Um my Dell has an i7, my Mac Pro has a Xeon. Of course it is going to cost more. My point is, just because it is a Apple computer, does not mean it will automatically perform horribly against a Windows PC. Macs + Bootcamp _ Windows make a very VERY good gaming platform. Just saying Macs suck for gaming is false. OS X sucks for gaming....NOT a MAC. Putting Bootcamp and a Apple computer and putting Windows on it should give the same performance as a similar spec'ed Windows box.
And no you cannot price a PC that can out perform a Mac Pro for less, especially with the new Mac Pro. These things have Xeon, ECC ram, PCIe flash storage, thousands of dollars in video cards, ...
And just one fan. The electricity usage of the Mac Pro is considerably less than any other workstation computer. Then Anti-Virus, then OS upgrades, then software suites... A Mac works out cheaper every time as long as you are actually using the computer.
Easy rule:
Windows PC purchase price is cheaper, actual usage the Mac and in total, Mac wins.
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VI™;19512447 said:
Not false. How much did you pay for your Mac Pro vs your Dell and have you priced the components to build your own PC? I can price a PC that will out perform your Mac Pro for less. Not to mention many OS X games are ports and some games you can't even get to run on OS X. Now for a better comparison compare a Dell XPS or Alienware computer vs. the Macpro.
And as I have stated in previous posts in this thread, a PC can be built to have more power that a similarly price Mac. Now if you start talking about similar parts and not prices, then it changes. Xeon 6 core processors, etc... can be found in a Mac Pro and cost a lot more than an i7 consumer grade CPU, Mobo, RAM, but won't give you any real performance boost when running games.
I'm pretty sure if I compared my latest gen rMBP with dedicated GPU vs. the newest Razer Blade Pro, that costs $2799.99, then Razer would provide better performance at the same cost as my rMBP.
And then there is the fact that you only get a few hours out of the Razor, where as the MBPr would get over twice as much. Even if you are happy with charging it, more charging means higher electricity usage, resulting in a higher running cost as well as the battery deteriorating faster due to an increase of charge cycles.
Here is something I wrote a while back:
I have heard and read a lot about people saying iMac's are more expensive over Windows PC's and wanted to make a thread here to show the real colours of this argument; making it more clear for buyers. I have below several price and spec comparisons between the iMac and a Windows PC in several different terms (like All In Ones, Desktops, Build Your Own, Light Users and Heavy Users). For each comparison I have added the price of both the compared iMac and PC's price after 1,3 and 5 years. So I hope you enjoy the read, and hope that it allows for people to see the real difference in price between an iMac and a Windows based PC. Enjoy.
First Comparison - iMac Vs. All In One Windows PC
For this comparison, I have chosen to compare the entry level iMac to the best (similarly priced) Windows 8 All In One I could find; the HP Envy.
iMac @ £1,149/$1,299/€1,299
Processor - Intel Core i5-4570S | 4th Gen Haswell | Turboboost's from 2.7GHz > 3.2GHz | 4Mb L3 Cache
Cores - 4 Cores | 4 Threads
RAM - 8Gb DDR3 1600Mhz
GPU - Intel Iris Pro 5200 | 128Mb eDRAM
Storage - 1Tb 5400 RPM Hard Drive
Display - 21.5 Inch IPS Fully Calibrated | 1920 x 1080
I/O - 4 USB 3.0 | 2 Thunderbolt | SD Card Reader | Gigabit Ethernet | Bluetooth 4.0 | Headphone Jack | No Optical Drive
Wi-Fi - 802.11ac
Camera - HD
In the Box - iMac | Wireless Keyboard | Magic Mouse/Trackpad
Operating System - Mountain Lion (with free upgrade to Mavericks)
HP ENVY Recline @ £1,049.99/$1,199/€1,199
Processor - Intel Core i5-4570T | 4th Gen Haswell | Turboboost's from 2.9Ghz > 3.6Ghz | 4Mb L3 Cache
Cores - 4 Cores | 4 Threads
RAM - 8Gb DDR3 1600Mhz
GPU - NVIDIA GeForce GT 730A | 1Gb
Storage - 1Tb 5400RPM Hard Drive
Display - 23 Inch | Multi-point Touchscreen | 1920 x 1080
I/O - 2 USB 3.0 | 2 USB 2.0 | SD Card Reader | Gigabit Ethernet | Bluetooth 4.0 | Headphone Jack | No Optical Drive
Wi-Fi - 802.11 b/g/n
Camera - HD
In the Box - HP Envy | Wireless Keyboard | Wireless Mouse
Operating System - Windows 8
The higher end 21" iMac has spec's more similar to the HP Envy but I chose to compare the entry level iMac with it to keep the prices similar. The iMac costs £100 ($100/€100) more than the Envy and at an initial look (at least in terms of the processor and screen); the HP Envy seems like the better deal. The Envy features a processor more similar to the high-end 21" iMac (with an initial clock of 2.9Ghz, that Turboboost's to 3.6Ghz as well as a dedicated graphics card with 1Gb of video memory.) compared to the above iMac that only features a 2.7Ghz i5 with Turboboost to 3.2Ghz. Both All In Ones feature 4th Gen Quad-Core i5 processors with 4 threads (i.e no hyperthreading). Both All In Ones also feature a 1Tb 5400 RPM Hard Drive, which may not be the fastest, but offers great storage at cheep prices.
But that is about it for the similarities as from here on, both computers are configured differently. The Envy features a discrete graphics card with 1Gb of video memory compared to the iMac's integrated GPU that comes with 128Mb of eDRAM. This is a big plus for the Envy as more graphically demanding tasks should perform better with a dedicated GPU. It should be noted that the Intel Iris Pro GPU featured in the iMac is no slouch, as tests have shown it can hold it's own weight. The iMac features better I/O and Wi-Fi connectivity than the Envy. The iMac has 4 USB 3.0 slots (fast data transfer speeds), where as the Envy only features 2 USB 3.0, then 2 USB 2.0 (slower data transfer speeds). What does this mean, transferring data (be it photographs, video, music...) from a USB to the computer will take longer on the Envy if the 2 USB 3.0 slots are taken up. The iMac also features 2 Thunderbolt ports allowing for 2 external Thunderbolt monitors to be connected. Another difference with the connectivity is the Wi-Fi. The iMac features the new 802.11ac, where as the Envy features the older 802.11 b/g/n. This means that with a 802.11ac router, the iMac will perform much faster in wireless activity compared to the iMac. I have also noticed the 802.11ac helped when the computer was placed further away from the router, which could be a very important factor for a buyer.
Up until now, all that has been stated is slight changes; the following is where these two computers differentiate more.
The iMac features a 21.5 Inch IPS screen at the resolution of 1920 x 1080. The Envy features a larger 23" touchscreen with a resolution of 1920 x 1080. First off, the increase in screen size can be seen as a positive and a negative as it is (obviously) larger, but due to the Envy featuring the same resolution as the iMac, the iMac has a greater pixel destiny. This will make everything on screen appear sharper that the Envy. The Envy does however feature a touchscreen, something the iMac does not. This makes the Windows 8 experience much better as without touch it feels in-intuitive. Another thing to note is how well the screens are calibrated when taken out the box. Most users won't calibrate their computer monitors to perfection so it is important that the "Out the Box" quality is good. Both screens are IPS (allowing for wide viewing angles as well as high response times). The Envy features a well calibrated monitor, but it can't touch the perfection of the iMac's calibrated monitor. In all tests, the iMacs monitor is so close to perfection (in terms of saturation, colour accuracy, brightness, Gamut average and white point average). The screen is so well calibrated out of the box, professional should be happy to use this machine without even re-calibrating it. In the end, the Envy's screen is very good but the iMac is on top.
Now onto Pricing. In the initial prices, the iMac comes out more expensive by £100 ($100/€100), now lets look beyond that.
The iMac (along with all new Macs) come with the following software:
iMovie
iPhoto
Pages
Numbers
Keynote
App Store
As well as others
And the Envy comes with:
Windows Store
Beats Audio Console
A few games
Looking above, I have only noted a small amount of software that comes preinstalled on each computer. It should be noted that the Envy (look most Windows PC's) comes with Crapware. This is software that has been installed on the computer taking up lots of space as well as slowing the computer down and is made hard (if not almost impossible) to remove. This can be removed if the user is willing to reinstall the OS but this can take several hours and can be very troublesome if the user struggles to get drivers for the PC (a good example is the drivers are on the internet, but you can't connect to the internet because you don't have the ethernet or wireless drivers). The Envy doesn't appear to bad with the crap ware installed, most of it is games that should be easy to uninstall.
Moving on, the iMac comes with Pages, Numbers and Keynote for free (also known collectively as iWork). These are a the Word, Exel and Powerpoint of the Apple world. I have used them extensively and have had no problems with them and never had something I can do on Microsoft Office that I can't do on iWork. For the Envy side of things, it does not come with Microsoft Office, that will set you back £79.99 ($99.99/€99.99) a year for Office 365 or a one off fee of £190 (£229, €229) for the 2013 edition (that will not be up to date when a new one comes out, where as iWork gets free updates).
I have also taken into account electricity costs. The iMac uses only 15W at idle. The average cost to run an iMac for a year is £8.06 The Envy on the other hand uses around £20-30 to run per year. This is on average usage.
There is also Anti Virus Software to be taken into account. It is still a fact that you are less likely to get a virus on a Mac with out Anti-Virus than you are on a PC with Anti-Virus. So I'm not saying it is impossible to get a virus on a Mac, I just saying that you are still less likely than if using a PC with. You can still get AntiVirus for Mac, and is usually free compared to being on average £19.99
for a PC.
So here are the figures:
iMac
Initial Price - £1,149
iWork - £0
iLife (for Movie Editing) - £0
Running cost per year - £8.06
Anti-Virus - £0
HP Envy
Initial Price - £1,049
Office(per year) - £79.99
Office (One Off) - £199
Movie Edit Pro - £39.99 (was £59.99)
Running cost per year - £25
Anti-Virus - £19.99
Now, instead of just adding that up, I am going to add up different values depending on the user.
Basic User
Wants to web browse, check emails, do social networking
1 Year
iMac : £1,157.06
Hp Envy: £1,093.99
3 Year's
iMac : £1,173.18
HP Envy: £1,183.97
5 Year's
iMac : £1,189.30
HP Envy: £1,273.95
Contains - Computer, running costs and Anti-Virus.
As you can see, for the Basic User keeping it for 3+ years, the iMac is cheaper than the Windows All in One Alliterative. I would say though that if you come under the Basic user, a cheaper Mac (like a Mac Mini or Macbook Air) or a cheaper Windows PC/Laptop would suit you better.
Average User
Wants to do everything a Basic User does but also Work related things like documents...
1 Year
iMac : £1,157.06
Hp Envy: £1,153.99
3 Year's
iMac : £1,173.18
HP Envy: £1,314.00
5 Year's
iMac : £1,189.30
HP Envy: £1,364.00
Contains - Computer, running costs, Anti-Virus and iWork/Office(365 for the one year user, One Off payment for the 3 and 5 year user).
For the Average User planning to keep the computer for one year, both computer are similarly priced. For the average user that want's to keep longer than that, the iMac is much cheaper (with a difference of around £200).
Heavy User
Wants to do everything an Average User does but also uses the system more and edits Video
1 Year
iMac : £1,161.00
Hp Envy: £1,218.97
3 Year's
iMac : £1,185.00
HP Envy: £1,479.66
5 Year's
iMac : £1,209.00
HP Envy: £1,738.89
Contains - Computer, running costs(£30 instead of £25 as user is on more, £12 for iMac instead of £8.06), Anti-Virus, iWork/Office(365 per year), iMovie/Movie Edit Pro.
For the Heavy User, the iMac is considerable cheap than the Windows based All in One.
iMac vs Custom Build
For this comparison, I will compare the high end 27"(with upgrade to i7) iMac against a Custom Built Window's PC I configured at PC Specialist. I will also add the software from above as it is the Windows alliterative to the Mac's software.
iMac @ £1,939.00/£2,199/€2,199
Processor - Intel Core i7-4771 | 4th Gen Haswell | Turboboost's from 3.5GHz > 3.9GHz | 8Mb L3 Cache
Cores - 4 Cores | 8 Threads
RAM - 8Gb DDR3 1600Mhz
GPU - NVIDIA GeForce GTX 775M | 2Gb Video Memory
Storage - 1Tb 7200 RPM Hard Drive
Display - 27 Inch IPS Fully Calibrated | 2560 x 1440
I/O - 4 USB 3.0 | 2 Thunderbolt | SD Card Reader | Gigabit Ethernet | Bluetooth 4.0 | Headphone Jack | No Optical Drive
Wi-Fi - 802.11ac
Camera - HD
In the Box - iMac | Wireless Keyboard | Magic Mouse/Trackpad
Operating System - Mountain Lion (with free upgrade to Mavericks)
Custom Built PC using PCSpecialist @ £2,058
Processor - Intel Core i7-4771 | 4th Gen Haswell | Turboboost's from 3.5GHz > 3.9GHz | 8Mb L3 Cache
Cores - 4 Cores | 8 Threads
RAM - 8Gb DDR3 1600Mhz
GPU - NVIDIA GeForce GTX 770M | 2Gb Video Memory
Storage - 1Tb 7200 RPM Hard Drive
Display - 27 Inch IPS Fully Calibrated | 2560 x 1440
I/O - 2 USB 3.0 | 4 USB 2.0 | SD Card Reader | Headphone Jack | No Optical Drive
Wi-Fi - 802.11n
Camera - Microsoft WebCam 720p
Contents - £80 tower, Microsoft Office Professional, Norton Anti-Virus 1 Year, Movie Edit Pro, Microsoft Touch Mouse, Arc Keyboard, HDMI, Asus 27" IPS Monitor
Operating System - Windows 8.1 Professional
Added better power supply and cooling which added around £130 to the price to make the computer quieter and cooler.
And all of that would cost £1,729 with no software, no anti-virus...
So in the end you get an uglier looking build PC for more money. The only way the Custom PC will be cheaper than the iMac is if you downgrade things or built it yourself.
So here you have reached the end. And the question I now ask myself is "Are iMacs expensive?". Yes, they are. "Are iMac's expensive compared to similar PC's? No. Defianatly not. Remember that you don't just by the computer and sit it somewhere, you use it and using it costs money as well as the software you use. So now I better go; I don't want to find this year has cost me more than £8.06 for running my iMac
