Why is everybody so obsessed with RAM?

[camotwen]

I mean I was more curious as to what sort of target group this memory upgrade refers to rather than if individually one is right or wrong about buying more ram, I am sure people can make the best decisions for themselves in that and it is stupid others to tell them what they need and what not. I am doing mostly data analysis and for me, generally speaking, more ram goes hand in hand with more demanding computations, meaning more time running full speed, meaning more heat, something I would not want to overdo in my macbook air but rather send these to cloud anyway. I would not say no to more ram but it is a cost-value tradeoff. I guess similar to people who do more intensive computations on their machines. But it does not have to do with the air cpu performance, but the lack of fan mostly that would be the bottlenech. I mean it does look that MBA and MBP at same specs are quite close to equivalent to specs and performance, it is mostly the fan that changes, but not sure how much this would be relevant to the uses people describe.

I see that people seem to have a lot of trouble and memory issues with running a lot of stuff like word and stuff, it is understandable for me as I also hate having these programs open while doing my data stuff, though for me this is both a memory and computation/thermal issue so more ram would only solve it partially. But also I think it says a lot about the design and typical professional use of outdated in many ways programs creating the need for more ram because now it is a thing rather than more ram solving a problem, but that is another story.

 

[jdb8167]

Well, in that case you'll be better served by the 16-core GPU as it allows up to 32GB of memory. And no, 32GB of memory is not wasted.

8/8/24 GB/1 TB M2 MacBook Air = $1999.

8/14/32 GB/1 TB M1 Pro MacBook Pro = $2599.

Spending an additional $600 for a screen upgrade that I don't need, an additional 8 GB of memory, and somewhat faster multi-core performance that I rarely use isn't worth it. Not to mention the downside of a less portable notebook with less battery life.

 

[Asiatic Black Hebrew]

This thread has certainly proven that a large amount of Apple customers have a very poor understanding of how MacOS works. It's been quite entertaining seeing people trying to pass off their screenshots of Activity Monitor using most of the available RAM, as proof that anything under 24GB is obsolete.

I've also gotten a kick out of the "future proofing" nonsense, as well as the 0.1%> doomsday scenario of SSDs failing due to swap.

 

[jdb8167]

This thread has certainly proven that a large amount of Apple customers have a very poor understanding of how MacOS works. It's been quite entertaining seeing people trying to pass off their screenshots of Activity Monitor using most of the available RAM, as proof that anything under 24GB is obsolete.

I've also gotten a kick out of the "future proofing" nonsense, as well as the 0.1%> doomsday scenario of SSDs failing due to swap.

Unfortunately this is true. The amount of misunderstand and misinformation on macOS RAM usage posted on MR is sad. Future proofing is subjective though. I wouldn't consider keeping a computer for more than 4 years but many people here do. In that case, if they have the funds, upgrading to 16 GB can make sense. I would encourage people in that camp to look at trading in or selling their computer after 3-4 years and see if it is actually less expensive to keep it 8 years instead but many people don't want the hassle and just want to buy a computer and replace it every 8 years or so.

Having said that, there are people (I'm one of them) that can actually use 24 GB to good effect. I know what I'm doing and what my RAM working set is.

Edit: Well I do still have a 2013 Mac Pro that I bought in 2014 but it hasn't been my main computer since around 2018. I bought a 2018 MacBook Pro as a daily driver. The Mac Pro acts like a NAS now with an attached TB2 RAID box.

 

[Asiatic Black Hebrew]

Unfortunately this is true. The amount of misunderstand and misinformation on macOS RAM usage posted on MR is sad. Future proofing is subjective though. I wouldn't consider keeping a computer for more than 4 years but many people here do. In that case, if they have the funds, upgrading to 16 GB can make sense. I would encourage people in that camp to look at trading in or selling their computer after 3-4 years and see if it is actually less expensive to keep it 8 years instead but many people don't want the hassle and just want to buy a computer and replace it every 8 years or so.

Having said that, there are people (I'm one of them) that can actually use 24 GB to good effect. I know what I'm doing and what my RAM working set is.

Edit: Well I do still have a 2013 Mac Pro that I bought in 2014 but it hasn't been my main computer since around 2018. I bought a 2018 MacBook Pro as a daily driver. It acts like a NAS now with an attached TB2 RAID box.

I personally take the "To thine own self be true" approach when it comes to things like this. I have no issues with whatever anyone chooses to spend their money on. For all the folks who want a 2TB/24GB model, I say go for it, if that is what you choose. The lines are often blurred when it comes to figuring out what we NEED vs. what we WANT, & there is nothing wrong with erring on the side of caution.

However, my issue are the elitist type undertones I've seen in a lot of these replies. People regularly masquerading their cherry-picked anecdotes as irrefutable evidence, all while dismissing any factual argument to the contrary. Quite a few responses were nothing more than thinly-veiled ad hominem attacks on other posters. This is essentially the Apple fanbase in microcosm. A sublime tragedy.

 

[Macalway]

I personally take the "To thine own self be true" approach when it comes to things like this. I have no issues with whatever anyone chooses to spend their money on. For all the folks who want a 2TB/24GB model, I say go for it, if that is what you choose. The lines are often blurred when it comes to figuring out what we NEED vs. what we WANT, & there is nothing wrong with erring on the side of caution.

However, my issue are the elitist type undertones I've seen in a lot of these replies. People regularly masquerading their cherry-picked anecdotes as irrefutable evidence, all while dismissing any factual argument to the contrary. Quite a few responses were nothing more than thinly-veiled ad hominem attacks on other posters. This is essentially the Apple fanbase in microcosm. A sublime tragedy.

You have a way with words. Unfortunately, you are wrong

 

[sgtaylor5]

It could be that it's a decade old? How many tabs? I'm not saying more RAM can't help with some cases because it's obvious that some people need more than even 64 GB. I will advise anyone that if you like to keep dozens of tabs open while also having other applications running then more RAM is helpful. My issue is some people say 16 GB is the bare minimum for anyone and that's just simply not true.

The thing is people on forums are usually either noobs asking for advice or techie people. The techie people always need and want more and don't often understand the needs of the average soccer mom using her MacBook Air to browse Facebook, make flyers for her kids bake sale and pay bills online. If she was buying a laptop in Windows land today it would likely have a Celeron processor with only 4 GB of RAM.

Oh my goodness, all I see is pain when somebody buys a Windows 10 laptop with those specs! I can't in good conscience spec a Windows laptop if it doesn't have 16 gigs of Ram in it. That's Windows; macOS is lighter weight.

 

[m1maverick]

Oh my goodness, all I see is pain when somebody buys a Windows 10 laptop with those specs! I can't in good conscience spec a Windows laptop if it doesn't have 16 gigs of Ram in it. That's Windows; macOS is lighter weight.

Windows is no more of a heavy weight than macOS.

 

[russell_314]

Oh my goodness, all I see is pain when somebody buys a Windows 10 laptop with those specs! I can't in good conscience spec a Windows laptop if it doesn't have 16 gigs of Ram in it. That's Windows; macOS is lighter weight.

Because you’re a tech person. It would be like a super car enthusiast driving a base model Hyundai. People drive those and it gets them to where they want to go just fine. Of course if you’re used to driving a Ferrari you might literally pull your hair out. I have friends who use Windows laptops with 4 GB of RAM and have no issues with them. Until very recently many had spinning hard drives. Imagine using a Windows PC with a spinning hard drive and 4 GB of RAM. Are you feeling nauseous yet? 😂😂

 

[russell_314]

Windows is no more of a heavy weight than macOS.

I think it depends on the configuration. If you pull out all the bloatware it’s about the same as macOS. I think the RAM usage of my Windows PC for gaming is about the same as my Mac but I will have to check. I know it’s within 1 GB. The problem is taking most of that bloatware out is beyond the skill level of most users so it just stays running. If you take a Windows PC and a Mac comparing them right out of the box the Mac is going to use much less RAM just because of how is configured.

 

[m1maverick]

I think it depends on the configuration. If you pull out all the bloatware it’s about the same as macOS. I think the RAM usage of my Windows PC for gaming is about the same as my Mac but I will have to check. I know it’s within 1 GB. The problem is taking most of that bloatware out is beyond the skill level of most users so it just stays running. If you take a Windows PC and a Mac comparing them right out of the box the Mac is going to use much less RAM just because of how is configured.

What bloatware are you referring to?

 

[russell_314]

What bloatware are you referring to?

You don’t know what bloatware is? I’m talking about the bloatware that’s installed on a Windows computer when you buy it new.

 

[Zest28]

I agree, which is why anyone who wants an MBA and is throwing money at it with lavish upgrades is better served by a MBP. I have also been a proponent of that.

Why get the base M2 MBA when the M1 MBA is faster once you open "too many things"?

With the M2 chip, you need to buy upgrades. Else you could be better off with the older and cheaper M1 MBA.

 

[Macalway]

Maybe it's like the hardware lags behind the software. So in effect, the machine bites off more than it can chew.

(Ok, that's a little scary)

 

[m1maverick]

You don’t know what bloatware is? I’m talking about the bloatware that’s installed on a Windows computer when you buy it new.

I didn't ask you what bloatware is, I asked you what bloatware you're referring to. With that said what parts of Windows do you consider bloatware?

 

[m1maverick]

Why get the base M2 MBA when the M1 MBA is faster once you open "too many things"?

With the M2 chip, you need to buy upgrades. Else you could be better off with the older and cheaper M1 MBA.

Presumably other changes to the M2 MBA outweigh the performance increase of the M2 chip itself.

 

[jav6454]

Why get the base M2 MBA when the M1 MBA is faster once you open "too many things"?

With the M2 chip, you need to buy upgrades. Else you could be better off with the older and cheaper M1 MBA.

That is also another option and the M1 chip packs such a punch that not even Intel's latest offerings can outright beat it.

 

[jav6454]

8/8/24 GB/1 TB M2 MacBook Air = $1999.

8/14/32 GB/1 TB M1 Pro MacBook Pro = $2599.

Spending an additional $600 for a screen upgrade that I don't need, an additional 8 GB of memory, and somewhat faster multi-core performance that I rarely use isn't worth it. Not to mention the downside of a less portable notebook with less battery life.

"Less portable"? Are you joking? Thickness wise there is little difference and the wait will be noticeable but not enough to create back pain.

The rest, it's up to the user.

 

[camotwen]

This thread has certainly proven that a large amount of Apple customers have a very poor understanding of how MacOS works. It's been quite entertaining seeing people trying to pass off their screenshots of Activity Monitor using most of the available RAM, as proof that anything under 24GB is obsolete.

I've also gotten a kick out of the "future proofing" nonsense, as well as the 0.1%> doomsday scenario of SSDs failing due to swap.

I am new to macos, how does macos handle ram differently than other systems? I have definitely noticed that my MBA m1 does not cramble when ram gets full and starts using swap memory, while my windows laptop would turn unusable, which I suspect is due to the speed of SSD and maybe more effective use of swap memory. As my other computer is definitely lower spec, I am unsure if it is just hardware or mostly macos swapping memory more efficiently than windows (eg putting inactive RAM to SSD while windows just having active tasks writing on SSD or sth). Is there any other part where memory is managed better/differently by macos?

 

[Isamilis]

This thread has certainly proven that a large amount of Apple customers have a very poor understanding of how MacOS works. It's been quite entertaining seeing people trying to pass off their screenshots of Activity Monitor using most of the available RAM, as proof that anything under 24GB is obsolete.

I've also gotten a kick out of the "future proofing" nonsense, as well as the 0.1%> doomsday scenario of SSDs failing due to swap.

I would say, MR users (including myself) are more of enthusiastic users rather than regular ones.

 

[m1maverick]

I am new to macos, how does macos handle ram differently than other systems? I have definitely noticed that my MBA m1 does not cramble when ram gets full and starts using swap memory, while my windows laptop would turn unusable, which I suspect is due to the speed of SSD and maybe more effective use of swap memory. As my other computer is definitely lower spec, I am unsure if it is just hardware or mostly macos swapping memory more efficiently than windows (eg putting inactive RAM to SSD while windows just having active tasks writing on SSD or sth). Is there any other part where memory is managed better/differently by macos?

macOS and Windows handle memory in a similar manner. There are differences in implementation but, for all intents and purposes, they can be considered the same. One is no better / worse than the other.

Windows and macOS have over two decades or more maturity behind them and the fundamentals of memory management are well flushed out now.

 

[russell_314]

I asked you what bloatware you're referring to. With that said what parts of Windows do you consider bloatware?

This is the bloatware I’m referring to.

I’m talking about the bloatware that’s installed on a Windows computer when you buy it new.

What do I consider bloatware? Well any non Microsoft app or program that the PC manufacturer was paid to include. That’s a start then I’d add any M$ telemetry applications running in the background. If you’ve ever purchased a Windows PC in the last decade or maybe longer you know what I’m talking about

 

[ChildOfTheWW]

Could someone tell me why Macs never use the full physically available ram? At around 14 of 16GB my Mac uses swap and never goes above.

 

[m1maverick]

What do I consider bloatware? Well any non Microsoft app or program that the PC manufacturer was paid to include. That’s a start then I’d add any M$ telemetry applications running in the background. If you’ve ever purchased a Windows PC in the last decade or maybe longer you know what I’m talking about

So it's as I originally said: Windows is no more of a heavy weight than macOS. We're right back where we started.

 

[eltoslightfoot]

Windows is made to run with 2GB minimum @ 64-bit. So yeah, Win users don't usually care for that or 8GB.

I have worked to fix many Windows PCs and laptops. 4 GB of RAM is terrible. Everything is VERY slow and unresponsive.

Edited to add: I have both an M1 MBA with 16GB RAM (After selling my M1 MBA with 8GB RAM) and a Gaming PC with 16GB RAM. I had a SP7 with 8GB RAM. I simply don't understand why anyone in this day and age with a decent workload would not get 16GB of RAM. It isn't proportionally that much more and it is hard to do later. Even on the windows machines, most people don't know how to physically upgrade their ram.

Look, most probably can get by with 8, but why limit yourself that way?