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Which laptop: PB 15"/17" or IBM Thinkpad?

Originally posted by Butla99
I was trying to figure this out from ATI's website, but that just confused me more. Obviously, the ATI 128MB Mobility FireGL T2 (used in the IBM T41p and R50p) has twice the MB of the ATI 64MB Radeon 9600 (used in PB 15" and 17"), but are they supposed to be optimized for certain applications? Will one work better for gaming/DVD's/etc. and one work better for detailed presentations and business-type appplications? Or is one just better and faster overall? I am not too familiar with all the terms relating to graphics cards, but I do know some and I know that bigger numbers are generally better (except when talking about time issues). Anyway, I am leaning towards one of the IBM notebooks over the PB (don't judge me, I love the PB's also but I am not sure that I am ready to switch) and wanted to make sure the Fire GL T2 was a great graphics card for all purposes, entertainment and business.
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As IBM states themself about the T41p.

"It's a laptop for the engineer on the move"

Which means its not really a laptop where the primary customers are homeusers or users that want to use it as a multimedia machine but have a powerfull laptop for CAD engineering and such, thats why IBM installed the Fire GL T2 into it.
 
Originally posted by legion
Nope, I'm right. The html page you've seen is referring to the specs of the cover material. They used to explain it with more clarity (but it seems their html table loading specs are missing fields now.)

Taken from IBM's internal documents (pdf file: tabook.pdf):

"Magnesium alloy in the top cover, titanium-reinforced carbon fiber reinforced plastic
(Ti-CFRP) in bottom cover"

The X series uses a Titanium cover material, but the body/bottom material is Ti-CFRP. You can find more info on Ti-CFRP (which is an amalgamation of materials) in IBM's research website whitepapers.

Besides those documents, I have a T41p (typing on it now) and I've seen the internals. I've also never owned a T20, so I wouldn't be doing comparisons to that laptop (other Thinkpads I've owned were the 600series and butterfly 700series) (The T20/T30 form factors didn't impress me.)
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Alright, but i've also looked at that tabook file and it depends what model you are looking to, some got it, some doesn't.

However my T20 is almost as thin as the T40 or T41 so it's not a bad form factor, however the T30 is almost three times as thick as my T20 and i can agree that the T30 seems thick and ackward.
 
my man, no offense, but you don't know what you're talking about. I work for the big blue and support 300 employees, and the T series machines are bunk. The T20 and T21's are on there last leg. Of course there are good T's, but the 570 and 770 were more stable than the T's. The latest wave of T's are crap. T30's are selling for $900, can you guess why? I'd even recommend the R over the T.
 
another thing, the hard drives are the worst........T30 and new R40's had hard drive recalls up the ying yang.....I have at least several hard drive crashes a week
 
Re: Which laptop: PB 15"/17" or IBM Thinkpad?

Originally posted by Butla99

4. Processor/Bus: G4 1.33GHz/167MHz (PB's) vs. Pentium-M 1.7 GHz/400MHZ (IBM)
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Just a minor point: the IBM is actually a 333 Mhz effective bandwidth bus, not 400 Mhz. This is because the memory bandwidth is only 333 Mhz effective (PC2700 DDR). This is basically just the opposite of the G4 situation...the G4 has 333 Mhz effective memory bandwidth, but the FSB is only 167 Mhz effective, so the bandwidth is effectively only 167 Mhz despite the DDR memory.

However, it should be noted that in terms of memory *latency* (as opposed to bandwidth), the Powerbook is actually much better than the Centrino. The Powerbook has a true 167 Mhz FSB, whereas the Centrino only has a 100 Mhz FSB. Yeah, it is quad pumped for 400 Mhz theoretical bandwidth, but double and quad pumping doesn't help reduce latency!

That said, I think the Centrino will still have something of an advantage in scalar int and fp stuff, while the G4 will have an advantage for vector stuff. Either will probably be more than sufficient to meet your needs.

I'd definitely go with the Mac, but that is just me...I appreciate something that is well designed with an attention to detail, and works like it should. =)
 
I'd definately get a thinkpad if I got a laptop right now. I'm a mac freak, but until the mac laptops get faster and have better battery life, there is no question in my mind.
 
Originally posted by Skilz34
another thing, the hard drives are the worst........T30 and new R40's had hard drive recalls up the ying yang.....I have at least several hard drive crashes a week
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That's a damn lie!

At least i "know" what i talk about and my experience as i work as consultant and we all got Thinkpads on the field and they almost never fail.

Regarding the harddrives that is completely flame from you side.

Hitachi Storage Systems delivers most drives and they are extremely well built.

Don't tell people lies just because you love Apple.
 
lol, dude, I bought an apple for music. I didn't even know what a Powerbook 6 months ago. holla
 
Originally posted by Counterfit
Well, thank you for such an informative post. I'm sure both Butla99 and packetloss, along with the rest of the forum, are the better off for it. :rolleyes:
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I agree with Counterfit. Also, HGST also supplies drives for the PBs (at least, it has in the past.) HGST also happens to be the number 1 supplier of hard drives for blade servers for continous long-lasting performance (always on scenario)

Skilz34.. you're a fraud. To what end, I have no idea (since you don't help out the Apple side or the IBM side by your rants.) All I can tell is you don't know what you're talking about and are fabricating stories.
 
Originally posted by Packetloss
I am in the same position as you are, however i got a Thinkpad T20 and it has worked extremely well, no faults.

Now i am considering the Powerbook 17" and i really love the design and the *NIX environemt as im used to Linux from the x86 world.


However i got some things to sort out.

Word processor, i do not want to use M$ Office as this is one of the reasons i buy the Apple, i want to get rid of M$ once for all.

What would you recommend as word processor?

I am thinking of converting all documents i type to PDF format and then distribute them to people when they want to share somehting with me instead of using *doc in Office as Windows users are used to.


The other thing is, how can i connect to M$ Exchange servers with OSX? i do not want to use Encourage or what it's called.

Any solution to this, open source maybe?

Last question...

Should i wait til January to buy the Powerbook or should i buy now?

Do you think it will actually come out a faster G4 Powerbook or even a G5 Powerbook in January?
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dont you just hate it when you ask a question in a forum and people just move on like you havent said any thing

moveing swiftly on just dl open office it runs just fine through x11 if you want simplicity use appleworks it's not bad it just dose not have some fetures that I personaly don't use it suits me justt fine what I don't understand is why people just run to m$ I cant stand office and only use open office when I have to
 
Originally posted by Hector
dont you just hate it when you ask a question in a forum and people just move on like you havent said any thing

moveing swiftly on just dl open office it runs just fine through x11 if you want simplicity use appleworks it's not bad it just dose not have some fetures that I personaly don't use it suits me justt fine what I don't understand is why people just run to m$ I cant stand office and only use open office when I have to
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Yes right and it is a shame that SUN doesn't release Star Office 7.0 to OSX.

I actually tried the latest Star Office 7 on my Linux machine and they have come very long.

Actually it is so mature you can use it as an alternative to MS Office.
 
I don't know performance-wise which type of laptop you should, the apple powerbook or Thinkpad.

but I got my first Apple about a year ago only and I didn't find it difficult to switch at all... in fact, I found it easier to switch than to go through all the troubles with a windows-based machine... one thing I love about MacOS X is how I have barely ever had to do a re-install...

but on the one occasion that i did because I wanted a fresh system for Panther, the install time after verification of the disc was only 18 minutes!!! WOW!!!

that is after customizing my install to exclude the languages and Printer drivers I don't need... but still... it's fantastic.

The whole user experience is also so much better... the visual splendor is there for all to see! I mean, every time I go back a windows (XP) machine that my kid sisters use at home, I can't get over how BORING everything is... I know it is customisable, but how many people actually want to go through the effort??? One example I have are the icons... they are so so so so bad in windows. in MacOS, you make them as big as you want and there is no pixellation!!! fantastic!!

I could never go back to such a boring, dull, static OS that is windows in a million years after experiencing the dynamic, almost organic user experience of MacOSX.

everything just seems so right...

try it man, and be in for one of those epiphany thingys...
 
18 minutes???? that's all it took?

as you all know by know, i just recieved my long-awaited PowerBook 17-inch beauty! :)

however, i was soooooo excited about setting up the pb that the next morning, i woke up the entire house at (seriously)
4:01 AM, and by around 4:30, the computer was set to go! unfortunately, i then realised that the pb had jaguar installed on it (the Apple Store had assured me that it was already w/ Panther). however, it turned out that the Apple Store opened all the PB's boxes, took out the Jaguar CD's, and put in panther ones.

so, I had to load Panther onto my computer. Unfortunately, i was downstairs drinking a glass of water while my father (never used a Mac; calls it a "cult" :confused: )

i don't really know if he did a clean install or just upgrade. but whatever he did, what should have been a 20-minute ordeal took an unbelievable 46-minute affair.

i had absolutely NO idea that Panther took such a long time to upgrade.

and also, so far, no problems with Panther. everything running ok.
 
The hardware really doesn't matter so much as the operating sytem's ability to stay viable for long periods. And if you want a crash-proof system, the Mac is the only way to go.

In eight months of PC ownership (a 15" 2.4ghz Toshiba), WindowsXP Home crashed straight out of the box almost every day, with IE & Outlook Express fouling every few days. Sometimes the system wouldn't even boot unless I turned off the machine for a minute or more, or after rebooting a half-dozen times (on average).

In a bit over two months, neither Jaguar or Panther has ever crashed, though one game, "Medal of Honor", freezes occasionally and requires a reboot.

Buy a Mac and never (OK... very very rarely) worry about crashes.
 
I don't understand one thing, Mac users associate a PC machine with Windows "always".

Who said this guy would use Windows in the first place?

I have Linux Gentoo installed on mine and has been like that for the last year, before that i had Slackware installed.

Most often you dualboot with Windows "if" you really need it.

A Thinkpad with any BSD or Linux distro is serious stuff and it's fast, really fast.

Good hardware and a good operating system.

Windows got nothing to do with if you buy the Thinkpad or Powerbook, however the Thinkpad can run most OSs compared to the Powerbook and you can run latest SUN StarOffice 7 on it.

Your choice, and it's a hard choice between these two laptops because they are good at everything and it all really comes down what you want to do with your laptop.
 
Skilz34.. you're a fraud. To what end, I have no idea (since you don't help out the Apple side or the IBM side by your rants.) All I can tell is you don't know what you're talking about and are fabricating stories.



As much as I enjoy posting in a forum, I apologize for not taking it as seriously as you do. I chose to use my precious time to post here in order to help (so I thought) someone concerning IBM ThinkPads. So the only fabricating going on are in your nylons. Loosen them up.

Oh, and allow me to take a side:
Go Apple!
 
You should also consider the warranty, with the Powerbook you only get 1 year when you buy it, and you can get 2 more years if you buy the expensive Apple Care Protection Plan for $349.

With the IBM you get full 3 year warranty at once at no extra charge.

That's something to consider also, but it also shows the extreme high buildquality that the IBMs got, however the Powerbook isn't bad either.
 
Originally posted by Skilz34
Skilz34.. you're a fraud. To what end, I have no idea (since you don't help out the Apple side or the IBM side by your rants.) All I can tell is you don't know what you're talking about and are fabricating stories.



As much as I enjoy posting in a forum, I apologize for not taking it as seriously as you do. I chose to use my precious time to post here in order to help (so I thought) someone concerning IBM ThinkPads. So the only fabricating going on are in your nylons. Loosen them up.

Oh, and allow me to take a side:
Go Apple!
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I know I shouldn't but... When someone asks a serious question, especially regarding the purchase of a hard care laptop such as a PowerBook or ThinkPad, they would prefer serious, well thought out replies with links and/or facts. Your post (in case you forgot):
lol, dude, I bought an apple for music. I didn't even know what a Powerbook 6 months ago. holla
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Notice how it contains nothing pertaining to the topic. No swaying arguments, no links, two "facts" that don't even matter. Butla did not say he/she was going to use the laptop for music, and he/she apparently already knows what a PowerBook is. The kicker? You started with "lol, dude" and ended with "holla", sure signs that the post will probably be devoid of any intellectual content, which Packetloss, legion, and others have in spades (maybe then can lend you some :p).
 
Dual booting on laptops

I always liked the ability to dual boot, whether OS 9 and OS X, or Windows and Linux.

But in every day practice, it's a pain in the ass. I had planned to repartition my Inspiron 3800 into a 16 GB Linux and a 4 GB Windows. But it always turns out, after I'm happily working away in Linux, someone at work will need me to access a MS Publisher doc, or need me to look at a work-related PC cd. I sure don't want to spend much time in Windoze, but it often becomes necessary.

So I decided to hold off on Linux for now.

On the Mac side, I've been looking for a 667-867 TiBook, so I can dual boot OS 9 and X. This is because I still use Virtual Game Station, and have Virtual PC 3 and don't plan to upgrade anytime soon. I think I'd boot into OS 9 on occasion, also, for sentimental reasons :p
 
Countertwit......

I heard the crowd go "oooooooooh" when you made those fantastic retorts. Nice! You should start your own website about forum etiquette. I apologize, I didn't mean to work you up. I'll send you some prune juice to relax you so you can handle these serious life issues.

You're a geek.
 
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