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not exactly sure of the point, I have had 2 of them and hated both. They were just not what I needed. The real estate of the 15'' is what I prefer the most and the palm rest of the 13'' just was annoying. I do not have big hands they are 8'', but the palm rest just felt to confining.
 
I'm a developer and a desktop guy at heart. I have a base 13" MBP (2011) with a 120 GB SSD and 8 GB of RAM which serves as my portable workstation (for those times when I absolutely can't use my own desktop).

I choose it over the Air because:
You're kidding, right? 4 GB of RAM? No Ethernet port? ULV processor? I'm just shuddering at the thought of running a major compile on the road and then having to upload it via Wifi. The Air serves a purpose--it just isn't my purpose. I know I'm not alone in this. Oh, and when I was purchasing, the current Sandy Bridge Air consisted of a whole lot of speculation and little else.

I chose it over the 15" Pro because:
I don't see the sense in spending $2200 on something that's going to sit in a closet most of the time. The 15" model is closer to a desktop alternative (not replacement--no such thing), and I neither need nor want that. And frankly, the 13" model is easier to use while traveling (in flight, at a restaurant, etc).

Side note:
I don't understand all the whining about the 1280x800 screen resolution--but then, I stare at text all day. Since OS X doesn't scale the interface (and fonts, accordingly), I'm more concerned about physical screen size than resolution. In any event, 113 PPI isn't bad (it's actually still better than most desktop monitors).

I'm also a developer and 4GB is plenty of RAM and the ULV i7 is still very fast. If you've seen comparison videos the Air is just as fast as the 13" Pro. Also I don't see what's so bad about WiFi. Also I use my Air as my desktop as well. It's my sole computer.

Maybe it's because I'm young. Or because I've been using Ultraportables for a while and realize they are powerful enough to do all sorts of this "pro" work.
 
Search is your friend. There are innumerable other threads out there on this exact same question.

In short: The MBP is more powerful, more upgradeable, can do more, has better color accuracy, has ethernet, has an optical drive, and is less expensive. The MBA is for people who want to be seen with their laptop; the MBP is for people who work on their laptop. Oversimplified, but there you go.

And the Air commands a significant price premium for weighing a bit less in exchange for giving up a LOT of capability.

So you're saying I don't work on my Air? It is definitely a stunning looking device though.
 
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Anyways the only reason I can see someone needing a 13" 2011 Pro over either is for Firewire or an optical drive on the go. And as someone said above they still need an ethernet port.

If you need power, why wouldn't you go for the 15" quad core and radeon, that's power. The Air has about 90% of the power of the 13" Pro especially if the Pro doesn't have an SSD in it. The other reason I could see is people wanting to upgrade the internals (something I don't do anymore). Or of course needing a lot more HDD space than 256GB.

Oh and some people prefer the form factor of the Pro. And the Pro is cheaper than an Ultimate Air.

Not to mention, even though the Air's i7 is ULV, it's still "newer" than the Pro's sandy bridge and faster than other sandy bridge ULV's from the Pro's sandy bridge line.

I watched some YouTube videos of someone doing video compiling and photo importing and editing on both machines side by side and they were about the same in terms of speed.
 
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This:
Not all of us can afford the 15" Pro and the Air is underpowered for some of our needs.

and most of this:
I'm a developer and a desktop guy at heart. I have a base 13" MBP (2011) with a 120 GB SSD and 8 GB of RAM which serves as my portable workstation (for those times when I absolutely can't use my own desktop).

I choose it over the Air because:
You're kidding, right? 4 GB of RAM? No Ethernet port? ULV processor? I'm just shuddering at the thought of running a major compile on the road and then having to upload it via Wifi. The Air serves a purpose--it just isn't my purpose. I know I'm not alone in this. Oh, and when I was purchasing, the current Sandy Bridge Air consisted of a whole lot of speculation and little else.

I chose it over the 15" Pro because:
I don't see the sense in spending $2200 on something that's going to sit in a closet most of the time. The 15" model is closer to a desktop alternative (not replacement--no such thing), and I neither need nor want that. And frankly, the 13" model is easier to use while traveling (in flight, at a restaurant, etc).

Side note:
I don't understand all the whining about the 1280x800 screen resolution--but then, I stare at text all day. Since OS X doesn't scale the interface (and fonts, accordingly), I'm more concerned about physical screen size than resolution. In any event, 113 PPI isn't bad (it's actually still better than most desktop monitors).

and add in:
Different people have different needs, as well as different budgets or perceptions of what they're willing to pay for.
I'm in the second case from above, but also agree with the first one - I write software, run VMs, and generally use it as a portable workstation. I'm in 100% agreement with akhbhaat about his reasons for 'why not an Air?' One day I might be using it to console into some older servers via direct connection, the next running a pair of VMs plus Eclipse, various servers running locally at different times, a ton of open browser tabs, reading, reviewing, or writing design or API docs, diagrams, etc., and I work on multiple projects, all of which adds up to a fairly large amount of storage and CPU power. It's also dual purpose for my personal projects, plus general stuff like music, etc., so - yet more storage. It's all backed up to a NAS, but that doesn't mean I don't keep a lot on the local disk. For *me*, the Air is a neat 'toy,' like an iPad with a keyboard instead of touch screen, but isn't enough RAM nor storage for me.

I would expect professional videographers and similar to run into similar issues - most video and image editing software tends to like both cpu power and RAM, while the data sets tend to get pretty large, quickly. Someone may be able to use it in 'mostly desktop mode' with external storage for things like video and image work, but they're still limited the minute they unplug, plus the CPU and storage may not cut it.

Someone else who does mostly text docs, powerpoint/presentations, spreadsheets, browser, general business software, would likely be a great fit for the Air as long as it met their storage needs. A lot of students in most fields would get on well with the Air, depending on discipline. Casual users would love the Air - it's fast enough for most things (and then some), is more than enough for web, email, flash, watching videos, etc.

The 13" MBP is somewhat of a 'tweener' - it's in between the casual or non power user but very light and cool Air, and the 'real' start of the Pro lineup, IMO. Cpu-wise, it's in the middle, while RAM and HD are equivalent (or can easily be made so). The resolution and lack of discrete graphics are the only real downside.

I also agree mostly with akhbhaat on the other comments made, but the 13" MBP low res drives me insane when not attached to an external monitor. It's ok for quick scripting in vi, but going to the widescreen layouts lost us space in the wrong direction - vertically. The annoyance factor when browsing API documentation or even normal web pages or through code with the lack of vertical resolution annoys me. I did use a 13" MB as my primary system for 4 years, and it was great when traveling, and when hooked up to an external LCD, but not, for me, for serious work using only the laptop screen. I do agree the pricing on 'the next jump up' to the 15" is pretty annoying. For me, the 13" is a great travel/portable size, and if it got a screen resolution bump, I'd probably be typing on a 13" MBP instead of the quad core 15" monster I'm on at the moment. :D

Anyway, it's about different uses and needs, as well as desires, from different people. The Air is great if it fits your needs, and the 13" Pro is better for some, not for others. I'd love to see the 13" MBP screen res jump up, offer the Air and 13" MBP at $999, a 15" starting at $1399, but as it is pick the Air if you're more about portability with some sacrifices that *may* not bother you at all, or the 13" Pro if you simply need 'more' in CPU, storage, or RAM.
 
I'm also a developer and 4GB is plenty of RAM and the ULV i7 is still very fast. If you've seen comparison videos the Air is just as fast as the 13" Pro. Also I don't see what's so bad about WiFi. Also I use my Air as my desktop as well. It's my sole computer.

Maybe it's because I'm young. Or because I've been using Ultraportables for a while and realize they are powerful enough to do all sorts of this "pro" work.

4GB is IMO marginal for a browser, eclipse, and a single VM along with normal other things open like mail.
What's so bad about wifi? Apparently your development is all small projects, and you've never done a code checkout of several GB in size, while having other systems on that same wireless router doing backups of a few TB, while running a remote desktop or two? :) Think of most wifi as a hub, if you remember them. Dedicated switches with dedicated bandwidth vs shared lower bandwidth = no contest, unless you're the only user and active system on the network. QOS can help the overall experience, but doesn't grow bandwidth.

I doubt I'd have real issues on CPU speed with an Air - my C2D was 'fast enough' for the most part, but RAM maxxed out at 6GB wasn't enough for me. That's great if it is for you and highly possible. For those working on large projects in compiled languages in particular, or simulating non-trivial server side environments on their laptop with a lot of data, or multiple VMs, 4GB RAM and CPU speed is certainly out-growable.

PS - if the 13" Air Ultimate had 8GB RAM and an ethernet port...I probably would have taken it over the 15" quad. I could live with trimming data down to 256gb and an external drive, the resolution is better than the 13" Pro, but the lack of ethernet and 4GB is a fail, for me. It's too bad, as I wouldn't mind it at all, given those two changes.
 
hdd memory, ram (upgraded to 8), speed/power, ports, glossy screen (no bezel), and price for me.

i don't see much point in spending more money for less memory, less ram, less speed, fewer ports, and a dull screen with a bezel (i think it looks washed out).
 
Oh try FireWire, it's amazing. Best thing on OSX data transfer for now until Thunderbolt becomes mainstream. They have a 500GB G-Drive at Apple for about $130. Price is kind of high for a cost to GB ratio, but the speed is worth it. Think of it like an SSD. Expensive, but worth the speed right?

Sorry for coming off as a douche. It's late and I'm usually against people who question other's purchases, but you just wanted an opinion so I respect that.

esata is more amazing tho =\
 
I'm also a developer and 4GB is plenty of RAM and the ULV i7 is still very fast. If you've seen comparison videos the Air is just as fast as the 13" Pro. Also I don't see what's so bad about WiFi. Also I use my Air as my desktop as well. It's my sole computer.

Maybe it's because I'm young. Or because I've been using Ultraportables for a while and realize they are powerful enough to do all sorts of this "pro" work.

I'm not sure where you got that, but the 2011 MBA is ALMOST as fast as a 2010 13" MBP C2D. And the 2010 13" MBP has less than half the processor power than the 2011 13" MBP.

I dare you to run a Win7 virtual machine in a 4GB MBA without lagg.

But as I always say, if you can't spot any difference between the MBA and the MBP, then you are just fine with the Air.

Cheers
 
i think the MBA Screen is glossy as well? then why get a 13" Pro?

three words: see my signature :D

i think the mba is glossy, but it doesn't look it (no glass plate over it). it looks washed out (to me), and i really don't like the bezel.

your computer, by the way, seems pretty intense, but it doesn't seem terribly cost effective :)
 
i think the mba is glossy, but it doesn't look it (no glass plate over it).

i would love to have the high-res option on the 13" but it better be 16:10 aspect, it's not only people watching movies on it :roll eyes:

my MBP was subsidized by university, and has had about the same price tag as a base 15" :cool:
 
I'm not sure where you got that, but the 2011 MBA is ALMOST as fast as a 2010 13" MBP C2D. And the 2010 13" MBP has less than half the processor power than the 2011 13" MBP.

I dare you to run a Win7 virtual machine in a 4GB MBA without lagg.

But as I always say, if you can't spot any difference between the MBA and the MBP, then you are just fine with the Air.

Cheers

Before posting erroneous statements, take the time to look at the benchmarks. The i7 11 macbook air is faster than the 2010 i7 15 inch macbook pros and most definitely faster than the C2D macbook pro
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4554/apples-11inch-macbook-air-core-i7-18ghz-review-update/2
 
I don't think anyone mentioned the point that the MBA was just upgraded and the 13" MBP was not. When it gets an update it might gain on the Air.

I like having an ethernet port and especially FireWire. I don't see the Air being that feasible for me until they have some sort of dock that allows those via Thunderbolt. Which also means the Air would need the better Thunderbolt chip and that isn't happening until they make 'em smaller.

Streaming video over WiFi just isn't fast enough. I can't get 720p video to my PS3 over N-class WiFi with my current 13" MBP without occasionally stuttering.

The Air is great for people who need to carry their laptop around all day into different meetings but it has limitations for those of us who want to use their Mac as a desktop replacement too and require a bit more processing power.
 
I'm not sure where you got that, but the 2011 MBA is ALMOST as fast as a 2010 13" MBP C2D. And the 2010 13" MBP has less than half the processor power than the 2011 13" MBP.
Cheers
http://www.primatelabs.ca/geekbench/mac-benchmarks/

MacBook Pro (13-inch Early 2011) Core i5-2415M 2.3 GHz (2 cores) 5910
MacBook Air (13-inch Mid 2011) Intel Core i7-2677M 1.8 GHz (2 cores) 5831
MacBook Air (13-inch Mid 2011) Intel Core i5-2557M 1.7 GHz (2 cores) 5372
MacBook Pro (13-inch Early 2010) Intel Core 2 Duo P8800 2.66 GHz (2co res) 3651
 
This is what I assumed. Really just a personal preference form factor thing.

What about resolution? Doesn't the MBA have better resolution than the 13" Pro?

Soon we will get a whole lot of 13" lovers covering you there poor machines but when it comes down to it, it is the result of Apple being lazy, plenty of Room for a dedicated graphics card, no reason for the low Res screen.
Now people can argue against this but the only real thing for the 13" is it's price, ports and for some, it's optical drive.
Plenty love it, but this is what I believe.
 
My Mum had a back operation and couldn't lift more than 1.5Kg so the MBP turned out to be too heavy for her and the 13inch MBA is still within her limits, she also only uses it for internet,online banking,and a small amount of photo editing, I on thr other hand have the MBP 13inch because I can multitask a lot more on it, use the enthernet port and have 2 harddrives daisychained on firewire, something which is simply not possible on the air.

Basically it depends on your use and preference.
 
I am a web developer and I love my base 13" 2011 mbp. The screen, at least for me, is superior to the mba. The color gamut is just so much better if put next to a mba. I also prefer the resolution of mbp because I find that the dpi of 1440x900 is just too high for 13" screen. Sure there is less work space, but I have not had any problems with it. Then there's the physical appeal of the mbp - it just feels a lot sturdier than mba.
 
Call me old fashioned but when I drop $1000+ on a laptop, I want something with a little weight and feel to it.

I could snap the Air with my bare hands.

MBP > Air
 
Call me old fashioned but when I drop $1000+ on a laptop, I want something with a little weight and feel to it.

I could snap the Air with my bare hands.

MBP > Air

Yup. Just like when I want to drop $400+ on a phone (early upgrade), I like my devices with a heavy dose of metal and glass.
 
Why wouldn't the Air be more suited for that, though? It has an amazing design quality and its much more portable.
I hate when people make this conclusion because it simply isnt true. In fact, I feel that if anything is lacking a point in Apple's lineup then its the 13" Air because its too big to be an "ultraportable workstation" and without Firewire, DVD or a large internal HDD then too lacking in standard Apple features to be a portable desk computer.

1) "Thin" is a misleading gimmick
This assumption that "Thin" makes things more portable is wrong. Nobody ever buys a "Thin" laptop, they buy on that fits the 13" dimension which is going to fit BOTH machines because the MBP and MBA both share the same footprint. That is a largely ignored restriction because any situation that you can't comfortably use a 13" MBP (Airplanes, cramped desks) will be equally retrained with an 13" MBA.

2) Since when was the MBP heavy?
Its amazing how many people assume the MBP is a heavy machine. It may not be as razor thin as the Air but it has continuously thinned down over the years and considering the features its an incredibly lightweight powerhouse.

3) No Glass Screen
When purchasing my MBA I completely forgot that it doesnt have a glass screen so I can no longer take ANY cloth to wipe it down, now I need a special microfiber and gentle hands. Its not something people think about much but glass was a fantastic choice by Apple that we now lost.

4) Pros need Pro features
When comparing a "Pro" computer to anything then you can't simply dismiss the features it has that the other model lacks. I love my Air but on a recent trip I was hit by the restrictions of the Air yet not the benefits:
- Reclined Seat in front of me still pushed my 13" MBA screen screen to an unusable angle
- My old MBP 500GB internal is now a portable which means separate accessories and slower drive access
- External drive fell off tray table while in use on flight. No damage, but I stopped using it because I didnt want to risk anything
- No Superdrive yet so I couldnt extract photos from the DVD a potential client gave me
- No movies since I usually rent a RedBox movie to take on the flight


Yes, there are "workarounds" to this, but when something needs creative/time consuming methods in order to perform standard tasks then that isn't progress. Thats making excuses.

Now dont get me wrong. I love my Air and all but I really dont want to see the Pro's get reduced in features just because it will "look" sexier.
 
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All these things may be true, but I've been able to put together some nice video work thanks to this little machine. It's very light, portable and I've run this thing full out for hours at a time - and never one little hi-cup.

I get that there are better options out there. But I've cut up some great stories not to mention I run win7 via a VM and do all the accounting for our non-profit as well. Could it be faster? yes. Could the screen be better? sure. But this machine serves me well.

Here's a look at some of the "pro" work that's come out of this machine (well and my canon t2i as well)

http://vimeo.com/23464436


fantastic production, sad video though.
 
Honestly, the 13" MBP is the best compromise you can possibly get. Great mix of portability and versatility when it comes to upgrades.

It really depends on your lifestyle and needs. If its your only CPU, it is perfect for college students, business people, artists/musicians and programmers. It's got everything you need without spending a ton of cash. If you need more space, there is a possibility of going all the way up to a 1TB harddrive, add another HD by removing the optical drive, as well as, using external HD's through the USB ports.

Serious professionals will have the $$ to spend for a 15" or 17" if they need the power... But for a 13" MBP, the 2011 models passed the high-end 17" 2010 model in performance.
 
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