Why SD slot in new MBP?

[harcosparky]

I am confused, if she had the old MBP she would have to tether or use an expresscard card reader, what is the difference? Or is she a professional photographer that does not already have a usb/fw card reader and only had a $25 expresscard card reader?

Never said she had an old MBP. She bought her first MBP this week.

What can she do with the SD Card Slot????

Read/Write SD Cards in the SD Card Slot.



I on the other hand have the previous model MBP, with the Express Card Slot so I am happy.

What can I do with with the older MBP that she cannot do???

Can I install an Express Card Reader for CF ??? YES

Can I install an Express Card Reader for SD ??? YES

Can I install an Express Card Reader for MMC ??? YES

Can I install an Express Card Reader for xD ??? YES

Can I install an Express Card Reader for Sony Memory Stick/PRO ??? YES

Can I install an Express Card that will operate an eSATA external drive? YES

Hell I could even install an Express Card to Serial Port adapter and have 2 RS-232 ports. ( you can laugh, but I have communications gear that have RS-232 interfaces )

Simply put, I can do more with the Express Card 34 slot, than I can with an SD card slot.

I think the SD card in the MBP was a mistake. Apple will realize it and fix it in a future release. Sort of like the Firewire Port issue.

Having a 4 week old MBP and a 4 day old MBP side by side allows me to make comparisons on their usefulness.

The 4 week old one is more versatile than the 4 day old one is.

 

[Drag'nGT]

I'm more interested in why it only reads SD cards. Multi card readers take up the same space. I like the new additions and see them being loved by the hard core Apple fans and the PC people still moving to Mac.

 

[dlhuss]

I've never been 'pissed' per say by an Apple announcement (except the $200 drop after 2 months of owning an iPhone), but when I was following WWDC this just outraged me.

Pros DON'T use SD cards.

And what "pro" photographer would use a 15" MBP regardless of what kind of slot it has? It's a pro-sumer laptop at best with mediocre screen resolution(edit: and glossy). The SD slot suits it well, admit it.

And why not just use SD cards in all those "pro" cameras with something like this? http://www.amazon.com/SD-CF-II-Type-Adapter-Supports/dp/B000YZGCIU (can't vouch for it's performance - i don't own one)

Get USB gadgets instead of express card do-dads if you need all those other things. The vast majority of digital camera owners appreciate the free SD card reader.

 

[harcosparky]

And what "pro" photographer would use a 15" MBP regardless of what kind of slot it has?

:lol:

I'll need a big bag of popcorn to watch the responses to THAT line.

Have you ever been on a field assignment with news photographers to see what size laptops they have in their bags????

Ever attended any event where pro photographers are shooting to see what size laptops they have in their bags???

I can tell you it's not 17"!

Ever been around any IT pro's doing site service to see what size notebook they carry???

They guys around here all haul around 15" units. You want to tell them they are NOT pro's.

I wonder how many people you insulted with THAT line ???

I have to haul around 2-3 bodies, several lenses, strobe units, not too mention filters, diffusers, batteries and a laptop in my gearbag. You think I am gonna haul around a 17" notebook ???????

:lol:

 

[Drag'nGT]

Canon puts SD in their " sub $1,000 " units like the Digital Rebel.

But the $1500 and up units use Compact Flash
Digital Rebel - SD - $795 - Current
20D - CF - $1500
30D - CF - $1500
40D - CF - $1500 - Current
50D - CF - $1500 - Current
5D - CF - $2500 - Current
EOS 1DS MkIIII - CF - $5500+ - Current

Out of 5 current DSLR model only 2 in Canon lineup are in the " multi-thousand " dollar range, one is sub $1,000.

The 40D and 50D can be had for closer to $1,000 if you shop right.

Where did they put the SD card ??? In the sub $1,000 unit.

I never said SD was " unheard of ", just that it was not used in the higher end " pro " or " pro-sumer " cameras that's all.

Just to add gas to the fire. I got the 24" screen on my iMac for the nice resolution and added workspace. Let's say I needed to work from a laptop and I'm taking photos on a nice 50D and needed a screen to work on. Why would I not want a 17" MBP? The screen res would give me much more room to work with my photos on and it has all those things that some of you are complaining about.

SD suits more people and that's what they've done. You're old standby from before was the USB cable.

 

[UMHurricanes34]

dlhuss says:

And what "pro" photographer would use a 15" MBP regardless of what kind of slot it has? It's a pro-sumer laptop at best with mediocre screen resolution. The SD slot suits it well, admit it.

No comment.

And why not just use SD cards in all those "pro" cameras with something like this? (can't vouch for it's performance - i don't own one)

Pro photography is about speed and reliability. I'd never trade a CF for an SD card. What a joke.

Get USB gadgets instead of express card do-dads if you need all those other things. The vast majority of digital camera owners appreciate the free SD card reader.

Who the hell wants to carry around more gear? Your entire post clearly demonstrates you obviously have no idea how pro users operate.

If your post was a joke, then I apologize for my hostility. Sadly, I'm pretty sure that you were serious.

Drag'nGT: The issue is that these Pro notebooks have always been useful to the pros because of the portable power appeal. No photographer wants to carry around a 17" notebook to upload pictures in the field. And no one wants to bring a USB card reader with them. I've always been able to pop my CF card into my Expresscard reader and go about my portable business, it saddens me that if I need to upgrade in the future I'm not going to have that option anymore without shelling out more money and effort to accommodate a 17" screen.

Carry around a bag full of lenses and a couple DSLR bodies for a few hours and tell me if you'd want a 17" notebook in there too.

 

[harcosparky]

Just to add gas to the fire. I got the 24" screen on my iMac for the nice resolution and added workspace. Let's say I needed to work from a laptop and I'm taking photos on a nice 50D and needed a screen to work on. Why would I not want a 17" MBP? The screen res would give me much more room to work with my photos on and it has all those things that some of you are complaining about.

SD suits more people and that's what they've done. You're old standby from before was the USB cable.

I tried working in the field with a 17" Powerbook some years ago. It really wasn't conducive to that sort of work. Sometimes you just don't have the desk to work on. I admit the bigger screen would be nicer for post processing, but it's a lot to haul around.

I guess it depends on what you are shooting, and where you are located.

But that's not the point of the thread.

Let's play a numbers game ....

Let's say SD suits 10,000,000 people and Express Card suits 5,000,000 people because they use other formats.

By putting in SD you please 10,000,000.
By putting in Express Card you please 15,000 ( the SD card and all others with an adapter )


Those who use xD, MMC, Memory Stick, Compact Flash, and others can also use the Express Card Slot.

I'd love to have a conversation with an engineer from Apple to hear their justification.

I bet the reason they put in an SD slot is the same reason they took out the Apple Remote that used to come with notebooks...... CHEAPER !!!!

 

[UMHurricanes34]

Let's play a numbers game ....

Let's say SD suits 10,000,000 people and Express Card suits 5,000,000 people because they use other formats.

By putting in SD you please 10,000,000.
By putting in Express Card you please 15,000 ( the SD card and all others with an adapter )


Those who use xD, MMC, Memory Stick, Compact Flash, and others can also use the Express Card Slot.

I'd love to have a conversation with an engineer from Apple to hear their justification.

This is exactly right. There is NO arguing this point, it's ridiculous. The fact is, before this update everyone could go about their business the way they needed to. There were adapters that read all sorts of cards. Taking away the option for the stated 5,000 people isn't the right choice. There is no justification other than price or space constraints for the new battery tech.

 

[nuckinfutz]

I bet size is the main reason. They want to get better battery life and thus the lith poly batteries stretch out across the laptop. EC cards are deep so they will obstruct the internals. Apple has more leeway with the 17" chassis so they kept the slot and it functions as a nice "incentive" to move upstream in your purchase.

 

[dlhuss]

Who the hell wants to carry around more gear? Your entire post clearly demonstrates you obviously have no idea how pro users operate.

Hey, umh34.

Well, I was taking the consumer side of the debate - and being a bit provactive. I have no idea how pro's operate, but I bet a lot of those "pro" cameras are used by weekend photogs. So, 20 MB/s versus 45 MB/s write speeds are gonna make them miss the shot.

Just taking the market leader in digital cameras, Canon, as an example. Their dSLR sales are about 10% of their sales (in units, I think). And, just guessing, half of those are SDHC equipped. So now we're talking about 5% of Canon's customers.

You right about who the hell wants to carry around extra equipment, or take it to the next step, BUY extra equipment. Build in support for 95% of us. Now 5% of you will have to work around it (If you're stuck on Mac) instead of 100% (last I checked, their aren't ANY camera with express card flash memory cards, so none of us were satisfied with just the express card slot )

As for the IT support tech's laptop, it's normally a tricked out corporate standard 15.4" Dell, HP or Lenovo at 1680X1050 with built-in Express Card AND SD card slots

 

[J&JPolangin]

...weren't there issues with the EC bus not being very robust handling some of the interfaces?
probably just didn't like the 3rd party gear people were buying/inserting into their MBP's...

 

[harcosparky]

...weren't there issues with the EC bus not being very robust handling some of the interfaces?
probably just didn't like the 3rd party gear people were buying/inserting into their MBP's...

uH Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.....

If that's the case " probably just didn't like the 3rd party gear people were buying/inserting into their MBP's "

Apple may remove the USB and Firewire ports as well, after all we are sticking 3rd party gear in those ports as well.

I think people had problems using eSATA adapters in EC slots, it had to do with the connector on the adapter end and the mechanics of the adapter. Adapter seating issue if I am not mistaken.

 

[Sehnsucht]

cough.. fanboys.. cough

I'm surprised you guys are defending the replacement of the ExpressCard with an SD slot.

Let me ask you this, had the SD slot and ExpressCard been optional, which one would you go for?

The fanboy comment was unnecessary, but I do agree that the removal of EC was retarded. My 15" MBP has EC and I wouldn't have it any other way.

 

[CPD_1]

Canon puts SD in their " sub $1,000 " units like the Digital Rebel.

But the $1500 and up units use Compact Flash
Digital Rebel - SD - $795 - Current
20D - CF - $1500
30D - CF - $1500
40D - CF - $1500 - Current
50D - CF - $1500 - Current
5D - CF - $2500 - Current
EOS 1DS MkIIII - CF - $5500+ - Current

Out of 5 current DSLR model only 2 in Canon lineup are in the " multi-thousand " dollar range, one is sub $1,000.

The 40D and 50D can be had for closer to $1,000 if you shop right.

Where did they put the SD card ??? In the sub $1,000 unit.

Yes, they have CF, but they don't only have CF. Either that or My 1DS doesn't have an SDHC card in it's slot right now as I'm typing this, and maybe Canon's website is lying about the specifications of the other cameras, but I'm fairly certain it lists both CF and SD/SDHC under specifications. Which means that Canon knows Pros like having the option between SD and CF. I prefer SD because I can carry more cards which take up less space. I still have CF laying around because I've had them for years, and they're nice to have if I ever need them, but I think SD's form factor is much more convenient.

So, to sum up, Canon offers SD as an option on all of their DSLR cameras, including the two which are MRSP $2,000+.

 

[samwise]

Yes, they have CF, but they don't only have CF. Either that or My 1DS doesn't have an SDHC card in it's slot right now as I'm typing this, and maybe Canon's website is lying about the specifications of the other cameras, but I'm fairly certain it lists both CF and SD/SDHC under specifications. Which means that Canon knows Pros like having the option between SD and CF. I prefer SD because I can carry more cards which take up less space. I still have CF laying around because I've had them for years, and they're nice to have if I ever need them, but I think SD's form factor is much more convenient.

So, to sum up, Canon offers SD as an option on all of their DSLR cameras, including the two which are MRSP $2,000+.

According to the Canon UK website, only the 1D, 1Ds, 500D, 450D and 1000D take SD cards - the 40D, 50D, 5D and 5D Mark II are all CF only

 

[Afterthecalm]

Hey guys, I want to chime in too.. It's almost 4 am, and I don't really have anything to bring to the table, but I'm going to anyways.

I have a Rev A. MBP 2.16 CD (yeah, it's not even a C2D), and I still love it, it does what I need it to do. Would I like to be like you guys and throw mad flow every 4 months with a new revision laptop...eh, not really. I'm sure a few of you guys in here bitching already own some variation of a MBP, and then you come on here ranting about a slot no one uses. You know what, I have all the slots you guys wish you had now (with the exception of a SD slot.. I have a $10 card reader for that) I have Firewire 400/800. I have the ExpressCard slot thingy, 3 USB ports.

I also have a Nikon D80, that exclusively uses an SD slot only. I can't change that fact. I understand the photog elitists probably got all up in arms about that and made Nikon go back to CF, doesn't matter to me. I would have used whatever was provided in the camera.

Been using the camera since Sept 2006, I think I have about 15,000 raw images in the 1TB harddrive (connected via USB.. I'm cheap..what do you expect) and I have never had a problem with the 4 SD cards (by different manufacturers), maybe I just take care of my stuff.

Well, the reason for my rant is that I have never used the ExpressCard slot for anything..and I've tried.

Went to Sprint to get internet, and I didn't want a USB dongle (I already use up too many ports) but the 2 they had required me to purchase at $60 and above, and well the USB one was free.

Free is what I chose, heh.

I went to the Apple store several times to see what I can purchase to make use of that slot.. nothing there. Didn't even know what options there were for me to use it. Get rid of it, I say.

My PC friends didn't use theirs either.

Same with Firewire, I don't strike it down, I'm sure it is better than USB, but I couldn't justify paying more for an external harddrive (by $100 more at Best Buy) for a similar version just because it uses Firewire.

You don't like the new version..then don't upgrade. I'm sure your buddies won't mind if you no longer have the bestest, fastest MBP around.

For people who do not own any version of a MBP, and want to buy one.. well, you're free to bitch about the inclusion of an SD slot

Thanks for listening, and don't forget to tip your waitress

 

[bruinsrme]

to me putting a pro label on a 13 inch computer is like putting "sport" tag on a toyota yaris

 

[cube]

It was done so that we can have another 3000+ thread fighting the unhelpful "I never used it" comments.

 

[grahamnp]

Apple put an SD card reader in because it's cheaper than an Express Card 34 slot.

 

[qpid]

Never said she had an old MBP. She bought her first MBP this week.

What can she do with the SD Card Slot????

Read/Write SD Cards in the SD Card Slot.



I on the other hand have the previous model MBP, with the Express Card Slot so I am happy.

What can I do with with the older MBP that she cannot do???

Can I install an Express Card Reader for CF ??? YES

Can I install an Express Card Reader for SD ??? YES

Can I install an Express Card Reader for MMC ??? YES

Can I install an Express Card Reader for xD ??? YES

Can I install an Express Card Reader for Sony Memory Stick/PRO ??? YES

Can I install an Express Card that will operate an eSATA external drive? YES

Hell I could even install an Express Card to Serial Port adapter and have 2 RS-232 ports. ( you can laugh, but I have communications gear that have RS-232 interfaces )

Simply put, I can do more with the Express Card 34 slot, than I can with an SD card slot.

I think the SD card in the MBP was a mistake. Apple will realize it and fix it in a future release. Sort of like the Firewire Port issue.

Having a 4 week old MBP and a 4 day old MBP side by side allows me to make comparisons on their usefulness.

The 4 week old one is more versatile than the 4 day old one is.

Wow o wow. Not a USB reader, for the humanity, that is torture....

I fail to see the difference between a usb reader (cheaper plentiful) and an expresscard one (more expensive, harder to find) for transferring images to a compute. In both cases it is extra gear. If your only argument is that it sits flush, well that is just being picky. If you are worried about speed they also
make fw readers.

There are also many treads about esata and people not liking to use it because the connection is flimsy.

Also if you don't like the new units don't buy them. I don't see your daughter on here complaining about not being able to connect her "ec to serial card" because even you have to admit that is an uncommon occurence.

 

[Demosthenes X]

Let's play a numbers game ....

Let's say SD suits 10,000,000 people and Express Card suits 5,000,000 people because they use other formats.

By putting in SD you please 10,000,000.
By putting in Express Card you please 15,000 ( the SD card and all others with an adapter )


Those who use xD, MMC, Memory Stick, Compact Flash, and others can also use the Express Card Slot.

I'd love to have a conversation with an engineer from Apple to hear their justification.

Logically sound, but ultimately a poor argument. Theoretical numbers are all well and good, but applying actual numbers to your example indicates that putting an ExpressCard reader in pleases less than 1.5 million, because less than 10% of MBP users actually used their ExpressCard port. The SD card reader pleases 10 million people.

10 million > 1.5 million, ergo SD > ExpressCard.

What people can do with ExpressCard is irrelevant if people aren't doing it. Yes, it's a better option, but if no one is making use of it, than Apple is better serving its customers by replacing it with a port that more people will make use of. That's just business. If you want to get mad at someone, get mad at all the people not using their ExpressCard port.

As to whether this machine appeals to "Professionals" anymore - it's design to appeal to the widest degree of users possible. Yes, it might alienate some professionals with specific needs, and that's a shame. But if one company does not offer what you need, then you go elsewhere. Toyota does not offer a Roadster, but do I waste my time lambasting that point? No. I shop elsewhere. Expecting one company to fill every need for every possible user is silly.

 

[CPD_1]

According to the Canon UK website, only the 1D, 1Ds, 500D, 450D and 1000D take SD cards - the 40D, 50D, 5D and 5D Mark II are all CF only

Ah, you know what, you're right. I'll eat some humble pie. However, it seems telling to me that the newer, and more expensive models are coming with SD.

 

[dogtanian]

I'm *outraged* I use my ExpressCard slot all the time... for an SD reader.

I've never known anyone to use it for anything else but then I don't hang around with 'professionals'. Sometimes I feel sorry for Apple, whatever move they make its always sure to upset somebody... but then I just go back shortly after getting mad about those bloody glossy MBP screens

Demosthenes X said it best:

What people can do with ExpressCard is irrelevant if people aren't doing it. Yes, it's a better option, but if no one is making use of it, than Apple is better serving its customers by replacing it with a port that more people will make use of. That's just business. If you want to get mad at someone, get mad at all the people not using their ExpressCard port.

 

[ilfn143]

what does "PRO" in MacBook Pro stand for? pro-photographer only? or any other professionals? like engineer, programmer, doctor..??? these other "PRO" they don't carry a Canon 1D MK III, or any other big @ss cameras around on the weekend.

 

[CPD_1]

I'm *outraged* I use my ExpressCard slot all the time... for an SD reader.

I've never known anyone to use it for anything else but then I don't hang around with 'professionals'. Sometimes I feel sorry for Apple, whatever move they make its always sure to upset somebody... but then I just go back shortly after getting mad about those bloody glossy MBP screens

Demosthenes X said it best:

I use mine to add a couple of firewire 400 ports to my machine, but I don't actually need to, because I can just daisy chain off my 800 port. So the other thing I use it for is a multi-card reader... which I use for SD cards (and on very rare occasion a CF, but I don't think I've ever used CF on my UMBP).