think?"

 

[Analog Kid]

Actually, I think that things changed, and changed for the worse (as a number of others have already pointed out) after the iPhone was released.

Yeah, that could be part of it too... It's probably a confluence of things-- iPhone definitely broadened the audience from the enlightened 8% to half the world. Social media and Twitter in particular honed peoples ability to condense their venom into 140 characters or less and, in my opinion, devalued extended dialog. Broader polarization and political trends and bots and misinformation and all the rest have piled in to exploit those divisions further.

I'd imagine this isn't just a MacRumors problem, it's just that MR is the only online community I participate in so I notice it here.

 

[John099]

I think people are getting tired of the Apple's monopoly and high prices, their lock-in methods are getting tiresome. I'm looking forward to the new google releases coming out to see what they have to offer.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Yeah, that could be part of it too... It's probably a confluence of things-- iPhone definitely broadened the audience from the enlightened 8% to half the world. Social media and Twitter in particular honed peoples ability to condense their venom into 140 characters or less and, in my opinion, devalued extended dialog. Broader polarization and political trends and bots and misinformation and all the rest have piled in to exploit those divisions further.

I'd imagine this isn't just a MacRumors problem, it's just that MR is the only online community I participate in so I notice it here.

No, of course this (decline in the tone of online debate) is not confined to MacRumors.

However, and this may also serve to offer some explanation to the OP's (@intriguer's) original questions, there are elements of this decline in the qualty of online debate and deterioration of the tone in which such discussions and debates took place which are unique to Apple, (such as the greater number of people flocking to Apple products as a result of the release of the iPhone) and therefore, will inevitably have an impact on a site that is dedicated mainly to discussion of Apple and its products.

 

[Big Bad D]

I don’t think it’s just a MacRumors problem. But I appreciate that MacRumors has an “ignore” function.

 

[Analog Kid]

No, of course this (decline in the tone of online debate) is not confined to MacRumors.

However, and this may also serve to offer some explanation to the OP's (@intriguer's) original questions, there are elements of this decline in the qualty of online debate and deterioration of the tone in which such discussions and debates took place which are unique to Apple, (such as the greater number of people flocking to Apple products as a result of the release of the iPhone) and therefore, will inevitably have an impact on a site that is dedicated mainly to discussion of Apple and its products.

Basically a greater relative fall to the same absolute level of dystopia...

 

[ThunderSkunk]

You flinch when you expect other people might have a negative reaction to Apples decisions about their products?

I have a handy book for you:
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/35167718-what-do-you-care-what-other-people-think

 

[JayAgostino]

You flinch when you expect other people might have a negative reaction to Apples decisions about their products?

No, I don’t think you interpreted the OP’s thoughts correctly.

I have a handy book for you:
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/35167718-what-do-you-care-what-other-people-think

That’s not an excuse for bad behavior though.

 

[Big Bad D]

You flinch when you expect other people might have a negative reaction to Apples decisions about their products?

I have a handy book for you:
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/35167718-what-do-you-care-what-other-people-think

No, for me, it’s nothing to do with negative reaction or any pro- or anti- Apple views. I may not agree with or in many cases follow the rationale of alternate views - but that should be a healthy exchange. And indeed I often learn or gain a new perspective from different views. It’s the negativity and confrontational way in which an increasing number of threads seem to degenerate.

The fact that many participate and try to constructively contribute to forums such as this suggests that we do indeed care what other people think?

 

[Isamilis]

I am strongly inclined to agree that the news threads have been the most 'toxic' part of the site. It's been like this since at least when the iPhone came out, I don't remember it being so bad before then (likely just due to the massive increase in users). Otherwise the site is pretty good. There are some threads that are totally beaten to death, but once you learn to just walk away from those it becomes a lot better.

I use ignore for specific users, and unwatch / ignore for thread. Life is too short and precious.

 

[jchap]

This is the problem! And it goes deeper than just the fact that those downvote buttons exist, because people take that personally, and then it leads to them feeling depressed and then all sorts of problems start happening. I know this because people have come to me and told me about their bad experiences.

I feel like I've developed a thicker skin by "hanging out" on MacRumors 😅 Sometimes you get it right, sometimes you get it wrong, and there are always people who will say yea or nay.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

This site has always been the same in regards to a mix of views. You get people who adore Apple in a very biased way, defending every aspect of their business like a free PR programmed bot. You get people like me who use lots of Apple tech but are happy to call them out on things like pricing hikes and purposely holding back software and hardware features etc. You get some people who just post questions and don’t care on the whole. I think you need a mix of views for a healthy forum, otherwise this would just be a positive fan club full of people loving everything in a very over the top way and giving off a very dishonest persona for the Apple brand. Let’s be thankful we have objectivity here I say.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

I feel like it started, or at least picked up, when the reaction button was introduced.

Thankfully I only view this forum through Tapatalk so the reaction button is completely redundant. I can simply like a post and that is it. If anybody leaves a negative reaction to my posts it just shows as a ‘like’ through this app. It’s rare I ever visit through the webpage and it cuts out all the ads too.

 

[MindYourMind]

Irrespective of the subject matter, some people can’t have a civil conversation. They come in ready for a fight and that is reflected in their posts.

I think this is the core of exchanges becoming nasty; it’s a state of mind. It is indeed subject matter-unrelated, tho some subject matters lead to heated exchanges more easily than others.

As far as I’m concerned, “toxic” exchanges arise from people being strongly attached to their viewpoints or opinions. To them, attachment can go largely or even completely unconsciously.

Because of this strong attachment, exchanges of many people are never free of the shadow of strong emotion, which happen to them when their expectations aren’t met.

The difference between people who are detached from their opinions and people who are attached to them is that in the first group people have opinions and in the second group opinions have people.

Being attached to opinions is of course not a requirement for having them. It’s just that when you’re detached, your opinions don’t “possess” you, you’re not “grabbed” by them.

The sheer recognition of our opinions owning us rather than we owning opinions, lifts our attachments slowly but surely allowing us to exchange more harmoniously with others.

 

[ndouglas]

I find a post like this more part of the problem than the solution.

You've been lurking for many years....? like how many years, what does this actually mean. You've just registered and this is your second interaction that, as you so well point out, is immediately negative.

—^ I was thinking similarly when read the original post… as someone who also has read the site for many years, there is no X or Y moment when it was better/worse. It’s a pretty good site as you say below esp. compared to FB/Twtr/etc, but the “negativity” has stood out to me just as much 10-15 years ago when I began reading it, as now.

And nothing you say is anything new... really there is nothing new. There have always been haters on any forum for anything mac, pc or any game or console or phone or lp or cassette tape, artist, sport or brand or what you drink or eat. You're acting as if people venting their dislike is a new thing.

I'm wondering why you feel the need to point this out while you've been lurking for years? Because as someone that is not that young I think macrumors is very good and does not have a lot of negative energy.
This place is nothing like fb or twitter or many of the early message boards that could get very very heated.

Very true, those who are old enough to remember message boards, “chat rooms,” IRC, etc. know the whole “flaming” and “Flame wars” type terms/ideas are not much different than whatever is going on today with “recent“ negativity on this or other forums…

 

[eyoungren]

The niceness must have been way before my time. I've been on and off since 2018 and that's always been that way to me. But I see that in every single forum and other social media platform. That just seems like human nature. I bet even a Martha Stewart Forum is got some nastiness, lol.

Actually, I think that things changed, and changed for the worse (as a number of others have already pointed out) after the iPhone was released.

I would just mention again, MR does have a couple of good communities in some of the subforums. Those communities are part of why I joined and a major reason why I stay, even when I no longer use (mostly) those things that are the major topic of one of the communities.

The problem, and why those communities aren't a larger part of MR on the whole, is because we are still using Apple stuff that the modern Apple customer abandoned a long time ago. So, unless you have that and therefore some reason to be in those subforums you don't see our community on MR.

But it exists. And I'm glad it does.

 

[Alpha Centauri]

I feel like it started, or at least picked up, when the reaction button was introduced.

I certainly wouldn't miss them if they were gone entirely.

 

[rm5]

Thankfully I only view this forum through Tapatalk so the reaction button is completely redundant. I can simply like a post and that is it. If anybody leaves a negative reaction to my posts it just shows as a ‘like’ through this app. It’s rare I ever visit through the webpage and it cuts out all the ads too.

I'm always on the web version, because I know how to use it.

 

[max2]

I'm always on the web version, because I know how to use it.

Me too.

 

[BigMcGuire]

I don't think it is just Macrumors. I remember being part of Slashdot and a handful of other forums over the last 10+ years... Sure people disagreed and had discussions that didn't always result in seeing eye to eye but I'm seeing that people today just don't have tolerance for difference of opinion today.

There are more "trolls" that post to drum up responses ... a reaction. People enjoy being unreasonable to set others off more than ever before. Close minded posts about how things should be vs using forums to discover other people's opinions is far more rampant now.

I left Facebook in 2016 because of the fact that FB seemed to encourage outrage and discord. People in general are attracted to that and platforms make a lot of $ off the reaction so they naturally encouraged/boost such posts.

I definitely see why some of the subforms that @eyoungren talk about still have that old MR vibe and are be REALLY enjoyable places. ---- I find myself less interested in news threads, however I believe MR makes the most $ from them.

 

[elvisimprsntr]

Trolls, that’s why.

 

[eyoungren]

Thankfully I only view this forum through Tapatalk…
…and it cuts out all the ads too.

As others have said, I primarily use this forum through a desktop web browser. Sometimes on Opera with my iPhone/iPad.

As far as ads, LOL. That's what uMatrix is for. And the ad blocker in Opera on my iOS devices. I haven't seen an ad on this forum since before I even signed up (2011).

 

[eyoungren]

I don't think it is just Macrumors. I remember being part of Slashdot and a handful of other forums over the last 10+ years... Sure people disagreed and had discussions that didn't always result in seeing eye to eye but I'm seeing that people today just don't have tolerance for difference of opinion today.

There are more "trolls" that post to drum up responses ... a reaction. People enjoy being unreasonable to set others off more than ever before. Close minded posts about how things should be vs using forums to discover other people's opinions is far more rampant now.

I left Facebook in 2016 because of the fact that FB seemed to encourage outrage and discord. People in general are attracted to that and platforms make a lot of $ off the reaction so they naturally encouraged/boost such posts.

I definitely see why some of the subforms that @eyoungren talk about still have that old MR vibe and are be REALLY enjoyable places. ---- I find myself less interested in news threads, however I believe MR makes the most $ from them.

It's about 'owning' people. If you drop the mic on them so hard it destroys the mic and they cannot respond with any sort of comeback then you've 'owned' them. And any comeback they could come up with won't work because you're coming from a righteous place. Nothing can shake your rock-solid belief that you are right and they are wrong and that's the end of it. They will always be wrong and you will always be right. Even if you change your mind.

I know where that's all coming from but the forum to express it in was closed.

PS. I ditched Facebook in February 2017. I actually found a browser extension at the time to strip all my content off my wall before closing it and a link to actually delete it. Have never been back.

I left because it became an echo chamber.