What would make you leave Apple?

[ThailandToo]

I wish we could choose what we want and it was all interoperable. I mean I would be using a Samsung Fold years ago along with Mac and iPad; and there’s no reason they shouldn’t all be interoperable like the EU requires. I can’t stand Apple’s BS like anticompetitive practices, and the minute I can switch to something else, I probably will not since Apple is finally releasing a foldable iPhone. I just like the hardware, hate the company and software. To me Apple, Meta, Google all are the same crap! Just Apple is the one that acts like an anticompetitive bully of the group - but then acts like they’re better and holier than though. But I am a sucker for the hardware far more than the crap software full of terrible bugs for years.

 

[tjminter]

TL;DR: Apple Maps ads triggered me, a step away from what I liked most about them, no ads and privacy, so time to explore alternatives.

I have been happily living in the "walled garden" for many years, deeply invested in the ecosystem with icloud photos, files and backups, etc. I have been happy to pay extra for Apple devices just because things work so well.

But recently a few of Apple's decisions have are making me second-guess if I should explore alternatives, for example adding ads to the App Store and Maps. Also, whenever I use my Linux computers, the friction of trying to use Apple services from those is very high, sometimes totally impractical (photos from the iCloud web interface kinda suck) or impossible (no AirDrop in Linux).

I am currently testing a few things: using Immich for personal/local cloud photos, got an old cheap pixel phone to try out "degoogling" it as much as I can, using Proton services for calendar+mail+cloud files, KDE Connect and LocalSend for sending files between devices, even testing Asahi linux on one of my macs (those guys are wizards!). The experience so far varies from "OK" to "janky", but usable, and at least I have control moving forward.

So where do you draw the line? What would make you switch?

I actually tried switching to Windows and Android last year. I liked both, but found my family and friends were still stuck in iMessage. So i ended up switching back.

At the end of the day, its really iMessage that makes the difference for me. Everything else... I use Office and Acrobat, so I could easily jump.

 

[GrumpyOldGuy52]

So where do you draw the line? What would make you switch?

The line was crossed years ago for me. I didn’t realize it when it happened, but moving the Mac towards a consumer device mentality (opposed to something that can be tinkered with and upgraded) just rubs me the wrong way. My computer should be something I can use for a decade or so—it might need upgrading during that time, but I shouldn’t be expected to replace it once or twice during that time.

The phone, frankly, has bugged me for years (the last one I truly liked was the 5S). I never liked the lack of a removable battery or difficulty in easily repairing something like a worn-out charging port (if the Fairphone can do it, Apple can), and the insistence on larger and more expensive phones has finally made me say enough is enough.

 

[Und Eser]

Not sure right now exactly which distro it'll be but, when times get much harder for everyone, it'll be one of 'em.

 

[mwhite]

Nothing. Nothing would make me leave Apple. What's the alternative? Windows? Android? Forget about it.

 

[crococarbs]

The options for me are:
1- Zero effort: Just stay with Apple a.k.a. wait and see, hoping they don't insert more ads and/or degrade their privacy stance.
2- The easy way: Windows and Android -> You lose all your privacy, Windows sucks, Android is OK but still a surveillance device.
3- The hard way: Linux and GrapheneOS -> You get full control and the most privacy, but gotta live with high-maintenance sometimes incompatible, sometimes janky software.

I am a mix of 1 and exploring/testing 3. Option 2 I have tried before and it's not an option for me anymore.

 

[escargot3]

To be clear, I am not switching to Google ecosystem/services, I am looking into different options, currently I have Proton for mail+calendar+drive, and for photos I have setup a personal "cloud" with Immich, which requires some work to set up.

Those are privacy-preserving alternatives, and I have more control on things, but not as smooth as what Apple provides for sure.

Proton doesn’t have a maps app or service AFAIK, which is the whole problem you brought up in the first place.

 

[Luftkopf]

I've wanted to play around so I got a $200 thinkpad from like 5 years ago on ebay and put linux on it.

I've been almost exclusively using that machine since. It's perfectly fine for everything I'd need. It's a real reflection on how BAD apple software has gotten. Crystal glass garbage theme, software glitches and hangups. Etc.

The hardware is still great and I'm thinking I might grab a few old macs and put linux on them to have around as well.

For now, it's not really enough of a bar for me to abandon everything but outside of the phone (I hate android and google), I could be happy with the old thinkpad running linux.

What needs to be addressed in software/hardware to make me happier.

1) The app store. It's garbage. All garbage. In the early days, you could find some amazing apps that really did things and were tools. Now, everything seems to be subscription or scam crap. How many garbage casino 'apps' do we need?

2) the GUI needs a serious reboot. Seriously, who ever came up with this crystal glass stuff needs to spend some time in design school, or at least home arrest time.

3) A cleanup of the entire line. Go back and look at the first Steve Jobs event when he came back to Apple. How he reduced the offerings to 4 boxes and that was it. Now we have a huge line of machines and computers and they are all marginally useless in some ways. The Neo is good till you need a little bit more then the air is right there that sort of overlaps with the Macbook Pro if you need it. Pick a handful and make them fantastic. 12 inch Neo, a 14 inch Air, and a 16 inch Pro. Each machine with one chip older than the last. M5 in the Pro, M4 in the air, m3 in the Neo, for example, assuming you want to really max out the useful life and inventory.

Same with the desktop and ipad line up.

4) Pricing. They needed to not raise pricing on the Neo. They need a computer that students can afford and want to get them hooked in the eco system. That investment will pay moving forward for years.

5) and the ipad. The poor little ipad that can't figure out what it is. Time to just hard code the tablet or desktop mode in it and be done.

In the end, what would drive me away from Apple is the software. It's still lightyears better than windows, but it's no where near what it once was.

The only thing I can agree with you on is pricing. They shouldn’t have raised the price on the Neo. It’s gone above the $1000 barrier here in Australia now.

Whether or not Apple Maps is a good option seems to come down to where you use it. Where I live, Apple gives me more reliable results than Google does. I’m always looking up addresses due to my job, and Google give locations that are just flat out wrong more often than Apple has.

 

[crococarbs]

Proton doesn’t have a maps app or service AFAIK, which is the whole problem you brought up in the first place.

oh, for maps I have OrganicMaps, and there are other non-Google ones. Not as sleek but functional!

 

[Cayden]

Likely not much could make me want a windows computer (though I’d be more inclined to use Linux), and I don’t see myself ever going back to Android, though I’ve been using all my devices less and less these days. This will be my first year without upgrading my phone since the 5S. My MacBook from 2015 is still what I use when I need a computer, but that doesn’t happen to often these days

 

[ClaraStahlbaum]

I am potentially looking into leaving Iphone. Doing some hard research into the Samsung A57. I could sell my Iphone 17e to cover the cost of it, and there are more workarounds for transferring files from Android to Mac than there were in the past.

Leaving Apple entirely? Probably not.

 

[SteveDmbp]

I actually tried switching to Windows and Android last year. I liked both, but found my family and friends were still stuck in iMessage. So i ended up switching back.

At the end of the day, its really iMessage that makes the difference for me. Everything else... I use Office and Acrobat, so I could easily jump.

You have to be in the USA ? ......... amazes me the hold imessage has over the people of the USA

In the UK almost everyone uses Whatsapp, this eliminates any android/apple divide in friend/family groups so everyone can use whatever phone they want/prefer

 

[conmee]

Giving this more thought and reading about @jbachandouris experience, if Apple permanently locked my me.com email of 18 years and I lost access to email as well as purchases, I would nuke all Apple stuff. Yeah, it would be short term self-inflicted pain, but I’d go Pop!_OS+Framework, Pixel+Graphene, change everything to my startmail.com email and deal with the loss of Messages. I already don’t use any social media except YouTube, MacRumors, and a couple Linux and retro gaming forums. Family and friends already begrudgingly forward photos and other stuff via text or email if they really want me to see something. So good news is I only see important stuff like birthdays and anniversaries and graduations these days, and not daily food/cat/fashion/random stuff. All this to say I would be sufficiently disgruntled to walk from Apple if they ever permanently locked my account and I would get on with my life without iCloud/Messages/FindMy. But for now, all is well! lol

 

[GregoryPeckEPA]

You have to be in the USA ? ......... amazes me the hold imessage has over the people of the USA

In the UK almost everyone uses Whatsapp, this eliminates any android/apple divide in friend/family groups so everyone can use whatever phone they want/prefer

Sure, putting all your eggs in Meta’s basket 😬 That’s not alarming 🫠🌊

It’s a shame Signal isn’t more ubiquitous or doesn’t have similar options and we are still locked into either evil companies or locked to hardware manufacturers as a society at large.

FWIW, lots of people I know use Discord as it supports a lot more than just messaging. It too is a crappy company, sadly.

 

[crococarbs]

You have to be in the USA ? ......... amazes me the hold imessage has over the people of the USA

In the UK almost everyone uses Whatsapp, this eliminates any android/apple divide in friend/family groups so everyone can use whatever phone they want/prefer

In australia is a bit like the UK too, a lot of people use Whatsapp, but I try to push people to use Signal instead = not owned by a questionable tech giant. Within my family we use iMessage, it's the one with the least friction to text each other to/from phones/tablets/computers/car etc. Since I try to avoid anything from Meta if I can like Whatsapp, I don't have too many contacts in there, maybe a handful. Most my contacts are in Signal or iMessage, and worst case I default to normal SMS.

 

[Ctrlos]

I wish we could choose what we want and it was all interoperable. I mean I would be using a Samsung Fold years ago along with Mac and iPad; and there’s no reason they shouldn’t all be interoperable like the EU requires. I can’t stand Apple’s BS like anticompetitive practices, and the minute I can switch to something else, I probably will not since Apple is finally releasing a foldable iPhone. I just like the hardware, hate the company and software. To me Apple, Meta, Google all are the same crap! Just Apple is the one that acts like an anticompetitive bully of the group - but then acts like they’re better and holier than though. But I am a sucker for the hardware far more than the crap software full of terrible bugs for years.

I'd argue the lack of interoperability is a myth whilst we still have USB ports.

 

[mwhite]

You have to be in the USA ? ......... amazes me the hold imessage has over the people of the USA

In the UK almost everyone uses Whatsapp, this eliminates any android/apple divide in friend/family groups so everyone can use whatever phone they want/prefer

&^%$ WhatsApp. It's owned by Mark *uckerberg.

Also, it's not an issue as iMessage has adopted RCS.

 

[lewchenko]

An interesting read this thread is! ..
And Ive already added my comments prior, but last night I was looking at the price of what the 17Pro Max is now (512) vs what I think the 18PM will be.
Ultimately the one that will kill it for me is PRICE!
£1399 plus apple care cost plus a case / screen protector for the current 512 model. 18PM likely to be +£100-200 on top.
That kinda kills it!
Some places are offering the 17PM at £100 off at present, but its still very expensive.
I guess I could do a 2 or 3 Yr credit deal etc but I really dont like being locked in like that.

Its also the heaviest phone out there across pixel, samsung and apple flagships. That's really not good. 18PM is forecast to be heavier too!

 

[crococarbs]

I'd argue the lack of interoperability is a myth whilst we still have USB ports.

As someone wise once said: "Never underestimate the bandwidth of a truck loaded with floppy disks!"