What would make you leave Apple?

[thistleknife]

As someone who has been here since the Apple //c, it's funny seeing what people would leave for. I was here through the company trying to implode, architecture changes, being the underdog—at this point I think it's one of the longest relationships of my life. So never say never, but it's been 42 years so far, let's see what happens.

 

[freashuping]

TL;DR: Apple Maps ads triggered me, a step away from what I liked most about them, no ads and privacy, so time to explore alternatives.

I have been happily living in the "walled garden" for many years, deeply invested in the ecosystem with icloud photos, files and backups, etc. I have been happy to pay extra for Apple devices just because things work so well.

But recently a few of Apple's decisions have are making me second-guess if I should explore alternatives, for example adding ads to the App Store and Maps. Also, whenever I use my Linux computers, the friction of trying to use Apple services from those is very high, sometimes totally impractical (photos from the iCloud web interface kinda suck) or impossible (no AirDrop in Linux).

I am currently testing a few things: using Immich for personal/local cloud photos, got an old cheap pixel phone to try out "degoogling" it as much as I can, using Proton services for calendar+mail+cloud files, KDE Connect and LocalSend for sending files between devices, even testing Asahi linux on one of my macs (those guys are wizards!). The experience so far varies from "OK" to "janky", but usable, and at least I have control moving forward.

So where do you draw the line? What would make you switch?

Price, less of innovation, less friendliness etc.

 

[eyoungren]

As someone who has been here since the Apple //c, it's funny seeing what people would leave for. I was here through the company trying to implode, architecture changes, being the underdog—at this point I think it's one of the longest relationships of my life. So never say never, but it's been 42 years so far, let's see what happens.

I started watching Apple some time in my high school years, which were the late 1980s.

My mother was a teacher and one of her elective classes was Computer Science. So there were computers in the house since 1980 when I was 10.

While a friend of mine got by in 1987 using a Classic Mac with a tiny B&W screen, I was moving along with a Commodore 64, full color, attached to a 15" monitor or a TV. I ran a BBS off that computer and later a Commodore 128. By 1992 I had also acquired an Amiga 1000 and a PC. By 1994 my mom was solidly Mac.

But I was too busy using a series of PC computers, DOS and Windows throughout the 1990s to pay a whole lot of attention to Mac. Every time I had to use my mom's Mac for something, it was a struggle to figure things out. Page layout applications changed all that.

By 1999 I had a job requiring me to use Macs. But I didn't fully convert until 2003 - two years after being gifted my own PowerBook G4.

As an Apple outsider until 2003 I'm glad I never had to go through all those early years. Being able to get stuff done on my C64/128 and then a PC was better for me. It's only since the launch of OS X 10.3 that I really came to like the Mac. Having worked in OS9 in the jobs I held then, I hated that OS. Glad Jobs finally had a funeral for it.

 

[Bruce205]

When my tech stops working for me and it switches to me managing it, I will dump it. I know that can sound jaded, and maybe it is a bit. The tech industry is in general headed to the rubbish bin in my opinion, and my life is too valuable to me to spend it trying to make tech work for it. I'm minimizing my reliance on tech, as well as disconnecting from news and media in general. Being in nature is so vastly better for my wellbeing anyway.
/Rant over/

I love tech but I totally agree 🙂

 

[Applfan81]

have been in the walled garden and been happy with it. But ads, price hikes and the AI stuff is really starting to grind my gears. I also start missing an android app that replaces youtube. I am getting really sick of advertisments everywhere.(been with apple since the original Iphone)

 

[derekheeps]

Mercedes vehicles have generally been rated highly for safety over the years, but, so have other makes/models. Insurance companies frequently use IIHS ratings to price consumer auto insurance. They publish their ratings. See, e.g.: https://www.iihs.org/ratings/class-summary/midsize-cars

Yep ; here , in Europe we have EURO NCAP ratings , which pretty much say the same things - Mercedes and Volvo pretty much sit at the top .

What value can anyone place on the difference between walking away from a crash and being taken away in a body bag ?

Obviously computers don't make that much of a difference , unless one sets your house on fire during the night , and maybe that could just as easily be an Apple computer , left on downstairs , but you pay your money and make your choice .

 

[derekheeps]

Did you go to another platform for watches? If ever my ultra 1 watch fails I’d consider another option with less integration, no messaging, and just sleep tracking, fitness, heart rate, and integrated hiking maps. If ever that comes to it.

I wear a mechanical wind up watch when I’m not sleeping or working out.

I still have a generation 1 Apple watch , which I have replaced the battery in , but it still works ; I really only use it to tell the time , so my Citizen perpetual watch is what I tend to wear ; I also have my Omega f300 Geneve Chronometer , and my f300 Speedsonic , both of which I love to wear , and currently needing servicing , my dad's 1956 Rolex , which I , my bad , left lying in a drawer too long .

The Rolex may go to my son for his 21st , and my Omegas after I draw my last breath . I really need to get my daughter a nice ladies' watch , although she will probably inherit her mother's Omega , which I bought her .... However I don't like to favour my son or daughter over each other .

 

[derekheeps]

As someone who has been here since the Apple //c, it's funny seeing what people would leave for. I was here through the company trying to implode, architecture changes, being the underdog—at this point I think it's one of the longest relationships of my life. So never say never, but it's been 42 years so far, let's see what happens.

I started with an Apple II at work ; a couple of years later the first computer I bought at home was a Commodore 64 , not long followed by an Amiga 500 , then a 1200 .

A couple of years after that I bought an iMac G3 DV400 , but it had a faulty screen and with no replacement available the company gave me a Powermac G4 !

 

[DankeBrutus]

Even if Apple became as horrible towards privacy and harvesting as Google and Microsoft, I'd still use Apple because it's what works best for me.

Nothing really changes in that regard: if all major OS builders give up on privacy I'd still pick the OS that is easiest to use and requires the least amount of attention. That's still macOS for me.

I see where you're coming from and I don't disagree. If everything sucks and the options are use computers with zero respect for user privacy or don't use a computer at all then ya I'd also just keep using a Mac. In a scenario where both Microsoft and Apple are awful in terms of privacy then there is a third option, that being Linux. I don't have much in terms of software I absolutely need so there are zero dealbreakers for me with a Linux switch.

 

[poorcody]

There are so many things that keep me in the ecosystem, I suspect it would hard to dislodge me. But creeping service prices is one I am keeping an eye on. I'm paying $3/mo for expanded iCloud storage, mostly for photos. If there were any more significant monthly charges for services that I would consider "necessary" or close to necessary, I would become wary. I don't mind paying for Apple Music or Apple TV etc as extras, but I don't want any monthly fees for things like photos, messages, etc.

 

[MacMorrison]

What they're doing right now - making the computers unaffordable, scanning devices without permission (and no doubt uploading the contents to their servers), selling your data, forcing ads in apps, changing software to subscriptions.

 

[TruthAboveAllElse]

If another company starts making as good of products as Apple does, cares as much about accessibility and reliability, and if they actually decided to start putting advertisements within the operating system, not just in specific apps but like on the home screen and everything, like Amazon does with their fire tablets and Alexa speakers.

I find it hard to believe that someone would go through the trouble of switching their entire ecosystem, dumping hundreds, if not thousands of dollars on all new equipment just because, checks notes, some search results in maps are technically advertisements. That person clearly wasn’t around when Steve Jobs spent a combined 40 minutes between April and June 2010 hyping up how good their “iAds” service was, only for Tim Cook to discontinue it three years later because, surprise, surprise, it immediately became complete spam and no one wanted to accept Apple’s revenue sharing terms.
something tells me these are the same people who would be back here in a week and a half telling us about how they just pre-ordered a 2TB iPhone 18 Pro Max, because that’s always how this seems to go.

And we are already on step one.

iAds is not at all like adding ads to Maps. iAds was Apple’s attempt to improve ads where they appeared in 3rd party apps. I wish it was still around and gained traction. I want nothing to do with ads in Maps.

 

[Und Eser]

Not being able to write a Linux boot image to my RPi M.2 SATA does make me cast my mind back to a time when everything tech did "just work". In Windows.

I am running MacOS developer beta though, hope they get it fixed and it doesn't turn out to be a new Apple garden wall "feature". 🙄

 

[conmee]

Parents had a 1978 Mercedes 300D diesel and a 1986 Peugot 505. I really liked the Peugot, used it for the driving test for my driver's license. Even though the 300D was older it just felt solid and well put together. I recall driving to a college class and pulling up next to a 500SEL and I knew that was the car for me (while making about $12/hr part time lol). I told myself SEL stood for "Super Extra Luxurious" and even though I was working on a minor in German, I didn't learn until later that it really stood for "Sonderklasse Einspritzung Lang." I wasn't in the proper income bracket to get an SEL back then, but I have been driving S-Class as a daily driver the past 17 years. Fantastic roadtrip car as well.

Back to the main topic: I first used an Apple IIe in high school. Used Macs on and off through the years before finally going all in on Apple when I left Microsoft in 2009. For me to leave Apple it would have to be a huge misstep on Apple’s part. If they embed ads in Messages or Photo Albums or if all their apps start having constant little reminders to upgrade or try something despite repeated attempts decline. I guess it would have to get much much worse. I’m more upset that Apple nixed 3D Touch, Dashboard, iTunes, LaunchPad, 32-bit support, soon to be axed Rosetta, and general Liquid Glass complaints. 🙂 I mean after all that if I’m still here, I guess it will take a lot more to get me to leave. There are still enough product choices at various price-points that I don’t think I’d leave just based on price hikes just yet (says the guy who bought an M5 Max with 64GB earlier this year which cost more than my first car, but I’m old, plus inflation etc lol).

 

[Sosab123]

Nothing really. The ecosystem is real reliable. It wouldn’t be cost.

 

[EdwardC]

In order for me to reverse course and start leaving the Apple ecosystem, someone somewhere is going to have to start making an astonishing array of amazing devices, with flawless software and integration. I started with MS DOS 3.2, and started using Windows with version 2, and carried on up to 11 (though I jumped ship during XP, and my PC became a glorified games console at that point). At various times I've used Linux, BeOS, and Amigas. Nothing I have used comes close to macOS/iOS and my array of Apple devices, which aren't all current as you can see in my signature.

Maybe one day Amiga will be reincarnated as a range of superbly designed, built, and integrated devices with an all-new Workbench that is beautiful, reliable, and secure. Who can say what the future will bring? For now, Apple has no competition for me.

Ditto, still have a nice PC on 11 but have been on Mac OS since System 7 and nothing comes close.

 

[Abydos]

seriously, not being able to use the CLI under terminal or single user boot

 

[superarijit]

TL;DR: Apple Maps ads triggered me, a step away from what I liked most about them, no ads and privacy, so time to explore alternatives.

I have been happily living in the "walled garden" for many years, deeply invested in the ecosystem with icloud photos, files and backups, etc. I have been happy to pay extra for Apple devices just because things work so well.

But recently a few of Apple's decisions have are making me second-guess if I should explore alternatives, for example adding ads to the App Store and Maps. Also, whenever I use my Linux computers, the friction of trying to use Apple services from those is very high, sometimes totally impractical (photos from the iCloud web interface kinda suck) or impossible (no AirDrop in Linux).

I am currently testing a few things: using Immich for personal/local cloud photos, got an old cheap pixel phone to try out "degoogling" it as much as I can, using Proton services for calendar+mail+cloud files, KDE Connect and LocalSend for sending files between devices, even testing Asahi linux on one of my macs (those guys are wizards!). The experience so far varies from "OK" to "janky", but usable, and at least I have control moving forward.

So where do you draw the line? What would make you switch?

It isn't that Apple is so good but that the alternatives are so bad. I definitely think we're at peak iPhone so need to upgrade until you current phone dies.

 

[MBAir2010]

at this point I think it's one of the longest relationships of my life. So never say never, but it's been 42 years so far, let's see what happens.

same here (1986,90) as my bro-in-law uses Microsoft since 1982ish
Shimano holds my longevity product wise along with adobe.

 

[derekheeps]

Parents had a 1978 Mercedes 300D diesel and a 1986 Peugot 505. I really liked the Peugot, used it for the driving test for my driver's license. Even though the 300D was older it just felt solid and well put together. I recall driving to a college class and pulling up next to a 500SEL and I knew that was the car for me (while making about $12/hr part time lol). I told myself SEL stood for "Super Extra Luxurious" and even though I was working on a minor in German, I didn't learn until later that it really stood for "Sonderklasse Einspritzung Lang." I wasn't in the proper income bracket to get an SEL back then, but I have been driving S-Class as a daily driver the past 17 years. Fantastic roadtrip car as well.

Back to the main topic: I first used an Apple IIe in high school. Used Macs on and off through the years before finally going all in on Apple when I left Microsoft in 2009. For me to leave Apple it would have to be a huge misstep on Apple’s part. If they embed ads in Messages or Photo Albums or if all their apps start having constant little reminders to upgrade or try something despite repeated attempts decline. I guess it would have to get much much worse. I’m more upset that Apple nixed 3D Touch, Dashboard, iTunes, LaunchPad, 32-bit support, soon to be axed Rosetta, and general Liquid Glass complaints. 🙂 I mean after all that if I’m still here, I guess it will take a lot more to get me to leave. There are still enough product choices at various price-points that I don’t think I’d leave just based on price hikes just yet (says the guy who bought an M5 Max with 64GB earlier this year which cost more than my first car, but I’m old, plus inflation etc lol).

Sorry for being off topic , but after having Rovers and Jaguars in the fifties ( I was born in 58 ) my dad bought a used 300 Adenauer in 1960 , I don't have many memories of it , then he bought my mum a new W110 190 in 1964 ( we went then from the only family in our town to have a Mercedes - to having TWO ! A bit later , my mum commented about the 'new Mercedes Sports Car' which she liked , and as my dad loved her so much , he traded his Adenauer for a Pagoda 230SL , and he took to drivng either the 1964 Land Rover or the 190 .

Got to 1970 ; I was sent off on a cruise and when I came back the 190 had been written off in a crash , but a new 220/8 took its place ; a few years later that was the car I learned to drive in and passed my test in . Meantime , my dad traded in the 230SL , which my mum had loved , for a 350SL , which she did not like at all and within 3 months it was returned and replaced by a VW Karmann-Ghia !

That takes us up to my crash in the 220/8 and it being replaced by a W114 280E , before countless other cars , my current mode of transport being a R129 SL 320 .

 

[steelslicerx]

But I don’t work at Apple

 

[capamac]

Move on to Linux on an x86 system? One appeal of Apple's current hardware is the combination of performance and efficiency. My Mac mini runs quiet, fairly cool, and sips on power. I hadn't realised how much I valued that, but I do. And replicating exactly that in other hardware is a bit of a challenge.

I believe the Intel Panther Lake CPUs are pretty close to Apple M-series i terms of performance and low power draw.

 

[SpotOnT]

my biggest tie to Apple is macOS. If they kill macOS, lock it down like iOS, or anything that forces me yo Linux, then I am out.

I can get by with a dumb phone if I have to.

 

[Abydos]

does a 1968 mgb classify as a devotion to a product or a form of insanity

 

[SpotOnT]

What they're doing right now - making the computers unaffordable, scanning devices without permission (and no doubt uploading the contents to their servers), selling your data, forcing ads in apps, changing software to subscriptions.

Can you elaborate on what Apple is doing with the “selling your data” part?