Why doesn't anyone go head to head with Apple?

Discussion in 'MacBook Pro' started by whitedragon101, Aug 4, 2011.

  1. whitedragon101 macrumors 6502a

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    #1
    I always think its strange when Apple do something with the Macbook Pro or OSX that I don't like and I look for competing products. But there don't seem to be any. HP have tried it with the HP Envy but its not really in the same class.

    With all the muscle of HP, Asus, Sony, Microsoft etc why hasn't anyone just gone toe to toe with Apple and tried not just to make a cheap looking knock off of a Macbook Pro, but actually make a product that competes for the crown?
     
  2. awer25 macrumors 65816

    awer25

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    #2
    They easily could, but why? HP already sells WAY more laptops than Apple. Plus, if you look at the Envy 17, it was half the price of the 17" MBP with similar specs.
     
  3. nuckinfutz macrumors 603

    nuckinfutz

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    #3
    It's not them. They could design hardware and put the effort in but they know their buyers and their buyers are looking for "cheap"


    HP, Dell, ASUS and more are serving the Walmart crowd.

    Apple services the Nordstroms, and Whole Foods crowd.
     
  4. rockyroad55 macrumors 601

    rockyroad55

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    #4
    Have you looked at the new line of Ultrabooks and the Sony Z Series? Pretty good looking laptops in my opinion.
     
  5. Eddyisgreat macrumors 601

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    #5
    [​IMG]

    Adamo by Dell, amongst others.

    Problem is that most of the people who want ultra premium want the name to go along with it. If it walks looks and quacks like a mac for the same price, why not just get one?
     
  6. randomrazr macrumors 65816

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    #6
    hp has some slick laptops that compete with the macbook pro.

    look at the hp envy 14!
     
  7. ABadSanta macrumors regular

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    #8
    A lot of companies have come out with computers to compete. The HP Envy series and the Dell XPS 15z (google it- it's almost a carbon copy of the 15")
     
  8. kasakka macrumors 68000

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    #9
    No other companies have the kind of hardware and software integration that Apple can offer. Windows in it's "compatible with everything and runs legacy crap too" ethos is never going to work as smoothly.

    The second thing is that most PC manufacturers simply seem to ape what Apple is doing rather than spending the time to make something unique. Most of the time they also choose really awful things (HP Elitebook touch strip volume controls come to mind) as features and don't spend time making sure that they work great.
     
  9. Macsavvytech macrumors 6502a

    Macsavvytech

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    #10
    Many have tried but Apple has patents for everything that makes a Mac a Mac. Apple aeronautical may be small but combine to make awesome laptops.
    Could also mention the fact Apple makes the laptop and the Operating System....
    .
     
  10. whitedragon101 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #11
    "These two laptops are not equals, but they never had to be -- for hundreds upon hundreds of dollars less "
    "When Dell tells you that the XPS 15z has no compromises, that's not quite the case -- it's a solid choice at this price point, but corners were cut to get here."

    http://www.engadget.com/2011/05/23/dell-xps-15z-review/


    This always seems to be the story other manufacturers, they try to make a cheaper version. They cater to the can't afford a Macbook Pro crowd. No one dares to try make a laptop that costs £2,000 and go head to head. I think Asus has the best shot at it due to their design flare and willingness to be interesting and take risks (just look at this a laptop finished in Bamboo).


    Apple is having to work very hard to stay ahead of the competition in the Phone market because the competition is releasing luxury phones in the same price bracket with the same goal. This kind of competition would really help drive innovation in the laptops I think.
     
  11. awer25 macrumors 65816

    awer25

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    #12
    Everyone cuts corners - Apple too. Look at their 13" MBP - it has a 1280x800 screen. The 13" and 15" only have 2 USB ports, and at 2.0 speeds. There is no eSATA port, no Blu-ray, etc.
     
  12. Prodo123 macrumors 68020

    Prodo123

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    #13
    Sorry, but most people don't consider a 13" laptop to be a premium laptop in the first place. There are exceptions, e.g. MacBook Air.
    The real big guns come out with the 15". Why can no one compete with apple? Design. Dell Adamos, Samsung computers, they all have great designs that turns heads. Apple has an even better design, and a glowing apple on the back which turns heads and makes mouths drool. Throw in great performance to go along with the design, and people stop caring if it costs $2000. Give it the world's best tech support and an average lifespan of 6 years, and people start paying.

    Dell has crap support and average lifespan of 2 years. ASUS is a good competitor but is lesser known, also tends to have heavy laptops. Samsung has decent design at best, and only the Series 9 can actually put up a good fight. HP is just a ripoff of Apple; look at their entire laptop line and compare them to the MacBook Pros! Even Amazon stuck Mac OS X onto an HP laptop on their ad.
     
  13. aeboi macrumors 65816

    aeboi

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    #14
  14. thinkinblue613 macrumors 6502

    thinkinblue613

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    #15
    There are a bunch of computer companies out there... I wouldn't be surprised if a few of them started merging in order to compete with Apple.
     
  15. awer25 macrumors 65816

    awer25

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    #16
    The 13" MBP is absolutely a premium laptop - it costs twice as much as other i5 13" laptops and is built much better.

    Are you kidding? Makes people drool? Apple unibody laptops are so ubiquitous now that I don't even notice them anymore.

    Dell's support is fine and on par with most other companies. When I had a problem with my old Dells, they would send a repairman out to my house the next day to replace the part. Also, HP isn't an Apple ripoff. Their computers are nothing like a MBP. They also sell more laptops than any other company IIRC, which is quite impressive.

    Apple makes a very nice computer, but it's not the end-all, be-all savior to the computer world.
     
  16. takeshi74 macrumors 601

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    #17
    Why would the big boys want to fight harder for a portion of a tiny market share? Consider it from the perspective of the businesses rather than just your own perspective. More manufacturers in this range don't automatically mean more customers or demand.
     
  17. sev macrumors member

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    #18
    you need to also consider that PC's are generic.

    Apple can tout the 'it just works' mantra because as we all know, Apple are hardware manufacturers first and foremost.

    The benefit of this is that Apple can dictate design and technology and then code to suit as we've seen from all its offerings over time. Because it can dictate the system architecture and then tailor the OS around it, it has the luxury of design freedom which other manufacturers don't have.

    Ultimately whatever windows box you choose, they are all somewhat generic as a platform, the chipsets being an across the board configuration hence the boards having the same number of slots, ports et al, irrespective of manufacturer.

    Windows has to work in all of these circumstances, so in truth, windows 'just works' because it has to install on possibly a thousand different machines all with different junk in the cases, even though the chipsets work on a common framework.

    Apple doesn't have to do this, nor does it have to play device mfr catchup as it does both.

    Imagine you are the designer, instead of being shown a motherboard and told - wrap it around this, you design the aesthetic and tell the engineers - how can we design to fit into this...

    that is a powerful and privileged position to be in. Take the Air, perfect example.

    The style was designed, and the motherboard was conceived from the ground up to fit into it - 'lets just break the ssd apart and lay all the chips side by side'. genius.

    That's apple's powerful advantage. for another to do the same they have to re-invent an entire chipset potentially. Yet this is why Macs just work, because the OS is designed to take advantage of the hardware, which is designed and engineered to take advantage of the style.

    Although I don't advocate it, if you ever tried to get OS X to run on pc hardware then you'll understand perfectly what i'm talking about. Intel chips or not, OS X doesn't run on generic hardware without a lot of dicking around.
    But in truth it's never needed to.

    That's why there are no real competitors to go head to head with apple - yet.
    Apple's true strength is innovation, an eye for design- having learnt the hard way. I remember the days of the Performa range. When iMac came out it changed everything.

    But what keeps Apple at the forefront? - easy. Apple don't play the numbers game. Lets face it, most new smart phones rip iphone apart, however Apple shine at taking something that is technically complicated and making it very easy to use and work with, And that is Apple's greatest strength, from iLife to Disk Utility to iOS, the user experience is simplicity itself, it doesn't intimidate, it doesn't make people nervous. It draws you in with beautiful interfaces and nice product design, and you feel at ease working with it. That's what makes mac users productive.

    On windows, I'm always fidgeting with settings and dicking around because in truth I never really feel comfortable using it. with my Mac I just concentrate on what I need to do, and enjoy the fluidity of it all. I just work! :)
     
  18. Prodo123 macrumors 68020

    Prodo123

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    #19
    Lenovo X1 is a premium laptop. Samsung Series 9 is a premium laptop. The new VAIO Z is a premium laptop. The MacBook Air 13" is a premium laptop. They all have certain components, e.g. SSDs, which makes them a powerhouse. They are all extremely thin. They all cost more than $1600, and they are hard to find in public. The MacBook Pro 13" has become so common that it's rarely considered a "premium" laptop, more of a social norm. Plus, it has the innards of a generic laptop, not a premium laptop.

    Like I said, the 13" is everywhere. The 15" is where people start noticing that your Mac is different. Many, many people drool over the 15" MBP's horsepower.

    Everyone has different support stories. Dell has been known as the "cheap" brand for a long time. Many people I know own Dells and they complain about its reliability and lack of support. Apparently they don't send repairmen out as often as you think.
    As for HP, they copied Apple's design but added their own flavor. Also, the reason why they are selling more laptops is because they're mostly sub-$1000. If you look beyond that point, Apple dominates the market.

    I'm not saying Apple's laptops are the best. I'm saying the competition can't catch up because of its design. There are much more powerful computers out there (see Falcon NW and Alienware), but their design sucks (11lb laptop). In a package like the MacBook Pro, there's really no competition.
     
  19. Macsavvytech macrumors 6502a

    Macsavvytech

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    #20
    This is just so true.
    I think the only thing left out is that Apple does have design patents limiting MacBook Pro "copies" to an extent
     
  20. rockyroad55 macrumors 601

    rockyroad55

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    #21
    I also remember reading somewhere that the technology and formula behind the aluminum unibody is kept a secret so that's why many metal laptops out there do not have such a great uniform construction as Apple computers.
     
  21. Cicatrix macrumors 6502

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    #22
    This was an interesting read sev. Thanks for this.
     
  22. -tWv- macrumors 68000

    -tWv-

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    #23
    Perfect explanation. Great job!
     
  23. rockyroad55 macrumors 601

    rockyroad55

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    #24
    DONE! Thread is closed haha
     
  24. Macsavvytech macrumors 6502a

    Macsavvytech

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    #25
    Indeed, now its time to abandon the thread before I say something to embarrass myself. Later :p
     

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