Why do Apple media/bloggers let Phil Schiller off the hook re:Mac hardware?

[Rogifan]

John Gruber wrote this in his first impressions of the new MBP.

It’s hard not to speculate that all of these changes are, to some degree, a de-Jony-Ive-ification of the keyboard. For all we on the outside know, this exact same keyboard might have shipped today even if Jony Ive were still at Apple.2 I’m not sure I know anyone, though, who would disagree that over the last 5-6 years, Apple’s balance of how things work versus how things look has veered problematically toward making things look better — hardware and software — at the expense of how they function.

And then he tweeted this:

John Gruber (@gruber)
11/13/19, 9:10 AM
⁦‪@neilcybart‬⁩ ⁦‪@benthompson‬⁩ It’s not positioning him as a fall guy for recent decisions, it’s arguing that the buck stops with him for decisions 3-4 years ago that only got fixed today.

OK even if the butterfly keyboard was 100% conceived by Jony Ive is it not Phil Schiller’s product marketing team that has the relationship with developers and customers, especially pro customers? Where was was Schiller’s team pushing back saying no, this isn’t what our pro customers want? Schiller was perfectly happy to get up on stage and tout the latest hardware product as being the thinnest and lightest Apple ever shipped. Yet Gruber, Marco Arment, Jason Snell etc. never ask Schiller and his team about that.

Only conclusion I have is Apple media/bloggers are too chickens—t to ever call out Schiller because if they do then they might not get an interview with him or someone on his team and might not be invited to a product briefing. They‘ll call out Ive because he has one foot out the door and they’d never get an interview with him anyway. Seems a bit disingenuous to let Schiller off the hook for decisions his team was most likely intimately involved with.

 

[impulse462]

Only conclusion I have is Apple media/bloggers are too chickens—t to ever call out Schiller because if they do then they might not get an interview with him or someone on his team and might not be invited to a product briefing. They‘ll call out Ive because he has one foot out the door and they’d never get an interview with him anyway. Seems a bit disingenuous to let Schiller off the hook for decisions his team was most likely intimately involved with.

I think you answered your own question

 

[poorcody]

Only conclusion I have is Apple media/bloggers are too chickens—t to ever call out Schiller because if they do then they might not get an interview with him or someone on his team and might not be invited to a product briefing. They‘ll call out Ive because he has one foot out the door and they’d never get an interview with him anyway. Seems a bit disingenuous to let Schiller off the hook for decisions his team was most likely intimately involved with.

Often when interviews are arranged, the PR people only agree if certain topics/questions are not brought up too.

 

[JPack]

Schiller's pay: about $10 million per year.
Ive's pay: about $30 million per year.

The guy being paid 3x as much gets to make the final decision at meetings.

 

[Rogifan]

Schiller's pay: about $10 million per year.
Ive's pay: about $30 million per year.

The guy being paid 3x as much gets to make the final decision at meetings.

What is your source for this?

I think you answered your own question

I know it was mostly a rhetorical question. But honestly I think Schiller’s power inside Apple is under-reported. I guarantee you decisions like product features, configurations, pricing etc. come from Schiller’s team or are heavily influenced by his team.

 

[throAU]

To throw Ive (OR Schiller) under the bus for this is wrong.

Yes, he may have pushed for it. Yes he may have signed off on it. But Apple are a corporation with plenty of people in it who could have either vetoed it or changed course when the problems were discovered or done more to resolve them. Rather than doubling down on it and changing their entire portable lineup over - even after reports were coming in.

This is a failure of the entire company - from design, to production, to marketing to customer support. It's a disgrace, and inexcusable that it has gone on now for more than FOUR YEARS.

Previously, apple hardware screw ups have been fixed within a product generation. Not this.


edit:
I hate to be one of those "Steve Jobs would have never let this happen!" people. Because i think that honestly - he would have let it happen. He let things like the puck mouse happen. Or all Apple mice for that matter. They're universally trash.

BUT. I very much believe that Jobs would have kicked arses over this and got it fixed within ONE product cycle. He would have not accepted the public ridicule and most certainly not have doubled down. Unless it was FIXED.

 

[Anarchy99]

Question:Why do Apple media/bloggers let Phil Schiller off the hook re:Mac hardware?

Answer: Access journalism, the nicer you are the more likely you are to get invites to events/behind the scenes as well as reveiw units, which often don't need to be returned but even when they do you benifit from your early access.

 

[JPack]

What is your source for this?

How Much Does Apple Pay Jony Ive?

How Much Does Apple Pay Jony Ive? That's a Secret.

fortune.com

Schiller may be a powerful guy, but Ive dominates him. Ive is the guy that designed every major Apple product in the past 20 years. How do you even compare resumes?
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I know it was mostly a rhetorical question. But honestly I think Schiller’s power inside Apple is under-reported. I guarantee you decisions like product features, configurations, pricing etc. come from Schiller’s team or are heavily influenced by his team.

Right from Steve Jobs' own biographer:

"If I had a spiritual partner at Apple, it's Jony. Jony and I think up most of the products together and then pull others in and say, 'Hey, what do you think about this?' He gets the picture as well as the most infinitesimal details about each product. And he understands that Apple is a product company. He's not just a designer. That's why he works directly for me. He has more operational power than anyone else at Apple except me."​

​

Answer: Steve Jobs said so.

 

[DanMan619]

Question:Why do Apple media/bloggers let Phil Schiller off the hook re:Mac hardware?

Answer: Access journalism, the nicer you are the more likely you are to get invites to events/behind the scenes as well as reveiw units, which often don't need to be returned but even when they do you benifit from your early access.

I think there's an element of just plain being professional involved here too. Tech journalism isn't supposed to be like TMZ or a political town hall with people angrily yelling criticisms at these company execs. We don't need tech journalists/tech youtubers treating Phil or whatever other executive like a criminal on the stand. Jonathan Morrisons video interview with Phil i thought he did a good job of politely bringing up past criticisms without raging at Phil about it like a child, which would have had Phil shut down the interview probably. Call out/rage culture doesn't have a place in tech journalism, in my opinion. Maybe on a blog or opinion piece article, but absolutely not when actually sitting down with the people behind the products.

 

[drzen]

The Jonathan Morrison interview if you pay close attention, you can watch the delicate dance in the entire production - because that's what it was, a carefully orchestrated production, with the new Macbook Pro highlighted as that centerpiece recording the entire interview. Watch how carefully he phrased the question about the SD card slot, and how Schiller had to reassure him that it was OK to ask.

When an interview is conducted on home turf by Apple (it was their space), they have the psychological upper hand. The new media crowd feel especially privileged to be invited to cover such an exclusive reveal, and that's reflected in their demeanor.

 

[Rogifan]

How Much Does Apple Pay Jony Ive?

How Much Does Apple Pay Jony Ive? That's a Secret.

fortune.com

Schiller may be a powerful guy, but Ive dominates him. Ive is the guy that designed every major Apple product in the past 20 years. How do you even compare resumes?
[automerge]1573786398[/automerge]


Right from Steve Jobs' own biographer:

"If I had a spiritual partner at Apple, it's Jony. Jony and I think up most of the products together and then pull others in and say, 'Hey, what do you think about this?' He gets the picture as well as the most infinitesimal details about each product. And he understands that Apple is a product company. He's not just a designer. That's why he works directly for me. He has more operational power than anyone else at Apple except me."​

​

Answer: Steve Jobs said so.

But Jobs has been gone for years.
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I think there's an element of just plain being professional involved here too. Tech journalism isn't supposed to be like TMZ or a political town hall with people angrily yelling criticisms at these company execs. We don't need tech journalists/tech youtubers treating Phil or whatever other executive like a criminal on the stand. Jonathan Morrisons video interview with Phil i thought he did a good job of politely bringing up past criticisms without raging at Phil about it like a child, which would have had Phil shut down the interview probably. Call out/rage culture doesn't have a place in tech journalism, in my opinion. Maybe on a blog or opinion piece article, but absolutely not when actually sitting down with the people behind the products.

OK but the keyboard wasn’t mentioned once. Another example is Gruber complaining about iOS storage options but never once asking Schiller about it on stage. Of course one can assume he’s told what he can and can’t ask about but that just make Gruber an Apple shill. Why would he want to be thought of as that?

 

[maflynn]

Where was was Schiller’s team pushing back saying no

How do you know he wasn't. We have no idea wha occurs behind closed doors.

Schiller was perfectly happy to get up on stage and tout the latest hardware product as being the thinnest and lightest Apple ever shipped

That's because its his job. regardless of any internal disagreements, when its time to promote a product he has a job to do. How long do you think he'd last if he got on stage and said negative things about the product

Yet Gruber, Marco Arment, Jason Snell etc. never ask Schiller and his team about that.

Bring that up with them - you ask an impossible question since they're not here

Only conclusion I have is Apple media/bloggers are too chickens

That's your conclusion, but that may not be the truth

 

[Rogifan]

How do you know he wasn't. We have no idea wha occurs behind closed doors.


That's because its his job. regardless of any internal disagreements, when its time to promote a product he has a job to do. How long do you think he'd last if he got on stage and said negative things about the product


Bring that up with them - you ask an impossible question since they're not here


That's your conclusion, but that may not be the truth

So we’re supposed to believe behind closed doors Schiller and his team were saying this was a bad laptop that pros wouldn’t like yet nobody in the company course corrected? And then Schiller got on stage and positively sold this thing because it’s his job? That doesn’t say much good about Schiller (or Cook for that matter) does it? And if we’re to believe that, what other products is he up on stage selling that he doesn’t believe in?

Of course I don’t believe that. Honestly there was probably only one product released that the entire executive team didn’t support and that was the gold Apple Watch. But that product got next to no stage time or promotion by Apple execs and was gone after one year.

 

[AustinIllini]

Only conclusion I have is Apple media/bloggers are too chickens—t to ever call out Schiller because if they do then they might not get an interview with him or someone on his team and might not be invited to a product briefing. They‘ll call out Ive because he has one foot out the door and they’d never get an interview with him anyway. Seems a bit disingenuous to let Schiller off the hook for decisions his team was most likely intimately involved with.

If Apple Marketing works like most marketing organizations, Schiller et al go to the engineering team and go "here's what the market demands based on our sales and research". Engineering builds it. Schiller et al then most go market the device to customers. What are we supposed to criticize him for?

Now that Ive is gone, I think this is Schiller's show. Already, you're seeing Apple respond to market demands in every facet of their business (always on display on Apple Watch, larger battery iPhone, new MBP keyboards, powerful low price iPads).

Not sure why we have to take it out on one guy.

 

[maflynn]

So we’re supposed to believe behind closed doors Schiller and his team

No, we're not supposed to believe anything. What I'm saying is your making assumptions on what's happening when its clear you have a very incomplete picture of what's been occurring. He could very well been beating the drum for the butterfly keyboard, or he could fought vehemently against it. We simply do not know. Yet you are drawing damning conclusions on such sparse information.

And then Schiller got on stage and positively sold this thing because it’s his job?

Yes:

That doesn’t say much good about Schiller

You mean he's not doing his job as the head of marketing if he gets up and promotes the butterfly keyboard

Of course I don’t believe that.

that's the great thing about being alive at this time. You are free to believe in what ever you want.

 

[AustinIllini]

I like this version of @maflynn

 

[pcd213]

The Jonathan Morrison interview if you pay close attention, you can watch the delicate dance in the entire production - because that's what it was, a carefully orchestrated production, with the new Macbook Pro highlighted as that centerpiece recording the entire interview. Watch how carefully he phrased the question about the SD card slot, and how Schiller had to reassure him that it was OK to ask.

When an interview is conducted on home turf by Apple (it was their space), they have the psychological upper hand. The new media crowd feel especially privileged to be invited to cover such an exclusive reveal, and that's reflected in their demeanor.

Bingo. You hit the nail on the head. These days, YouTube and Instagram “influencers” (almost as gross a feeling as saying “millennials”) get primo access and first dibs on new products. There was a time when that was the WSJ and NYTimes. So, do you think Jonathan Morrison, Justine Ezarik, or Marques Brownlee are going to give up that opportunity by asking a pointed question? Not a chance. Also, as much as some of them are incredibly talented, they are terrible journalists and interviewers, and some need time to mature. So, I’d argue that they’re not the right person to deliver that type of question for there to be a “we/I made a mistake” response. Don’t forget, we got that response from Apple in response to Joanna Stern’s WSJ piece on the butterfly keyboard issues. No one ever saw that coming.
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Not sure why we have to take it out on one guy.

Only playing devil’s advocate here for a moment, this is exactly what they did to Scott Forstall.

 

[AustinIllini]

Only playing devil’s advocate here for a moment, this is exactly what they did to Scott Forstall.

1) Forstall was responsible for a broken product, which wasn't damning.
2) What was damning was his refusal to fess up he screwed up
3) Forstall had a much different job than Schiller

 

[TheRealAlex]

Schiller's pay: about $10 million per year.
Ive's pay: about $30 million per year.

The guy being paid 3x as much gets to make the final decision at meetings.

Mic Drop..

 

[psingh01]

I don’t know why some assume he has some kind of veto power over design decisions. It’s possible, but is there any evidence to back that up?

 

[AustinIllini]

I don’t know why some assume he has some kind of veto power over design decisions. It’s possible, but is there any evidence to back that up?

There's no way he has that power. He goes to management and says "Here's what the market says we need".

 

[matram]

I think the 2016 MBP was a combination of several things. And Jony Ive was probably one of them.

But I also think the 2016 model was designed from the beginning to be used with Intel 10 nm chip, hence smaller batteries, thermal management less critical. Then Intel could not deliver, and still has not delivered H-class 10 nm CPUs. Apple anyhow released the MBP with an under dimensioned chassis for a 14 nm CPU, something they now correct.

Remember also that the butterfly keyboard had already been introduced in the MacBook, so it probably seemed like a relatively safe bet at that point in time to bring it to the MBP.

 

[Abazigal]

Only playing devil’s advocate here for a moment, this is exactly what they did to Scott Forstall.

I suspect Tim Cook had wanted to get rid of Scott Forstall all along, and was simply searching for the right excuse to do so.

Phil Schiller seems like someone who knows how to toe the party line when needed, so he stays. No matter how many mistakes he may have made.

 

[pcd213]

I suspect Tim Cook had wanted to get rid of Scott Forstall all along, and was simply searching for the right excuse to do so.

Phil Schiller seems like someone who knows how to toe the party line when needed, so he stays. No matter how many mistakes he may have made.

Totally agree.

 

[JPack]

But Jobs has been gone for years.

Power hasn’t changed hands in any substantial manner. Read WSJ and Bloomberg on testimonials about working with Jony Ive. He is the center of every design approval. Phil Schiller is only the vehicle to carry Ive’s designs.

​

“Members of the human interface and industrial design teams viewed approval from their new leaders as merely tentative. “They still wanted Jony’s thumbs-up to go forward,” this person said.”​

Apple is not a marketing company. They design technology first and foremost. How could Schiller possibly have any veto power over Jony Ive? Most journalists probably realize this fundamental fact. Why ask a silly question to Schiller?