Why people just don't get it?

[gorkt]

But... Every time I glance at my wrist to find one of my hand made, all mechanical Swiss chronographs with its gears and more gears, sans anything electronic or modern, it causes a broad smile to come to my face. I love precision workmanship, high quality, and the pleasure of knowing it's a one of a kind. Made by just one watchmaker, representing a full year of his time. Analog can be delightful.

See, I think that microcircuitry is also beautiful once you understand what is actually involved in making the microchips in these small devices. My husband is a lithography chemist, and I can tell you that the effort and skill that goes into making the chemicals that create these circuits is also something that is very impressive. You are essentially making etchings on the sub-micron scale.

I think analog watches and the romanticism around them has the weight of history and is easier for the layman to grasp, but I can assure you, the technology and craftsmanship that went into designing and making the microelectronics in these circuits puts traditional watchmaking to shame.

 

[Pravda]

One thing for sure to me, an Apple Watch will never posses one quality of a mechanical watch, Soul. The ticking sounds, the spinning of the automatic rotor when moving your hand/wrist. The winding of the crown every few days.

I love all gadgets, i am intrigued by the smart-watch. But i am concerned that once i start wearing this watch snapped computer on my wrist, i will no longer want to wear anything else. And i really really love my mechanical watches.

I guess my mechanical watch is the one thing I'm trying to hold on to in the 010101 world. I mean even Harley Davidson is now making an electric bike.

 

[Sodner]

I often miss calls because i do not feel or hear the phones vibration in my pocket. Now the watch will tap me on my wrist, no more missed calls.

I'm seated and I do feel a text vibration. Digging a 6+ out of your front pocket while seated is a pain. Now the watch will display the text.

Just two quick examples off the top of my head where the watch will add a bit of convenience to my day.

Thanks Apple!

 

[petvas]

How much more?

I'm playing the devils advocate.

You can get reminders, texts and calls on it. The iPhone has to be nearby so why not use that? You want to run with it, great, but if you want the GPS component, you need to run with the phone as well. What does it have that the iPhone doesn't? The health components and sensors like the heart rate. Is that enough to justify spending several hundred dollars?

Don't get me wrong, I like the watch but those arguments above were used against me, as I explained the watch.

It's all about comfort. Some times it's too cumbersome to take out your iPhone and use it, especially when outside. The watch would serve this purpose.
Apart from that, there is no other real reason..

 

[matrix07]

Buddy, don't be condescending, you don't know me or what knowledge I do/don't have.

If I'm so "lost", then feel free to fill me in on Apple's watchmaking pedigree to date. Of course Apple are a premium computer brand, it doesn't mean a damn thing when it comes to watchmaking. And I didn't say that Apple = Hyundai of the auto world, as Mr Jobs would have said "you're reading it wrong".

Fair enough.

The fact that Apple just enter the market doesn't mean it's the lowest of the low though. Hope you'll understand this point.

Looks like Apple has an intention to establish itself as a best smartwatch maker. We shall see if it will be successful or not.

 

[Chupa Chupa]

To your initial question of "why people don't get it?"

1) It's a new concept to people -- a Smart Watch, not a watch. But a watch is a dated concept to most these days. It's more of a social class, and fashion statement today. This doesn't include sport watches which are a tool but also not usually worn except during the activity.

2) People are stuck in their ways and slow to change. You read it here on MR -- "I'm not so lazy that I can't pull my phone out of my pants." Witty remark :roll eyes:

3) Pricing. I know it horrifies some people here to dredge up the Ghost of Jobs. But when Jobs returned from exile in 1997 the first thing he did was to ditch the million and one Mac Performa price points because it gave consumers too much to consider and turned them off.

If the Apple Watch fails -- not saying it will, but if it does -- I think we can point to too much information being tossed to consumers. First they have to learn about what the Apple Watch is and does THEN they have to figure out which of the 20 models to buy, then deal with the dissapointment that they can't afford the band they want -- maybe deciding they don't want anything but so opt to buy nothing.

Given this early stage of the product and information consumers have to digest I think it would have been far smarter to have just offered one exclusive link and leather band for the SS and Gold to minimize price points and options. Then, maybe towards the holiday season introduce new SS and gold bands.

 

[Rogifan]

Given this early stage of the product and information consumers have to digest I think it would have been far smarter to have just offered one exclusive link and leather band for the SS and Gold to minimize price points and options. Then, maybe towards the holiday season introduce new SS and gold bands.

I get what you're saying but my guess is it will be far less confusing than we think. People are over complicating it. You pick the model and size you want and choose a band. Done. Shoot iPhones and iPads could be more confusing with the different sizes, colors, storage options, wifi only, LTE, etc. Apple will see over time which bands are selling well and which ones aren't and adjust accordingly (either taken out of the lineup or price reduction).

 

[redman042]

Given how new this is, you're going to see a wide spectrum of opinions on it. It's hard for people to understand the value of such a watch, having never owned or touched one, and not knowing many people if any that have used a smartwatch. It wasn't a whole lot different when most people carried flip-phones and then Apple and Google came along and told people they should consider a smartphone.

It will be easier for the masses to understand after a year or two has gone by and their circle of family and friends starts jumping in one-by-one. Once enough people you know say "I own it and it has become indispensable" then the benefits are easier to trust.

Now for a smartwatch, I don't think it will ever hit the level of the smartphone - ie. a lower percentage of people will see the need even once they know everything there is to know.

But I suspect many of the naysayers going out of their way to bash this whole idea of a smartwatch will change their minds in 1-2 years.

 

[cmChimera]

The only feature that would have been cool is a "time mode" this would disable
the watches wireless and bluetooth allow for maximum battery conservation yet have continuos display of the time kind of like a real watch.

I think I may actually pull the trigger and get the space black anyone else out there ?

There is a power reserve mode that maximizes the watch battery by pretty much disabling every thing else but time. But it will still only activate the screen when needed, and not constantly be on. I know it's not exactly what you asked for, but it's close.

Oh, and I'm getting the Space Black SS.

 

[VFC]

Over time, when the technology allows for always on display & GPS, 24hr HR monitoring, 128GB+ internal storage, WiFi, LTE, etc, the AW will start to cut into iPhone sales. Just like iPhone sales are cutting into iPad and iPod sales, and iPad sales are cutting into Mac Book sales.

 

[KPOM]

Lastly, you are paying an awful lot for a first gen product from a company that rarely nails first gen products. If history is any indication, the 2nd and 3rd gen will be huge leaps forward, meaning you are stuck with an $1100 outdated device.

I don't believe the Watch actually compares well to a regular luxury or semi-luxury watch. It will not last as long. Its place in fashion is far from certain. I just don't see people buying the Watch as a fashion piece. But hey, who knows?

$500 of the $1100 is the band, so if the third generation is a significant improvement, you should be able to update it 2 years to that version for $600.

 

[Cashmonee]

$500 of the $1100 is the band, so if the third generation is a significant improvement, you should be able to update it 2 years to that version for $600.

Assuming that the bands will continue to be compatible in 2 years, and that the band colors still match the case colors, and that the band holds up well enough that it still looks decent in two years. That is a lot of if's.

Apple has been known to change interfaces (like the band interfacing with the watch). Space Black today may not be the same space black in two years, and nearly every Apple device I have ever owned looks well used after 2 years.

 

[ksuyen]

I love precision workmanship, high quality, and the pleasure of knowing it's a one of a kind. Made by just one watchmaker, representing a full year of his time. Analog can be delightful.

That describes Apple Watch very well, except that it's Digital. It's also only made by just one watchmaker (though one can argue Apple is watchmaker or not after this).

 

[papa8706]

That describes Apple Watch very well, except that it's Digital. It's also only made by just one watchmaker (though one can argue Apple is watchmaker or not after this).

That doesn't describe the apple watch lol. The apple watch is a mass produced smartwatch. A mechanical watchmaker (single person) can spent months to years on making a watch that is truly one of a kind. These are the one of a kind watches people spend 10k plus on. I have a feeling a lot of people justifying the apple edition have little knowledge on watches in general

 

[KPOM]

Assuming that the bands will continue to be compatible in 2 years, and that the band colors still match the case colors, and that the band holds up well enough that it still looks decent in two years. That is a lot of if's.

Apple has been known to change interfaces (like the band interfacing with the watch). Space Black today may not be the same space black in two years, and nearly every Apple device I have ever owned looks well used after 2 years.

Things are different this time. Every watch reviewer I have seen has said that everything about the stainless steel watches matches what you'd expect from "regular" watches. All leather bands wear out over time, but typically last 2-3 years. Stainless steel link bands last for years. Apple has chosen mostly traditional colors. "Space black" is quite a common color, as is stainless steel. Jony Ive and Marc Newson are huge watch fans.

 

[ksuyen]

That doesn't describe the apple watch lol. The apple watch is a mass produced smartwatch. A mechanical watchmaker (single person) can spent months to years on making a watch that is truly one of a kind. These are the one of a kind watches people spend 10k plus on. I have a feeling a lot of people justifying the apple edition have little knowledge on watches in general

Let's see. The Edition Version is limited, not mass produced.

They (Apple) spent at least 3 years just for designing the watch which is truly of a kind (until someone copy them).

People will spend up to 20k for Apple Watch (Edition).

I have a feeling people who criticize Apple watch are plain ignorant.

 

[papa8706]

Let's see. The Digital Version is limited, not mass produced.

They (Apple) spent at least 3 years just for designing the watch which is truly of a kind (until someone copy them).

People will spend up to 20k for Apple Watch (Edition).

I have a feeling people who criticize Apple watch are plain ignorant.

How am I ignorant? A simple google will show you how wrong you are. A watchmaker spends months to years on a single watch using a loupe to do intricate work. A year of one mans life into one single watch.

I'm buying the apple watch, cause I like smart watches but I understand the difference and how ridiculous the edition model is? You don't understand the study of watchmaking trying to say apple's digital smartwatch is one of a kind.

"Taiwan's Quanta Computer will start mass production of Apple Inc's first smartwatch in July" One of a kind eh?

 

[daijholt]

How am I ignorant? A simple google will show you how wrong you are. A watchmaker spends months to years on a single watch using a loupe to do intricate work. A year of one mans life into one single watch.

I'm buying the apple watch, cause I like smart watches but I understand the difference and how ridiculous the edition model is? You don't understand the study of watchmaking trying to say apple's digital smartwatch is one of a kind.

"Taiwan's Quanta Computer will start mass production of Apple Inc's first smartwatch in July" One of a kind eh?

Fair points, but it's a different kind of craftsmanship. Whereas a watch maker will spend a year laying out the jewels and the mechanisms, apple's designers, both software and hardware, collectively spent years condensing all the components into a tiny surface area, while also writing line after line of code to make sure it all actually works as intended.

To each his own. They both require their own kind of precision. Just because the method of creation isn't as physically tangible as assembling complications by hand doesn't mean it requires any less skill to achieve.

 

[VFC]

Fair points, but it's a different kind of craftsmanship. Whereas a watch maker will spend a year laying out the jewels and the mechanisms, apple's designers, both software and hardware, collectively spent years condensing all the components into a tiny surface area, while also writing line after line of code to make sure it all actually works as intended.

To each his own. They both require their own kind of precision. Just because the method of creation isn't as physically tangible as assembling complications by hand doesn't mean it requires any less skill to achieve.

That's true of all smart phones, tablets, laptops, etc (even those non-Apple models). Are they all one of a kind and manufactured with superior craftsmanship that justifies a premium price?

 

[arubinst]

How am I ignorant? A simple google will show you how wrong you are. A watchmaker spends months to years on a single watch using a loupe to do intricate work. A year of one mans life into one single watch.

I'm buying the apple watch, cause I like smart watches but I understand the difference and how ridiculous the edition model is? You don't understand the study of watchmaking trying to say apple's digital smartwatch is one of a kind.

"Taiwan's Quanta Computer will start mass production of Apple Inc's first smartwatch in July" One of a kind eh?

The kind of watches you're referring to are not 10k or 20k or 30k watches. If you're thinking about something in the lines of Rolex, for example, these are also machine and mass-produced. They sell over 1 million watches a year and they don't have 1 million watchmakers each working on a single watch for months or years.

Although the kind of intricate work that you describe still exists today, it is much more expensive than the Apple Watch or your typical Rolex. No piece of work that requires a single individual working for months or years using high precision tools and loupes will be affordable for a common mortal.

So, while I'm not putting the Apple Watch in the same league as a Rolex or similar brands that sell for the same kind of prices, because of the "timeless" nature of some of these pieces, they might actually share a lot of similarities with the Apple Watch in terms of manufacturing and quality of materials.

If workmanship is what you think distinguishes other watches from the Apple Watch, you will be disappointed to discover that only very few watches are actually hand-made in the way you describe

 

[Piggie]

Actually, I totally and utterly agree that the accuracy, precision, time, care and skill that goes into something like the Apple watch, iPhone, iPad etc etc, far far leaves a traditional watch in the dust.

A traditional watch is like an poorly engineered horse and cart compared to modern computer circuitry
there simple is no comparison.

There is no way any human craftsman with a little hammer, file, drill etc can even come close to a device such as the inside elements of anything like the Apple watch.

I cannot see how anyone could disagree with this, as it's simply a fact.

The problem is however, as soon as you create anything, no matter how amazing that can, with enough money on machinery, be quickly and simply reproduced on a MASSIVE scale, it looses almost all it's value instantly.

It's just the way things are.

Or rather, the way us humans value things.

That why I smile a bit when people say "OMG This is hand made, each one if slightly different and unique"
You mean, it's low quality, and the person doing it is unable to create accurate copies, so we'll make out their inability is actually a plus point, so make them sound special

It's funny when you think about it.

 

[Supermallet]

Does your Tag slow down after a few years? Does the Lamborghini suddenly stop going as fast as it was the day it came out of the showroom just because it turned 2 years old?

If you know the answers to the above questions, you know why a smart watch is not the same as those above products. A smart watch, by its inherent technological limitations, has a limited life. Hence it cannot be seen in the same light as some of these other 'timeless' (sorry had to do it) products.

Mechanical watches require maintenance (which can be quite expensive if you're maintaining a top tier mechanical watch) and every car also has to have maintenance, again often at high prices, especially on speciality cars. Apple has already said that it will replace watch batteries when they can't sustain more than a 50% charge, and ultimately, you can get a new watch much more cheaply than you can get a new car or even the maintenance costs of a high end car, especially since once you have the bands you like you can buy the lowest end version of your desired watch and swap on the existing bands.

Assuming that the bands will continue to be compatible in 2 years, and that the band colors still match the case colors, and that the band holds up well enough that it still looks decent in two years. That is a lot of if's.

Apple has been known to change interfaces (like the band interfacing with the watch). Space Black today may not be the same space black in two years, and nearly every Apple device I have ever owned looks well used after 2 years.

Apple has been known to change interfaces, but how long did it take them to change the 16-pin interface on the iPhone/iPad? It was much longer than two years. And the band clasp will be a major selling point for the watch, so Apple will hold onto it as long as they can.

Certainly new bands will come out, but if you get a solid color band, then you'll know what watches it will match with. It's not rocket science.

As for the durability of the bands, that's an unknown at this point. But just because your Apple devices look well worn in 2 years doesn't mean that they all do, or they generate scuffs on themselves spontaneously.

There will also be third party bands.

 

[papa8706]

The kind of watches you're referring to are not 10k or 20k or 30k watches. If you're thinking about something in the lines of Rolex, for example, these are also machine and mass-produced. They sell over 1 million watches a year and they don't have 1 million watchmakers each working on a single watch for months or years.

Although the kind of intricate work that you describe still exists today, it is much more expensive than the Apple Watch or your typical Rolex. No piece of work that requires a single individual working for months or years using high precision tools and loupes will be affordable for a common mortal.

So, while I'm not putting the Apple Watch in the same league as a Rolex or similar brands that sell for the same kind of prices, because of the "timeless" nature of some of these pieces, they might actually share a lot of similarities with the Apple Watch in terms of manufacturing and quality of materials.

If workmanship is what you think distinguishes other watches from the Apple Watch, you will be disappointed to discover that only very few watches are actually hand-made in the way you describe

You would be surprised how many there are out there, in a niche market, and how many people there are willing buying them. While I agree about mass marketed watches like rolex, that's not what I am referring to.

Arguably, the kind of people who drop 20k on a watch wouldn't put a company that makes their phone and iPad in the same category as quality of craftsmanship.

What's next? Their second wearable: A bluetooth headset made of solid gold marketed as jewelry. Some of you would still try and defend it saying people spend 20k on earrings all the time. Jewelry doesn't have a typical 3 year lifespan like smartphone tech does.

 

[arubinst]

You would be surprised how many there are out there, in a niche market, and how many people there are willing buying them. While I agree about mass marketed watches like rolex, that's not what I am referring to.

But that is exactly my point. I don't think anyone is trying to compare an Apple watch to that niche market of (single person working for a year) hand-made watches your referred to in another post.

You said that:

A mechanical watchmaker (single person) can spent months to years on making a watch that is truly one of a kind. These are the one of a kind watches people spend 10k plus on

But actually, these are the kind of watches people spend 100k plus on (notice the extra 0).

Gold watches that retail for 20, 30 or 40k are as mass-produced as the Apple Watch will be. They are hardly exclusive and appeal to a special segment of the population. One that is not rich but can afford these kind of "luxury". And for these people, spending 10k on a watch that might be unusable after 4 or 5 years might not such a big deal.

 

[mattopotamus]

I'm the ideal candidate for a good full featured smartphone. My iPhone 6 Plus fills that requirement very well. It gets used very heavily and over many hours each day.

When not traveling for work I'm an engineer in a computer lab. Thus I've had enough of the digital world by the end of day.

But... Every time I glance at my wrist to find one of my hand made, all mechanical Swiss chronographs with its gears and more gears, sans anything electronic or modern, it causes a broad smile to come to my face. I love precision workmanship, high quality, and the pleasure of knowing it's a one of a kind. Made by just one watchmaker, representing a full year of his time. Analog can be delightful.

/thread

While I like a smartwatch and will get the SS, it is b.c of the technology in a "decent" looking package. Anything over $1000 is crazy to me. Apple may think it is a fashion statement, but it is far from it. I will have my apple watch and my fashion watch. At this point, they are very different in looks.