i don't really see the point in switching. i have a pc and a 12" pb. the powerbook is fantastic, but so is the pc (i assembled it myself. never crashed. not even once). why limit myself to one os and one philosophy when i can have both. i agree os x is the better os, but i guess i'll never run out of my need for windows, so i'm happy rinning both systems.
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Why Window Users Won't Switch
- Thread starter nate
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SiliconAddict
macrumors 603
Why don't I switch? Simple. I'm not compromising what I already have for a slower product. I have few issues with OS X. It looks like a fantastic OS that still needs a bit of tweaking when it comes to GUI responsiveness but all in all I can deal with that. No its Apple hardware where the problems occur.
I've stated this time and again on the boards, enough so that people are probably rolling their eyes at this point, that the PowerBooks is an underpowered computer. I don't care how much thought Apple puts into its products. If the system feels slow to me I'm NOT going to be happy with it. And every time I go into an Apple store and start playing with that gorgeous 17" PowerBook the wait for some things in X is long enough that I can take the time to drum my fingers on the counter.
Bitch all you want about the PC world but my apps open in a snap on my 866Mhz Tosh laptop. From what I can tell this is a speed issue in that as soon as I turn around at the counter and play with a G5 the speed of opening an app is notably faster. Enough so that I'd say its >= to my out of date Tosh laptop. This smells like horsepower compensating for an OS but frankly I don't care about the reasons. I want a fast experience with whatever my next computer will be. People keep claiming on the board that OS X makes up for any deficiencies in the hardware. And to those who claim that I call BS on you. A computer is made up of hardware and software. If one is deficient it WILL affect the other in some form and will impact the experience one has with that computer. I will NOT compromise quality on a $3,500 purchase. (The price my 17" PowerBook would spec out to be.) So I wait, and wait, and wait for Apple to come out with a system that will make me a believer but I'm not going to wait forever. September 1st apple (I may push it back to that Apple Paris thing.) will either release something amazing or I will go and get myself an IBM. And for those who say I will be sorry? I'm a geek. A nerd. I know windows. I know its quirks. I know how to make it my ***** and that makes all the diff in the world when dealing with Windows. Consequently I've had next to no probs with 2K and XP. I've never been hacked. I've never been infected with a virus. No adware ever because I use FireFox and previously Mozilla.
So you know its not that big of a deal for me to stay on Windows. I have no love for MS and would prefer OS X but if Apple isn't going to ante up with some solid mobile hardware screw them. I consider an OS X an OPERATING SYSTEM. Not some freakish battle cry to take on the Redmond behemoth. I use what works and right now XP works just fine. Hardly perfect but good enough. That being said if Apple meets some prerequisites for me I will happily nab a 17" PowerBook in a heartbeat. I swear I go to Apple's site at least twice a week to spec out a PowerBook. I want one badly but not so badly that I'm going to blindly pounce on anything Apple releases.
Then you have the iPod. I have 37.8-38GB of tracks on my Tosh. The current iPod only is 40Gb which would barely hold my collection. (Someone told me it wouldn't hold it I have yet to do the math on what the actual storage space it so they may very well be right.) So again I'm waiting on Apple to catch up to my expectations.
Maybe my expectations are high. Maybe too high. But since I AM paying a premium for this computer I expect the specs to reflect that and right now, IMHO, that ISN'T the case.
I've stated this time and again on the boards, enough so that people are probably rolling their eyes at this point, that the PowerBooks is an underpowered computer. I don't care how much thought Apple puts into its products. If the system feels slow to me I'm NOT going to be happy with it. And every time I go into an Apple store and start playing with that gorgeous 17" PowerBook the wait for some things in X is long enough that I can take the time to drum my fingers on the counter.
Bitch all you want about the PC world but my apps open in a snap on my 866Mhz Tosh laptop. From what I can tell this is a speed issue in that as soon as I turn around at the counter and play with a G5 the speed of opening an app is notably faster. Enough so that I'd say its >= to my out of date Tosh laptop. This smells like horsepower compensating for an OS but frankly I don't care about the reasons. I want a fast experience with whatever my next computer will be. People keep claiming on the board that OS X makes up for any deficiencies in the hardware. And to those who claim that I call BS on you. A computer is made up of hardware and software. If one is deficient it WILL affect the other in some form and will impact the experience one has with that computer. I will NOT compromise quality on a $3,500 purchase. (The price my 17" PowerBook would spec out to be.) So I wait, and wait, and wait for Apple to come out with a system that will make me a believer but I'm not going to wait forever. September 1st apple (I may push it back to that Apple Paris thing.) will either release something amazing or I will go and get myself an IBM. And for those who say I will be sorry? I'm a geek. A nerd. I know windows. I know its quirks. I know how to make it my ***** and that makes all the diff in the world when dealing with Windows. Consequently I've had next to no probs with 2K and XP. I've never been hacked. I've never been infected with a virus. No adware ever because I use FireFox and previously Mozilla.
So you know its not that big of a deal for me to stay on Windows. I have no love for MS and would prefer OS X but if Apple isn't going to ante up with some solid mobile hardware screw them. I consider an OS X an OPERATING SYSTEM. Not some freakish battle cry to take on the Redmond behemoth. I use what works and right now XP works just fine. Hardly perfect but good enough. That being said if Apple meets some prerequisites for me I will happily nab a 17" PowerBook in a heartbeat. I swear I go to Apple's site at least twice a week to spec out a PowerBook. I want one badly but not so badly that I'm going to blindly pounce on anything Apple releases.
Then you have the iPod. I have 37.8-38GB of tracks on my Tosh. The current iPod only is 40Gb which would barely hold my collection. (Someone told me it wouldn't hold it I have yet to do the math on what the actual storage space it so they may very well be right.) So again I'm waiting on Apple to catch up to my expectations.
Maybe my expectations are high. Maybe too high. But since I AM paying a premium for this computer I expect the specs to reflect that and right now, IMHO, that ISN'T the case.
½win½lin
macrumors member
Apple need to approach the task by giving reasons that Macs are better than Windows PC's.
And they don't.
They focus on features which are, in general, as good as a Windows PC and think that is going to make them overcome the inertia of finding an Apple dealer or website compared to the generic PC which is on every street corner.
Top Ten Reasons to Switch
1. The Mac ... it just works - ½ point
You learnt where your programs were, you learn where you documents were, now we've put them somewhere else.
Change has to be as painless as possible, and despite having a mac I wouldn't recommend it to a beginner computer user unless they have absolutely no Windows experience. This means a 'start' menu, 'programs' folder and *shudder* even My Documents, or at least a Windows theme. Look who's gaining desktop share : do-it-my-way Mac or bend-over-backwards-to-accommodate-windows Linux?
½ point for the driver stuff assuming my personal experience with printers is not entirley representative.
2. It doesn't crash - 0 points
zzzzzzzzz ... no less than Windows2000 or Windows XP. So what?
3. Simply the best in Digital Music - 0 points
Yes, a player with a battery that won't last a long haul flight. Downloadable music you can't listen to on any other player. Some reasonable software. All also available on Windows. D'oh!
4. The missing link in digital photography - ½ point
Not substantially better than XP. Experience certainly varies.
5. Your own digital entertainment centre - ½ point.
No arguments about the software and ease of use. Lose ½ point for constantly trying to find codecs for movies that 'just worked' under windows and the failure to find a full screen mode in QT. God that's embarassing.
6. Goes everywhere you go - ½ point
So do PC laptops and they are smaller and lighter and the batteries can be every bit as good. And yes they can change all those settings. Yes without rebooting. ½ point for the superb 12" iBook at a mere £800 😉
7. It's built for the internet - ½ point
Is this really worth commenting on? They don't even bother mentioning viruses, spyware and such like, which is worth a point (assuming the computer buyer is experienced enough to know about them but inexperienced enough not to know how to deal with them). Cut half a point for the foot-shooting malware omission and blatant deceipt about ready for wifi - you are not ready without a wireless NIC, grrrr!
8. Office is Office and then some - 0 points
And thanks to exclusive features, the Mac versions improve on their Windows counterparts ... like what? Thus far they seem about the same apart from a few characters changing from a windows powerpoint on a mac.
Again, give me a reason Apple is better, not the same. I already have Office, I got it as a deal with my PC, will you give me a free upgrade, Mr. Gates? And what's the deal with those floating toolbars? I want my familiar office back please ... stop confusing me!
9. Works effortlessly with PCs - 0 points.
By and large, PCs work effortlessly with PCs. By and large Macs work effortlessly with PCs. So, why change?
10. It's Beautiful - 1 point.
Subjective but I would like to think the majority think Macs look better. Obviously this alone is worth 10 points in some quarters 🙂
3½ out of 10 for their own arguments.
I don't get out of bed for less that 7 let alone down to the computer store.
(and not one of the reasons I chose a Mac is metioned, but I don't think that unix-on-a-laptop is going to be that great a marketing tool)
And they don't.
They focus on features which are, in general, as good as a Windows PC and think that is going to make them overcome the inertia of finding an Apple dealer or website compared to the generic PC which is on every street corner.
Top Ten Reasons to Switch
1. The Mac ... it just works - ½ point
You learnt where your programs were, you learn where you documents were, now we've put them somewhere else.
Change has to be as painless as possible, and despite having a mac I wouldn't recommend it to a beginner computer user unless they have absolutely no Windows experience. This means a 'start' menu, 'programs' folder and *shudder* even My Documents, or at least a Windows theme. Look who's gaining desktop share : do-it-my-way Mac or bend-over-backwards-to-accommodate-windows Linux?
½ point for the driver stuff assuming my personal experience with printers is not entirley representative.
2. It doesn't crash - 0 points
zzzzzzzzz ... no less than Windows2000 or Windows XP. So what?
3. Simply the best in Digital Music - 0 points
Yes, a player with a battery that won't last a long haul flight. Downloadable music you can't listen to on any other player. Some reasonable software. All also available on Windows. D'oh!
4. The missing link in digital photography - ½ point
Not substantially better than XP. Experience certainly varies.
5. Your own digital entertainment centre - ½ point.
No arguments about the software and ease of use. Lose ½ point for constantly trying to find codecs for movies that 'just worked' under windows and the failure to find a full screen mode in QT. God that's embarassing.
6. Goes everywhere you go - ½ point
So do PC laptops and they are smaller and lighter and the batteries can be every bit as good. And yes they can change all those settings. Yes without rebooting. ½ point for the superb 12" iBook at a mere £800 😉
7. It's built for the internet - ½ point
Is this really worth commenting on? They don't even bother mentioning viruses, spyware and such like, which is worth a point (assuming the computer buyer is experienced enough to know about them but inexperienced enough not to know how to deal with them). Cut half a point for the foot-shooting malware omission and blatant deceipt about ready for wifi - you are not ready without a wireless NIC, grrrr!
8. Office is Office and then some - 0 points
And thanks to exclusive features, the Mac versions improve on their Windows counterparts ... like what? Thus far they seem about the same apart from a few characters changing from a windows powerpoint on a mac.
Again, give me a reason Apple is better, not the same. I already have Office, I got it as a deal with my PC, will you give me a free upgrade, Mr. Gates? And what's the deal with those floating toolbars? I want my familiar office back please ... stop confusing me!
9. Works effortlessly with PCs - 0 points.
By and large, PCs work effortlessly with PCs. By and large Macs work effortlessly with PCs. So, why change?
10. It's Beautiful - 1 point.
Subjective but I would like to think the majority think Macs look better. Obviously this alone is worth 10 points in some quarters 🙂
3½ out of 10 for their own arguments.
I don't get out of bed for less that 7 let alone down to the computer store.
(and not one of the reasons I chose a Mac is metioned, but I don't think that unix-on-a-laptop is going to be that great a marketing tool)
netytan
macrumors 6502
Dude, u just rated there advertising. Surly it would be more acurate to grade the actual product 😛.
Other than that you seem very biest 3 1/2 points what the ****! And, Windows 2000 and XP dont crash?! The number of problems i've had with them its a wonder *nix isn't the standard desktop OS!
Seriously, anyone spending any resonable amount of time infront of Windows will find it lacking; myself i've spent the last 6 years and aprox between 12 and 16 hours a day with it. Its a Joke, and from a developers point of view even more so (the only thing it has going for it is .NET and even Mac can use this now).
And the Unix underbelly of OSX is a great selling point for developers 🙂. And I'm just happy to be finally getting away from this **** at long last!
Mark.
Other than that you seem very biest 3 1/2 points what the ****! And, Windows 2000 and XP dont crash?! The number of problems i've had with them its a wonder *nix isn't the standard desktop OS!
Seriously, anyone spending any resonable amount of time infront of Windows will find it lacking; myself i've spent the last 6 years and aprox between 12 and 16 hours a day with it. Its a Joke, and from a developers point of view even more so (the only thing it has going for it is .NET and even Mac can use this now).
And the Unix underbelly of OSX is a great selling point for developers 🙂. And I'm just happy to be finally getting away from this **** at long last!
Mark.
rueyeet
macrumors 65816
I think some of the discussion about build-your-own PCs and other largely niche (though perfectly legitimate!) reasons for not switching miss the point.
The Mac wouldn't have to be all things to all people, would not have to dominate every single tiny little specialized need in order to recoup some marketshare. They just have to appeal to the common denominator of computer users enough of the time.
The question Nate tried to answer wasn't: Why don't highly specialized market segments like the home-built enthusiasts or home gaming network people or what-have-you buy Macs? All you have to do is give their particular specialty and it explains why they don't want a Mac.
The more puzzling question is why doesn't your ordinary, run-of-the-mill, tech-support-needing consumer buy a Mac? We're not talking about people who know how to set up that much-vaunted "properly maintained installation" of Windows, here. We're talking about the folks who take advantage of CompUSA's consulting services just to have programs installed, who call tech support the second their computer doesn't behave as expected, who tell everyone about how they're "not good with computers", and who don't know that Internet Explorer is a browser (much less that there's more than one).
I think the most realistic reason I've seen yet is because they don't care. Not only that, they don't want to care, and don't see why they should. They neither know nor want to know enough about computers to make a real choice, they just ask the salesteen at their local big-box computer dealer and strike the best balance they can between the prices and spec lists they see offered. The object is to get the biggest spec numbers for the lowest price number, and that's usually it.
Maybe I'm just sour from my tech-support days, but I think some of the people discussing this question would be genuinely surprised to come face-to-face with how little most people know, or care to know, about computers. Even some of the people who DO research their purchases still don't know memory from disk space, or Internet Explorer from the Internet.
I think enough of those people are confused enough by a computer purchase (just read those yearly back-to-school "how to buy a computer" guides in your local paper if you don't believe me) that the strange, unfamiliar, non-Windows Mac is more than they can deal with thinking about. I really do.
The Mac wouldn't have to be all things to all people, would not have to dominate every single tiny little specialized need in order to recoup some marketshare. They just have to appeal to the common denominator of computer users enough of the time.
The question Nate tried to answer wasn't: Why don't highly specialized market segments like the home-built enthusiasts or home gaming network people or what-have-you buy Macs? All you have to do is give their particular specialty and it explains why they don't want a Mac.
The more puzzling question is why doesn't your ordinary, run-of-the-mill, tech-support-needing consumer buy a Mac? We're not talking about people who know how to set up that much-vaunted "properly maintained installation" of Windows, here. We're talking about the folks who take advantage of CompUSA's consulting services just to have programs installed, who call tech support the second their computer doesn't behave as expected, who tell everyone about how they're "not good with computers", and who don't know that Internet Explorer is a browser (much less that there's more than one).
I think the most realistic reason I've seen yet is because they don't care. Not only that, they don't want to care, and don't see why they should. They neither know nor want to know enough about computers to make a real choice, they just ask the salesteen at their local big-box computer dealer and strike the best balance they can between the prices and spec lists they see offered. The object is to get the biggest spec numbers for the lowest price number, and that's usually it.
Maybe I'm just sour from my tech-support days, but I think some of the people discussing this question would be genuinely surprised to come face-to-face with how little most people know, or care to know, about computers. Even some of the people who DO research their purchases still don't know memory from disk space, or Internet Explorer from the Internet.
I think enough of those people are confused enough by a computer purchase (just read those yearly back-to-school "how to buy a computer" guides in your local paper if you don't believe me) that the strange, unfamiliar, non-Windows Mac is more than they can deal with thinking about. I really do.
Timelessblur
macrumors 65816
here is my though. I looks at what comes out for the mac on the page I say marketing Bull to 85%-90% of the crap they post. the other stuff I tend to look more carefully at. I would love to have expose for windows. Is it worth switching to mac for it HELL NO.
For me windows is just better. Mainly because I am know how to use it very well and there are many things in there that I would have trouble giving up. I dont want to give my up my task bar or start menu since I use them both very heavily. I have microsoft power toys that allow me to mess with the OS and set it up more to my liking. I am one of those people who is very good about system mantaince so I dont run into any really problems on my personal computer.
Mind you I am also not you average user. When I come back from collage I normal end up speeding an hour or 2 fixing and dont some mantances on the families computer because my parents dont do it. It a pain in the ass yes.
For people who know how to use windows very well and are just desent about maintaining there system I would say dont switch to macs it going to be a pain in the ass. Simple because there is less stuff you can really do to the OS look and feel but that for the more advance user who does very diffent things.
For my grandparents I going to recomend they buy a mac for there next computer simple because if you not very good at maintaince macs are much more forgiving and if dont know the advance stuff you not going to miss it and more than likely dont care. I think my mom sister and brother (maybe) could switch to the mac and not be phased to a great degree. for my dad and I we would stuggle at more since we know the more advance tricks on windows.
Now there are a few things that I hate and really can not stand about the mac OS and I mean I hated them since day one. The first computer I really used was my grandad parents apple II eh it an apple II I though it was really cool at the time (5 year old thinking hear).
The next computer I used was among one of the first generation macs so it was among the first GUIs. The one thing I hated about it was the menu place ment. I could not stand them always being at the top of the screen and I had trouble figure making them work right (I am 7-9 right now). I would click on the back ground by mistake and they would change so it was some time frustrating figure it out and after I figure out how to work them I could not figure out it logic. To me even then it was always more logic to put them on the windows them selves (like how it is done always been dont in windows. XP like). from there my house got it first computer. Some old IBM from my dads work. Dos computer that had a easy to use menu system (A,B,C ect)but it was not a GUI.
After that we got a windows 95 system and low and be hold the menu system for file edit and what not was the way I like it. They are on the bloody windows them selves the most logic placement in my eyes. I person wish apple would give you an opition do to that to it OS it would make windows user like me very pleased.
(windows user switching)
Yeah windows is good for a some what above average users who know has learned some tricks. Average user it is in the air. for the slightly below average user mac would be better and a switch would be good. Then there are the dumbass who have no right using a computer. They dont need a mac. They dont even need a computer.
For me windows is just better. Mainly because I am know how to use it very well and there are many things in there that I would have trouble giving up. I dont want to give my up my task bar or start menu since I use them both very heavily. I have microsoft power toys that allow me to mess with the OS and set it up more to my liking. I am one of those people who is very good about system mantaince so I dont run into any really problems on my personal computer.
Mind you I am also not you average user. When I come back from collage I normal end up speeding an hour or 2 fixing and dont some mantances on the families computer because my parents dont do it. It a pain in the ass yes.
For people who know how to use windows very well and are just desent about maintaining there system I would say dont switch to macs it going to be a pain in the ass. Simple because there is less stuff you can really do to the OS look and feel but that for the more advance user who does very diffent things.
For my grandparents I going to recomend they buy a mac for there next computer simple because if you not very good at maintaince macs are much more forgiving and if dont know the advance stuff you not going to miss it and more than likely dont care. I think my mom sister and brother (maybe) could switch to the mac and not be phased to a great degree. for my dad and I we would stuggle at more since we know the more advance tricks on windows.
Now there are a few things that I hate and really can not stand about the mac OS and I mean I hated them since day one. The first computer I really used was my grandad parents apple II eh it an apple II I though it was really cool at the time (5 year old thinking hear).
The next computer I used was among one of the first generation macs so it was among the first GUIs. The one thing I hated about it was the menu place ment. I could not stand them always being at the top of the screen and I had trouble figure making them work right (I am 7-9 right now). I would click on the back ground by mistake and they would change so it was some time frustrating figure it out and after I figure out how to work them I could not figure out it logic. To me even then it was always more logic to put them on the windows them selves (like how it is done always been dont in windows. XP like). from there my house got it first computer. Some old IBM from my dads work. Dos computer that had a easy to use menu system (A,B,C ect)but it was not a GUI.
After that we got a windows 95 system and low and be hold the menu system for file edit and what not was the way I like it. They are on the bloody windows them selves the most logic placement in my eyes. I person wish apple would give you an opition do to that to it OS it would make windows user like me very pleased.
(windows user switching)
Yeah windows is good for a some what above average users who know has learned some tricks. Average user it is in the air. for the slightly below average user mac would be better and a switch would be good. Then there are the dumbass who have no right using a computer. They dont need a mac. They dont even need a computer.
Krizoitz said:
Buy a PC Case, a 2500XP AMD processor, Radeon 9800pro, 512Mb memory and a 160GBHD separately (<700). Ask the shop to build it or do it yourself. It's ridiculous to say that it's not a faster machine than a mac with the same pricetag!
Another example, Buy the same RADEON for a mac and you'll pay 100 more! Let's say you want to get a new prosessor upgrade. It's costs a fortune for a mac, for PC updating your old AMD 1500+ to a 2500xp costs about 70?
For big corporations with tech support etc mac might be a better choice, but it's absolutely stupid to say that buy any mac and it's cheaper than a PC. Specially for most consumers who need a Word, Excel, Email and Internet machine...
Example:
2x256 Mt, 400 MHz DDR 78
AMD Athlon XP 2500+ (Barton) Boxed 82
ASRock K7S8X 31
Club 3D Radeon 9800 Pro 128 Mt AGP 215
NEC ND-2510 8x IDE DVD+/-RW Dual Layer 87
Samsung SpinPoint P80 (160 Gt, 7200 RPM) 87
Samsung SyncMaster 753S 109
TOTAL 689
Now tell me which mac should I choose for 689 . Notice the DVDRW and DualChannel Memory!
Fukui
macrumors 68000
This works fine in a single tasking, single app running environment (the old old mac os) with just the finder running plus one app where clicking on the background was an easy escape to the finder, but it starts to fall apart wil lots of apps running because there is a disjoint between the menu and the app itself, though it is nice to always have it in one place too.. trust me, comming from windows, sometime I wish photoshop would place a background behind all its windows like on the windows version so I wouldn't accedentally click the background for example, and loose the menu bar.Timelessblur said:
I think a nice compromise might be to have the menu come out of the apps icon in the dock when clicked, or, like on NEXTSTEP have it come out if you right/or middle click... I do think ascthetically speaking though, the menu bar on the top looks nicer...
Danrose1977
macrumors regular
I was going to post here, and typed a rather lengthy message.... but frankly I decided that the whole debate bores me. There are far better things that we can all do with our time than attempt to convince people that MacOS makes a better home platform.
Timelessblur
macrumors 65816
looks wise the menu at the top is nice if but I find it breaks down in usefulness in multitasking. One of the most useful things I find I like about windows is my taskbar it is something I dont want to give up. Plus is fun have a skinable OS. I used to make my window laptop look look like OS X and it would require a double take to figure out that it was XP (looking closing at the menu bar you would notic it just the taskbar. I happen to like that skin but my hard drive on the laptop got reformated and some time bettween me getting that skin and the laptop reformated apple had sued to get it removed.
As I said before I think it would be a nice option for Mac to add the ablitly to put the menus on individl windows in the OS. mac it a choice since I know many macy would hate it and want to leave the menu just at the top.
Back on the task bar I like to know what my active widows are. Most programs I like to say in the task bar when minmized exact for things like my messager prgrams and music media players (something I wish I could do with itunes since it is my primery media player and it open pretty much when ever my computer is on. I wish I could minzimzed it and not have to have it cluter up my taskbar since it is normaly already clutter enough.
Besides I have learned I like to doing something the more advances ways using short cut key comonds more typing in the command simple because it is faster (Drafting programs are taking away my command line it is really getting to me). I have a feeling there is a lot of stuff you can do in macs like this but I dont know very well since when I started playing around in pear PC I found out that I had a bad motherboard (it a week old so I figure I got ship a bad one). I should have it back up and running this weekend and I contine playing around in Pear PC learning more about OS X and some of the stuff it can do. anything I find really instersting to look at and want to see what it like not being bogged down I just go to one of my friends with a mac and have them show me it on theres
As I said before I think it would be a nice option for Mac to add the ablitly to put the menus on individl windows in the OS. mac it a choice since I know many macy would hate it and want to leave the menu just at the top.
Back on the task bar I like to know what my active widows are. Most programs I like to say in the task bar when minmized exact for things like my messager prgrams and music media players (something I wish I could do with itunes since it is my primery media player and it open pretty much when ever my computer is on. I wish I could minzimzed it and not have to have it cluter up my taskbar since it is normaly already clutter enough.
Besides I have learned I like to doing something the more advances ways using short cut key comonds more typing in the command simple because it is faster (Drafting programs are taking away my command line it is really getting to me). I have a feeling there is a lot of stuff you can do in macs like this but I dont know very well since when I started playing around in pear PC I found out that I had a bad motherboard (it a week old so I figure I got ship a bad one). I should have it back up and running this weekend and I contine playing around in Pear PC learning more about OS X and some of the stuff it can do. anything I find really instersting to look at and want to see what it like not being bogged down I just go to one of my friends with a mac and have them show me it on theres
Each to their own...
There are certainly circumstances in which a Wintel machine is the best choice. I think these circumstances are less common than is widely perceived, and that most users would be better served with modern Macs running OS X than they can imagine.
That has not been true for long. Prior to OS X, the MacOS was no better than Windows, and, while the hardware was arguably better in Macs, the diversity of software and hardware available on the PC side made PCs a better choice for most (me included).
I've been buying (and building my own) PCs, installing various OSes (DOS, DesqView, OS/2, Linux, FreeBSD, and every flavour of windows from 3.0 to XP Pro) since the early '80s, and I know how to make these systems work. My PC at home runs Win2k and Linux very well indeed, and I rarely have problems with it. I used to use it fairly heavily, and had consistent problems under Win2k with memory leaks when doing lots of slide scanning/photoediting under photoshop, but nothing a reboot wouldn't fix (sill...it was very irritating to have to reboot every few hours to keep the system running when I was working it hard). I never had any problems under Linux, but there were lots of things I never got around to setting up.
Since I purchased my PowerBook, I hardly ever use my PC any more. I can do everything with my PowerBook that I could under Windows or Linux on my PC, it never crashes, it needs almost no set-up or configuration, and I don't have to scan for viruses or spy-ware every week.
Messing around with computers was kind of fun for a few years, but now I like them to work well with a minimum investment of effort on my part. So paying a small extra percentage (actually, my PowerBook was cheaper than a similarly spec'ed Sony, but I'll agree that Macs are, in general, a little more expensive) is worth it to me.
I'd actually encourage any aspiring young computer geeks to build their own and run linux. Then, once they're skilled and getting well-paid, they can buy themselves Macs and use their knowledge to support their clients while they enjoy trouble-free computing on their own systems.
Cheers
There are certainly circumstances in which a Wintel machine is the best choice. I think these circumstances are less common than is widely perceived, and that most users would be better served with modern Macs running OS X than they can imagine.
That has not been true for long. Prior to OS X, the MacOS was no better than Windows, and, while the hardware was arguably better in Macs, the diversity of software and hardware available on the PC side made PCs a better choice for most (me included).
I've been buying (and building my own) PCs, installing various OSes (DOS, DesqView, OS/2, Linux, FreeBSD, and every flavour of windows from 3.0 to XP Pro) since the early '80s, and I know how to make these systems work. My PC at home runs Win2k and Linux very well indeed, and I rarely have problems with it. I used to use it fairly heavily, and had consistent problems under Win2k with memory leaks when doing lots of slide scanning/photoediting under photoshop, but nothing a reboot wouldn't fix (sill...it was very irritating to have to reboot every few hours to keep the system running when I was working it hard). I never had any problems under Linux, but there were lots of things I never got around to setting up.
Since I purchased my PowerBook, I hardly ever use my PC any more. I can do everything with my PowerBook that I could under Windows or Linux on my PC, it never crashes, it needs almost no set-up or configuration, and I don't have to scan for viruses or spy-ware every week.
Messing around with computers was kind of fun for a few years, but now I like them to work well with a minimum investment of effort on my part. So paying a small extra percentage (actually, my PowerBook was cheaper than a similarly spec'ed Sony, but I'll agree that Macs are, in general, a little more expensive) is worth it to me.
I'd actually encourage any aspiring young computer geeks to build their own and run linux. Then, once they're skilled and getting well-paid, they can buy themselves Macs and use their knowledge to support their clients while they enjoy trouble-free computing on their own systems.
Cheers
Timelessblur said:
you sound like a 15 year old bashing macs because when you were 5 you though that one of the early apples werent perfect.........unless, of course rabid macs burned down your house 😀 .....also, half of this post is spelt (or spelled) wrong
'nuff said.
Timelessblur
macrumors 65816
typic dumb ass maccy. Did not even notic any of the points I made. I said in one point what I hated about macs menus since day one. Set up they still use today so my point is a vaild point. I hated when I was 6-7 and I still hate the menu set up today. I never said any where the windows was better. I NEVER said I based my opinion mac OS from the quitly of an earily OS. I was making a point about there menu set up they use now and point out the fact that I had used that menu set up before I ever used M$ windows. I countering a point that people could come up with saying I am used to Windows 95 and be on. Now do you get it. read the post again if you dont beleive me.
The above average XP users is more than likely going to be happer off windows than having to loose all there tricks. The average users it in the air and it can go either way. For the below average user I said they should go to mac.
Now I not even going to count the dumbass who use a computer and have not right on them. They bring down the schools to where average looks a lot lower. Those people I not really counting would have just as many problems on a Mac as they would a Windows computer. They dont have any right on a computer. They are not willing to learn.
Btw I am dyslexic so I dont always see all my mistakes nor do I really ever go back though my post to find them because general I need to leave and come back later to see my mistakes (that is how I correct any papers I have to write). Chances are I am quite a bit smarter than you and I know more than you.
The above average XP users is more than likely going to be happer off windows than having to loose all there tricks. The average users it in the air and it can go either way. For the below average user I said they should go to mac.
Now I not even going to count the dumbass who use a computer and have not right on them. They bring down the schools to where average looks a lot lower. Those people I not really counting would have just as many problems on a Mac as they would a Windows computer. They dont have any right on a computer. They are not willing to learn.
Btw I am dyslexic so I dont always see all my mistakes nor do I really ever go back though my post to find them because general I need to leave and come back later to see my mistakes (that is how I correct any papers I have to write). Chances are I am quite a bit smarter than you and I know more than you.
There are some interesting observations in this thread.
I think the new G5s have 5.1 Dolby Digital sound support built into them. It isn't mentioned very prominently on Apple's Web site; I had to look on
this support page.
I had cable Internet installed yesterday. The Comcast guy apologized for bumbling around on my G4 looking for the Network Preferences. He said for years he had only installed their service on one Mac, but in the last month he's had to do three of us.
That's a nice trend.
Crikey
topicolo said:
I think the new G5s have 5.1 Dolby Digital sound support built into them. It isn't mentioned very prominently on Apple's Web site; I had to look on
this support page.
I had cable Internet installed yesterday. The Comcast guy apologized for bumbling around on my G4 looking for the Network Preferences. He said for years he had only installed their service on one Mac, but in the last month he's had to do three of us.
That's a nice trend.
Crikey
Squire
macrumors 68000
bryanc said:
I'm in the same boat. I bought a 17" 1 GHz iMac when they came out and have used my PC only a handful of times since. I used to play multiplayer games quite often but I haven't done so recently. Actually, my wife and 2-and-a-half-year-old son are the only ones who use the PC nowadays. (There are some compatibility problems with our online banking.)
In a nutshell, using the PC just became too much of a headache. My PC did things that I didn't want it to do. My Mac, on the other hand, never does.
Squire