Why Apple TV fails in the UK....

[scaramoosh]

There is no Freeview.... Everyone in the UK uses Freeview and Sky and Virgin have their own versions. People are just used to plugging in an aerial and watching TV with the whole app stuff on the back end. So many times I tried to get people and family members into these boxes, it never works because they have to switch source, no one can ever seem to work it out. It's like how most people I know cannot work out 101 is HD and 01 is SD, but they're so used to watching channel 1 - 4 that they will never watch HD, they do not care it looks bad.

Apple TV needs to have a built in decoder for Freeview or it'll never be big in the UK.

 

[-Gonzo-]

Well Im certainty not classed as everyone.
I haven’t used Freeview for many years, don’t have an aerial for a start and got rid of SkyQ a few years ago.
We do have a satellite feed going into the TV but very rarely use it.
AppleTV 4K with TV Launcher, iPlayer, ITVX, Ch4, Five cover most of the live TV channels we watch.
The likes of U, PlutoTV, Plex, Tubi, Watch Free UK, Freevee & RakutenTV covers other free to view tv viewing.
Other than that it’s atv+, NOW, Netflix, Disney+, Paramount+ & YouTube that covers the rest.
The AppleTV remote is the only remote we use in our house, in both the main lounge and bedroom.

 

[JulianL]

Well Im certainty not classed as everyone.
I haven’t used Freeview for many years, don’t have an aerial for a start and got rid of SkyQ a few years ago.
We do have a satellite feed going into the TV but very rarely use it.
AppleTV 4K with TV Launcher, iPlayer, ITVX, Ch4, Five cover most of the live TV channels we watch.
The likes of U, PlutoTV, Plex, Tubi, Watch Free UK, Freevee & RakutenTV covers other free to view tv viewing.
Other than that it’s atv+, NOW, Netflix, Disney+, Paramount+ & YouTube that covers the rest.
The AppleTV remote is the only remote we use in our house, in both the main lounge and bedroom.

Yeah. TV Launcher is a life saver for those people like me who want a EPG for live broadcast channels as well as streaming from Netflix, ATV(no plus any more!), Amazon Prime etc.

It's maybe worth pointing out that as well as the free stuff (BBC, ITV, C4 etc) Now TV is also integrated into TV Launcher to add some of the Sky channels for people moving away from Sky Q or Sky Stream but that does incur a Now TV subscription charge.

I hope that one day Freely might be available as an app but right now, unless something changed in the last few months without me noticing, it's not even available as a stand-alone box/puck and you have to buy a new Freely-enabled TV if you want to get it so I suspect it might be a while (if ever) before there's an app for it. I suppose it's probably a money issue, Freely presumably gets some licensing fee from TV manufacturers which makes a stand-alone app tricky to monetise.

Personally I would pay a modest subscription fee if a Freely app offered a more seamless experience by hiding the fact that it's going in and out of iPlayer, ITVx etc to watch the various channels but that's just me. For now TV Launcher at least gives me a pretty nice unified EPG interface to the live broadcast channels.

 

[StumpyBloke]

Couldn’t agree less with the OP.

Linear TV is dying and we know this as an absolute fact. TV on demand is increasing and we know this as a fact. That’s all that needs to be said IMO.

 

[BMox81]

I do get what the OP is saying-my wife’s side of the family still use Virgin Media/a TV guide so when they come over to ours (for babysitting) the concept of the ATV (or any streaming device) is absolutely alien to them and they ask if they can use the regular LG remote and they will just watch freeview.

And when you have the latest TV manufacturers of this world baking in Fire/Google TV into the their TV’s and people just being happy making do, I can’t ever see the ATV gaining traction here in the UK even though we know it’s a great device.

 

[Neonblue]

Well Im certainty not classed as everyone.
I haven’t used Freeview for many years, don’t have an aerial for a start and got rid of SkyQ a few years ago.
We do have a satellite feed going into the TV but very rarely use it.
AppleTV 4K with TV Launcher, iPlayer, ITVX, Ch4, Five cover most of the live TV channels we watch.
The likes of U, PlutoTV, Plex, Tubi, Watch Free UK, Freevee & RakutenTV covers other free to view tv viewing.
Other than that it’s atv+, NOW, Netflix, Disney+, Paramount+ & YouTube that covers the rest.
The AppleTV remote is the only remote we use in our house, in both the main lounge and bedroom.

Same, and quite a broad assumption by the OP. What sources do you have to back that up?
I haven’t watched linear TV since the early 2010s and have used Apple TV as my standalone media device for serval plus years and know many other (not so tech savvy) owners too.

 

[DJHB1980]

in the UK it needs these but not all maybe

• a Freely App, or a Freeview Arial to USB converter if such a thing exists, but will be redundant quite soon
• another alternative would be a much improved TV Launcher App with better links to all Live channels & Catchup services, as an extra option as competition to keep the Freely app on its toes
• HDMI Stick option for portability,
• sub £100 price point for low(er) cost option
• cloud storage or, (maybe) better still, onboard storage

 

[pacmania1982]

There is no Freeview.... Everyone in the UK uses Freeview and Sky and Virgin have their own versions. People are just used to plugging in an aerial and watching TV with the whole app stuff on the back end. So many times I tried to get people and family members into these boxes, it never works because they have to switch source, no one can ever seem to work it out. It's like how most people I know cannot work out 101 is HD and 01 is SD, but they're so used to watching channel 1 - 4 that they will never watch HD, they do not care it looks bad.

Apple TV needs to have a built in decoder for Freeview or it'll never be big in the UK.

I disagree with this.

We used to have Sky with everything other than the movies. When we looked at what we watched, it was never the movies so we cancelled those. When we did the same again a year or so later, we found we weren't watching the paid for channels, and only really using the box to pause the TV. When we returned from a three week holiday to Europe, we realised we hadn't missed the TV and so cancelled all of our subscription and returned our box.

We then cancelled our TV licence as we don't watch any form or have access to any form of live TV.

We just use our Apple TV to watch YouTube or Amazon Prime.

We don't miss it. And several of our friends do the same. So to say everyone in the UK uses Freeview or Sky/Virgin is false.

 

[kiranmk2]

This is like asking for optical drives to be added back to Macs. It is not happening. Freeview itself likely has only 10 years left, with ITV/ Channel 4 and Five being out of contract with the terrestrial broadcaster, Arqiva and the government wanting a switchover from broadcast to IP streaming (i.e. Freely) in the 2030s https://observer.co.uk/news/business/article/terrestrial-switch-off-date-too-fast-for-all-tv-viewers

As has been pointed out, TV launcher and the BBC, ITV, Channel 4 and Five apps gives an approximate Freeview experience and if you really want a "Freeview on the Apple TV" experience - buy an HDhomerun and the Channels App.

A more realistic option would be for Apple to support the DVB-DASH standard (so iPlayer UHD/HDR would work) and Freely to cut a deal with Apple for a Freely app to be released.

 

[Ctrlos]

There is no Freeview.... Everyone in the UK uses Freeview and Sky and Virgin have their own versions. People are just used to plugging in an aerial and watching TV with the whole app stuff on the back end. So many times I tried to get people and family members into these boxes, it never works because they have to switch source, no one can ever seem to work it out. It's like how most people I know cannot work out 101 is HD and 01 is SD, but they're so used to watching channel 1 - 4 that they will never watch HD, they do not care it looks bad.

Apple TV needs to have a built in decoder for Freeview or it'll never be big in the UK.

Or pay £6 for TV Launcher and watch all the freeview you like streamed directly to an interface a lot easier to use, faster and ad free than the arse-end one that comes with your smart TV!

Or just watch streaming platforms both free (U, ITVX, All4 etc) and paid and cancel your TV licence to save £170 a year.

 

[afd]

I’ve got an HDHomeRun attached to an aerial that receives FreeView and use the Channels app to watch it on any Apple TV or iOS device in the house. There’s also a free HDHomeRun app that wasn’t available when I bought the box years ago. It works well, but I don’t use it as much as I thought I would.

 

[theluggage]

There is no Freeview.... Everyone in the UK uses Freeview and Sky and Virgin have their own versions. People are just used to plugging in an aerial and watching TV with the whole app stuff on the back end.

(For non-UK viewers: Freeview is the UK over-the-air Digital TV platform. It's an umbrella brand/standard for a bunch of channels for half a dozen different providers including the BBC, C4, ITV and various other commercial operators. It's what you get if you plug your TV into an aerial...)

People who just want to watch Freeview channels have a new-fangled device called a Television for that. Apparently, though, some portion of of the UK TV-watching population must have worked out how to go beyond punching in a channel number in order to run Netflix, Prime, Disney, ATV+, iPlayer etc.

Apple's bigger problem is that any TV bought in recent years will also have those Apps built into the TV - and probably Netflix/Prime/Dismal+ buttons on their remote controls where you once might have found "HDMI 1/2/3" buttons. I guess you have to cross the TV maker's palm with silver for that (I'm sure Apple could afford it). Also, the iPlayer app on ATV is lame (no 4k or subtitles last time I looked) but since other providers have managed to implement such things I think that one is down to the BBC.

So many times I tried to get people and family members into these boxes, it never works because they have to switch source, no one can ever seem to work it out.

I'm assuming the people in question are "sound in body and mind" - making digital services accessible to people with genuine issues is an important topic that I wouldn't dismiss but I don't think that's the question here.

Given that, if they really want to watch something on streaming or play their Apple Music library (while you're not there to do it for them), they'll work it out. If they're not interested, they'll find another "problem".

True, the UI design on TVs is universally awful (and the UI design of most streaming apps is frankly sociopathic). Powering up the Apple TV first will do it on most modern rigs, though...

Apple TV needs to have a built in decoder for Freeview or it'll never be big in the UK.

Do you mean having a hardware DVB2 (?) TV tuner (a UK/Europe standard not used in the US) and a co-ax aerial connection to the Apple TV? Not gonna happen on what is primarily a streaming box, but if it did...

How does a channel-based service like Freeview integrate into the app-based Apple TV UI, though? You'd either need several dozen channel apps, or a "Freeview" app with it's own channel-based UI. Perfectly feasible but it's not going to help anybody who won't accept a "learning curve". If they only ever use whatever app lets them watch Freeview and punch in channel numbers, they don't need an Apple TV.

In any case, most - if not all - of Freeview is available via streaming, and while that means half-a-dozen different Apps on an Apple TV, Freeview do offer a one-stop-shop streaming App for Android and iOS - just not on ATV, which is probably down to Freeview, not Apple.

 

[supertomtom]

I’ve got an HDHomeRun attached to an aerial that receives FreeView and use the Channels app to watch it on any Apple TV or iOS device in the house. There’s also a free HDHomeRun app that wasn’t available when I bought the box years ago. It works well, but I don’t use it as much as I thought I would.

I do exactly the same. HDHomeRun + Channels app. Works great, though I also rarely watch free to air nowadays.

 

[BMox81]

It’s that level of effort that is the barrier though.

Like I’m could say to my in-laws that the ATV is the greatest device in the world but if this is the requirement to just watch TV then they’d say f that and they’d keep the VM box.

It needs to be front and center with minimal effort.

 

[theluggage]

I do exactly the same. HDHomeRun + Channels app.

HDHomeRun is probably the best solution if you want over-the-air Freeview - and there are a variety of apps that can use it. Haven't tried Channels, but the free (only needs a subscription for PVR features) app does the trick & I've got a NextPVR server which also comes with an ATV App. It also lets you watch Freeview on your Mac, iPhone, iPad etc. while you're connected to your home network. You can also run something like NextPVR on a Mac, NAS etc. to get subscription-free PVR.

However - I don't think getting an external HDHomeRun box, connecting it to the network, getting it tuned, installing an App (with yet another different UI) etc. is going to be a solution for the customers that @scaramoosh was talking about who can't figure out changing the input source on their TV.

I have a potentially great HDHomerRun+NextPVR setup but even I tend not to bother when I can just turn on my TV and get some junk to point my face at while I'm having a cup of tea. These days I actually want to *watch* a show, 99% of the time it's on streaming (including iPlayer, ITVx etc.) and the main entertainment from the DIY PVR stuff is just getting it to work on new equipment... I've been pursuing the perfect homebrew PVR for years, and had a MythTV setup back at the dawn of time (hell to get working - supremely powerful once it was going). Now there's a range of reasonably easy-to-set-up PVR solutions, I'm just not using over-the-air any more :-(

So I don't think lack of a built-in DVB tuner is Apple TVs problem (a port of the official Freeview app would be nice, but not Apple's department) - however, I'm seriously considering switching to just using the streaming Apps on my TV, and having a Raspberry Pi for streaming local content. The biggest appeal of the Apple TV for me is that the 'Computers' App is the easiest, 'just works' way of streaming my local music collection from the Mac Music app... which still works for me as of Sequoia.

 

[kiranmk2]

However - I don't think getting an external HDHomeRun box, connecting it to the network, getting it tuned, installing an App (with yet another different UI) etc. is going to be a solution for the customers that @scaramoosh was talking about who can't figure out changing the input source on their TV.

Most modern TVs can be set to always start up on the external input so noone has to change inputs, just select the relevant App from the homescreen.

 

[Starfia]

(For non-UK viewers: Freeview is the UK over-the-air Digital TV platform. It's an umbrella brand/standard for a bunch of channels for half a dozen different providers including the BBC, C4, ITV and various other commercial operators. It's what you get if you plug your TV into an aerial...)

Thank you for the useful orientation. ^ ^

(Thankfully, I also knew what an "aerial" was.)

 

[nickf]

It has BBC iPlayer, ITVx, C4, 5, U, Now, Pluto etc. That's not a bad start. I can't say I've missed having Freeview on mine.

 

[theluggage]

Thankfully, I also knew what an "aerial" was.

Sorry, missed that one - the "ae" should have been a red flag

It has BBC iPlayer, ITVx, C4, 5, U, Now, Pluto etc. That's not a bad start. I can't say I've missed having Freeview on mine.

I don't think there's anything significant on Freeview that you can't stream via BBC iPlayer, ITVx, C4, 5 or U - but you do have to install and register half a dozen different apps (probably with irritatingly different UIs) & learn what is where.

I think OP has a point about "discoverability" vs. a TV which you just plug in, let it auto-tune and then just flip channels. I just don't think that's in the Apple TV box's power to fix - and probably not a concern for their target market. Even if Freeview ported their App to ATV it wouldn't really give the same "experience" (for better or worse...)