So I guess if you were to put Windows on Macs and sell them, Apple's marketshare would suddenly jump through the roof.
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Why I switched to a BlackBerry, and I'm not coming back
- Thread starter CrzyCanuck72
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So I guess if you were to put Windows on Macs and sell them, Apple's marketshare would suddenly jump through the roof.
Ah my bad. Here I was thinking that my job consisted of doing real work. Glad to know that what I am doing is not considered real work, I must be doing childrens work right? High level programming? Server management? Nah your right thats childs play. Gtfo.
Fair point, however, I admin a mixed network, we have Windows clients and a few Mac clients, the Macs see our servers just as well as our windows PCs, admittedly the directory utility WAS in a very unintuitive place, but in SL it is in System Preferences.
As you say, you use MS products religiously so that's why you would want to use Office 2007 rather than office 2008, Microsoft's MBU is pretty badly funded I think and although I quite liked office 2008, I'm not an Office power user so I probably don't have the requirements in office that you have. However, I would probably just use Office in a VM if I really needed it that badly.
The main reasons that I like OSX are the UNIX system underlying it, having an ssh client built in and cli commands and utilities at my disposal is brilliant for my work, can't tcpdump in windows. The way I can make changes just in text editors in OSX and apps like Garageband and Aperture amke using my computer at home more fun.
As you say, you use MS products religiously so that's why you would want to use Office 2007 rather than office 2008, Microsoft's MBU is pretty badly funded I think and although I quite liked office 2008, I'm not an Office power user so I probably don't have the requirements in office that you have. However, I would probably just use Office in a VM if I really needed it that badly.
The main reasons that I like OSX are the UNIX system underlying it, having an ssh client built in and cli commands and utilities at my disposal is brilliant for my work, can't tcpdump in windows. The way I can make changes just in text editors in OSX and apps like Garageband and Aperture amke using my computer at home more fun.
I find your perspective interesting since I use both on a daily basis.
The fact that I can run Unix, Mac OS, and Windows natively on one computer is very nice. But taking it a step farther, with VMware Fusion, I also run the following virtually: Windows XP, Vista, Windows 2003 Server and Ubuntu. I will be adding DOS, 98SE, and NT.
With Mac Office 2004/8, I can work on my documents, spreadsheets and presentations and share them with my Windows using co-workers.
So I am wondering, what work can I not get done when using a Mac? IMHO, there is nothing that I can't do that I need to accomplish. This is especially true since I can run the Mac OS and the associated programs, but also Windows and the associated applications.
Please elaborate as to what "work" I cannot get done when using a Mac.
This is getting interesting....*getting out the popcorn*
I'd love to know why people think that Macs are not business machines. I am a business person and know many others that are and my Macbook works perfectly for business and does everything that I need. Much easier than Windows on many instances too (Keynote > Powerpoint).
I reluctantly have to have Windows on here too but thats only because there are a few software programs and websites that I need for business that wont run on Safari or Leopard, but everytime I open Windows, my MB gets sluggish and difficult to work with. I even had a WindowsXP "blue screen" the other day!
So, Im really curious to hear this arguement. *munches on popcorn*
I'd love to know why people think that Macs are not business machines. I am a business person and know many others that are and my Macbook works perfectly for business and does everything that I need. Much easier than Windows on many instances too (Keynote > Powerpoint).
I reluctantly have to have Windows on here too but thats only because there are a few software programs and websites that I need for business that wont run on Safari or Leopard, but everytime I open Windows, my MB gets sluggish and difficult to work with. I even had a WindowsXP "blue screen" the other day!
So, Im really curious to hear this arguement. *munches on popcorn*
Wow.. WhereTF did you pull that out of??
Please define your SERIOUS work?????? Oh, I have got to hear this. Please let myself and others here know what SERIOUS work is?
I agree with one of the other posters...I guess I don't do real work. I guess the 300 desktops, 25 servers, Cisco Switches, Routers, and Firewalls I support are for kids or hobbyists. I need to go back to a Windows Laptop that I can reboot a few times a day, because the tools I need chew up memory, or cause issues. This MB I'm using, and haven't rebooted in over 3 weeks, is wayyy too much a toy for these high level things I need to do...
EDIT: Forgot to mention. Two good friends of mine do statistical analysis, and programming. Both use Macs; one a Mac Pro, and the other a MBP/15". The latter does a number of development projects, and swears by Mac, and OS X due to UNIX AND the stability/robustness of the MBP. I'll be sure to tell them that they're doing child's work, and to get rid of those toys and get a Vista box...LMAO...
EDIT: Forgot to mention. Two good friends of mine do statistical analysis, and programming. Both use Macs; one a Mac Pro, and the other a MBP/15". The latter does a number of development projects, and swears by Mac, and OS X due to UNIX AND the stability/robustness of the MBP. I'll be sure to tell them that they're doing child's work, and to get rid of those toys and get a Vista box...LMAO...
I agree with one of the other posters...I guess I don't do real work. I guess the 300 desktops, 25 servers, Cisco Switches, Routers, and Firewalls I support are for kids or hobbyists. I need to go back to a Windows Laptop that I can reboot a few times a day, because the tools I need chew up memory, or cause issues. This MB I'm using, and haven't rebooted in over 3 weeks, is wayyy too much a toy for these high level things I need to do...
Classic. How true that is. OS X has built in tools to help manage servers, or I can use Windows and download cygwin and putty. Hm, which is easier? I think its clear the person who bashed OS X for being for kids doesn't have a real job himself.
Kinda ironic that he went missing after that last post huh??
Guess its one of those kids playing the "throw the sh$t and run" game!
Guess its one of those kids playing the "throw the sh$t and run" game!
You may be on to something.
But... but... I can't play every computer game on a Mac, so it obviously can't do serious work.
Good grief...is this forum moderated? Any chance we could delete the last page and a half of posts or move them to their own thread?
This thread WAS actually a nice, informative resource with varying viewpoints on why a reluctant BB user should consider an iPhone, before it got hijacked and turned into a ridiculous (on both sides) "I'm a Mac/I'm a PC" flame war.
--Mav
This thread WAS actually a nice, informative resource with varying viewpoints on why a reluctant BB user should consider an iPhone, before it got hijacked and turned into a ridiculous (on both sides) "I'm a Mac/I'm a PC" flame war.
--Mav
Haha sorry I went MIA - I was doing work
Anyway, I didn't want to make this into a Mac vs. PC battle but I guess that's what it has become...
Saying you can run Windows on a Mac is not the point I was making. My point was that the Mac OS cannot do the items I previously mentioned. All of you who keep saying you run Windows virtually on your Mac are proving my point so thank you! And nobody else has said anything to disprove any of my points except for explaining what "work" your macs are capable of. I never said Macs are incapable of doing ANY work but they are just not able to do as MUCH as Windows based PCs.
Nobody ever said you can't manage your company servers on a Mac so I don't know where that came from. It's like a lawyer who asks a completely different question to a witness just to get them to answer with a "Yes". It's still an irrelevant point!
And Rhett- your point is well taken, "serious" work to one can be be different than "serious" work to another. For ME (and I understand I may be in the minority here) serious work consists of spreadsheets, quickbooks, presentations, photoshop, illustrator and compatibility with coworkers. In all these tasks, Windows outshines Mac OS by a wide margin (IMO). Now I agree Mac OS is the simpler OS to use, but I stand by the fact that I can just get a whole lot more done with Windows. Is there anything that you guys CAN'T do with Windows that causes you to use a Mac and run Windows virtually!?
Anyway, I didn't want to make this into a Mac vs. PC battle but I guess that's what it has become...
Saying you can run Windows on a Mac is not the point I was making. My point was that the Mac OS cannot do the items I previously mentioned. All of you who keep saying you run Windows virtually on your Mac are proving my point so thank you! And nobody else has said anything to disprove any of my points except for explaining what "work" your macs are capable of. I never said Macs are incapable of doing ANY work but they are just not able to do as MUCH as Windows based PCs.
Nobody ever said you can't manage your company servers on a Mac so I don't know where that came from. It's like a lawyer who asks a completely different question to a witness just to get them to answer with a "Yes". It's still an irrelevant point!
And Rhett- your point is well taken, "serious" work to one can be be different than "serious" work to another. For ME (and I understand I may be in the minority here) serious work consists of spreadsheets, quickbooks, presentations, photoshop, illustrator and compatibility with coworkers. In all these tasks, Windows outshines Mac OS by a wide margin (IMO). Now I agree Mac OS is the simpler OS to use, but I stand by the fact that I can just get a whole lot more done with Windows. Is there anything that you guys CAN'T do with Windows that causes you to use a Mac and run Windows virtually!?
Haha sorry I went MIA - I was doing work
Anyway, I didn't want to make this into a Mac vs. PC battle but I guess that's what it has become...
Saying you can run Windows on a Mac is not the point I was making. My point was that the Mac OS cannot do the items I previously mentioned. All of you who keep saying you run Windows virtually on your Mac are proving my point so thank you! And nobody else has said anything to disprove any of my points except for explaining what "work" your macs are capable of. I never said Macs are incapable of doing ANY work but they are just not able to do as MUCH as Windows based PCs.
Nobody ever said you can't manage your company servers on a Mac so I don't know where that came from. It's like a lawyer who asks a completely different question to a witness just to get them to answer with a "Yes". It's still an irrelevant point!
And Rhett- your point is well taken, "serious" work to one can be be different than "serious" work to another. For ME (and I understand I may be in the minority here) serious work consists of spreadsheets, quickbooks, presentations, photoshop, illustrator and compatibility with coworkers. In all these tasks, Windows outshines Mac OS by a wide margin (IMO). Now I agree Mac OS is the simpler OS to use, but I stand by the fact that I can just get a whole lot more done with Windows. Is there anything that you guys CAN'T do with Windows that causes you to use a Mac and run Windows virtually!?
Yep. I couldnt get all my work done previously on my PC because of WIndows deciding to go into a hissy fit and shut down on me in the middle of something. That just caused me to have to work longer. (it just happened on my Windows side of my MB last week!).
I also had to take time out of my day to run virus tests (especially if a new threat came out) and spyware tests.
It took longer to do simple tasks because of the computer either freezing, being slow or just taking double the amount of time to find what I was looking for, whereas the OSX is much more simpler to work with.
The batteries on my PC laptops didnt last anywhere near as long as on my MB, so I not only had to carry around a much heavier computer, but also a cord as well.
Most people think things like iWork are too simple...I find the opposite. They are easier to work with for business because the menus arent bogged down with a bunch of crap that 99% of the people dont use, thus draining more resources and taking longer for those simple tasks.
There are many more things that caused working on a PC much more difficult and time consuming than on my Mac, but I wont list them all here and now. I think you get the point.
Well Windows 7 seems to have solved the issues you were having so looks like Windows might be the better option for you after all! Again, this is not a discussion of aesthetics so if you are buying the computer for looks or hardware then I understand. But even so, you can buy many PCs that have better battery life and about the same size as the Macbooks.
You simply don't get it. There are plenty of jobs (like mine) where OS X outshines Windows hands down. Server administration is one of those. I prefer doing my programming on OS X also. It is a hassle free OS. And when I look around my college campus I see more and more Mac's being purchased my students AND faculty. Yeah, faculty ya know, those people with PhD's. You calling them dumb? If you like Windows, so be it. But please, take your "OS X is for kids" attitude and leave. You are uninformed, ignorant, and uneducated with your comments.
How is it the better option now? Seems like the poster is happy with OSX so why would Windows 7 be the better option?
To be perfectly honest, aside from just overall prefering OSX...I dont TRUST the MS people! I have yet to see a quality product that they have made and just because someone claims that Windows 7 is so much better, does not take back the years and years of problems with them. IOW, a leopard cant change its spots! And I seriously doubt that after so many years, MS has FINALLY got it right. I just dont buy it!
I'm happy with my MB, Im happy with my setup (with the exception of having to use XP for a few things) and have no reason to switch.
I never pointed out that you can't do certain work on a Mac so you can keep trying to imply that I did but it's simply inaccurate. My point is that no matter WHAT you do, Windows can get the job done but that is NOT the case in with Macs OS. You might PREFER Mac OS to do your programming but you can also do your programming on Windows. You can see more and more Macs on college campuses but there are many majors in most schools that don't even ALLOW them (architecture, engineering, computer science, pre-med, pre-law, information technology and management just to name a few)! On the flip side, there is NO major that prevents its students from using Windows! The faculty for certain majors may be able to get their work done using Mac OS but again, nobody said that certain work can't be done on Macs. There is a reason that Apple's market share was stagnant for many years before they 1. redesigned their computers and 2. allowed them to run Windows. I'll leave it to you to figure out why.
First of all I got by with 95% of my course work so far on a Mac. The 5% was excel stuff, and since MICROSOFT screwed up Excel on the Mac, that is their fault, not OS X's fault. Second a lot of programming done in high level Computer Science classes is in Java, C++, etc. Much of that is text, so no Windows is not a requirement. And also, I can't do iPhone programming on Windows now can I? I WORK in a business college that is part of a large University, so if you want to try to outsmart me on what is 'normal' for colleges to allow and not allow, by all means try me.
If I wanted to do my server admin work on Windows, I would need to install a bunch of other stuff because Windows doesn't support scp, ssh, svn, or even have a terminal out of the box.
How is it irrelevant? Your argument was that you can/could do more on a PC than that of a Mac. The rebuttal was that a person working in an all Windows environment can manage/maintain that environment [as a Job!] with a Mac with NO extra software, and/or tools. Meaning they can do MORE with the Mac out of the box than a PC. I do not need Windows on my Macbook to do my job. Nor do I have it running in VM...
I can also do MORE with my Mac; both professionally and personally, than that of ANY Windows PC I've used/owned.
If you like Windows...good for you. Enjoy. Lots of people like using an interface [and yes, I lump Vista and Windows 7 into this as well] that looks like it was designed by kids...knock yourself out.
I just have to step in and say, while I fully get what you're saying, I think this isn't the best analogy to use, what with Snow Leopard and all.